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Random Stranger posted:Nunes is the one person they explicitly cannot call. Well, one of 435 people they explicitly cannot call. I think the SC haven't actually weighed in on if someone in one chamber of Congress could be called before the other, and the language is ambiguous enough that you could make the argument. But the general consensus is you are correct. But hey, hell world! Maybe they'll actually try to subpoena Schiff an we'll get to find out.
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Dec 10, 2019 20:04
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Really looking forward to watching McTurtle ratfuck this process. Dude gives not the slightest gently caress about laws, decorum, the constitution...nothing. So I'm horrified and morbidly curious about how he's going to weaponize this and dick over the country. He's astonished me multiple times in my life how little he cares about anything that isn't raw power, so I'm at a loss for what devious poo poo he's gonna pull.
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Dec 10, 2019 20:05
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bird food bathtub posted:Really looking forward to watching McTurtle ratfuck this process. Dude gives not the slightest gently caress about laws, decorum, the constitution...nothing. So I'm horrified and morbidly curious about how he's going to weaponize this and dick over the country. He's astonished me multiple times in my life how little he cares about anything that isn't raw power, so I'm at a loss for what devious poo poo he's gonna pull. The main thing constraining McConnell at this point is that he has to get the other Senators to sign their names to whatever he wants to do, and how willing they are to play along depends on how their local bases would react.
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Dec 10, 2019 20:06
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bird food bathtub posted:Really looking forward to watching McTurtle ratfuck this process. Dude gives not the slightest gently caress about laws, decorum, the constitution...nothing. So I'm horrified and morbidly curious about how he's going to weaponize this and dick over the country. He's astonished me multiple times in my life how little he cares about anything that isn't raw power, so I'm at a loss for what devious poo poo he's gonna pull. He's going to do his absolute best to quietly sweep this all under the rug as quickly as possible and Trump is going to do his absolute best to turn it into a circus.
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Dec 10, 2019 20:06
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KillHour posted:He's going to do his absolute best to quietly sweep this all under the rug as quickly as possible and Trump is going to do his absolute best to turn it into a circus. So to be more succinct McConnell is going to quietly try and sweep this under the big top.
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Dec 10, 2019 20:42
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DandyLion posted:So to be more succinct McConnell is going to quietly try and sweep this under the big top. The only saving about Trump is that he won't let this happen. He craves the spotlight and thinks he's always right and wants to turn this into must-see reality TV because its what he thinks he's good at.
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Dec 10, 2019 20:45
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Oracle posted:The only saving about Trump is that he won't let this happen. He craves the spotlight and thinks he's always right and wants to turn this into must-see reality TV because its what he thinks he's good at. I hope Trump takes McConnell's tactics to save his rear end as an attempt to deny him the public vindication he thinks he's entitled to and publicly and clearly drags him through the mud over it. The only thing that could get McConnell out is Trump telling his base to forward forsake him. If Trump ends McConnell's career, it will be the biggest silver lining we could hope for. Edit: And if you think that could never happen, remember how badly Trump hosed McConnell's real and replace bill.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:02
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I assume that the moment the Senate starts up the impeachment trial Durham will start dropping criminal referrals to the DOJ against anyone even tangentially involved in the Mueller investigation, Barr will find every one of them credible, and then we'll have a whole made-for-counterprogramming show trial (or set of show trials) during the formal impeachment process. Like if I was Peter Strzok or James Comey I'd already be planning for it.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:11
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SubG posted:I assume that the moment the Senate starts up the impeachment trial Durham will start dropping criminal referrals to the DOJ against anyone even tangentially involved in the Mueller investigation, Barr will find every one of them credible, and then we'll have a whole made-for-counterprogramming show trial (or set of show trials) during the formal impeachment process. Like if I was Peter Strzok or James Comey I'd already be planning for it. Would it be able to move that fast though?
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Dec 10, 2019 21:13
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Gatts posted:Don’t forget Mitch is on the take from Russian money so even if he has concerns with the GOP he had them build a plant in Kentucky and he might go for broke to support his meal ticket. Might place that as more important than the Republican Party. I don't think it's even built yet, or at the very least not complete. Last I could find was stuff from mid-year where the location is still a field.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:13
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Taerkar posted:I don't think it's even built yet, or at the very least not complete. Last I could find was stuff from mid-year where the location is still a field. The money's still in McConnell's pocket regardless if the plant materializes or not. See Wisconsin, Foxconn.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:14
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SchrodingersCat posted:The Democratic party right now is what the Republican party was in the 1960s. Our politics have moved that far to the right. This is utter nonsense. The Democratic party of the civil Rights era? Yeah?
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Dec 10, 2019 21:15
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. The Republicans know that America is trending progressive and anti-rich, and are fighting for their lives, which is why they are fully inviting foreign interference and money.
