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bee posted:Hello, potentially dumb question ahead. When it says this under the selection criteria on a job advertisement It means either/or. Like "Masters in shitposting and/or 2 years' experience in posting in BFC" means that you can have either or both and still be qualified. Also, if you have neither, still apply. It might be some poo poo that doesn't matter to the hiring manager that HR slapped on.
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Jan 20, 2020 03:51
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Thank you. I've got the qualifications but not the experience and lately when I apply for jobs I'm qualified to do, I'm yet to get a callback. So I was wondering if I'm wasting my time putting in applications until I get the experience somehow. I'll keep trying 
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Jan 20, 2020 03:55
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Dik Hz posted:It means either/or. Like "Masters in shitposting and/or 2 years' experience in posting in BFC" means that you can have either or both and still be qualified. Also, if you have neither, still apply. It might be some poo poo that doesn't matter to the hiring manager that HR slapped on. Yea I was gonna say, in my experience stuff like that is pretty flexible. Resume requirement = BS in CS + 2 years experience in Python programming or MS Person they hire = BS in IT degree and a few python projects on GitHub but seems motivated an interviews well Its a tough market in many sectors. bee posted:Thank you. I've got the qualifications but not the experience and lately when I apply for jobs I'm qualified to do, I'm yet to get a callback. So I was wondering if I'm wasting my time putting in applications until I get the experience somehow. I'll keep trying Keep applying. You never know whats going on behind the scenes of job reqs. Applying for jobs sucks, make sure to sure a browser or password manager plugin that form fills to make it faster. CarForumPoster fucked around with this message at 15:07 on Jan 20, 2020 |
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Jan 20, 2020 15:04
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bee posted:Thank you. I've got the qualifications but not the experience and lately when I apply for jobs I'm qualified to do, I'm yet to get a callback. So I was wondering if I'm wasting my time putting in applications until I get the experience somehow. I'll keep trying It takes lots of applications. Don't fall in love with a job posting and get stuff out there. Also, keep in mind most postings will say: Qualifications Needed: 1 2 3 4 5 They really mean 2 or 3 out of the 5 are what they want (with maybe 1 or 2 being absolutely needed). I have been coaching my company to start splitting out the requirements or adding soft language (Qualifications: A combination of the following). In particular I've noticed differences in gender around this, where men are more likely to say "I think I'm a good fit, I have almost all the qualifications" vs "I am not a good fit, I am missing 1 or 2 qualifications". Obviously that's a gross generalization but it works to inadvertently limit your candidate pool. Pekinduck posted:Thanks, that's a good way to put it. I was just worried I'd potentially be volunteering one of those "do not ask" discriminatory questions and making it a legal mess for the employer. (I'm clearly not a lawyer) The job is a weird super specialized thing I have experience in so I feel I might have a chance. Most of the time the employer can't ask but the applicant can volunteer whatever info they want. Citizenship/Race/country of origin/etc can be one of those things like can make people feel awkward though and that's not what you want someone to feel looking at your resume. Work authorization is more cold and clinical and won't give people the squirmys.
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Jan 20, 2020 16:47
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bee posted:Thank you. I've got the qualifications but not the experience and lately when I apply for jobs I'm qualified to do, I'm yet to get a callback. So I was wondering if I'm wasting my time putting in applications until I get the experience somehow. I'll keep trying Keep applying. Hiring managers will absolutely put "requirements" which are really more wishlists and if you meet what the actual requirements are you can get an interview if there aren't stronger candidates applying. Good hiring managers will also sometimes bring you in to interview for a different job than the one you applied for if they notice that your resume fills an area they need in a different part of the company. I've gotten two different jobs that way and both of them turned out to be the best jobs I've had so far. It can feel insulting when you interview but its actually a good sign because it means that the management actually pays attention instead of churning through applications or blindly trusting the automated computer program. Ultimately its just a numbers game dude.
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Jan 20, 2020 18:00
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Sometimes the hiring manager does it, but in my experience it's more commonly HR that tacks on ludicrously specific and/or irrelevant lists of Requirements, and often fights to defend them when the hiring manager complains about it.
