Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
feedmyleg
Dec 25, 2004

Going by the Wikipedia entry, not at all. I am, however, going to add that to my reading list. Mine's about an actor playing Humphrey Bogart in a Maltese Falcon sequel who is investigating the murder of his professional rival in a world obsessed with its own past. So less Hitler and insect-faced demon gods, more the dangers of facial recognition technology, the loss of identity via social media, and the toxic nature of nostalgia. With jazz clubs.

e: Though I do use a similar aptronym for the main character.

feedmyleg fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Dec 6, 2019

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Chairchucker
Nov 14, 2006

to ride eternal, shiny and chrome

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2022




feedmyleg posted:

Going by the Wikipedia entry, not at all. I am, however, going to add that to my reading list.

Excellent. Robert Rankin is my boy and I think everyone should read him.

KrunkMcGrunk
Jul 2, 2007

Sometimes I sit and think, and sometimes I just sit.

Does anyone here have experience with writing a fiction novel synopsis for a publisher? Or any particular examples of a good synopsis?

I'm looking for some guidance.

KrunkMcGrunk fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Dec 11, 2019

FormerPoster
Aug 5, 2004

Hair Elf

KrunkMcGrunk posted:

Does anyone here have experience with writing a fiction novel synopsis for a publisher? Or any particular examples of a good synopsis?

I'm looking for some guidance.

This is the guide I've been using for years. It's been a big help for me, so maybe it'll help you!

http://www.publishingcrawl.com/2012/04/17/how-to-write-a-1-page-synopsis/

KrunkMcGrunk
Jul 2, 2007

Sometimes I sit and think, and sometimes I just sit.

Nae! posted:

This is the guide I've been using for years. It's been a big help for me, so maybe it'll help you!

http://www.publishingcrawl.com/2012/04/17/how-to-write-a-1-page-synopsis/

Thanks!

Leal
Oct 2, 2009
Don't know if this would be the best place to ask, but does anyone know of books that take place or have chapters during a siege or a partially occupied city? Preferably in a medieval setting. Been trying to look up advice and tips others have put out in writing such scenes but they're basically telling me the logistics of a siege and why there would never be an actual attack and to not actually write the attackers busting in cause that barely ever happened and god dammit guys I just want some tips that isn't "don't" for fucks sakes. I also tried to use different words like how sallying out during sieges happened and all I get was Total War video game threads :sigh:

I guess I'm looking for seeing how people write characters who first defend against a siege, originally well nourished and rested, and starts devolving as hunger starts setting in and the fighting breaks out and the wear down of weeks or months of it.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Nae! posted:

This is the guide I've been using for years. It's been a big help for me, so maybe it'll help you!

http://www.publishingcrawl.com/2012/04/17/how-to-write-a-1-page-synopsis/

As always, you're the best

FormerPoster
Aug 5, 2004

Hair Elf

Leal posted:

Don't know if this would be the best place to ask, but does anyone know of books that take place or have chapters during a siege or a partially occupied city? Preferably in a medieval setting. Been trying to look up advice and tips others have put out in writing such scenes but they're basically telling me the logistics of a siege and why there would never be an actual attack and to not actually write the attackers busting in cause that barely ever happened and god dammit guys I just want some tips that isn't "don't" for fucks sakes. I also tried to use different words like how sallying out during sieges happened and all I get was Total War video game threads :sigh:

I guess I'm looking for seeing how people write characters who first defend against a siege, originally well nourished and rested, and starts devolving as hunger starts setting in and the fighting breaks out and the wear down of weeks or months of it.

