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in college my non-nerdy roommates got really into nuXCOM when they saw me play it. I would not recommend this game to them. rough edges, a pretty bad UI, and what little tutorials there are are somewhere between unhelpful and aggravating (why are you forcing me to end my turn?! I’ve got a guy with four unused action points!) but I’m still really enjoying it so far. Long War was too... grognardy, maybe? and having to deal with systems bolted on to a game that had eschewed them for a reason was lame. but it feels less bad in this game, since presumably they were planned from the get go. a large part of my enjoyment is the complete simulation of projectiles and free aiming. had an anu assault spot for my heavy, who shot through a fence and oneshot the arthron on the other side. on another mission I had another shotgunner not only kill his primary target but hit a second for 50 damage thanks to a stray pellet. and, yes, I have shot my own soldiers in the rear end by accident. could be great with responses to feedback, and maybe the number of planned dlcs is a good sign for post-release support. but I wouldn’t bet the farm on it. but I’m still satisfied with what it is for myself.
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Dec 5, 2019 23:38
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I've played about five hours so far and I'm really liking the game. There's some rough spots, but I'm also extremely digging the art style, the three different factions and being able to get weird and different soldiers from them. I got a guy who looks like a chartered accountant, but who uses a massive electric maul to beat enemies into pieces, and it's been awesome. I'm sure once I've completed a playthrough the illusion will shatter somewhat, but right now I'm digging it.
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Dec 5, 2019 23:42
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oh, yeah, speaking of the berserkers, that's one thing I unreservedly hate: they hold the hammers like they're made of foam. one-handed, swinging like a wacky wavy inflatable guy at a used car lot, vague motions towards enemies, the haft clips through the soldier's hand. looks really bad. but then I got a guy who's got some kind of mutation for armor that literally makes him look like an xcom2 berserker which is amusing the writing is not great but it's serviceable enough for me to enjoy it anyway, time to boot it up again
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Dec 5, 2019 23:52
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First non-tutorial mission is a bunch of crazy soldiers. What could go wrong? Turns out, one of the soldiers was a badass psychic shaman that dominated half my squad while standing out of LOS on a rooftop. And then my sniper had both circles planted squarely inside their head but managed to whiff completely. Yeeeeeaaaaah not sure how long this game will keep my attention.
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Dec 6, 2019 00:23
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Cheston posted:The second point of interest I scouted was a New Jericho haven, with a mission to dispatch some mist-crazy soldiers. I think I counted 6 enemy soldiers before I lost my squad, and all of them had crazy good armor that could absorb the shots of my entire squad of 4 without going below 1/2 health. dyzzy posted:First non-tutorial mission is a bunch of crazy soldiers. What could go wrong? That mission seems like it might need some tuning. Not that it's impossible, but it's clearly harder than worm extermination or thief-catching. Until it's tuned down, just remember to snipe the soldiers' arms with your sniper - assault rifles are two-handed weapons and if one arm is disabled they can't shoot.
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Dec 6, 2019 00:48
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New Jericho seem like a bunch of overt fascists and borderline Nazis with their purity and order narratives. They try to put their leader off as an Elon Musk but he’s just an rear end in a top hat control freak.
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Dec 6, 2019 01:05
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Demiurge4 posted:New Jericho seem like a bunch of overt fascists and borderline Nazis with their purity and order narratives. They try to put their leader off as an Elon Musk but he’s just an rear end in a top hat control freak. But you repeat yourself
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Dec 6, 2019 01:16
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lol yeah the only faction that seems even arguably good are the high tech guys. They're also the only ones I haven't actually encountered yet though, so who knows what I'll think of them with additional info The good thing is, I'm not gonna feel much guilt once I start firebombing fashy Google campuses or mutant temples
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Dec 6, 2019 01:31
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Pharmaskittle posted:lol yeah the only faction that seems even arguably good are the high tech guys. They're also the only ones I haven't actually encountered yet though, so who knows what I'll think of them with additional info
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Dec 6, 2019 01:46
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The fash are very clearly ripped off from Warhammer 40k, so it's not entirely clear whether the author actually thinks it's a reasonable ideology or is just cool robotting.