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Jan 21, 2020 01:45
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BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:Keep applying. Hiring managers will absolutely put "requirements" which are really more wishlists and if you meet what the actual requirements are you can get an interview if there aren't stronger candidates applying. Good hiring managers will also sometimes bring you in to interview for a different job than the one you applied for if they notice that your resume fills an area they need in a different part of the company. I've gotten two different jobs that way and both of them turned out to be the best jobs I've had so far. It can feel insulting when you interview but its actually a good sign because it means that the management actually pays attention instead of churning through applications or blindly trusting the automated computer program. Ultimately its just a numbers game dude.
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Jan 21, 2020 06:44
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bee posted:Thank you. I've got the qualifications but not the experience and lately when I apply for jobs I'm qualified to do, I'm yet to get a callback. So I was wondering if I'm wasting my time putting in applications until I get the experience somehow. I'll keep trying My last job posting was due to a recent amicable departure from my team. I got roughly ten solid resumes that matched the job description that I wanted to phone screen. I called back exactly zero, because my boss got fired for incompetence and I was told to wait until my new boss was in place and up to speed. poo poo is hosed on both ends some times.
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Jan 21, 2020 06:46
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Thanks for all the feedback and encouragement, goons I have been seeing job postings where I meet 3-4 out of the 5 selection criteria and while I think that I'd be able to do the job, I haven't felt confident about applying. Really though, you're all right that I should apply anyway as I've got nothing to lose except a bit of my time. I don't know if it's a thing particular to Australia, but I see a lot of "applicants who do not address the selection criteria in their cover letter will not be considered" in advertisements. In this event, would it be a good idea to just give an example of a transferable skill or express my willingness to obtain the experience they are looking for? For example, I have no management experience, but I've worked in a study facilitator role where I had to deliver training and explain complex concepts to students.
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Jan 21, 2020 08:20
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bee posted:Thanks for all the feedback and encouragement, goons
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Jan 21, 2020 12:54
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Welp I just saw a business services lead position that I applied for just before Xmas readvertised so I guess your point just got proved 
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Jan 22, 2020 01:28
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Eric the Mauve posted:Sometimes the hiring manager does it, but in my experience it's more commonly HR that tacks on ludicrously specific and/or irrelevant lists of Requirements, and often fights to defend them when the hiring manager complains about it. I've watched our HR do this with multiple departments at my place now. We have had an entry level backend developer job open for about 18 months because of this (and the absurdly low pay, and the fact that they say the offer is non-negotiable lol) My rule of thumb has always been to fire one off if I at least tick off like 2/3 of what they are looking for and the things I am missing are not extremely obvious hard requirements. But even trying to figure out that is hard given the above and how different titles are company to company. The only time I don't hail mary is if it's a company I genuinely want to work for and I don't want to risk sending an unqualified resume to a dipshit HR rep who may see it for a job I care about THE MACHO MAN fucked around with this message at 03:41 on Jan 29, 2020 |
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Jan 29, 2020 03:34
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Every application that comes in is more work for HR. Little wonder that HR people like to discourage applications!
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Jan 29, 2020 03:41
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bee posted:I don't know if it's a thing particular to Australia, but I see a lot of "applicants who do not address the selection criteria in their cover letter will not be considered" in advertisements. In this event, would it be a good idea to just give an example of a transferable skill or express my willingness to obtain the experience they are looking for? For example, I have no management experience, but I've worked in a study facilitator role where I had to deliver training and explain complex concepts to students. I'm Canadian and I don't think I've seen statements like this in job postings, but I would interpret it as saying that they're not going to consider applications unless they have a cover letter that is at least a little customized to the specific job.