So here's what you want to do if you haven't already: listen to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History episode 'Prophets of Doom', which will take you six hours but will answer every single possible question about what happens when a medieval town suffers through an extended siege. It's not written prose, so it's not quite what you're looking for, but Carlin's got a distinct story-telling style that will be a big help for you here. I can say this because I haven't listened to this particular episode (or this podcast) in quite a few years, but it still sticks with me as the perfect summation of a besieged city's descent into insanity.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmsDOemNbjo Here it is on youtube if you're hard up for cash, but IMO it's worth the $2 to give Carlin the money for the work on this one.

https://www.dancarlin.com/product/hardcore-history-48-prophets-of-doom/

MockingQuantum
Jan 20, 2012



Leal posted:

Don't know if this would be the best place to ask, but does anyone know of books that take place or have chapters during a siege or a partially occupied city? Preferably in a medieval setting. Been trying to look up advice and tips others have put out in writing such scenes but they're basically telling me the logistics of a siege and why there would never be an actual attack and to not actually write the attackers busting in cause that barely ever happened and god dammit guys I just want some tips that isn't "don't" for fucks sakes. I also tried to use different words like how sallying out during sieges happened and all I get was Total War video game threads :sigh:

I guess I'm looking for seeing how people write characters who first defend against a siege, originally well nourished and rested, and starts devolving as hunger starts setting in and the fighting breaks out and the wear down of weeks or months of it.

KJ Parker's Sixteen Ways to Defend a Walled City is basically this for the whole novel, it's entirely about a medieval or pre-medieval style city (it's a fictional world, not a historical one) being seiged, written from the perspective of the chief of the city's engineering corps.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender

Leal posted:

Don't know if this would be the best place to ask, but does anyone know of books that take place or have chapters during a siege or a partially occupied city? Preferably in a medieval setting. Been trying to look up advice and tips others have put out in writing such scenes but they're basically telling me the logistics of a siege and why there would never be an actual attack and to not actually write the attackers busting in cause that barely ever happened and god dammit guys I just want some tips that isn't "don't" for fucks sakes. I also tried to use different words like how sallying out during sieges happened and all I get was Total War video game threads :sigh:

I guess I'm looking for seeing how people write characters who first defend against a siege, originally well nourished and rested, and starts devolving as hunger starts setting in and the fighting breaks out and the wear down of weeks or months of it.

No time to post much, but these come to mind:

"Sixteen Ways to Defend a Walled City" by K.J. Parker.
The Red Queen's War Book 3: "The Wheel of Osheim" by Mark Lawrence.
The Ancient Blades Book 3: "Honor Among Thieves" by David Chandler

Stabbey_the_Clown fucked around with this message at 17:00 on Dec 16, 2019

REMEMBER SPONGE MONKEYS
Oct 3, 2003

What do you think it means, bitch?
I seem to recall The Religion by Tim Willocks having a fair bit about siege in it, and it was quite a good read, IMO.

KrunkMcGrunk
Jul 2, 2007

Sometimes I sit and think, and sometimes I just sit.

so, I've been posting this stuff in the self-pub thread, but I guess it doesn't belong there!

Anyway, I'm a mystery/thriller author, and have historically published my stuff through KDP (since 2014). Over the years, I've gotten to know a few people, including a guy I'm now co-writing a book with. He's indie published, too, and has a very strong following.

He had a meeting in Seattle a couple weeks back with an editorial director at Thomas & Mercer, and pitched our book. They're interested, and have asked for some pages (I've already got 70k of a first draft typed up), so we're sending our synopsis of the book along with the first 7 chapters today.

I'm excited!

Leal
Oct 2, 2009

MockingQuantum posted:

KJ Parker's Sixteen Ways to Defend a Walled City is basically this for the whole novel, it's entirely about a medieval or pre-medieval style city (it's a fictional world, not a historical one) being seiged, written from the perspective of the chief of the city's engineering corps.

Stabbey_the_Clown posted:

No time to post much, but these come to mind:

"Sixteen Ways to Defend a Walled City" by K.J. Parker.
The Red Queen's War Book 3: "The Wheel of Osheim" by Mark Lawrence.
The Ancient Blades Book 3: "Honor Among Thieves" by David Chandler

Thanks I'll grab one or two of these!