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Dec 6, 2019 01:59
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I'm blown away that people even remotely like this game in any way. I love XCOM 2012, XCOM 2, and had zero expectations about this game one way or another except it would scratch the itch. I enjoyed the hell out of SimCity 2013 (and constantly got grief for it from trolls) despite its flaws, and generally enjoy lots of games that have warts. This game however is a heaping pile of poo poo. It's so incredibly bad that it feels like a bad mod slapped on top of an old game that would have come out in 2001 and got a 71/100 back then. It's obvious that Julian Gollop is clueless about modern game design, and basically decided to come out of hiding to cash in on some of his name recognition due to the success of XCOM 2012 * horrible animations * horrible music * horrible sound effects * tactics barely even exist - it has nothing as dynamic as the cover/flanking/pod management in xcom * the cover system barely even makes sense in a game with free aim, so it feels like some awful mashup of mass effect and xcom * the creative direction is just dull and generic * the classes and their abilities are complete garbage with almost nothing being as interesting as a standard xcom ability oswald ownenstein fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Dec 6, 2019 |
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Dec 6, 2019 02:20
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Wait I was wrong, I decided I'd try a game on Legend and it's much better. Still janky but drat, every battle is tense as gently caress and I'm really thinking about my options, using Valkyria Chronicles Aim to disabled fools' arms and stuff if I can't down them in one turn, all kind of poo poo. It still needs a ton of polish and I hope the DLCs help improve things, but I'm having a much better time than I would yesterday.
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Dec 6, 2019 02:25
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Pyromancer posted:So transparently dicerolls that stray shots weren't even a thing in the release version. Also, you're not hitting the body part you supposedly aim at, it just improves chance to hit it compared to just shooting, not by much at that(until you get through all of your tactics skill). Also also, when shot from behind robots don't have arms or legs to aim at, but you still can hit them, because reasons. Battletech also had all the mechs pre-modeled from the MWO team (also the animations?). That was huge. I'm not sure if they got terrain assets too, but they got a huge part of the design load already down. boredsatellite posted:What the hell happened then?  dyzzy posted:First non-tutorial mission is a bunch of crazy soldiers. What could go wrong? Each circle is 50% prob. So the entire inner one is 50% and the other one is the other 50%. If you're saying the entirety of both circles were on the hit box idk what happened. Otherwise you can still miss if some of the circle is empty/terrain. Also this can be resolved by destroying cover by targeting it. Though I don't know how effective that will be without heavy weapons. (IE bring down the tower so you can stab their face etc). Alchenar posted:In Valkyria it's fine because it's just how you choose which enemy to attack in a way that brings you closer to the action. Here it's pixel hunting. The red inner space just tricks you into taking higher risk shots (~50%) by visual cues. That Italian Guy posted:I mean, this game has its moments : https://clips.twitch.tv/TangentialSquareSheepDoggo As a good X-COM player I'm looking forward to this. I hated nuCom because of the lovely design decisions and dumb simplifications that added. Being unable to target terrain for no loving reason is a huge deal. The classes in nuCom were dumb too. I played the first one and refuse to spend money on the second one. People who say free aim adds nothing to the game just aren't being creative with heavy weapons. All cover is just concealment and every wall and floor is actually a door just waiting to be opened. The added granularity is a god send. It isn't as good as TUs, but it is close enough to be playable. None of the AI seems to understand shooting and returning to cover though. Which is a huge problem. It is partially excusable in X-COM because of how old it was, but mods added better AI. This should be basic now. The set dressing complaints make sense but I am playing openX-com now so none of it is stuff I really care about. The lack of music is odd. I've heard the ingame stuff but it seems that there should be more tracks. oswald ownenstein posted:* tactics barely even exist - it has nothing as dynamic as the cover/flanking/pod management in xcom Tactics don't exist?????? You can obviously flank people and get better shots. Even completely dumb streamers like beagle manage it. There just isn't stupid backward arbitrary hit bonuses on people like solomon-Com. Pod management was dumb. It was idiotic design choice were enemies would be ignorant until you passed some invisible boundary then got a free turn to setup. It removes the ability to sneak up on enemy positions that was a feature of base X-COM. All it did was slow down gameplay and punish you when you didn't activate a pod with the first move of your turn. The cover system was dumb in solomon-Com because it should have just be dropped percentage based on percent of body obscured by all intervening terrain.
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Dec 6, 2019 03:24
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I rerolled and got the worm extermination mission, definitely way easier. Trivial, even. Now I just wish the UI weren't rubbishArmadillo Tank posted:Each circle is 50% prob. So the entire inner one is 50% and the other one is the other 50%. If you're saying the entirety of both circles were on the hit box idk what happened. Otherwise you can still miss if some of the circle is empty/terrain. Also this can be resolved by destroying cover by targeting it. Though I don't know how effective that will be without heavy weapons. (IE bring down the tower so you can stab their face etc). Both circles covered by the enemy, body part was glowing, damage estimate was there too. Nothing but air.