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Jan 29, 2020 04:09
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I had a phone screen with a large firm, and I have an in-person interview coming up. During the phone screen, the hiring manager stressed her desire to get the personality for the position right, and noted that employees can be less effective than they should be because of office drama. I responded by agreeing, noting my history of good relationships with coworkers and gave an anecdote of me coming to an understanding with a co-worker with a different communication style. She seemed to like that. The hiring manager really likes my qualifications, so what can I do when I come in to further assure her that my personality is a good fit as well? I will, of course, be friendly and respectful, but is there anything else I should emphasize? William Bear fucked around with this message at 15:16 on Jan 29, 2020 |
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Jan 29, 2020 15:13
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William Bear posted:I had a phone screen with a large firm, and I have an in-person interview coming up. During the phone screen, the hiring manager stressed her desire to get the personality for the position right, and noted that employees can be less effective than they should be because of office drama. Try to match the vibe of the office. Is it a younger office, or one that is trying to be all "We're like a startup!" if so play up your energy and maybe some light-touch quirkiness. If it's a more stuffy, serious office play up your professionalism and willingness to get things done. Its a bit weird they are making a deal about this since it (very slightly) opens them up to discrimination whenever they vet for non-qualification requirements, so my guess is they are trying to build a very specific culture. Figure out what that is and try to match it.
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Jan 29, 2020 15:36
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I would add that the team might have difficult individual(s) or management so they're trying to compensate. Not a 100% assessment but I've heard similar language and sort of sniffed that out.
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Jan 29, 2020 16:22
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Thanks for the advice. It's a large law firm, so I'll definitely play up the professional can-do spirit. My guess from her tone and the context of our conversation was that the manager had difficult employees in the past. This job opening might even be because someone difficult got removed.
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Jan 29, 2020 16:41
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in that case i think there are two options: 1) the culture is bad and they are trying to hire people that can deal with difficult people and problematic company culuture 2) the culture is good and they are trying to maintain it it can be tough to find out which is which, though!
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Jan 29, 2020 17:21
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William Bear posted:Thanks for the advice. It's a large law firm, so I'll definitely play up the professional can-do spirit. Oh yeah Lawyers are some of the worst people on the planet to manage. Definitely play up professionalism and that you are easy-going. My wife (who is a JD herself) manages a team of mostly JDs and there are a few individuals who suck up a TON of management time. They are probably trying to reduce that. Come up with some examples of where you solved a problem without having to drag on managers, maybe something where you mediated an issue between two individual contributors. That'll likely play well.
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Jan 29, 2020 18:42
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William Bear posted:It's a large law firm You should make it clear you can solve problems without needing specific instructions and follow through on a task until is is complete without being asked. Especially if you're supporting the attorneys in some way. If youre a support person, remember that lawyers If you are an attorney, asking stupid loving questions you should know already is called "analysis" and is billable. Good job!
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Jan 29, 2020 18:47
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I really need a job, any job, so I've been applying everywhere. Clothing stores, the city, fast food places. I'll take anything since our bills can just about be covered by full time minimum-wage here and my EI is running out in two weeks. But, I'm a teacher. I have 12 years of experience teaching tons of poo poo from like, cross-country skiing to 3D modelling and printing. 6 of those years are in curriculum development as well as direct education. But it's a bad time to be in education, had to leave my last contract because my father-in-law is dying and now the Alberta Fascist Party has cut education to the loving bone. I haven't worked retail for like 12 years and I don't know how to spin that. This leads to fun interactions like today at Staples (I was told to bring a resume into the store to apply instead of online). I tried to hand over my resume - edited to highlight "customer service" - but the cashier called a manager over: Me: "Hi, I'm looking for a job." Manager: "Which department? Full or part time?" Me: "Oh I think the print shop would be really good and I'm great with tech but I'll do whatever you need." Manager: "Do you have retail experience?" Me: "Yes! When I was a little younger." Manager: "How long ago was that?" Me: "Oh... uh... 13 years? I'm a teacher. 😳" Manager: "Yeah, you'll have to apply online. We'll see what we can do." So what should I do with this? Do I leave out my degrees on my resume? Do I list my gas station experience from 2005 instead of, say, my "customer service" job at the library teaching tech stuff? I'm not sure if the resume is even the issue. I don't even get calls back for job postings that are literally, "We need snow removal. Pay cash. Text this number." No temp office work has worked out. Nothing is biting. I'm cursed!
