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So Picard didn’t want to get help from Worf, Riker, Troi, or Geordie because they would be too willing to help, despite them presumably having their lives together. Instead he beamed over to a different former subordinate’s drug trailer and guilts her into helping him? Despite her hating him and not wanting to? This doesn’t make sense to me.
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Feb 7, 2020 16:54
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Delthalaz posted:So Picard didn’t want to get help from Worf, Riker, Troi, or Geordie because they would be too willing to help, despite them presumably having their lives together. Instead he beamed over to a different former subordinate’s drug trailer and guilts her into helping him? Despite her hating him and not wanting to? This doesn’t make sense to me. For some reason in episode 2 they came to the conclusion that the ideal partners in this venture would be someone who hated Jean-Luc. No, I can't remember why exactly. It seems like it was a line written as a stitch to close a gaping plot hole
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Feb 7, 2020 16:56
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Delthalaz posted:So Picard didn’t want to get help from Worf, Riker, Troi, or Geordie because they would be too willing to help, despite them presumably having their lives together. Instead he beamed over to a different former subordinate’s drug trailer and guilts her into helping him? Despite her hating him and not wanting to? This doesn’t make sense to me. Worf murdered his way to the top of Klingon society. Riker and Troi retired to spend their days having old people sex. Geordi I imagine Picard going to see him and he like an intercontinental playboy in a mansion full of beautiful women and the holodeck shorts out for a second revealing the empty room he lives in.
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Feb 7, 2020 16:57
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PostNouveau posted:Geordi I imagine Picard going to see him and he like an intercontinental playboy in a mansion full of beautiful women and the holodeck shorts out for a second revealing the empty room he lives in. Please don't tell anyone how I live.
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Feb 7, 2020 16:58
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PostNouveau posted:
Lol
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Feb 7, 2020 17:49
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So I can't help but feel that if all the cliches and "setting breaking" elements everyone has been complaining about happened on DS9 in the 90's, everyone woukd have been fine with them.
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Feb 7, 2020 17:52
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Geordi flies around in a colourful shuttle reading stories to children.
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Feb 7, 2020 17:59
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Drink-Mix Man posted:So I can't help but feel that if all the cliches and "setting breaking" elements everyone has been complaining about happened on DS9 in the 90's, everyone woukd have been fine with them. DS9 wasn't set on a place always referred to as a literal utopia though. They had to move star trek _out_ of the federation to get conflict. The difference with Picard is they are now showing that same type of problem happening in utopia. Maybe this will all make sense, maybe with more backstory the rot in the federation will be exposed and we'll get to it. But right now it is very jarring and not explained at all. DS9 was real easy to grasp - a place under brutal occupation by the I like this show but agree with many other posters they are making some really odd choices in pacing & plot. This is like watching a 10 hour movie in 45 minute increments.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:02
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There was literally an entire arc in DS9 about how Earth briefly turned into a police state out of sheer paranoia from the Dominion invasion, with a whole speech about how utopia has to be maintained and defended not only from outside threats but people's own selfish and short-sighted impulses.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:03
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I lost my job 14 years ago in post-scarcity paradise so I live in a meth trailer out in the desert. I call it a "hovel".
