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So, it's been long enough to not have to bother spoilering show stuff. But a friendly reminder to try and be careful about book and game stuff, as there's a decent chunk of watchers new to the franchise! I say this knowing I've probably slipped up like 7 times alrdy but let's be the change we want to see or whatever lmao
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Dec 30, 2019 10:20
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It really upsets me that people call him The Bard. He has two names god drat it.
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Dec 30, 2019 10:36
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I went into this show completely cold, clicking on the Netflix recommendation without so much as seeing a poster showing all the protagonists. I knew vaguely that there was a video game called The Witcher, but that was my total knowledge of the franchise. Anyways, I was dubious by the end of the first episode, given the gratuitous softcore wizard porn, the princess mentioning her rape and Geralt being called out for being an emotionless monster. So far, so GoT grimdark. But it was the holidays and I was bored, so I put on episode two and boom, Jaskier appeared, and suddenly Geralt was less Brooding Macho Hero and more grumpy Shrek with his lute-playing Donkey trailing behind him. Given how grimdark episode 1 had been I was ready to turn off the show once Jaskier got murdered by the monster but drat, he made it, and I was completely sold on the show. One thing I really don't get is what a Witcher actually is. This is what I gleaned from the show: - Witchers are unaging beings who only die from being killed. Geralt is way older than he looks. - This is because Witchers are mutants. They wear cool medallions to mark themselves as Witchers. I think they're created from a curse on their mother like the Striga are?? - Maybe they earn these medallions when they learn their amazing sword skills? Does being a Witcher make you an amazing swordsman or is this a result of being both magically young and having half a century of fighting experience? - Witchers aren't being made any more because some sort of kingdom fell in the years before Calanthe was born? Geralt was muttering when he made a remark so I missed the exact explanation. - They definitely don't breed to make more because Geralt is sterile. - Witchers have blunted emotions... or maybe that's just a facade - Witchers have yellow eyes, which is Creepy in-universe, and sometimes when they fight their eyes go black. - Geralt has some sort of Airbending magic power where he can throw an airpunch at people. It's not particularly powerful; good enough for knocking people back a few steps, not strong enough to punch a princess out of her own tornado - sometimes he drinks healing potions. We don't know where do these come from, but we know people in the magic school make potions. Maybe this is why he knows Mousesack?? Help, I don't want to use the video game wiki and risk getting spoiled for the post-season plot.
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Dec 30, 2019 12:17
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codswallop posted:I went into this show completely cold, clicking on the Netflix recommendation without so much as seeing a poster showing all the protagonists. I knew vaguely that there was a video game called The Witcher, but that was my total knowledge of the franchise. Most of this will almost definitely be explained in season 2, but is just backstory and not really a spoiler: On a very basic level, Witchers were taken/bought/law-of-surprised as children and taken through a process that mutates them into Witchers. It involves a lot of potions and poo poo, and kills the majority of people it's used on. If they survive they're a Witcher and have superhuman senses (which causes the cat eyes) can drink potions to enhance their abilities (which causes the black eyes) and are generally better at combat (although they do a shitload of training too). They're basically an ancient order of monster hunters for hire - but they don't kill intelligent creatures. They learn some basic spells (called signs), but we only see a few in the show. They can summon fire and poo poo if they need to, but they mostly use it for cooking and candles. Everyone hates them because a load of propaganda painted them as emotionless monsters (and swindlers - a lot of people try to get out of paying them for their monster killing work), so at some point in the recent past their home (a smallish keep called Kaer Morhen) was invaded by pitchfork wielding villagers and their mutation equipment got all hosed up, and most of the Witchers were killed. There's only a handful left and they can't make any more (and they either can't breed or refuse to, I forget).
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Dec 30, 2019 12:31
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Witchers are made by subjecting young children to mutations. The children are either given away by their families / orphaned / taken as payment for witcher services. This is also a part of why they are hated, they literally steal babies. The mutations are induced by a long course of administering various herbs and potions, and only a fraction of the initiates survive due to the massive toxicity of the preparations. Also throughout their education, the witchers are taught strict discipline and combat skills, becoming essentially warrior monks. Their unique combat abilities are then a combination of the mutagens' effects and of rigorous training. Other effects of the mutation include immunity to disease and poisons, longevity, ability to use simple magic (the airbending power, among others), but also sterility. The immunity is also what allows them to use potions, which would be deadly to a normal human. As for their ability to feel emotions, that's never totally cleared, but probably it's just that most witchers suffer from fantasy PTSD and are unable to connect with non-witchers. In Geralt's case, he also likes to use his supposed lack of emotions as a convenient excuse not to get involved in other people's squabbles. Witchers aren't made anymore because the main fortress where they use to be trained has been sacked, but also the need for them is diminishing. Monsters are becoming rare, steadily pushed away from the civilized world by growing population, settling of once undisturbed lands, new technologies, large standing armies etc.
