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She cracked an egg with a hammer
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Dec 3, 2019 17:29
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tin can made man posted:On reflection, Angela HAS spent the entire series either obviously lying or deflecting the truth; originally this seemed to just be related to police work and her general reticence over a traumatic past, then her being on the fringes of Wills great conspiracy, but I think on a rewatch she'll definitely track as a person who's keeping the world's most important secret and is instantly hostile to ANY attempt to know more about her or especially her family life. If you don’t want your kids to be afraid, why be a cop at all? If you don’t want to keep secrets, why marry Dr Manhattan? I think the Millenium Clock is a giant memory eraser, everyone can let go of their past trauma and start fresh. The Dr Redneck plan is going to real monkeys paw territory- being god lets you do anything, but you no longer want to do anything. Doc could just vaporize the whole 7th Cavalry right now! He just isn’t engaged enough with the world to do it. He just follows his destiny, a puppet who can see the strings. The Squiddening didn’t get Adrian what he expected, Keene’s plan won’t either.
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Dec 3, 2019 17:31
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Trieu knows the 7th Kavalry's plans, knows that it will be done within an hour, has the resources to stop them, but chooses not to. I guess it was all a long-shot plan to get Dr. Manhattan out of hiding. And I don't see how the Kavalry would know about Cal unless they were tipped off by Trieu or Will.
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Dec 3, 2019 17:39
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Mike the TV posted:Trieu knows the 7th Kavalry's plans, knows that it will be done within an hour, has the resources to stop them, but chooses not to. I guess it was all a long-shot plan to get Dr. Manhattan out of hiding. I amend my previous remarks: Maybe the Millennium Clock destroys Manhattan FIRST, before Keene can capture him. No Jon, no problem.
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Dec 3, 2019 17:41
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Oh also good call on those who predicted that Trieu was re-creating her own mother.
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Dec 3, 2019 17:48
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I figured Bian was a clone of Trieu. Almost there.
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Dec 3, 2019 17:52
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Mike the TV posted:Trieu knows the 7th Kavalry's plans, knows that it will be done within an hour, has the resources to stop them, but chooses not to. I guess it was all a long-shot plan to get Dr. Manhattan out of hiding. Maybe Jud was the 2nd 7k on the white night and cal hulked out to save Angela revealing himself as manhattan. Which would also explain why his wife said the original plan that Laurie cracked was correct but then seemed like small potatoes.
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Dec 3, 2019 17:58
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I love that FOREVER I thought Angela was a “knows as much as the audience” character and has been hiding this poo poo since ep 1. loving love it. A few eps ago Grampa Justice said that in 3 days she’ll find out she’s been betrayed or something to that nature. VERY curious what that is
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Dec 3, 2019 18:10
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Bread Set Jettison posted:I love that FOREVER I thought Angela was a “knows as much as the audience” character and has been hiding this poo poo since ep 1. loving love it. Manhattan outed is a pretty big betrayal.
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Dec 3, 2019 18:35
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romanowski posted:also thought juxtaposing that vietnam attack with the KKK tulsa massacre was um questionable Just Chamber posted:Not sure if Cal does but Will suggests to Angela he's Dr Manhattan when she has him locked up and Angela says he can't take on human form. In retrospect this was a bit of a giveaway because how the gently caress could anyone say that with any amount of confidence unless they either knew Dr. Manhattan personally, or were lying. SpiderHyphenMan fucked around with this message at 18:39 on Dec 3, 2019 |
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Dec 3, 2019 18:36
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https://twitter.com/kphipps3000/status/1201920572281827329?s=12
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Dec 3, 2019 18:52
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:The flashes start before the attack, making the explicit link between American colonialism and a racist massacre. Gonna have to go back through my posts to find where I said this and gloat quote all the haters cuz I was riiiiiihhgt about Dr Manhattan looking human. Wrong about him being veidt tho, but I was orbiting the fact that the show was telling us something Also lol at not seeing the connection between tulsa 1921 and colonialism in Vietnam
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Dec 3, 2019 18:59
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According to Calvin's medical report from the day he apparently met Angela (12/23/09), he said his name was Calvin Jelani. The meaning of the name “Jelani” is: “Great, powerful” in Swahili, also he worked for Veidt's company.
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Dec 3, 2019 19:24
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:The flashes start before the attack, making the explicit link between American colonialism and a racist massacre. Right? It's Angela's trauma mirroring Will's. Will watching / Angela renting a movie -> terrorist attack -> orphaned -> became police, masked heroes. The bombing was a response to an occupation utilizing poor and non-white (and blue) soldiers to conquer Vietnam and enforce American culture. It kills Angela's parents, presumably many Vietnamese civilians, makes no real difference, and Angela's testimony to the cops leads to the puppeteer being executed without trial. If it's juxtaposing anything, it's the Bass Reeves movie Will was watching before the massacre.