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Jan 30, 2020 00:57
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Nah, you're not cursed, it's standard. Retail managers don't like hiring people who are between jobs in professional fields, because they usually aren't good at accepting the kind of pervasive casual humiliation that is the life of a retail drone, they usually bounce out after a month or two, and if these things turn out not to be true then they might become a threat to the manager's own position. Teacher is probably especially bad in this case, because when you say 'teacher' to a lot of retail managers, what they hear is 'person who will chafe against my micromanagement.' I'd do everything possible to de-emphasize the word 'teacher' in my interactions with these people if I were you. It sucks, but there's nothing you can do but carpetbomb applications (frustrating and horribly time consuming as that is) and try your best to act ultra upbeat and positive when talking to people. Also Staples in particular is a really, really bad company to work for even by the incredibly low standards of the modern retail industry, so try to avoid that if at all possible. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 01:15 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 01:13
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Have you checked with tutoring services like Sylvan and the like? They usually churn through people so you can find slots and the teacher thing is a plus. People who I knew who did it had to work at a couple places to make FT hours, but the pay was a step up from retail work. I don't think any of those places offer benefits though.
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Jan 30, 2020 01:22
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A few friends and I are doing job apps at the same time. I keep telling one of them the one-page rule. She keeps not figuring out what to trim out. And editing MORE detail into it with each draft for some reason. The Newbie Programming Interview thread gave it a go and tore it up. She liked the harsh advice and cleaned it up some. But they suggested posting it here for a non-programming perspective (since she's not the programmer, I am). Here's her new draft. Can you help her figure out what to delete first? Would be much appreciated!  
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Jan 30, 2020 08:03
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Dumb Lowtax posted:A few friends and I are doing job apps at the same time. I keep telling one of them the one-page rule. She keeps not figuring out what to trim out. And editing MORE detail into it with each draft for some reason. Could you share the link to The Newbie Programming interview thread please? Is there a thread for hardware/electrical engineers somewhere? I'm getting hit out of nowhere by lay-offs at my company and have about two months to find a new job, before my exit-date and severance package happens. I'm trying to refresh my resume and do a crash course on interviewing. Being my first job, and having been at the company for 8 or 9 years, this feels real lovely and jarring. I have the option to find another job internally, but professionally, financially, and for my own mental health I want to go elsewhere. (I'm still trying to keep in touch with my coworkers in other departments to try and lineup a backup plan.) Thanks for reading my E/N post.
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Jan 30, 2020 09:56
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Dumb Lowtax posted:A few friends and I are doing job apps at the same time. I keep telling one of them the one-page rule. She keeps not figuring out what to trim out. And editing MORE detail into it with each draft for some reason. I'm not an expert on her field, but: There are a lot of descriptive about what she did, but not why they mattered. For instance - improved global presence - how is that measured? Eyeballs? Reach in terms of countries? get some mother fuckin metrics up in here hiring managers love metrics. the resume should be things you achieved at your position, not just job duties and responsibilities. i only think you should include the older jobs in detail if there are specific duties or achievements that you don't have elsewhere. for instance if you photographed teapots for the website in your current role, you don't need to say you photographed decanters for the website in a role two years ago. it seems fuckin buzzword heavy as all get out but i don't know the business so i can't comment with any real authority. however "ensured concerted action throughout content lifecycle by producing cross-departmental live tracker for deliveries of (&c)" sounds like absolute bullshit and likely that the person created a google doc or something. actually i realized when re reading the resume that my eyes just kind of slide over the words because they seem meaningless. again this could be a lack of SME but on the other hand, a HR person is gonna be reading it first and they're not SMEs at anything
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Jan 30, 2020 14:15
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Dumb Lowtax posted:A few friends and I are doing job apps at the same time. I keep telling one of them the one-page rule. She keeps not figuring out what to trim out. And editing MORE detail into it with each draft for some reason. I have no idea what librarians/people in media do or whats important to the roles she is going for. Also you might want to edit her LinkedIn URL as that trailing bits are a unique identifier. Some thoughts: -Its way too long for an engineers resume, but 2 pages isn't nuts. -Short stints with gaps is a red flag. What'd she do for 6 months? -It has way WAY WAYYYYY too many unimportant details, buzzwords and undefined acronyms. Who cares if the FTP software she used was proprietary or open-sourced? What is a DAM? DCI? -It has a lot of filler: 20 sentences written like this one is obnoxious to read: Transmitted a grand total of 220 books to production between Spring 2012 and Fall 2015 consistently passing annual quotas Instead write: Averaged 63 books/year to production exceeding quota of 50 books/year. CarForumPoster fucked around with this message at 14:51 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 14:40
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MetaJew posted:Could you share the link to The Newbie Programming interview thread please? Is there a thread for hardware/electrical engineers somewhere? https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?noseen=0&threadid=3376083 Just note that its a thread mostly full of programmers so...uhh, expect accordingly. It's a good resource though.