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bird cooch posted:This is utter nonsense. The Democratic party of the civil Rights era? Yeah? yeah, the Dems have gone far right on economic issues but have improved in most facets of civil rights
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Dec 10, 2019 21:17
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bird cooch posted:This is utter nonsense. The Democratic party of the civil Rights era? Yeah? Well, the Democrats of the Civil Rights era were still a weird mishmash of left and right wing ideologies due to the lingering influence of the Dixiecrats. They were largely left on most issues as of the early 70s.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:26
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SchrodingersCat posted:Well, the Democrats of the Civil Rights era were still a weird mishmash of left and right wing ideologies due to the lingering influence of the Dixiecrats. They were largely left on most issues as of the early 70s. The Democrats are always going to be a weird mismash. In reality there's two parties, the Republicans and then everybody else. Post New deal there's not really a central rallying point or rallying figure the way that the Republicans have religion and abortion. in a way the big tent works a lot better it's far more inclusive but it ends up with having blue dogs and socialists and everybody else sharing a table. that can be good and bad and gives a lot of people reasons to be upset and it also gives a lot of people exposure to ideas that they wouldn't hear. But the idea of them going far right on economic issues, that isn't even true. It's wildly untrue. As far left as many of the posters on here would want them to be? No no no no. Left at all? That's loving debatable for sure. But you look at the u.s. population on a hole and they're far more representative than the Republicans are. bird cooch fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Dec 10, 2019 |
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Dec 10, 2019 21:29
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The GOP has been a big tent party as well, but until the last few decades the various factions of it were mostly involved with their own things and didn't really care about the other extremists. The Neocon military types didn't care about the big business types who didn't care about the hyper-religious types who didn't care about the super-racist types who didn't give a poo poo about what little remained of the 'moderate conservative' after all of the fringes pulled people away from the pseudo-center. They're straining now because the fringes are all trying to take the wheel and direct everything towards their fringe over the others, but the party hasn't fractured because they're all still united in 'Making the Libs Mad'
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Dec 10, 2019 21:37
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First step is to cut out the right/fringe. Second step is to drag it all left. Third is to fight those who fight against dragging to the left back to sanity. If the Dems win, that’s a shift to cut out fringe. Then fight the battle within the party as you drag leftward.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:39
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Gatts posted:First step is to cut out the right/fringe. Second step is to drag it all left. Third is to fight those who fight against dragging to the left back to sanity. Oh OK just "cut out" the huge segment of insane people in the USA. It's so simple.
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Dec 10, 2019 21:46
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Gatts posted:First step is to cut out the right/fringe. Second step is to drag it all left. Third is to fight those who fight against dragging to the left back to sanity. How are you going to do that when they have their own media bubble that tells them what they want to hear and anything that conflicts with their worldview is instantly labeled fake news? When most of the mass media is owned by the same billionaires that aren't down with what the left is selling and actively fight against it or misconstrue facts on the ground to keep up a horserace narrative that keeps eyes on the screen?
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Dec 10, 2019 21:47
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Oracle posted:How are you going to do that when they have their own media bubble that tells them what they want to hear and anything that conflicts with their worldview is instantly labeled fake news? When most of the mass media is owned by the same billionaires that aren't down with what the left is selling and actively fight against it or misconstrue facts on the ground to keep up a horserace narrative that keeps eyes on the screen? Well, the slow decline of people giving a poo poo about mass media, for one. Basically, a bunch of boomers have to die
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Dec 10, 2019 21:52
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theflyingorc posted:Well, the slow decline of people giving a poo poo about mass media, for one. Not disagreeing, but I always find these comments interesting because what people are really saying is "my parents and a lot of my friend's parents have to die".
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Dec 10, 2019 22:00
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UnknownTarget posted:Not disagreeing, but I always find these comments interesting because what people are really saying is "my parents and a lot of my friend's parents have to die". They won't give up power any other way. Edit: Also many people here have Gen-Xers for parents.
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Dec 10, 2019 22:14
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UnknownTarget posted:Not disagreeing, but I always find these comments interesting because what people are really saying is "my parents and a lot of my friend's parents have to die". I also highly doubt we're talking about singling out post-boomers (~1965 onwards) either
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Dec 10, 2019 22:14
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There will be a weird inflection point sometime soon when baby boomers really start to die en mass. The millenials are all hitting 30 so maaaaaybe they'll actually vote regularly. I wonder if they'll actually vote as liberal as people think. One thing that is really apparent from talking to my older relatives is that they have NO idea how bad the economy has been for younger people. It feels to me like if you aren't in tech it's hard to get a job that pays well. Also there's the whole "the country is addicted to painkillers because life is awful for an enormous chunk of people" thing that everyone would like to ignore.
