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large_gourd posted:i think i'll have a better sense of what the gently caress this show actually is with another couple of episodes. still in wait and see mode. 
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Jan 30, 2020 13:59
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Something that felt a little odd was Admiral loving Hubris being completely closed to Picard's claim. I mean, he was just involved in a mysterious explosion on the roof of one of their buildings the day before (for which he does not appear to have been questioned by the police about) and I struggle to believe someone so incredulous would hold that rank unless they're also in on the plot (which it seems they are not?). Probably didn't help that Picard brought none of the evidence he'd just acquired with him for some reason, cause you'd think she'd be very interested in both Romulan operations on Earth and the development of synths despite their acrimonious past. I get why they did it from the show's marketability perspective, they wanted Picard on a ship with rag tag cool mercenaries not boring star trek crew members, so having him be shot down by Starfleet was necessary to that plot. It just didn't feel very organic or in character. Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 14:20 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 14:15
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Wasn’t Romulan Space comparable to the Federation in territory? Did the Super Nova destroy all of their systems? 900 million seems like a low number even for one planet. This writing blows.
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Jan 30, 2020 14:16
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gohmak posted:Wasn’t Romulan Space comparable to the Federation in territory? Did the Super Nova destroy all of their systems? 900 million seems like a low number even for one planet. This writing blows. No, not really. Federation space has always been substantially bigger than any of the other Alpha/Beta quadrant players from TNG onwards. Note the blue to the far east separated by the Klingons is also part of the Federation. 
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Jan 30, 2020 14:34
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Bringing back the syndrome from All Good Things is a good plot device to use if Patrick dies while they're filming I guess and to remove his presence from the show and maybe if that doesn't happen, with the borg plot, they can have borg tech repair it
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Jan 30, 2020 15:59
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Thom12255 posted:Bringing back the syndrome from All Good Things is a good plot device to use if Patrick dies while they're filming I guess and to remove his presence from the show and maybe if that doesn't happen, with the borg plot, they can have borg tech repair it It'd be pretty weird to have Star Trek: Picard without Picard. Not saying they wouldn't do that, it'd just be weird.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:04
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The 'Romulans have always hated all AI' plot is odd - TNG had Admiral Jarok talk to Data about it: "You're the android. I know a host of Romulan cyberneticists that would love to be this close to you."
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Jan 30, 2020 16:10
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Thom12255 posted:The 'Romulans have always hated all AI' plot is odd - TNG had Admiral Jarok talk to Data about it: "You're the android. I know a host of Romulan cyberneticists that would love to be this close to you." By "cyberneticists", he meant "double secret Tal Shiar", and by "this close to you", he meant "within stabbing distance". For real though this is one of those "the story they want to tell trumps a throwaway line from 30 years ago don't worry about it" things.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:16
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This episode started with some super clunky exposition about the Romulans super double secret police that is the kind of story telling I kind of hate. But I think it picked up with the Borg cube stuff. So they're removing the fixtures from dead Borg, but they still stay dead? I mean, nice to be respectful and all, but why? To further study the Borg? I definitely want to learn more about what's going on there. And yeah, Alison Pill is great. So sexy Romulan spy is trying to get close to her to learn more about where other androids may be? Don't they know they're un-activated, based on what happened when they attacked the last one? Why do they think she knows anything? I like the idea that Maddox kept researching androids and just completely hosed it up. No where near as advanced, and I'm guessing hackable? By these Romulan spies? Still finding it's footing, but it has me hooked to see what happens next. Nitrousoxide posted:No, not really. Federation space has always been substantially bigger than any of the other Alpha/Beta quadrant players from TNG onwards. Note the blue to the far east separated by the Klingons is also part of the Federation. As a primarily Star Wars fan where this poo poo is not thought out to anywhere NEAR this degree, I find maps like this fascinating.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:21
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I kinda feel like the desire to avoid TNG characters hurt this episode a good bit, especially when they get namedropped. If they didn't want to tell a TNG story, they shouldn't have made it about Picard. Geordi and Worf would've been perfect people to try to convince him not to go or to go get him a ship. I get not wanting to tell a story with the same old people, but you get a lot better character moments if it's them rather than his old doctor from the stargazer. His crew doesn't have to be the old crew, but I feel like giving the ensemble bit parts would've worked better here in telling more story in less time. The admiral scene kinda sucks, i think, because they really wanted to get to the 'hard decisions' line but had no idea how to get there. Panzeh fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 16:26
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Panzeh posted:I kinda feel like the desire to avoid TNG characters hurt this episode a good bit, especially when they get namedropped. If they didn't want to tell a TNG story, they shouldn't have made it about Picard. I sympathize with Starfleet's position - it is pretty serious for member worlds to be threatening to pull out and after the attack I can easily see the rest of the Federation giving in out of fear. I think this is meant to be a mirror of the western and eastern European Union countries fighting over the Middle East refugee crisis. I think the Admiral scene makes sense if you view it as divorced parents coming face to face after decades not seeing each other and Picard acting like he can act like he can ignore all the bad things that happened.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:32