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Dec 30, 2019 12:33
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codswallop posted:One thing I really don't get is what a Witcher actually is. davidspackage fucked around with this message at 12:54 on Dec 30, 2019 |
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Dec 30, 2019 12:52
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stev posted:He has two names god drat it. Yea, they're "The" and "Bard" 
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Dec 30, 2019 13:42
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Though they'll probably drop the timeline shifting going forward since it's irrelevant to the story from now on, I think they also did it as a means to encourage repeat viewings. Near the end of episode one theres actually a flash forward to episode 8 when Geralt is dreaming about Renfri, but it's actually his hallucination from episode 8 and you can tell because the lighting changes.
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Dec 30, 2019 14:08
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the fact that they cut sword of destiny for evil doppler makes me really worried also the whole loving point of lesser evil is that renfri wasnt an actual monster but a independent woman who caused trouble to her uptight family. the black sun curse is bullshit. Zeta Acosta fucked around with this message at 14:37 on Dec 30, 2019 |
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Dec 30, 2019 14:34
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Just left Brokilon forest. I have only played small amounts of the game. I've enjoyed it, but there's some missing elements. Mainly with Yennefer. I found Yenn's origin compelling, but why she's lame and weak after 30 years I don't understand. Like, her problems basically got cured, but now she's on sadquest to cure the thing she gave up for badass powers? For that to work, i need to see her using badass powers, relish it, get a little cruel, relish some more, then eventually get unhappy. All of that happened offscreen, making Yenn seem weak and lame. Geralt rules. We need more crunchy Witcher stuff, potions, tracking, idk. Ciri's plot is yawnsville. Wanted to skip Brokilon. More monster of the week, but tracking, clue gathering, revealing of political secrets. Dialogue needs trimmed up a bit. Any royal scene has the royals saying "This sucks!" for five minutes, then getting on with the meaty stuff. Showing/telling, etc. Overall enjoyable, but the writing for Yenn is super frustrating.
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Dec 30, 2019 14:50
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It's not fantasy PTSD. Imagine being an unwanted child taken to a scary remote place with lots of weird mutated old guys and being subjected to what seems (to you) to be unsual and cruel punishment in the form of grueling training. And after years of that 70% of your friends get killed in the Trial of the Grasses. You'd be a little grumpy too. ThePopeOfFun posted:Just left Brokilon forest. I have only played small amounts of the game. I've enjoyed it, but there's some missing elements. Mainly with Yennefer. If you're talking about the episode with the assassin, she was weak because she's been "wiping royal asses" for 30 years instead of challenging herself. itry fucked around with this message at 15:05 on Dec 30, 2019 |
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Dec 30, 2019 15:02
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LAW OF SURPRISE ....gently caress
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Dec 30, 2019 15:14
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stev posted:Most of this will almost definitely be explained in season 2, but is just backstory and not really a spoiler: Isn't that just a Geralt thing? From what i remember Lambert didn't really give a gently caress.
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Dec 30, 2019 15:56
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Yeah, there aren't really rules, but Geralt likes to pretend there is a Witcher's code so he can make up excuses to turn down jobs.
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Dec 30, 2019 16:07
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Netflix just put out a video on youtube of Henry Cavill reading The Witcher https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUST_IQYp-o
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Dec 30, 2019 16:20
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CJ posted:Isn't that just a Geralt thing? From what i remember Lambert didn't really give a gently caress. IIRC It's kind of a school of the Wolf thing, but Lambert is a prick and very cynical. With the falling of the keep, Lambert realizes he can do whatever he wants and breaks a whole lot of the former rules.