Nae! posted:

So here's what you want to do if you haven't already: listen to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History episode 'Prophets of Doom', which will take you six hours but will answer every single possible question about what happens when a medieval town suffers through an extended siege. It's not written prose, so it's not quite what you're looking for, but Carlin's got a distinct story-telling style that will be a big help for you here. I can say this because I haven't listened to this particular episode (or this podcast) in quite a few years, but it still sticks with me as the perfect summation of a besieged city's descent into insanity.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmsDOemNbjo Here it is on youtube if you're hard up for cash, but IMO it's worth the $2 to give Carlin the money for the work on this one.

https://www.dancarlin.com/product/hardcore-history-48-prophets-of-doom/

And thanks for this, I can definitely listen to this in the background while playing a game.


E:

REMEMBER SPONGE MONKEYS posted:

I seem to recall The Religion by Tim Willocks having a fair bit about siege in it, and it was quite a good read, IMO.

I'll also take a peek at this one.

Leal fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Dec 16, 2019

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender

Leal posted:

Thanks I'll grab one or two of these!

The latter two are from the third book of a trilogy, so jumping into them might leave you confused, but if all you're interested in is the siege parts, it'll be fine. I liked the Red Queen's War, The Ancient Blades was merely okay.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
Crossposting-
My sci-fi novel Charred is nearly complete. I'd say I'm maybe 95% away from my final, publishable draft. Just one last editing pass and phrase usage to work through.

So now focus is starting to shift to the more cosmetic stuff. If we end up self publishing, which is always an option, this is the rough draft of the cover we're thinking about using.



Thoughts?

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









surreptitious muffin self pubbed and made the point that you can go way more insane with big title fonts than you think you can. Try out some crazy ones, that looks a little bland

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe
Push it until it has clearly passed the boundary of good taste, so you know where that boundary is.

Screaming Idiot
Nov 26, 2007

JUST POSTING WHILE JERKIN' MY GHERKIN SITTIN' IN A PERKINS!

BEATS SELLING MERKINS.

TooMuchAbstraction posted:

Push it until it has clearly passed the boundary of good taste, so you know where that boundary is.

COMIC SANS IT IS!

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

Regalingualius
Jan 7, 2012

We gazed into the eyes of madness... And all we found was horny.




No, no, no.

Papyrus.

Wallet
Jun 19, 2006

sebmojo posted:

surreptitious muffin self pubbed and made the point that you can go way more insane with big title fonts than you think you can. Try out some crazy ones, that looks a little bland

In a similar vein on Amazon or wherever the cover is going to be pretty small when people are browsing, particularly if they're doing it on an e-reader or a phone. A quick/dirty edit, but I would consider pushing the intensity a little further and dropping the foreground the little person is standing on because it doesn't read super well when it's the size of a postage stamp:



Edit:
Also independent of font-changes your title might pop a lot more if you invert it (could stylize it as white ash or something).

Wallet fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Dec 20, 2019

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
That does look better.

Also, to me, the little guy looks like he's either waving hi or impotently shaking his fist at the big un'. Neither of which fits, I assume.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
Passing these notes on to the artist, I really like the white ash suggestion. This is both of our first book and his first book cover, so this stuff is really helpful.

Megazver posted:

That does look better.

Also, to me, the little guy looks like he's either waving hi or impotently shaking his fist at the big un'. Neither of which fits, I assume.

Yeah that's going to be made clearer later. We're still hashing out what the little guy is going to be doing on the cover exactly, but for this pose he's going to be reaching out to the giant.

The other two alt ideas are him being lifted up or him being ensnared in the vine stuff you see, but I think that's going to be too complicated myself.

REMEMBER SPONGE MONKEYS
Oct 3, 2003

What do you think it means, bitch?
That may be hard to convey from that perspective and with the undefined style. Maybe reaching across? Just thinking out loud.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
Oh, this isn't close to the final art. This is just a rough draft of how the final art is going to come out. I just want to get the composition right



This is an example of what the artist's finished work looks like.


