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Nilfgaard also speak a dialect of elvish and most of the nilfgaardians proper are mixed elf-humans and they don't try to cover it up.
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Jan 1, 2020 05:24
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Phenotype posted:Also, and I think this goes along with the discussion you book-readers are having, the Nilfgaardians seem pretty chill? The first guy I met was asking a farmer what they could spare in taxes, and the farmer says "forty bushels of grain", and the Nilfgaard captain says "okay, bring us thirty bushels and we're good." They've all been pretty good dudes so far, I expected more evil assholes in armor made from the scrotums of their wailing victims. Geralt points out how unusual that captain's gentle hand is, and if you've played pretty much any further at all you've seen how quickly that act disappears
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Jan 1, 2020 05:28
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They're certainly evil in the sense of any exploitative imperial power, but needless butchery and cruelty of the Radovid kind isn't really what they're about, at least not in the games. They want obedient, productive vassals not heads on pikes.
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Jan 1, 2020 05:51
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:They also mentioned that Calanthe had killed some elves in their campaign against non-humans but that was glossed over pretty quickly.
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Jan 1, 2020 06:37
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Nilfgard in the books and video games is more Rome and less... whatever the gently caress they are in the show. Holy Roman Empire?
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Jan 1, 2020 07:28
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Wasn't it mentioned like four times? Maybe they never really lingered on it, but I feel like they laid the groundwork pretty well that Calanthe got what was coming to her, and that Ciri's love for her is not the same as her being a good person, at all. Like, they establish really well that the humans in general and Cintra in particular has a genocidal attitude towards elves, that's not exactly the characteristics of a (modern) hero. The idea that Cintra vs. Nilfgaard is a battle between good and evil has to ignore some pretty clear evidence that Cintra is one flavor of bad guy getting beat up by a different stronger flavor of bad guy. I reckon it's a deliberate recontextualisation brought about by the show's narrative ploys. When you're introduced to Cintra's royal family they seem like pretty fun and decent rulers, but by the time you roll back around to those scenes you have a very different take on events.
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Jan 1, 2020 08:17
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hobbesmaster posted:Anachronism is not the right word. Idiosyncrasies?
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Jan 1, 2020 10:55
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Wild Horses posted:eh i'd say lioness country (dont know the name) comes across as pretty bad, what with all the genocide they did some years ago and also their queen totally flagrantry trying to gently caress geralt out of his "destiny" (which apparently is almost legally binding) numerous times. And the "good" magic school is also fueled by human sacrifice.
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Jan 1, 2020 11:00
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BrotherJayne posted:Nilfgard in the books and video games is more Rome and less... whatever the gently caress they are in the show. Holy Roman Empire? I always felt like Nilfgaard is supposed to be the Ottomans, considering the slavic roots of the setting; it's just turned to eleven in the show.
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Jan 1, 2020 12:21
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So I just had a dumb revelation watching the show. Geralt's first wish in Bottled Appetites was for peace and quiet, not for the Djinn to go gently caress it self via elven prayer as per the books. I didn't catch that the first time I watched it because my brain knew what was supposed to happen and just kinda glazed over. Wonder what else I missed. This second viewing is great!
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Jan 1, 2020 12:55
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I'm also doing a second viewing and I noticed a ton of clues to the multiple timelines in the first two episodes, but in the first viewing I was completely new to the setting, trying to juggle all the new fantasy names/terms/general history/etc. and it's easy to lose that stuff in the jumble. And I'm even more convinced that ep 3 is the best.
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Jan 1, 2020 13:20
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Bip Roberts posted:Just imagine how easy it was to animate that 100% dead assed dragon. Yea just wished they animated the living one better. I half expected it to be voiced by Sean Connery.
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Jan 1, 2020 16:12
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I'm beginning to think a lot of the Witcher memes and all the hype of the Toss a Coin song are being artificially generated by Netflix. It's just not that good of a song.
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Jan 1, 2020 16:41
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I liked the series as a whole. It was a fun ride, and though it looks cheap when it comes to stuff like dragons, Nilfgaard armor, Aretuza(sp?) it's a charming sort of cheap like I'm watching a SyFi channel show in the early 00s. The show doesn't take itself super seriously even though the subject matter and setting are both pretty dark and heavy. I didn't have trouble picking up on the multiple timelines thing after the first couple episodes, and the fact that Geralt was locked up in a cell during the Nilfgaard siege the whole time reveal was telegraphed hours of screen time in advance. I came into the whole thing cold. No books or video games in this setting for me. Everyone who says the show is coding the North as the "good guys" and Nilfgaard as the "bad guys" isn't paying attention. The show uses semiotics to give you this initial impression for the first episode (perhaps to draw you into a more easily understood setting) then spends the entire rest of the show showing you that everyone is an rear end in a top hat even if they wear a white hat. Geralt out and about doing his job is where the show is at its strongest, I think. I hope there's more monster of the week sort of stuff like the striga even at the expense of stalling the plot a little.