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Dec 30, 2019 16:22
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ThePopeOfFun posted:I found Yenn's origin compelling, but why she's lame and weak after 30 years I don't understand. Like, her problems basically got cured, but now she's on sadquest to cure the thing she gave up for badass powers? For that to work, i need to see her using badass powers, relish it, get a little cruel, relish some more, then eventually get unhappy. All of that happened offscreen, making Yenn seem weak and lame. Yenn's a pretty horrendous person tbh, but she's baby crazy because of trauma, not because she wants a baby in particular. She wants everything, and resents people who have more than her for their luck, and tends to characterise them as stupid and worthless (even when they're not, like Fringella). I wouldn't mind all that so much, except she also hates poor people and holds them in contempt. (episode seven) Apparently, she'd rather people starve if it ensures she's well off.
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Dec 30, 2019 16:26
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CJ posted:Isn't that just a Geralt thing? From what i remember Lambert didn't really give a gently caress. Lambert rules.
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Dec 30, 2019 16:34
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stev posted:Most of this will almost definitely be explained in season 2, but is just backstory and not really a spoiler: Fantastic, that's what I was after. steinrokkan posted:Witchers are made by subjecting young children to mutations. This actually all makes sense now Wait, Druid? Mousesack wasn't the Court Mage? Was there a Court Mage in Calanthe's court? Were there any other druids in the story? God I'm so confused again. But talking about the mages, I was really hooked on Yennefer's storyline. Like I said, I went in so cold I hadn't even seen the posters, so the first time I saw her without her deformities was in the grand reveal at the Ball. They did a good job over her first episodes establishing her personality before the change, so she didn't follow the usual trope of Poor Victim Who Only Blossoms When Beautiful. She grew into her power and ambition before her change, and with that thirty year jump we got to see that the world hadn't changed her, it had just disappointed her. (It says something about how low my expectations are for fantasy women that I was actually impressed that she only hooked up with Geralt once she was middle aged too)
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Dec 30, 2019 16:55
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Witcher 3 makes it pretty explicit without outright stating it so I'm not sure this is canon, BUT ANYWAY: another reason they don't make more witchers is that the surviving witchers have unpleasant memories of most of their childhood friends dying from magical mutations and surgeries and have miserable aimless lives and therefore aren't motivated to restart the process.
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Dec 30, 2019 17:07
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Arglebargle III posted:Witcher 3 makes it pretty explicit without outright stating it so I'm not sure this is canon, BUT ANYWAY: another reason they don't make more witchers is that the surviving witchers have unpleasant memories of most of their childhood friends dying from magical mutations and surgeries and have miserable aimless lives and therefore aren't motivated to restart the process. Were girl-children ever put through the process? Is Calanthe over here thinking that her Ciri is in danger of being Witcher'd if Geralt claims her?
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Dec 30, 2019 17:17
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Are there many differences between cat, wolf, viper and manticore? Did I miss any?
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Dec 30, 2019 17:32
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I'm surprised by how much I like this show
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Dec 30, 2019 17:44
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codswallop posted:Makes sense! And if their Order was destroyed, I imagine they'd probably have to practice on a few kids before refining their first-hand memories of the ordeal into the most workable practices. There are only male witchers. Women don't survive the mutation process according to the books, iirc.
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Dec 30, 2019 17:48
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Solice Kirsk posted:Lambert rules. We need a Keira/Lambert spinoff
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Dec 30, 2019 17:54
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codswallop posted:Makes sense! And if their Order was destroyed, I imagine they'd probably have to practice on a few kids before refining their first-hand memories of the ordeal into the most workable practices. Girls can't survive the mutations. The survival rate is already around 30% with boys. Best not to try it with girls. edt: btn To atone for posting this information second, here's some more Witcher lore: The games again imply* that many witchers who do survive the mutations end up with severe nervous system damage, and so the stories about witchers with no emotions are not without cause. By the time the books take place we only meet old witchers, because they're the only ones who took the mutations well enough to survive. The kids who survived training but had burnt-out brains all died on the job early in their careers. *One of the reasons W3 is hailed as one of the greatest RPGs of all times is that it manages to have its virtual models actually act through scenes. When I say it's implied, I'm often talking about how the characters in Witcher 3 respond to an event without dialogue. For example in Witcher 3 a young character is subjected to the Witcher mutations, and the reactions of the Witchers present says a lot without them having to deliver any dialogue. Of the witchers present at the mutations/surgery, Geralt looks horrified, Lambert stomps off angrily, Eskel slinks away when nobody is looking, and Vesemir turns away so he doesn't have to watch. None of them deliver dialogue but it's strongly implied they are dealing with terrible memories. This is one reason why Witcher 3 is such a good game. Apparently we will meet these characters in season 2 if you have no idea who those people are. Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Dec 30, 2019 |
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Dec 30, 2019 17:58
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i say swears online posted:Are there many differences between cat, wolf, viper and manticore? Did I miss any? Cat school went all in on being crazy assassins according to Seasons of Storms. Vipers and the other schools really only get covered in the games so they're not really relevant to the show.