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thrawn527 posted:As a primarily Star Wars fan where this poo poo is not thought out to anywhere NEAR this degree, I find maps like this fascinating. Star Trek nerds love stuff like this, but what's onscreen doesn't actually support or care about star maps or other peripheral content. You'll have characters say things like "the cardassians are going through romulan space to stage surprise attacks on the federation" and people on screen will nod like that's a perfectly sensible thing and you just have to not care that it contradicts your Star Trek Encyclopedia.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:35
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Thom12255 posted:I sympathize with Starfleet's position - it is pretty serious for member worlds to be threatening to pull out and after the attack I can easily see the rest of the Federation giving in out of fear. I think this is meant to be a mirror of the western and eastern European Union countries fighting over the Middle East refugee crisis. I think the Admiral scene makes sense if you view it as divorced parents coming face to face after decades not seeing each other and Picard acting like he can act like he can ignore all the bad things that happened. I think that's pretty reasonable, I don't really have a problem with what, but more, that a Starfleet admiral meeting another former admiral would respond to the request with an emotional outburst like that. That feels like a weird, forced moment where she gets to yell to him about hard decisions and Picard gets to be a hero and own the evil admiral.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:37
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Panzeh posted:I think that's pretty reasonable, I don't really have a problem with what, but more, that a Starfleet admiral meeting another former admiral would respond to the request with an emotional outburst like that. That feels like a weird, forced moment where she gets to yell to him about hard decisions and Picard gets to be a hero and own the evil admiral. My sense was she was possibly putting on a show for the other Actually Evil Commodore. She knew the Commodore (idk if we know if she's Section 31 or just normal Starfleet Intelligence?) would be aware of the meeting and possibly listening in, and that she was supposed to turn Picard down. The Commodore makes a note when she's needlessly expositing at the Romulan lieutenant that when Admiral Absolute loving Gall told her about her meeting with Picard, she left out crucial details.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:40
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Pinterest Mom posted:Star Trek nerds love stuff like this, but what's onscreen doesn't actually support or care about star maps or other peripheral content. You'll have characters say things like "the cardassians are going through romulan space to stage surprise attacks on the federation" and people on screen will nod like that's a perfectly sensible thing and you just have to not care that it contradicts your Star Trek Encyclopedia. Oh so it's exactly like Star Wars then. Cool. Y'all have a jivjov around here who refuses to let canon go?
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Jan 30, 2020 16:41
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I did chuckle at the "5124 days since the last assimilation" sign in the cube staging area. Which, interestingly, lines up just right with the Mars attack.
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Jan 30, 2020 16:46
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Pinterest Mom posted:Star Trek nerds love stuff like this, but what's onscreen doesn't actually support or care about star maps or other peripheral content. You'll have characters say things like "the cardassians are going through romulan space to stage surprise attacks on the federation" and people on screen will nod like that's a perfectly sensible thing and you just have to not care that it contradicts your Star Trek Encyclopedia. Also a 2D map of space is not very meaningful. Maybe the Romulan empire is shorter in length and width compared to the federation, but greater in height.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:07
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Nitrousoxide posted:I did chuckle at the "5124 days since the last assimilation" sign in the cube staging area. 5843 https://i.imgur.com/MeKQqaV.png the VERY next day is 16 years exactly (12*365 + 4*366 =5844) so... LMAO if its not a foreshadowing marktheando posted:Also a 2D map of space is not very meaningful. Maybe the Romulan empire is shorter in length and width compared to the federation, but greater in height. Thats what always baffled me when seeing ST visualisation of maps. I get it, its for viewer's easier understanding but a small blop of someone's space on the map can be a 2k LY cylinder of controlled space. Erulisse fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 17:17
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Brawnfire posted:That was funny. I drew this yesterday but got sidetracked by real work 
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Jan 30, 2020 17:25
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nine-gear crow posted:They seem to be going with the end of Voyager being truly cataclysmic for the Borg. Whatever Future Janeway did to them absolutely ruined them beyond recovery from all outward appearances. This also tracks with the backstory of Star Trek 2009 where Nero's ship was a Romulan mining ship outfitted with recovered tech from a dead Borg ship that then activated and self-replicated until it turned the ship into that monster of spikes and blades seen in the film before they got it under control. Oh, well, I'm glad they did something to explain his goth spike ship. I always thought it looked a bit sinister for what was supposed to be like, a mining vessel.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:30
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Give us an Elite Dangerous style 3D blob map now CBS.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:33
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That was really good. When the classic theme started I couldn't stop smiling.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:37
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Taking a really wild guess: The Romulan species began as synthetic that's virtually indistinguishable from biology millennia ago. That's the closely guarded secret and reason they discourage research in robotics. Heck, they can even do a repeat of the DISCO Kelpien storyline with how originally they were created by the Remans or ancient Vulcans or something crazy like that. I hope I'm not right. Have we ever even seen an assimilated Romulan? Echo Chamber fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 17:43
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AFAIR yes. https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Borg_species
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Jan 30, 2020 17:45
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Echo Chamber posted:Taking a really wild guess: We did in that one episode of Voyager where Chakotay finds that colony of former Borg
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Jan 30, 2020 17:46
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Echo Chamber posted:Taking a really wild guess: I could actually see that happening, and would explain THE SECRET and their hatred of synths. I wouldn't really hate that. There are certainly dumber ways to go.