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Jan 1, 2020 17:20
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Solice Kirsk posted:I'm beginning to think a lot of the Witcher memes and all the hype of the Toss a Coin song are being artificially generated by Netflix. It's just not that good of a song. I mean, yeah. That's how netflix operates.
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Jan 1, 2020 17:26
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Solice Kirsk posted:I'm beginning to think a lot of the Witcher memes and all the hype of the Toss a Coin song are being artificially generated by Netflix. It's just not that good of a song. This is definitely true but it's also a really catchy song.
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Jan 1, 2020 17:45
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BrotherJayne posted:Nilfgard in the books and video games is more Rome and less... whatever the gently caress they are in the show. Holy Roman Empire? Yeah, they practice chattel slavery and cart off whole populations to feed their economy.
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Jan 1, 2020 18:22
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ShakeZula posted:Geralt points out how unusual that captain's gentle hand is, and if you've played pretty much any further at all you've seen how quickly that act disappears Yep, I saw that guy again last night and the farmer gave him a bunch of spoiled grain even though the captain was so generous about the taxes, and so the captain had him whipped. Again, very reasonable and chill of him not to just kill the farmer outright for attempted sabotage. I have a feeling I'm going to be very pro-Nilfgaard during this game. Seems like exactly the firm hand these Nordic barbarians need to drag them kicking and screaming into the 14th century.
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Jan 1, 2020 19:07
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Solice Kirsk posted:I'm beginning to think a lot of the Witcher memes and all the hype of the Toss a Coin song are being artificially generated by Netflix. It's just not that good of a song.
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Jan 1, 2020 19:21
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Netflix didnt even have the song up on spotify or any streaming services when the series first came out, so doesn't seem to me like they were trying very hard to drum up interest. They've certainly been hyping it up on twitter after they realized people liked it.
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Jan 1, 2020 19:26
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Vilgefortz in episode 8: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIPlOInTo-Y
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Jan 1, 2020 20:57
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Phenotype posted:Yep, I saw that guy again last night and the farmer gave him a bunch of spoiled grain even though the captain was so generous about the taxes, and so the captain had him whipped. Again, very reasonable and chill of him not to just kill the farmer outright for attempted sabotage. I have a feeling I'm going to be very pro-Nilfgaard during this game. Seems like exactly the firm hand these Nordic barbarians need to drag them kicking and screaming into the 14th century. The question is whether the authoritarian order they bring with them justifies the mass slaughter and impressment of the territories they conquer. Nilfgaard presents itself as order to a world beset by chaos. But to the average person it is just trading one oppressor for another. Sure Nilfgaard won't let some upstart prince go for a happy murder romp but they'll still conscript you to do slave labour after they've rolled into town and slaughtered all the fighting men that the local lord has levied for resistance. That's if you're lucky. They also tend to emphasize military priority and will harshly punish anything and anyone that impedes progress. Whipping is the lightest offense but the most common is execution. Areas that refuse to capitulate get put to the sword and then they bring in settlers to rebuild the region from the ground up. People have already said that Nilfgaard is like Rome or 20th century Germany and they're not wrong. Just remember that being like Rome does not make you good in the slightest. Rome was a nation of expansionist assholes who massacred their way across Europe, Africa and the Middle East to finance their economy and shore up their popularity in Italy. It was unsustainable and fraught with infighting and civil uprisings because it turns out when you rule by strength it just takes someone stronger or smarter than you to undo all your accomplishments. Nilfgaard might be bringing the world into a more modern age but that's hardly a comfort for the people on the bottom who continue to be oppressed and murdered for the sake of progress. Remember what Geralt said in the first episode when he was talking to Roach about his first "monster"? He might have thought he was being a hero but all the girl saw was a white haired mutant kill a guy and douse them all in blood. Nilfgaard is much the same except on an international level. They might be bringing some modernity to the Continent, but to the common person they are an invading army, a monolithic entity that burns whole towns, slaughters those who resist and then imposes harsh rules on the survivors. And when you get further into the game, be sure to visit the Nilfgaardian army camp in the southeast of Velen. There's a quest over there that gives you more of an insight on just how brutal and cruel Nilfgaard can be on the warpath. I don't know how you can justify death marches. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Jan 1, 2020 |
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Jan 1, 2020 20:59
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Also that farmer guy brought the only grain they had, because it takes people to harvest and collect grain and most of those people were killed.
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Jan 1, 2020 22:52
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The Witcher 3 kinda explicitly makes Nilfgaard the Third Reich invading Russia.
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Jan 1, 2020 22:55
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itry posted:Also that farmer guy brought the only grain they had, because it takes people to harvest and collect grain and most of those people were killed. Still sounds like a farmer problem to me. Why did you tell the captain you could give him forty bushels, then? Why didn't you realize the grain was spoiled before you gave it to them? I think that whipping was the best thing that could have happened to that farmer, it might give him the motivation he needs to pull himself up by his bootstraps and do things properly from now on.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:01
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Alchenar posted:The Witcher 3 kinda explicitly makes Nilfgaard the Third Reich invading Russia. So Radovid is Stalin, and Philippa is... a brain hemorrhage?