This is what we're trying to emulate, just with more details, from other concept art we've done.

ravenkult
Feb 3, 2011


That's not gonna read well at all as a cover, as a thumbnail, from a distance, in a bookstore, or anywhere.

SelenicMartian
Sep 14, 2013

Sometimes it's not the bomb that's retarded.

A bird's eye view of a man flipping a bird upwards while standing in a giant footprint?

Leal
Oct 2, 2009


Confirm/deny?

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Leal posted:



Confirm/deny?

Not just male writers, let me tell you


But mostly

Sham bam bamina!
Nov 6, 2012

ƨtupid cat

Leal posted:



Confirm/deny?




Half Price finds from this weekend.

(To be fair, the first one is self-published.)

Sham bam bamina! fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Dec 24, 2019

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe
His name is Sturgis? That's barely less blatant than Buck Turgid.

(Not that these authors have demonstrated any understanding of subtlety)

Anomalous Blowout
Feb 13, 2006

rock
ice
storm
abyss



It makes no attempt to sound human. It is atoms and stars.

*
I won’t bother repeating what others have said about your cover Burk (all good advice!) but one really important thing if you’re gonna self-publish: you will need a much, much bigger title.

Check out the size of thumbnails on Amazon and Kobo books on the storefront. Your title and author name have to be 100% legible at that size.

Tias
May 25, 2008

Pictured: the patron saint of internet political arguments (probably)

This avatar made possible by a gift from the Religionthread Posters Relief Fund
Hi all! Aspiring writer/setting creator here.

Do any of you have experience with, or know good litterature on, creating fantasy settings? I'm going into the deep end of setting creation, making an RPG in which friends can play gods and primeval beings and so shape the basic, fantasy-ish history of the world. That part will run it's own course, but when making geography, polities, culture and all that, I kind of fall a little flat.

I'm a history buff and would conceivably be able to just steal stuff off the real world (a lot of it is stranger than fiction, after all), but I just feel like it's really played out now.

I recognize that it's an unwieldily large question, and any feedback or just on part of it would be very welcome. Thanks a lot!

HIJK
Nov 25, 2012
in the room where you sleep
In that case shouldn't you just follow a Dungeon Master guide or just google "How to build your own DnD game?"

Hard to answer without knowing more about the players and what kind of campaign you're running. In the campaigns I've been most of these nations etc have only been brief blurbs. There's more info in source books but in a casual group you don't get into that stuff much.

Doctor Zero
Sep 21, 2002

Would you like a jelly baby?
It's been in my pocket through 4 regenerations,
but it's still good.

Download Dwarf Fortress and let it generate a world. Use that.


I’m not even kidding.

Tias
May 25, 2008

Pictured: the patron saint of internet political arguments (probably)

This avatar made possible by a gift from the Religionthread Posters Relief Fund

HIJK posted:

In that case shouldn't you just follow a Dungeon Master guide or just google "How to build your own DnD game?"

Hard to answer without knowing more about the players and what kind of campaign you're running. In the campaigns I've been most of these nations etc have only been brief blurbs. There's more info in source books but in a casual group you don't get into that stuff much.

I should have specified, maybe. The thought was to arrive at a fleshed-out setting I could write novels in. The RPG element was mostly to expedite the writing of a creation myth. I'm using a system (Dawn of Worlds) specifically made to play deities who create a fantasy world.


Doctor Zero posted:

Download Dwarf Fortress and let it generate a world. Use that.


I’m not even kidding.

I suppose it would work for the geology and geography, but I don't want to deal with the instability caused by an abundance of necromancers and necrotic powder colossi with ten wings and eleven dicks :ohdear:

Doctor Zero
Sep 21, 2002

Would you like a jelly baby?
It's been in my pocket through 4 regenerations,
but it's still good.