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Dec 3, 2019 19:29
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Does this mean this coming episode or the one that just aired on the first?
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Dec 3, 2019 19:38
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Trieu is using to use her big clock to broadcast "White America, stop being so loving racist, gently caress, what is wrong with you people??". Also Red Scare is always eating cheezies with a fork.
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Dec 3, 2019 19:41
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Soonmot posted:Does this mean this coming episode or the one that just aired on the first? https://twitter.com/kphipps3000/status/1201922576731328512
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Dec 3, 2019 19:44
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I love that they put Dr Manhattan in that aerial footage of Vietnam getting napalmed that every documentary uses.
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Dec 3, 2019 19:46
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Lol I was like looking at the names in the credits trying to figure out what this guy was talking about
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Dec 3, 2019 19:56
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twistedmentat posted:Trieu is using to use her big clock to broadcast "White America, stop being so loving racist, gently caress, what is wrong with you people??". And he drives an M3 or whatever bmw
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Dec 3, 2019 20:00
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Seriously, Panda saying that Dr Manhattan can time travel is like still stickin a craw in my. . craw?
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Dec 3, 2019 20:03
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He exists in all times simultaneously so
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Dec 3, 2019 20:06
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Yea he can time travel in the sense that he can send information back in time, by giving the information to people in the past who would not have had it otherwise. It seems like the full extent of Manhattan's powers aren't ever really known just because he never cares enough to use them.
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Dec 3, 2019 20:09
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I mean the question is, can he appear in physical form to times before he was alive as a human or before he was Manhattaned? I would assume so, and a lot of the show is going to be this Basebf555 posted:It seems like the full extent of Manhattan's powers aren't ever really known just because he never cares enough to use them. And so, when we look back after the season we're going to have a lot of moments that seemed odd but make complete sense. Which makes me revisit Topher, does he have a loving Manhattan ring in his head? Seems too far fetched but that loving castle toy is like screaming something KoRMaK fucked around with this message at 20:26 on Dec 3, 2019 |
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Dec 3, 2019 20:23
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I love Lindelof stuff but he better have something up his sleeve to wrap this up because I'm starting to teeter on this story being garbage. Great acting, great cinematography, amazing soundtrack, and it has all the little details that Lindelof shows have. But there doesn't seem to be much story here. Outside of I guess some redneck racists somehow mastered quantum physics and will destroy a God like entity from an abandoned warehouse. I guess what bugs me is I give zero shits about any of the characters in this show. Angela was the only one that you could connect with and it turns out she's been something completely different the entire series. Complete opposite of a series like the Leftovers where you cared about every character.
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Dec 3, 2019 20:25
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KoRMaK posted:I mean the question is, can he appear in physical form to times before he was alive as a human or before he was Manhattaned? We don’t know for sure if Jon can be killed, but there is evidence for “no”: - Intrinsic field removal not effective. Didn’t kill Osterman in 1959, definitely didn’t kill Manhattan in 1985 at Karnak. - Veidt didn’t figure it out. Smartest man in the world vaporized Bubastis and just pissed Doc off. How does 7th Cal determine this? Are they more advanced than Veidt or Trieu? - Conventional weapons not effective. As evidenced by Vietnam War. - Manhattan can teleport interplanetary distances instantaneously, create or destroy matter, and can see all events simultaneously, so he can’t be surprised. Gonna be real hard to get the drop on him or imprison him. Evidence for “yes”: - has a human mind and human desires (sex), so attacks that are psychological can work. Veidt tricked him into leaving Earth. - technology is more advanced in 2019 than 1985 Tachyons have been proven to muddle his awareness. - There could be a “soul field” or something similar we don’t know about that is holding Manhattan’s consciousness together. (How does he think without a human brain?) Someone who is a mind and memory expert could figure out how to disrupt/destroy it.
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Dec 3, 2019 20:46
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Maybe convince him to end his own existence? The whole Laurie joke with the little girl and the brick and wasn't there a bar involved in that? Is Angela the little girl who tossed the brick?