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Jan 1, 2020 23:02
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Phenotype posted:Still sounds like a farmer problem to me. Why did you tell the captain you could give him forty bushels, then? Why didn't you realize the grain was spoiled before you gave it to them? I think that whipping was the best thing that could have happened to that farmer, it might give him the motivation he needs to pull himself up by his bootstraps and do things properly from now on. Telling a feudal society farmer to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, huh.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:05
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I did a rewatch of the series but skipped basically everything except the Geralt bits and it was great. Books question: is it worth reading 'Season of Storms', which is a one-off book set between the Last Wish and Sword of Destiny short stories collections? It's the only one I haven't read. Atlas Risen posted:Yea just wished they animated the living one better. I half expected it to be voiced by Sean Connery. Bananasaurus Rex posted:Netflix didnt even have the song up on spotify or any streaming services when the series first came out, so doesn't seem to me like they were trying very hard to drum up interest. They've certainly been hyping it up on twitter after they realized people liked it. The song's on their soundcloud though, along with the genuinely great 'The Call of the White Wolf' song which plays at various points including the final episode's credits: https://soundcloud.com/giona_ostinelli/the-song-of-the-white-wolf
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Jan 1, 2020 23:19
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Yeah I don't think their boots even have straps.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:19
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itry posted:Also that farmer guy brought the only grain they had, because it takes people to harvest and collect grain and most of those people were killed. Where did you learn this?
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Jan 1, 2020 23:21
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Alchenar posted:The Witcher 3 kinda explicitly makes Nilfgaard the Third Reich invading Russia. It doesn't. There's nothing to suggest Emhyr wants to wipe out the North. And Radovid is hardly a better option since he wants to unite the North using equally as brutal methods as Nilfgaard, and he's insane to boot. Even Djikstra, the Great Temerian Nationalist, expects to hand Nilfgaard massive concessions in their influence over Northern kingdoms as part of his Northern victory scenario. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Jan 1, 2020 |
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Jan 1, 2020 23:21
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World War 2 in The Witcher is literally the second Nilfgaard War in the book saga, right down to Not Russia and Not Germany dividing up Not Poland while the blitzkrieg overruns Not France. Witcher 3 is just the latest war.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:24
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I just assumed all the Nilfgaard/northern kingdom wars were supposed to be the various Prussian(HRE/German empire)-polish conflicts.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:25
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It's a cultural pastiche rather than a recreation of a specific conflict.Arcsquad12 posted:World War 2 in The Witcher is literally the second Nilfgaard War in the book saga, right down to Not Russia and Not Germany dividing up Not Poland while the blitzkrieg overruns Not France. WWII wasn't the first, or second, or third division of Poland.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:26
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Poland has been invaded and divided so many times over the centuries it's pretty much a running joke, like how Italy changes sides in every single conflict it participates in.steinrokkan posted:WWII wasn't the first, or second, or third division of Poland. A lot of the military jargon Sapkowski uses does seem to invoke the Second World War, specifically. Maybe not a 1:1 comparison but it's definitely there.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:26
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Arglebargle III posted:Where did you learn this? In the game the guy says they don't have enough for the captain's first "request" because the Temerians came through and took all their grain. They most likely also took volunteers to fight the war. Then the Nilfgardians came in and killed some of the local population. Who's going to plant or harvest?
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Jan 1, 2020 23:34
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Poland basically didn't exist from the end of Poland-Lithuania until the end of ww1 with the exception of a brief puppet kingdom created by Napoleon. Nilfgaard always felt like a combination of Prussia/Russia/Austria.
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Jan 1, 2020 23:35
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itry posted:Yeah I don't think their boots even have straps. Well, he'll have to save up for a decent pair of boots first, ones with straps on them. Then maybe he can pull himself up by the straps. itry posted:In the game the guy says they don't have enough for the captain's first "request" because the Temerians came through and took all their grain. They most likely also took volunteers to fight the war. Then the Nilfgardians came in and killed some of the local population. Who's going to plant or harvest? That second bit might be true, but that farmer specifically said he could pay up to forty bushels of grain, and he apparently couldn't come up with even thirty bushels that weren't rotten. Either he's trying to sabotage the army or he's a terrible farmer, and in either case a good bullwhipping sounds like the perfect remedy. Phenotype fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Jan 2, 2020 |
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Jan 2, 2020 00:16
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I think you're missing the part where an uneducated peasant receiving physical punishment for a mistake, whether honest or dishonest, is in fact a bad look for a man who is part of an invading army. Yes, Commander Gwynleve did make an honest effort to appeal to the farmer when they first met, but that doesn't really excuse whipping a man and it doesn't endear Nilfgaard to the locals. Geralt even points out as much if you press the issue.
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Jan 2, 2020 01:00
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Someone asked upthread; but I thought Season of Storms was a very good and fun read. But I like all the Witcher books quite a bit.
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Jan 2, 2020 01:08
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