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Dec 6, 2019 03:25
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It's gonna be interesting when this guy starts engaging with the actual released version of the game and not the imaginary one he's built up in his head.
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Dec 6, 2019 03:32
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Worm mission on Legend is loving wild because there's a chiron
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Dec 6, 2019 04:42
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Ah yes, mega-idiot Jake Solomon who designed the lovely and simplified Xcom 2012, a game so lovely and dumbed down it revitalized and redefined a dead genre and influenced countless other games, including the one just released by the original inventor of the genre.
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Dec 6, 2019 05:02
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quote:There just isn't stupid backward arbitrary hit bonuses on people like solomon-Com. You missed the sectoid at close range huh
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Dec 6, 2019 05:35
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The PP developers put a notice on their forums site: https://forums.snapshotgames.com/c/phoenix-point quote:We’ve spent the last 48 hours since release going through the reported issues on these forums, reddit, Discord and in game.
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Dec 6, 2019 05:50
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Get rid of shred on most Pandoran poo poo. Make heavy armor more appealing as a result because currently folks stack accuracy instead. Make Siren mind control cost 3 ap. Make Crabman grenade launcher cost 3 ap so it cant be fired twice a turn. Make Chirons have a cooldown between goo spits, or make it just one goo projectile. Fix flamethrower so it actually lays down a cone of fire rather than the weirdness it has going on now. Nerf Heavys tier 7 ability so it doesn't dump an entire mag in one shot and trivialise everything. What the gently caress. Gg game is better (I must really suck because all of these things annoy the gently caress out of me)
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Dec 6, 2019 06:09
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What kind of weirdo calls XCOM "nuCOM?"
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Dec 6, 2019 06:38
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drat bashing with your gun is more powerful than i expected Also am I dumb or does the NJ Gauss AR seem definitely worse than the default AR based on the stats? Pharmaskittle fucked around with this message at 06:54 on Dec 6, 2019 |
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Dec 6, 2019 06:51
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Seeing a scathing review for this game from Oswald Owenstien has convinced me that it's worth keeping an eye on.
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Dec 6, 2019 07:00
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Pharmaskittle posted:drat bashing with your gun is more powerful than i expected You get a bit of penetration but yeah its accuracy blows in particular and less DPS. The upgraded AR-51 is good though.
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Dec 6, 2019 07:09
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Also I feel like bashing on what Jake Solomon and Firaxis pulled off with XCOM overlooks a lot of how cleverly the pieces of that game fit together and how well-thought out the streamlining is. It's a lot like a well-designed board game and has done a lot to inform the modern turn-based tactics genre the way og X-Com informed the genre a generation ago. There's a reason why Phoenix Point isn't trying to be og X-Com but modernized, it's trying to be XCOM but with Valkyria Chronicles aiming and extra granularity. Some of that granularity, like PP's basic resource split, may be a bit hit or miss considering how that specific example doesn't seem to be informing and funneling decisions in the way that, say, XCOM's various resources do. EDIT: Jake Solomon also tried to make a slavish recreation of og X-Com, too, only to realize that maybe blind nostalgia wasn't the way to go https://www.polygon.com/features/2013/1/31/3928710/making-of-xcoms-jake-solomon-firaxis-sid-meier Runa fucked around with this message at 07:19 on Dec 6, 2019 |
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Dec 6, 2019 07:15
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Xarbala posted:EDIT: Jake Solomon also tried to make a slavish recreation of og X-Com, too, only to realize that maybe blind nostalgia wasn't the way to go Best of og XCOMs is Apocalypse, that what he should have tried recreating, not the original and underwater mod for original 
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Dec 6, 2019 07:39
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Pyromancer posted:Best of og XCOMs is Apocalypse, that what he should have tried recreating, not the original and underwater mod for original Sometimes you just wanna say gently caress it and level a building with lasers
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Dec 6, 2019 07:42
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Xarbala posted:Sometimes you just wanna say gently caress it and level a building with lasers never forget. 