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Dec 3, 2019 20:58
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It's possible that by "become him", the real intention is for the 7th Cavalry to somehow trap Manhattan(assuming he can't be outright killed), and once he's out of play they can insert their own substitute for him who can go around espousing all their white supremacist ideas. The reputation is already established, you can have most of the power that Manhattan has just by fooling people into thinking you're him.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:02
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KoRMaK posted:I mean the question is, can he appear in physical form to times before he was alive as a human or before he was Manhattaned? I very much assume NOT, however I would assume that Manhattan is able to VIEW events from before he was born. But not appear or change them. The past already happened. It is immutable. There was no Manhattan back then to say those things. He can only "time travel" and say things because he can always see the future. That doesn't mean he can actually travel. KoRMaK posted:Maybe convince him to end his own existence? This is the obvious answer I can think of, but its not outside the realm of possibility that enough tachyons or something could permanently "kill" him
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Dec 3, 2019 21:04
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Basebf555 posted:It's possible that by "become him", the real intention is for the 7th Cavalry to somehow trap Manhattan(assuming he can't be outright killed), and once he's out of play they can insert their own substitute for him who can go around espousing all their white supremacist ideas. The reputation is already established, you can have most of the power that Manhattan has just by fooling people into thinking you're him. No I think they want to replicate the intrinsic field generator accident and get that power. I think Trieu is pretty emphatic on that. Also, I would simply defeat Dr. Manhattan by exposing him to a rock from his homeworld, the mysterious element earthite, to weaken him and then drop a safe on his head.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:19
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Zaphod42 posted:I very much assume NOT, however I would assume that Manhattan is able to VIEW events from before he was born. But not appear or change them. The past already happened. It is immutable. I thought Dr Manhattan can only view events that he has, will or is currently experiencing? Whatever it is has to be happening to him. So he wouldn't be able to view anything before he existed or wasn't present for, like he can't jump back and witness the signing of the declaration of independence for example. He knows every event that he will ever witness first hand and every piece of knowledge he will learn as he experiences his timeline all at once.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:27
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HppyCmpr posted:I feel a little bad for Angela and Cal's adopted children to be honest. Their parents were killed by the 7K, not sure how much more danger they could really be in 
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Dec 3, 2019 21:31
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Ha it just occurred to me how loving furious Laurie is going to be when she finds out about Cal El
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Dec 3, 2019 21:32
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Just Chamber posted:I thought Dr Manhattan can only view events that he has, will or is currently experiencing? Whatever it is has to be happening to him. Like he can't jump back and witness the signing of the declaration of independence for example, just as he shouldn't be able to view anything that occurred before he existed and wasn't present for. He knows every event that will ever occur around him and every piece of knowledge he will learn as he experiences his timeline all at once. It's really not clear, because Manhattan is very obtuse in the way that he describes himself. He can see the fabric of the universe down to the smallest particle, who's to say he couldn't use that knowledge to travel in time? For instance, if he wanted to he could instantly transport himself to the event horizon of a black hole.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:33
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Just Chamber posted:I thought Dr Manhattan can only view events that he has, will or is currently experiencing? Whatever it is has to be happening to him. So he wouldn't be able to view anything before he existed or wasn't present for, like he can't jump back and witness the signing of the declaration of independence for example. He knows every event that he will ever witness first hand and every piece of knowledge he will learn as he experiences his timeline all at once. That's a fair point, its ambiguous in the comics. What he talks about in the past or future is related to his own life, but also there seem to he sections where he wasn't directly observing something. But then he could just be inferencing the gaps and not actually seeing them. But the way manhattan said "nothing ever ends, Adrian" makes it seem like he's nearly omniscient.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:37
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Basebf555 posted:It's really not clear, because Manhattan is very obtuse in the way that he describes himself. He can see the fabric of the universe down to the smallest particle, who's to say he couldn't use that knowledge to travel in time? For instance, if he wanted to he could instantly transport himself to the event horizon of a black hole. That lets you go forwards in time, not backwards. Anybody can travel forwards in time.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:38
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Zaphod42 posted:That lets you go forwards in time, not backwards. Anybody can travel forwards in time. I'm going with an assumption here that Dr. Manhattan has more intimate knowledge of those mechanics than we do. Anyway it's probably moot, it's true that so far we've seen nothing in the comic/movie/show to indicate he can travel to times that he wasn't alive in.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:40
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Dr. Manhattan is way less omniscient than he's given credit. While he's able to bring awesome new technology to the world of the 80's, he also has to do the experiments to figure it out. He doesn't just 'know' it all already. He gets muddled when dealing with human relationships. He gets fooled into believing that he caused the cancer of his friends and colleagues. He gets tricked by Veidt, several times actually, and in the end gets tricked into siding with him.
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Dec 3, 2019 21:58
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Midgetskydiver posted:So of all the women on Earth, Dr. Manhattan falls for the secret granddaughter of the secretly black first masked vigilante? Lol ok Angela crushing Cal's skull while tripping balls and that just being it would have owned so much
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Dec 3, 2019 21:59
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Mike the TV posted:Dr. Manhattan is way less omniscient than he's given credit. While he's able to bring awesome new technology to the world of the 80's, he also has to do the experiments to figure it out. He doesn't just 'know' it all already. He gets muddled when dealing with human relationships. He gets fooled into believing that he caused the cancer of his friends and colleagues. He gets tricked by Veidt, several times actually, and in the end gets tricked into siding with him. He doesn’t really have free will, he does things but always knows how they will turn out. He can’t use his foreknowledge to change outcomes- since everything is simultaneous to him. He’s a train on a track, but with an overhead view. Trying to become like this to enact your white power plan is strange- I can’t imagine anything Manhattan cares about less than distinctions of ‘race’ or power. A black man and a white man have the same number of particles.
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Dec 3, 2019 22:10
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