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Jan 30, 2020 14:56
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Dumb Lowtax posted:A few friends and I are doing job apps at the same time. I keep telling one of them the one-page rule. She keeps not figuring out what to trim out. And editing MORE detail into it with each draft for some reason.
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Jan 30, 2020 15:09
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This is an amazing resume and I'm going to amuse myself by translating it into English. This is the stuff just for the current gig: Delivered 400 finished originals to DCI specification, meeting year-end goal and making more automotive content interoptable in the digital cinema market My job was basically to resize and upload pictures, and I successfully did that. Improved MT global presence by providing assets (video, captions, descriptions) to international and domestic networks through proprietary and open-sourced file-transfer means I also sometimes emailed pictures to other people, or put them in a Sharepoint folder. Assessed studio's nonlinear editing workflows, perused case studies, researched DAMs, and cultivated collective involvement initiative to build meaningful interfacial access to studio's repository of unused raw footage I reorganized some messy folders. Concocted shortlist of vendor suggestions based on studio needs, by continuously developing and enhancing use-case scenarios for vendors/resellers to test in demos I didn't actually interact with vendors, but I did touch-ups that I'm pretty sure Procurement and/or Sales used sometimes. Communicated best practices to avoid duplicated material, pushbacks in QC/upload stages, and ensure proper metadata across servers, archive and media library I sent my contact a "hey, so-and-so hosed up" email when I noticed something wrong. Fulfilled requests to restore archived items to designated locations, enabling projects to commence re-edits by Original Programming and Broadcast teams I moved some files from one folder to another folder. Created documentation of archive conditions for future user instruction and comprehension My contact emailed me a list of which kinds of files should go into which folders, and I turned it into a Google Doc. Overall if you read the resume it's pretty clear what's up: her training is in graphics design and/or multimedia editing, a ridiculously overpacked job market, and she's struggling to gain traction doing entry level upload-monkey work. It looks like she got bounced out of a gig at End of Year 2018, was unemployed for six months before finally accepting what sounds like a truly horrifically dull and/or frustrating gig at "CarLover Group". I know it's hard as hell to make "I did basic, repetitive tasks an eight year old could be trained to do if that was legal" sound good, and the usually excellent advice of "focus on what you actually accomplished, not just on what your duties were" is kinda irrelevant when your job precludes the possibility of any meaningful accomplishments. It's a lovely spot to be stuck in. But this hysterically buzzword-saturated resume is going to make her job hunt harder, not easier. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 16:07
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Eric the Mauve posted:This is an amazing resume and I'm going to amuse myself by translating it into English. This is the stuff just for the current gig: She's a librarian? Archival jobs are hard to come by without a specialty. If she's any decent at tech, though, I feel like moving over to database management would get her a paycheck. Does she not know MySQL? I'm unfamiliar with any of the stuff she uses, but putting "Wordpress " in the same category as database management tools makes me think she doesn't qualify for a computer toucher library job. If she's willing to learn, though, those jobs all pay more than a library position and less than most other engineer positions so the competition isn't as fierce.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:32
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I get the keyword stacking when all the bot screeners add points for using the right words but are too dumb to make associations. It's def a balance but I've been there myself and it sucks.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:49
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There are some industries where that poo poo absolutely works though.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:00
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Has anyone worked at an org where they actually prioritize or auto reject based on keywords? Like I've heard that they do but I've never seen it in the wild. I'm cheap and only use LinkediIn/Indeed's built in ATS though so I wouldnt get those features.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:05