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Dec 10, 2019 22:15
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UnknownTarget posted:Not disagreeing, but I always find these comments interesting because what people are really saying is "my parents and a lot of my friend's parents have to die". Yeah and it really sucks, I'd prefer for Boomers to break their mass delusion but, well
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Dec 10, 2019 22:15
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theflyingorc posted:Well, the slow decline of people giving a poo poo about mass media, for one. The moneyed interests behind movement conservatism are already covering for that by propping up various new media talking heads and outlets.
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Dec 10, 2019 22:18
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Fart Amplifier posted:Oh OK just "cut out" the huge segment of insane people in the USA. It's so simple.
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Dec 10, 2019 22:20
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PeterWeller posted:The moneyed interests behind movement conservatism are already covering for that by propping up various new media talking heads and outlets. I mean yeah, but it's not working anywhere near as well as Fox It seems to be doing a terrible job recruiting, and a good job radicalizing the ones you already have. Which means they do insane things that hurt recruitment
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Dec 10, 2019 22:20
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Spite posted:There will be a weird inflection point sometime soon when baby boomers really start to die en mass. the reason boomers went to the GOP was because of FYGM. Young people cannot do that unless/until they get rich too. So the chance that millennials shift right as they age is not good
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Dec 10, 2019 22:21
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oxsnard posted:the reason boomers went to the GOP was because of FYGM. Young people cannot do that unless/until they get rich too. So the chance that millennials shift right as they age is not good That FYGM attitude can be simulated though by simply taking more away from whatever minority their prospective voters dislike too. Easy Peasy.
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Dec 10, 2019 22:34
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DandyLion posted:That FYGM attitude can be simulated though by simply taking more away from whatever minority their prospective voters dislike too. Easy Peasy. Millennials WERE drifting to the right (although they were more left than any previous generation) like previous generations as they got older Until 2016, when they shot like 12 points to the left. Millennials are going to be so much better than their parents lol
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Dec 10, 2019 22:41
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theflyingorc posted:Millennials WERE drifting to the right (although they were more left than any previous generation) like previous generations as they got older Would love to see polling data on this not gonna lie
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Dec 10, 2019 22:44
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https://twitter.com/GeoffRBennett/status/1204518922873167873?s=20
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Dec 10, 2019 22:55
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Spiffster posted:Would love to see polling data on this not gonna lie https://www.people-press.org/2018/03/01/1-generations-party-identification-midterm-voting-preferences-views-of-trump/ The second page has this graphic:  edit: also notice the huge shift in boomers and silents away from Democrats the second they elect a black man And it was PERMANENT for silents lol theflyingorc fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Dec 10, 2019 |
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Dec 10, 2019 23:03
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Oracle posted:Would it be able to move that fast though? So unless you really believe that they're about to blow the lid off this whole deep state conspiracy (or whatever it is they're claiming) then it sure as poo poo looks like it's a politically-motivated hatchet job, and if Durham wants to start producing referrals and Barr wants to start charging based on them there isn't a lot to stop them. I suppose they might have so little that they can't find a grand jury to actually follow up with indictments, but even if they can't possibly win anything at trial doesn't mean that they can't abuse the process to distract from impeachment.
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Dec 10, 2019 23:07
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theflyingorc posted:Well, the slow decline of people giving a poo poo about mass media, for one. By the time the boomers are dead, your own children and grandchildren will be rooting for you to die.
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Dec 10, 2019 23:20
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Fart Amplifier posted:Oh OK just "cut out" the huge segment of insane people in the USA. It's so simple. Right but the Dems have made progress and gains in recent elections. Have to ungerrymander after.
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Dec 10, 2019 23:46
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Spite posted:The millenials are all hitting 30 so maaaaaybe they'll actually vote regularly. I wonder if they'll actually vote as liberal as people think. Given millennials' historic low numbers of homeownership and kid having, voter turnout for this generation may end up not manifesting in as large of numbers as we hope.
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Dec 10, 2019 23:50
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Oracle posted:most people don't start voting regularly until they a) buy a house (and figure out how much property taxes cost) or b) have kids (and realize their property taxes fund schools and school boards do stuff that they don't like). Basically until local politics starts directly visibly affecting them, most people don't have a reason to bother. It really is just about age. Millennial turnout has increased as they got older at about the same rate as previous generations. In 2018 Gen X, Millennials and Zoomers outvoted Boomers and Silents for the first time.
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Dec 10, 2019 23:59
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Deteriorata posted:By the time the boomers are dead, your own children and grandchildren will be rooting for you to die. Hey, if the country moves far enough left that my views make me a centrist, I will loving die happy.
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Dec 11, 2019 00:24
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