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Dec 6, 2019 08:19
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I do really like how you can shoot arms off enemies to prevent them from attacking or if you're in that pain in the rear end starting New Jerico mission and all the guys have crazy armor you can shoot the actual gun they're holding until it breaks. Mindfragger is also a cool enemy type that wouldn't work in XCOM because it's mechanics rely on free aim and it's way more interesting than just Mind Control.
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Dec 6, 2019 08:23
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uber_stoat posted:never forget. EDF! EDF!
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Dec 6, 2019 08:39
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Shine posted:EDF! EDF! TO SAVE OUR MOTHER EARTH FROM ANY ALIEN ATTACK
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Dec 6, 2019 08:45
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VolticSurge posted:TO SAVE OUR MOTHER EARTH FROM ANY ALIEN ATTACK FROM VICIOUS GIANT INSECTS WHO HAVE ONCE AGAIN COME BACK
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Dec 6, 2019 09:56
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Shine posted:FROM VICIOUS GIANT INSECTS WHO HAVE ONCE AGAIN COME BACK
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Dec 6, 2019 10:06
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oswald ownenstein posted:* tactics barely even exist - it has nothing as dynamic as the cover/flanking/pod management in xcom Yeah the cover system seems loving weird. You can have a dude in what the game claims is full cover, and some loving crab guy with a machine gun will just land a full burst on his head. Of course having his head disabled doesn't actually seem to do a whole hell of a lot so v  vMy heavy gunner also seems real bad at aiming. Free aim or auto aim, the dude will miss roughly 60% of his shots even if he's firing at a water tower sized alien pod thing from two meters away. So that's true to XCOM at least.
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Dec 6, 2019 11:01
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so it turns out there are silly hats and chest armours with ascots, which is a great look. but we are not allowed to have the silly hats or fashionable coats... unless you wanna reactivate the console and blindly pump in item id codes 'til you get lucky. if anyone gets the id for the spiky football helmet or the duster, lemme know. this game actively hates fun.
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Dec 6, 2019 11:04
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One of the perks in the release-date preview build Beagle showed off was called Sniperist Odd choice of phrasing
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Dec 6, 2019 12:12
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Der Shovel posted:My heavy gunner also seems real bad at aiming. Free aim or auto aim, the dude will miss roughly 60% of his shots even if he's firing at a water tower sized alien pod thing from two meters away. So that's true to XCOM at least.
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Dec 6, 2019 13:28
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Watching beagle play the game wasn’t very fun because it was obvious he just wanted to poo poo on the game instead of play it. He didn’t even poo poo on it in a funny way.
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Dec 6, 2019 14:03
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Demiurge4 posted:Watching beagle play the game wasn’t very fun because it was obvious he just wanted to poo poo on the game instead of play it. He didn’t even poo poo on it in a funny way. tbf he probably ran out of material after all the backer beta streams he did also fwiw I enjoyed watching him go into detail about what he didn't like about PP, and then start to nitpick after about halfway through
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Dec 6, 2019 14:16
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Xarbala posted:Also I feel like bashing on what Jake Solomon and Firaxis pulled off with XCOM overlooks a lot of how cleverly the pieces of that game fit together and how well-thought out the streamlining is. It's a lot like a well-designed board game and has done a lot to inform the modern turn-based tactics genre the way og X-Com informed the genre a generation ago. Yeah this. There's a lot of straight-edge simplicity in the design of XCOM that I think people can mistake for lack of thought or subtlety, but which actually makes the game great. There's that tweet from Jake Solomon responding to someone asking about the sci-fi ballistics of the ADVENT standard mag rifle to which he responds something like "Yeah you can just make that stuff up, I just said it should do 3 damage and look like an angry playstation". You can read it as "dur-hur 3 damage only stat for gun, baby game for morans", but I bet there's a LOT of time and thought that's gone into that 3 damage. Gun does 3, rookies have 4 health. So a rookie can take 2 standard hits. Or 1 hit and a graze. Or just 1 unlucky crit. Someone at Firaxis has mapped out the theoretical damage distribution of a squad of advent troopers a hundred times at different ranges of damage and accuracy and picked the one that worked just right, so that the advent rifleman is just the right level of threat. Then I see the stats in Pheonix Point of like 35 damage x 6 x hidden probability of hitting against multiple body parts with 15 armour but it's hiding behind a wall but if you wait for the animation to be just right you can shoot it in the face and bypass the armour... and it's enough to make me think that no-one has modelled any of this. It's all just numbers that felt right pulled out of a hat. The game doesn't feel designed, it feels like it just kinda happened.
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Dec 6, 2019 14:36
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