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CarForumPoster posted:Has anyone worked at an org where they actually prioritize or auto reject based on keywords? My last company I've had our internal recruiters do blind searches for keywords to send candidates that were horribly suited for the position. Like "Our customers are software developers, I need someone who can help them build java customizations for our enterprise product" and they would send me resumes from Geek Squad. I went ahead and got access to the full pool and found tons of good candidates that were never sent because they didn't mention all 4 of the keywords or whatever. I have started every job since telling recruiting "Hey, just let me get a look at the entire pool and we can work together with that." My recruiter now has been pretty good and puts a lot more intelligence into it, but at this point I am super jaded and still distrust everything.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:27
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Lockback posted:Have you checked with tutoring services like Sylvan and the like? They usually churn through people so you can find slots and the teacher thing is a plus. People who I knew who did it had to work at a couple places to make FT hours, but the pay was a step up from retail work. I don't think any of those places offer benefits though. Thanks to you and Eric for the advice. I’ll keep on keeping on, and I understand to be obsequious and cheerful when dealing with lower management. They’re a lot like potentially upset parents! And yeah, a few months ago there were some posts from those tutor mills for like, $17/hour. I’m on the grid here for like 80k a year so that just didn’t seem reasonable at the time, but those postings haven’t opened up since and I have learned my lesson. I did go look at my tutor listings and updated those as well, saw a couple of technical problems that might explain the lack of work (time zone was wrong in one, another deactivated my account for some reason) so hopefully that works out. I have a feeling the economy is kind of strangling the tutoring market here as well though. Thanks again. Hopefully I can get some temp work or labour jobs to keep the lights on soon.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:31
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Well I have to say, after applying to around 2 dozen positions, yesterday I finally submitted an app followed by a LinkedIn connection request with a follow-up message ("Hi __ I just applied..., I'm interested because..., Let me know if you think this is a good fit for us both...") and now a day later I have a screener call request. I know the sample size is small but so many HR people online say not to do this as "you're not special enough...". My reasoning was that I wouldn't even be seen otherwise, since I'd probably be number 200 when they've already found 12 good candidates in the first hundred, not counting any employee referrals. Any guidance on the best time to schedule a screening call? I don't want to schedule one for tomorrow as it feels too soon but would Tuesday be too far away?
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Jan 31, 2020 02:23
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Suicide Watch posted:Well I have to say, after applying to around 2 dozen positions, yesterday I finally submitted an app followed by a LinkedIn connection request with a follow-up message ("Hi __ I just applied..., I'm interested because..., Let me know if you think this is a good fit for us both...") and now a day later I have a screener call request. No problem asking about asking about tomorrow, if it's too soon they'll tell you. Try to be as open as you can be. Saying something like: "I'm free tomorrow after noon, monday from 11-3 or anytime Tuesday" is a fine.
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Jan 31, 2020 05:03
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Xguard86 posted:I get the keyword stacking when all the bot screeners add points for using the right words but are too dumb to make associations. I just showed her these responses, and she said that her resume actually is full of MORE keyword stacking in a white invisible font  Honestly though, SMART i might do the same right now to mine. Clearly the places I'm applying to might be susceptible to it. I just submitted to Activision and their website ate my entire job application four times, making me start over from page ONE each time, because it incorrectly scanned words from my resume PDF into web forms that can't be changed once they're set for some galaxy-brained reason. They're clearly already automatically scanning things out of my PDF so chances are they're doing this keyword stacking poo poo too, so white text would work on them. Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 06:57 on Jan 31, 2020 |
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Jan 31, 2020 06:53
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