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Jan 30, 2020 17:52
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marktheando posted:Also a 2D map of space is not very meaningful. Maybe the Romulan empire is shorter in length and width compared to the federation, but greater in height. Much like the planets of our solar system are all roughly on the ecliptic, much of the stellar content of our galaxy is in a roughly planar configuration. (Of course, the width of that plane is several thousand light years, even at the edges.)
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Jan 30, 2020 17:58
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You think the Irish Romulans hate the English Romulans Also as a member of the Bones transporter school of thought watching all those people walk through those suicide arches makes me uncomfortable You can tell that Measure of a Man was the most influential TNG episode w/r/t the premise of the show, they even made an army of Data proles just like Maddox said they wanted to do zoux fucked around with this message at 19:01 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 18:57
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 The food replicator just a 3d printer 
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Jan 30, 2020 19:29
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I was wondering about that replicator. Why would it be programmed to make lovely food? Can't it make...anything?
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Jan 30, 2020 19:33
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Seemlar posted:I usually don't care about EU stuff all that much but I tracked down the prelude comic book they made out of curiosity and it says that Starfleet spent four years helping evacuate planets before withdrawing from the mission. Belated thanks, that clarifies a lot for the first episode. Especially that they were doing evacuations and stopped, not that they never started.
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Jan 30, 2020 19:34
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thrawn527 posted:I was wondering about that replicator. Why would it be programmed to make lovely food? Can't it make...anything? They switched the dang protein matrix is what, even in the future the workin man gets the shaft I always figured the UP shipyards were in space but I guess we all owe JJ an apology for building the Enterprise on earth now
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Jan 30, 2020 19:36
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Logically I would think shipyards in space, but since the shipyard was named for a big ol' plain on the surface of Mars I guess it was on the tin Edit: oh it's both Brawnfire fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Jan 30, 2020 |
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Jan 30, 2020 19:40
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Oh free advice for the thread: if you approach every episode with trepidation that it could be the one that proves you were right that the show was going to suck - that's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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Jan 30, 2020 19:42
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The themesong and its graphics are absolutely perfect. It's fitting that the first Star Trek show that focuses on introspection is also the first to use "exploration of the nanoscopic and AI" graphics instead of "exploration of the macroscopic" graphics, and the opening with the shard of glass falling from the sky over the vineyard ending with it becoming part of Picard's face is great.
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Jan 30, 2020 19:44
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Honestly I can't remember the theme tune except that the flute from the inner light is in it slightly
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Jan 30, 2020 19:45
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My little nerd brain can't stop pausing every 15 minutes to Google whether each new character is someone I'm supposed to remember from TNG or entirely new.
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Jan 30, 2020 19:46
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Brawnfire posted:Logically I would think shipyards in space, but since the shipyard was named for a big ol' plain on the surface of Mars I guess it was on the tin One thing that confused me is the robot guy did something that looked like it turned orbital defense platforms on the planet, but then there were mystery spaceship bombers as well? One thing that I think we can all agree on is that the Super Tal Shiar did android 9/11 for the same reasons that George Bush did actual 9/11
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Jan 30, 2020 19:48
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zoux posted:One thing that confused me is the robot guy did something that looked like it turned orbital defense platforms on the planet, but then there were mystery spaceship bombers as well? One thing that I think we can all agree on is that the Super Tal Shiar did android 9/11 for the same reasons that George Bush did actual 9/11 Kurtzman pulls off his Scooby-Do mask to reveal Robert Orci.
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Jan 30, 2020 19:51
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Yeah who’s that lady from the end? Are we supposed to remember her?
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