I don’t mean this as snarky as it might sound, but is there a reason you can’t do it yourself? Keep a journal or start a private wiki and start with something. A person or a place. Describe the history. Whenever you have to describe another place or person or character, you start a new entry. Then keep it going. If you just want an RPG setting then random generators and the like are fine, but if you ever plan on writing in the setting you’d be doing yourself a disservice in letting anything else do your work. The more you develop, the more you know the world forwards and backwards and writing will be just describing the things in your head.

I have a fantasy world (that I really should document someday) in my head and nearly every piece of fantasy fiction I write is essentially somewhere in that world. I know its history, I know how magic works, I know what the rules are, I know its creation and gods. It’s the framework when I write and the most I may have to do is create a new place and characters. But I don’t have to sit and ponder how that world works, because i already know.

Now it’s probably not the most original setting ever because of what I grew up watching and reading, but that doesn’t matter so much, it’s more the illusion of a fully fleshed out world because I only show small parts of it here and there, but those parts (hopefully) don’t contradict each other.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender

Tias posted:

I should have specified, maybe. The thought was to arrive at a fleshed-out setting I could write novels in. The RPG element was mostly to expedite the writing of a creation myth. I'm using a system (Dawn of Worlds) specifically made to play deities who create a fantasy world.


I suppose it would work for the geology and geography, but I don't want to deal with the instability caused by an abundance of necromancers and necrotic powder colossi with ten wings and eleven dicks :ohdear:


Many people start out with a character in mind or a plot in mind, and then write a world around the character or plot, expanding as it needs to be filled in. Others start out with an idea for a world, then fill in characters to fit it.

It doesn't seem like you have either.

My advice is just to write and figure out these things yourself in a first draft, then go back in a second draft and put in all the bits you decided on while writing the first draft, because your ideas are going to change and expand over the course of writing a draft.

Djeser
Mar 22, 2013


it's crow time again

Here is the thing you were directly looking for: https://curiosityquills.com/limyaael/

It's a series of articles touching on various worldbuilding topics; you can pick which ones are critical to your situation and read them to get an understanding of some of the pitfalls people fall into. Though, as with any writing advice, keep in mind that you should ignore any of it if it would make your story less interesting.

I do want to say, though, that creating a setting for use both in an RPG and a novel is going to have its own difficulties. A game and a book are very different things, and something that's engaging for a player may not be interesting to a reader. There are things that are compelling to participate in that aren't compelling to hear about, and vice versa. Also, the audience isn't necessarily going to have the same investment that you do in RPG characters that you and your friends made. They're inherently interesting to you, because you were part of that game group, but the audience for your novel isn't going to have any of that experience.

HIJK
Nov 25, 2012
in the room where you sleep

Tias posted:

I should have specified, maybe. The thought was to arrive at a fleshed-out setting I could write novels in. The RPG element was mostly to expedite the writing of a creation myth. I'm using a system (Dawn of Worlds) specifically made to play deities who create a fantasy world.


I suppose it would work for the geology and geography, but I don't want to deal with the instability caused by an abundance of necromancers and necrotic powder colossi with ten wings and eleven dicks :ohdear:

If you're interested in writing a creation myth then making it an RPG would be an active hindrance. RPGs don't get it into the mysticism inherent in those old stories.

IMO you would be better off reading a whole lot of creation myths, as many as you can find. Follow the lines you think are interesting. Make your creation myth based off what you feel. If you tried to make it from an RPG then I think that would game-ify it too much. And you would end up having a pretty generic story when all is said and done.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Screaming Idiot
Nov 26, 2007

JUST POSTING WHILE JERKIN' MY GHERKIN SITTIN' IN A PERKINS!

BEATS SELLING MERKINS.
In the beginning, the Grand Creator harnessed the flames of chaos to forge the earth and wove the tapestry of stars into the heavens to protect his new creation. The Grand Creator has 600hp, divine armor, and a multi-attack feat, and once per turn he can summon 1d6 Celestial Steel Golems.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply