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RBA Starblade posted:I only just realized some leg mods are zero weight, incidentally There are zero weight arm mods as well which are amazing if you can mass them properly. I filled my Firestarter with the things and it was incredibly lethal along with a full load of small lasers. I actually got the achievement for punching an assault mech to death with a light when it finished off a King Crab in melee.
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Jan 11, 2020 12:32
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I played this when it came out, but didn't really make it that far. Picked it up again recently and ran into what feels like a huge difficulty spike in the pretty early game. After the liberation of Weldry, I took a few more missions on that planet, and the jump between a difficulty rating of 1, and a difficulty rating of 2, seems to be huge. The first mission I did after the liberation was challenging, but I came out of it OK. The second one I took was, I guess, an ambush of some sort, since the mission briefing said that they didn't expect an escort- but I wound up facing 3 assault mechs, a heavy mech, and two light mechs, plus light and medium vehicles. All my mechs were mid-range brawler-type assault mechs, and we got completely wrecked. Is there any general guidance for what I should be doing at this stage of the game? I only have assault and light mechs available to field, and not great equipment. But if I go back to fighting lower difficulty missions, I'm not really getting any salvage that would be useful for me- on the other hand, I absolutely can't afford to lose 3-4 assualt mechs in a single mission, I don't have enough backup mechs to stay in the game after something like that ambush.
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Jan 11, 2020 13:51
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Comte de Saint-Germain posted:Is there any general guidance for what I should be doing at this stage of the game? By "Assault 'Mechs" I'm assuming you mean Mediums? Do you have bulwark? Are you making use of cover? Also, post your 'Mech builds, people can offer some advice.
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Jan 11, 2020 14:12
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For that mission I had a Centurion, a Quickdraw, A Vindicator and a Shadowhawk, all stock. I'm using bulwark and cover- though at least in this mission I did a really bad job of positioning and got caught in a space without a lot of cover, but they weren't able to flank me (I couldn't flank them either). I am guessing that one of my problems is that I'm not really super invested into the mech customization, but it feels like the stock versions of the mechs I'm using are not well-specialized, and tend to fit into the same role.
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Jan 11, 2020 14:29
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Yeah the reference to only having lights and assaults is a little odd. What specific mechs have you got? Edit: Comte de Saint-Germain posted:For that mission I had a Centurion, a Quickdraw, A Vindicator and a Shadowhawk, all stock. I'm using bulwark and cover- though at least in this mission I did a really bad job of positioning and got caught in a space without a lot of cover, but they weren't able to flank me (I couldn't flank them either). OK, none of those are assaults, the Quickdraw is a bottom tier heavy that's worse than many mediums. The simplest way to improve stock builds is to replace everything with some combination of medium lasers, SRMs and AC/20s. If you have the Heavy Metal DLC add the smaller LBX and Ultra auto cannons and snub PPCs to the list. LRMs are best used in bulk on a dedicated missile mech that can carry multiple big launchers to knock mechs over from across the map. They're sort of wasted using one smaller one mixed with other weapons. Which the stock loadouts do CONSTANTLY. E2: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fnaqQv8nnYpy9gtQm75-D6fmYfNJ5u3OALSIe8ckOuo/htmlview?sle=true Lazy way to tell good mechs from bad: sort by tons free, mechs with more are better. sean10mm fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Jan 11, 2020 |
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Jan 11, 2020 14:29
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Yeah, I got assault and medium mechs confused. Thanks for the advice. I actually have a decent warchest saved up from spending a lot of time dicking around before Weldry, so I'll visit a planet with a better shop and refit my mechs.
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Jan 11, 2020 15:38
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Jedit posted:The C4 is better than the Zeus for almost anything you care to name. Friends don't let friends use 80T assaults. Are the 80 ton class suboptimal because tons free or something else?
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Jan 11, 2020 15:52
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the yeti posted:Are the 80 ton class suboptimal because tons free or something else? Basically all mechs at the very bottom of their weight class are suboptimal because they (behind the scenes) require heavier engines than the mechs at the very top of the class below them. This gives them fewer free tons, generally heavier JJs (there is an exception here for light assaults who actually can still equip the 1ton JJs) and a lower initiative in return basically nothing.
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Jan 11, 2020 16:01
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the yeti posted:Are the 80 ton class suboptimal because tons free or something else? There are exceptions. The Victor, Battlemaster and Zeus have the same movement speed as the Orion and dont' have any more available free tonnage (see google doc posted earlier). If this was all there was to it, they would be fine: they'd be Orions with slightly different hardpoints and the capacity to carry slightly more armor. However, because they're "Assaults" (80+ tons), they have have a base initiative of 1 instead of 2. This makes them, in general, inferior to the Orion and other high end heavies. This doesn't mean that they aren't useful (at least until you get better mechs). Just think of them as initiative-handicapped Orions with different hardpoints. The Awesome and Stalker are another story. Like the Victor/Battlemaster/Zeus, they also have a base initiative of 1. They're also slower than the Orion. However, they have significantly more available tonnage, which makes them useful even in the context of Orions, and better than the other aforementioned 80/85 tonners. They're outclassed by heavier mechs with similar hardpoints (aside from the BNC M and E), but they're still good (if not best), even in endgame lances.
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Jan 11, 2020 16:17
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I'm wrapping up the flashpoint campaign now and man this dlc has just been a ton of fun. I imagine a sequel is next but I'd definitely buy another season pass
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Jan 11, 2020 16:23
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Thanks y’all; I think I knew most of those things piecemeal but hadn’t connected it all together intuitively as a gap in performance
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Jan 11, 2020 16:38
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Lol, I ended the campaign headshotting two Cyclops Qs - turns out you can only make one of the same mech at a time. Yang throws the other three parts in the trash I guess  I also shot the Black Widow in the back and my Annihilator's UAC10s blew away the Bounty Hunter Annihilator's LBX10s. 
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Jan 11, 2020 17:02
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RBA Starblade posted:Lol, I ended the campaign headshotting two Cyclops Qs - turns out you can only make one of the same mech at a time. Yang throws the other three parts in the trash I guess First time I attempted the final mission, the bounty hunter immediately crit out the leg ammo in my Atlas. Second attempt, I'm running an ECM lance. The bounty hunter sprints in to spot the ECM lance. He was the first mech to go down. Later on, the Black Widow moved melee, and she got precision-strike backshot by my CP10-Z ML/SRM brawler. My ECM Atlas still got hosed up, but still pulled it off. The final mission is a good example of what a "boss fight" type mission should look like. It was nice to fight against mechs with upgraded equipment: kind of interesting to fight against mechs with stability+++ LRMs, hit-def gyros, DHS, etc. There should be more missions like this. Generic contracts where you fight against "elite" house units or mercenaries with upgraded/custom mechs, and boss missions in flashpoints where you fight against tricked out configs like the black widow/bounty hunter lance.
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Jan 11, 2020 17:27
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the yeti posted:Thanks y’all; I think I knew most of those things piecemeal but hadn’t connected it all together intuitively as a gap in performance If you have any MT pilots, you can use the fast 80/85 tonners before you salvage better assaults and heavies. In one career, I salvaged a Zeus early, and I used it like a heavy mech/fire support mech for a while. It performed just fine until I salvaged better mechs.
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Jan 11, 2020 17:28
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I seriously need that move speed mod I don't have two hours to play a mission. Anyone know its name at least?
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Jan 11, 2020 17:33
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Arglebargle III posted:I seriously need that move speed mod I don't have two hours to play a mission. Anyone know its name at least? There is a speed up combat option in the options menu now that makes things WAY faster (maybe too fast really) Also spacebar at any point to skip animations. I don't think the quick cam mod works quite right after 1.8 but I haven't checked in a month or so.
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Jan 11, 2020 17:41
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Organ Fiend posted:First time I attempted the final mission, the bounty hunter immediately crit out the leg ammo in my Atlas. I immediately fell back into the high ground forest and camped taking a potshot or two for a couple rounds then stormed down. The Bull Shark ate a few gauss shots to the chest but it made it out My favorite moment was when I opened fire on the Widow's Marauder, missed, and all the stray shots hit the mech next to it, then the Hunter's Atlas aimed at it, did the same thing, and blew the rando mech to pieces.
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Jan 11, 2020 17:47
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Ravenfood posted:Basically all mechs at the very bottom of their weight class are suboptimal because they (behind the scenes) require heavier engines than the mechs at the very top of the class below them. This gives them fewer free tons, generally heavier JJs (there is an exception here for light assaults who actually can still equip the 1ton JJs) and a lower initiative in return basically nothing. tabletop mech design rules desperately need a stake driven into their heart
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Jan 11, 2020 18:08
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Comte de Saint-Germain posted:Yeah, I got assault and medium mechs confused. Later, as you get better with tactics, you can run with lower armor in strategic places for specific reasons, but max armor when learning the game is never a terrible choice. It saves your inevitable newbie mistakes from becoming disasters.
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Jan 11, 2020 18:11
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:tabletop mech design rules desperately need a stake driven into their heart The initiative tier thing isn't from tabletop I don't think, and that's what really hurts several of the "bad" mechs. But yeah, Battletech is hilariously illogical in general, I mean it has weapon ranges from the Civil War and poo poo. As in the one in the 1860s.
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Jan 11, 2020 18:24
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sean10mm posted:Zeus and Victor are absolutely worse than the Orion, Black Knight, Marauder, Warhammer and Grasshopper. I would probably use a Cataphract instead too. Broadly speaking this is true but the Victors are pretty mobile as assault mechs go and with a UAC20 and jump jets they can backstab pretty well. Otherwise they're trash though, yes.
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Jan 11, 2020 18:26
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vmdvr posted:Another good piece of general advice for when you're just starting out and don't know how to play yet: stock mechs are very low armored. Take off a weapon or two (preferably that don't match the range you intend that mech to engage at) and max or near max the armor everywhere. I would change this to say FRONT armor specifically. Maximum rear armor is a waste. I personally never bothered with boosting armor much unless the stock armor was abnormally low for its weight, like the Shadowhawk D or Jagermech. Or if I was forced to use a tiny light mech. sean10mm fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Jan 11, 2020 |
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Jan 11, 2020 18:27
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sean10mm posted:I would change this to say FRONT armor specifically. Maximum rear armor is a waste. I only max rear armor on my close range brawlers because the ai cheats a bit and gets to walk in ways you technically don't, so they can occasionally surprise you with a rear shot.
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Jan 11, 2020 18:31
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Yeah the whole "80-tonners are bad" thing comes from plugging them into the hbs weight class initiative system, where they have the same init phase as 100 tonners. Same with 60 and 75 ton heavies In tabletop, initiative is rolled rpg-style so there's not the same kind of hard deadzones of tonnage inefficiency. There's softer ranges of tonnage inefficiency but they're related more to engine weights and such.
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Jan 11, 2020 18:35
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sean10mm posted:The initiative tier thing isn't from tabletop I don't think, and that's what really hurts several of the "bad" mechs. Yeah it's terrible
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Jan 11, 2020 18:45
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Lol I started one more career mode just to see what I get, and I got an Enforcer, Assassin, Coil-M, Vindicator, Firestarter, Panther, and the store had a DHS, S Pulse, ER Small laser, and an ER ML. It's also selling whole Banshees and Archers; I started on Claybrooke
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Jan 11, 2020 19:27
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On the Archer I am never sure if + damage or +stab LRMs make more sense. More damage makes sense to take advantage of better clustering on called shots, but I really use LRMs mostly for knockdowns. Though it's actually a great laser + SRM brawler too
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Jan 11, 2020 19:33
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I almost never take +stability unless I just don't happen to have any +damages. I'd rather the component come off if I can
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Jan 11, 2020 19:53
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Is the Rifleman a horrible deathtrap? I got one and the AI seems to beeline all of its shots onto it.
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Jan 11, 2020 20:31
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What's the best overhaul mod that's 1.8 ready? Started getting Rogue Tech set back up, and the fucker is 1.7.1
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Jan 11, 2020 20:33
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Falcorum posted:Is the Rifleman a horrible deathtrap? I got one and the AI seems to beeline all of its shots onto it. It's a slightly smaller Jaegermech with a baked in rangefinder and reduced recoil penalties. Fill it with UAC2'S.
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Jan 11, 2020 20:42
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And Tyler Too! posted:It's a slightly smaller Jaegermech with a baked in rangefinder and reduced recoil penalties. Fill it with UAC2'S. Haven't seen any UACs at all yet. I've decided to restart though and the lootcrate gave me a UAC20 so that will be fun at least.
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Jan 11, 2020 20:49
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Falcorum posted:Is the Rifleman a horrible deathtrap? I got one and the AI seems to beeline all of its shots onto it. If you're using the stock loadout then yes it is, it's very poorly armored and generally the AI selects targets, when given multiple options within line of sight, based on a combination of hit chance and hit points. So all things being equal, the AI will preferentially target your least armored unit.
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Jan 11, 2020 21:00
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Ravenfood posted:Basically all mechs at the very bottom of their weight class are suboptimal because they (behind the scenes) require heavier engines than the mechs at the very top of the class below them. This gives them fewer free tons, generally heavier JJs (there is an exception here for light assaults who actually can still equip the 1ton JJs) and a lower initiative in return basically nothing. How would things look if, say, the bottom-barrel assaults were heavies instead? Shift the brackets 5 tons
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Jan 11, 2020 21:01
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Rifleman has really bad stock armor but otherwise is fine.
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Jan 11, 2020 21:08
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BrotherJayne posted:What's the best overhaul mod that's 1.8 ready? Battletech extended?
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Jan 11, 2020 21:16
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Lawman 0 posted:Battletech extended? On it, ty!
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Jan 11, 2020 21:24
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RBA Starblade posted:My favorite moment was when I opened fire on the Widow's Marauder, missed, and all the stray shots hit the mech next to it, then the Hunter's Atlas aimed at it, did the same thing, and blew the rando mech to pieces. Here's something that will warm the cockles of your heart - stray shots only care about position. Line up the Widow with another mech that is easier to hit and shoot that one instead. All the stray shots will hit her.
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Jan 11, 2020 21:25
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New beefy toys  I think I need to pull all the DHS I took out of the Highlander and put 'em in that Awesome, don't I? Soon as I get some snubs I'll PPC the Awesome back up   Edit- with this my "seriousest of business" lance is the highlander, awesome, and two of warham, pault, and jager the yeti fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Jan 11, 2020 |
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Jan 11, 2020 21:39
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Falcorum posted:Is the Rifleman a horrible deathtrap? I got one and the AI seems to beeline all of its shots onto it. I've never gotten a Rifleman before a Marauder (could be dumb luck, but Marauders seem to have better availability), and if you have a Marauder there's basically no reason to use a Rifleman.
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Jan 11, 2020 21:43
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