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Dec 30, 2019 17:59
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Wild Horses posted:LAW OF SURPRISE LAR'OSURPRISE  Tythas posted:Netflix just put out a video on youtube of Henry Cavill reading The Witcher
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Dec 30, 2019 18:27
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He's dry in this but I like him as Geralt more than pretty much any other role I've seen him in.
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Dec 30, 2019 18:37
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Alhazred posted:It's kinda weird of the direction of this show seems to have been "make Cavill as uncharismatic as possible". That’s the character though. Cavil should get to use more range next season.
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Dec 30, 2019 18:40
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I first saw Cavill in the Count of Monte Cristo and he was good in that, and I far prefer him to Reeves in his Superman role. Haven't seen Mission Impossible. But he does really well in every role I've seen him in, especially as Geralt, and never quite get the criticism of him.
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Dec 30, 2019 18:40
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chaosapiant posted:I first saw Cavill in the Count of Monte Cristo and he was good in that, and I far prefer him to Reeves in his Superman role. Haven't seen Mission Impossible. But he does really well in every role I've seen him in, especially as Geralt, and never quite get the criticism of him. Same.  What's charisma got to do with reading a book?
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Dec 30, 2019 18:43
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Witcher Schools each have their own styles too. Some focus more on swordsmanship, others potion making. You could think of them like MMO classes, Bear is Tank, Viper is DPS, Manticore is Support, Wolf is the balanced one. Not perfect analog but it explains it enough. Also I always figured that Yennifer being around Geralt so much made her a better person. Geralt is written as someone who truely cares about people, especially common people. You can't really hang around with him for a long time without that rubbing off.
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Dec 30, 2019 18:45
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itry posted:Same. He shows more natural charisma reading the book than during the show, so I have to assume making Geralt boring and uncharismatic was an intentional choice by the ones producing the show and not by Cavill. The show was fine but Geralt was the worst thing about it. It would honestly be much better if the show focused on the mages, it certainly seems like that was what writers were most interested by. I actually did like that the show made the viewer figure out the various timelines in the show and I wish that more shows would do the same. We don't always need letters on the screen saying "ten years ago" or "now". Alhazred fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Dec 30, 2019 |
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Dec 30, 2019 18:50
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Cavill as Geralt being the worst part of the show is a helluva take, but to each their own!
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Dec 30, 2019 19:07
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Alhazred posted:He shows more natural charisma reading the book than during the show, so I have to assume making Geralt boring and uncharismatic was an intentional choice by the ones producing the show and not by Cavill. The show was fine but Geralt was the worst thing about it. It would honestly be much better if the show focused on the mages, it certainly seems like that was what writers were most interested by. Ah, got it. I think hobbesmaster is correct in saying Cavill will have more to work with next season with Geralt showing more of his human side.
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Dec 30, 2019 19:08
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One thing to point out is this is all from the books and games, the show has certainly been willing to play fast and loose with the established setting at times. Also a lot of those Witcher Schools are pretty much entirely created by CD Projekt to be those type of MMO classes. I think only the Cat & Wolf School (Geralts) are mentioned in the original books.
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Dec 30, 2019 19:09
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itry posted:Ah, got it. The training of Ciri with Geralt in Blood of Elves is one of my favorite parts of the entire series. "For I am....indisposed!"
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Dec 30, 2019 19:09
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Solice Kirsk posted:Lambert rules. So long as the show lasts long enough/deals with CDPR get done so that we get this scene, I'll be happy: 
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Dec 30, 2019 19:25
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I'll be happy enough to see Coen, Lambert, Eskel, and Vesemir next season when they're all teaching Ciri and Lambert keeps pissing off Triss by calling her "Merigold". Edit: added spoiler bar just in case
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Dec 30, 2019 19:27
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