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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:CA is going to decline, sadly. The Central Valley has pumped so much water out of the aquifer that this has happened already in some places! 
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Jan 15, 2020 21:06
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e.pilot posted:Having somewhat recently moved to California, I have to say the ratio of people here that act like they’re the only ones in the world seems way out of wack compared to everywhere else I’ve lived. It’s really odd. Well most of the US is Californian, so they have that going for them. disband the Senate
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Jan 15, 2020 21:07
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:CA is an exceptional state. I'm sorry, I'm leaving soon but it's true. There's a bunch of reasons for that but one of them is massive federal infrastructure projects in the 30s - 60s and another is burning up centuries of natural resources at an insane rate. A third is that it maintained a frontier innovation mindset and so a bunch of "new" industry powerhouses like tech and movies ended up in our state. Assuming water supplies hold out it’ll always be an agricultural powerhouse to some extent.
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Jan 15, 2020 21:14
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CPColin posted:The Central Valley has pumped so much water out of the aquifer that this has happened already in some places! Also from oil and gas extraction!
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Jan 15, 2020 21:16
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As long as the weather stays nice, California will be just fine no matter how many busts it goes through. We might end up losing our reputation of being a hothouse for innovation because it’s too expensive for risk takers to live here, but we’ll always have plenty of money tied up in real estate. At worst, we’ll become an expensive wrinkle room for moneyed boomers. People hate snow and humidity and we have very little of either.
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Jan 15, 2020 21:19
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Kenning posted:When I was studying in Syria back before the civil war people would introduce themselves and where they were from and there were several Americans, but I introduced myself as being from California. The teacher laughed, and asked if I was also from the USA, since California part of the USA.I observed that Californians always introduce themselves as Californians abroad, a fact which was confirmed by the other Californian in the class, and which I imagine other people here have experienced. When I was in Paris a couple of years ago I said I was from California whenever anyone asked. We went to a wine lesson thing near the Louvre & another couple was there that identified themselves as New Yorkers. Totally agree with the elitism thing because lmao, I don't want to be associated with places like Kentucky or Alabama. Quick edit: This was 2 years ago, and my reasoning for saying California over The U.S. had more to do with not wanting to be associated with Trump and less Kentucky & Alabama.
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Jan 15, 2020 21:20
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People in Texas, The South, and New York do the exact same thing so idk why the rest of the country is so focused on our attitudes. Plus we have a poo poo ton of people and a lot of agriculture so we obviously matter more 
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Jan 15, 2020 21:31
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Kenning posted:When I was studying in Syria back before the civil war people would introduce themselves and where they were from and there were several Americans, but I introduced myself as being from California. The teacher laughed, and asked if I was also from the USA, since California part of the USA.I observed that Californians always introduce themselves as Californians abroad, a fact which was confirmed by the other Californian in the class, and which I imagine other people here have experienced. I always introduce myself as a Californian when abroad because in my experience it lets the person I'm talking to skip the whole song and dance of trying to figure out if I'm an insane person / bigot / Christian dominionist / Trump supporter.
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Jan 15, 2020 21:34
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part of that too is that the US is too big to be monocultured, despite the best efforts of capitalism. there's other parts of the world too where people will have an identity of origin more specific than a sovereign country. lots of catalonians aren't going to introduce themselves as being "from spain", or benghali as "from india", and someone from belfast is likely going to identify as almost anything other than "from the UK" and even when people do identify as simply "american" they often are referring to their own cultural piece of the US. That's why the term "real americans" gets thrown around, as if not being from the south or a rural area means you literally aren't from the US
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Jan 15, 2020 21:39
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e.pilot posted:Assuming water supplies hold out ProperGanderPusher posted:As long as the weather stays nice, Gentlemen...I have bad news
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Jan 15, 2020 21:48
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Yeah, i mean i was born in california and spent all my life here...it's already almost too big and varied to identify as a "Californian", let alone identifying as an "American". And anyway the things you might identify with "U.S." culture or the country as a whole tend to be negative and lame.
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Jan 15, 2020 22:22
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I always call myself a San Franciscan abroad, because identifying as a Californian invites lame jokes about how I probably surf to work and go to Disneyland every weekend. I got one guy start earnestly asking how they can get in on some sweet Silicon Valley VC capital for their business idea, but everyone laughed at him for it, including me.
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Jan 15, 2020 22:46
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e.pilot posted:Having somewhat recently moved to California, I have to say the ratio of people here that act like they’re the only ones in the world seems way out of wack compared to everywhere else I’ve lived. It’s really odd. Which part of California did you move to? I don't believe this is the case throughout the entire state.
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Jan 15, 2020 22:54
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ProperGanderPusher posted:I always call myself a San Franciscan abroad, because identifying as a Californian invites lame jokes about how I probably surf to work and go to Disneyland every weekend. I got one guy start earnestly asking how they can get in on some sweet Silicon Valley VC capital for their business idea, but everyone laughed at him for it, including me. I ran in to someone when I was in Sweden, who started off claiming they were from the bay area. To which I responded "Oh yeah? Me too" to make conversation "Actually i'm more from like Napa, where in the bay are you from?" "SF" "Ah... well I'm from Redding" like what
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Jan 15, 2020 22:55
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The Sacramento River is just one long, slanted inlet of the Bay, if you think about it.
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Jan 15, 2020 23:04
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If you can't stand on the highest point in your county and see the Bay, it's not the Bay Area. edit: I recognize that this lets Livermore in, and I'm sorry about that.
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Jan 15, 2020 23:12
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When I was abroad I started as saying I'm from the US, but that was always followed up with "ooh which state?" so I just switched to leading with being from California. It elicited a lot of interesting reactions while in Europe, in particular one guy from the UK who launched into a story about how when he'd worked in SF for a few months as part of a project his boss came to work in shorts and people would just leave work at 3PM with no consequence and how he could just never get used to how laid back we all are over here. I asked him who he'd worked for because my job was nothing like that and it sounded pretty nice.
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Jan 15, 2020 23:18
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When I lived in Washington I would say I was from Seattle because no one knows what/where Washington is. Now I guess I would say I'm from LA rather than from California but I live in Pasadena (don't tell  )
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Jan 15, 2020 23:27
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gently caress SNEEP posted:When I lived in Washington I would say I was from Seattle because no one knows what/where Washington is. Now I guess I would say I'm from LA rather than from California but I live in Pasadena (don't tell Yeah same. I just say LA because like 99% of people know where that is and it skips a lot of bullshit. I was watching a trash reality TV show tonight and the family that was on the show was from the OC but anytime they cut to that family they showed the same 3 locations Dockwiler beach, Hollywood sign, DTLA lol I’ve seen them do it when people live like in Redlands and poo poo.
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Jan 15, 2020 23:33
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I don't have any statistics to back it up but it feels like regionalism in general has grown massively everywhere over the last 20 years, and I put the starting point at the Bush-Gore election and red america vs. blue america. Any sort of regionalism before that was silly cultural stuff, but now the two sides view each other as almost traitors.
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Jan 15, 2020 23:36
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MarcusSA posted:Yeah same. Lazy establishing shots editor. Also you can tell the age of any shot of DTLA because it has been changing drastically.
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Jan 15, 2020 23:43
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Family Values posted:I don't have any statistics to back it up but it feels like regionalism in general has grown massively everywhere over the last 20 years, and I put the starting point at the Bush-Gore election and red america vs. blue america. Any sort of regionalism before that was silly cultural stuff, but now the two sides view each other as almost traitors. Thank you, NYT Opinion Columnist "Family Values".
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Jan 15, 2020 23:49
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Family Values posted:I don't have any statistics to back it up but it feels like regionalism in general has grown massively everywhere over the last 20 years, and I put the starting point at the Bush-Gore election and red america vs. blue america. Any sort of regionalism before that was silly cultural stuff, but now the two sides view each other as almost traitors. It's more a return to status quo. America (and other countries) unified in a big way in WWII. That unity was always a bit illusory and started to fracture with the end of the cold war. Bush/Gore accelerated it but it had been trending since '89.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:01
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Kenning posted:If you can't stand on the highest point in your county and see the Bay, it's not the Bay Area. Also lets Santa Cruz in too
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Jan 16, 2020 00:04
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Kenning posted:If you can't stand on the highest point in your county and see the Bay, it's not the Bay Area. It'd be good if you could see the Bay from the top of Mount Shasta (Siskiyou County), but not Lassen Peak (Shasta County), because that would let Weed in, but not Redding.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:07
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Kenning posted:When I was studying in Syria back before the civil war people would introduce themselves and where they were from and there were several Americans, but I introduced myself as being from California. The teacher laughed, and asked if I was also from the USA, since California part of the USA.I observed that Californians always introduce themselves as Californians abroad, a fact which was confirmed by the other Californian in the class, and which I imagine other people here have experienced. My wife, as a 17-year-old visiting Israel, managed to walk into Jordan by accident (this was in the 1970s) and got surrounded by armed troops. She waved her hands in the air saying "Hollywood! American!" and they pointed to the west and let her go.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:08
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You can always say Anaheim because you can link it with Disneyland and that will give people a rough estimation. Failing that yeah, just say LA and someone will inevitably ask you if you live in Hollywood.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:10
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Kenning posted:Thank you, NYT Opinion Columnist "Family Values". Just because he posted an anecdote doesn't make what he's describing wrong. He's seeing the impact of increased income and opportunity inequality in the US and in particular how it mirrors the urban/rural divide in a lot of cases. More complicated than that, of course, but his view is close enough for a two-sentence post.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:10
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Zuul the Cat posted:You can always say Anaheim because you can link it with Disneyland and that will give people a rough estimation. Failing that yeah, just say LA and someone will inevitably ask you if you live in Hollywood. what's kinda fun is if you've ever actually lived or had friends/family who lived in hollywood. it blows people's goddamn minds
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Jan 16, 2020 00:16
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Despite California's agricultural sector being enormous, it's also only like 2% of the state's economy. It'd be terrible to lose it to climate change and drought, but it also won't ruin the state's economy if that happens. By which I mean, climate change alone isn't going to degrade the state's economy to the point that it stops being a wealthy state full of expensive to live in cities. It is also not going to run out of water for those cities, because something like 75% of the state's fresh water usage is for agriculture. No matter how many "congress created dust bowl" signs line the rural highways, eventually the voters (which means the cities) will vote themselves the water rights that are currently held by the farmers, if it comes down to severe droughts. The state has severe problems and climate change may be the biggest of them in the long run, but economic destruction is not the immediate concern. It's human welfare, the housing crisis, wealth disparity, gentrification, and all the social problems that descend from those things.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:17
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luminalflux posted:Also lets Santa Cruz in too
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Jan 16, 2020 00:18
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If you want to last in California through any natural disaster, just buy 10 acres in Lancaster for $10k. Or 1 acre for $500, whatever. No one will ever try to take it from you and you'll already know how to live in a hell blasted desert.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:19
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Shbobdb posted:It's more a return to status quo. America (and other countries) unified in a big way in WWII. That unity was always a bit illusory and started to fracture with the end of the cold war. Bush/Gore accelerated it but it had been trending since '89. My uncle was given the side eye and even occasionally snubbed by older white people when he taught at Duke back in the 70’s. There was a real lingering hatred of northerners in general at that time, at least among olds, that you don’t really see anymore beyond good natured ribbing. I’m sure desegregation exacerbated it at that time, of course.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:33
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Again I must stress that everyone should read Cadillac Desert, which is a great book that revealed to me that the modern CA that we all know is a mirage that was willed into existence by the New Deal. It has existing for a comparatively tiny amount of time and is propped up by a trillion dollars in infrastructure created by two competing federal agencies with blank checks and a competitive streak. It is incredibly fragile and will collapse with terrifying speed when climate change hits with full force and we all have to confront the fact that we'll be lucky to keep it under 4c.
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Jan 16, 2020 00:35
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Leperflesh posted:Despite California's agricultural sector being enormous, it's also only like 2% of the state's economy. It'd be terrible to lose it to climate change and drought, but it also won't ruin the state's economy if that happens. By which I mean, climate change alone isn't going to degrade the state's economy to the point that it stops being a wealthy state full of expensive to live in cities. It is also not going to run out of water for those cities, because something like 75% of the state's fresh water usage is for agriculture. No matter how many "congress created dust bowl" signs line the rural highways, eventually the voters (which means the cities) will vote themselves the water rights that are currently held by the farmers, if it comes down to severe droughts. agriculture's role in the economy is a lot more complicated than the % of real GDP or jobs. if you include support industries it employs like 10% of the state. and that's highly regional; there's like five or six counties whose entire economies would cascade-fail rustbelt-style if agriculture became inviable, and another fifteen or so that would have major employment crises on their hands, including ones you might not expect like ventura and sacramento. it's also heavily inbound; something like 1/3 of the ~50billion GDP$ it's responsible for are from out of state. it's dwarfed in GDP dollar amount by finance, information, and manufacturing, but that distorts the picture of how connected it is. The money also tends to flow down the socioeconomic spectrum; overwhelming majority of that value is going into the hands of workers, and the majority of the dollar value comes from items that lean upmarket like fruit, veggies, dairy, and meat (as opposed to staples like corn, soybeans, or rice). that means it skews toward moving money away from the social classes that hoard wealth toward the end of the spectrum that has to spend everything they make, which is the opposite of most of the biggest industries in the state like finance and information. not that i dont doubt clueless suburbanites' ability to turn tantrums about their lawns into economic disaster, but there would be a lot of people who know what they're talking about making persuasive arguments against nuking agriculture, and they'd have the ear of the legislature and executive for sure. 10% of jobs is an enormous amount of voters agriculture absolutely will change over the course of the next century, but i doubt it will be because finance people say "we're more of the economy, let us water our lawns"
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Jan 16, 2020 01:29
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Yeah IMO the main change we're going to see, inevitably, is an abandonment of the water-intensive crops that are consuming an outsized amount of water: tree nuts and alfalfa, for example. And we are more likely to see a shrinking agri sector (and shrinking profitability due to less-predictable weather) than just one day be all "welp CA doesn't grow any food any more."
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Jan 16, 2020 02:21
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Yeah. Crop restrictions should be considered. Water intensive crops should probably go
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Jan 16, 2020 04:19
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Restore Tulare Lake and divert the Colorado back into Salton Sea
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Jan 16, 2020 04:23
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Goodpancakes posted:Yeah. Crop restrictions should be considered. Water intensive crops should probably go The largest almond growers in the state use more water than all of LA and SF combined. Just almonds, not any other crop. Banning lawns would do literally jack poo poo to address any water concerns in the state.
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Jan 16, 2020 04:47
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The pistachio growers use more water than all of LA and spend millions a year lobbying for war with Iran to disrupt their biggest pistachio competition.
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Jan 16, 2020 05:29
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