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Feb 7, 2020 18:06
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CPColin posted:Those three episodes should have been edited down to and presented as a single, feature-length premiere. I couldn't agree more. I wonder if a fan-edit will eventually pop up. I'm not too bothered by the obvious 21st century metaphors here, that's actually what I came looking for. Trek has always had some kind of reflection on our society, and Starfleet is based to a great degree on the American military-industrial complex. That's why I've always felt resentment that, between Enterprise and JJTrek, the former producers managed to cram in at least three 9/11 analogies, but never confronted the Iraq/Afghanistan occupations or the philosophy of regime-change interventionism. I doubt that's going to come up here either, outside of the refugee crisis, but I'm happy to see Trek once again trying to say something about the world we live in, even if it is somewhat heavy-handed and inconsistent. I felt pretty strong empathy for Raffi, but we definitely needed to see more of the backstory between her and Picard. I feel like the core of her story that they should emphasize is that she lost a personal connection to a mentor and father-figure, but we're not shown enough to really solidify that relationship. Best moment of the episode, for me, was when Picard calls her to dump the Maddox info and immediately hangs up. I really enjoyed seeing Hugh as a leadership figure. Jonathan del Arco gave a touching interview about how he had just lost his partner to AIDS right before he got the role of Hugh, and how that informed his performance... so it's great that he has the opportunity to develop the character further. He's actually the only character on the cube that I even like... Soji and the Romulan sex-tension siblings are doing nothing for me. Lastly, they need to hurry up and get on top of marketing Oh's sunglasses like they did combadge pins in the 90s. Hell yeah I want to rock the same shades as the fuckin' Director of Starfleet Security...
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Feb 7, 2020 18:07
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^^^^ The performance by Hugh is really great. I loved every bit of that arc so far. Ghost Leviathan posted:There was literally an entire arc in DS9 about how Earth briefly turned into a police state out of sheer paranoia from the Dominion invasion, with a whole speech about how utopia has to be maintained and defended not only from outside threats but people's own selfish and short-sighted impulses. Yeah and it made sense with the dominion war and the shapeshifters. It was also very brief - as in resolved in a 2 parter - and easily explained. Nothing here is being explained but we're just guessing. We've seen no signs the earth is at war and outside of a attack on a shipyard - which this episode at least made it seem as though Starfleet couldve recovered from easily - no sign of external conflict to impose this drastic change. It might all make sense here in a few episodes! we'll see. adaz fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Feb 7, 2020 |
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Feb 7, 2020 18:08
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I'm a poor person in the future, just barely scraping by. *taps combadge* Earth computer, one to beam up to my friend's space ship that he owns.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:08
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I bet the drugs in Star Trek loving rule. Like you get higher than gently caress and then you just shake it off with zero ill effects. Synthaheroin.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:08
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Drink-Mix Man posted:So I can't help but feel that if all the cliches and "setting breaking" elements everyone has been complaining about happened on DS9 in the 90's, everyone woukd have been fine with them. It’s an unpopular argument that might get dogpiled on, but I mostly agree with you here. When you take a lot of the stuff that gets complained about on Disco and Picard and try to imagine it happening in the 90s with 90s production elements and direction, they usually fit a whole lot better. The main faults I see with this argument (which pretty much come down to personal preference) are: 1. Stuff that appears in Picard and Disco that would have been fine (and even cool!) in the 90s now seems played out and tired in the 20s. 2. The direction, cinematography, and production style is not what people want or expect in a Trek show.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:09
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Cojawfee posted:I'm a poor person in the future, just barely scraping by. *taps combadge* Earth computer, one to beam up to my friend's space ship that he owns. I get the sense that, like many drug addicts, she's somewhat full of herself when it comes to throwing a pity party over her present situation and blaming everyone else for her "problems."
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Feb 7, 2020 18:13
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HD DAD posted:It’s an unpopular argument that might get dogpiled on, but I mostly agree with you here. When you take a lot of the stuff that gets complained about on Disco and Picard and try to imagine it happening in the 90s with 90s production elements and direction, they usually fit a whole lot better. What kind of direction and cinematography do people want from a Star Trek show in the 2020's? People have been complaining about changes in this since the TNG movies.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:15
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PostNouveau posted:I bet the drugs in Star Trek loving rule. Like you get higher than gently caress and then you just shake it off with zero ill effects. Synthaheroin. This is what I'm thinking. A galaxy of narcotics and you're smoking some poo poo that makes you paranoid? Come on, Raffi. Get the gently caress out there and find something about than snake-leaf.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:16
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Drink-Mix Man posted:I get the sense that, like many drug addicts, she's somewhat full of herself when it comes to throwing a pity party over her present situation and blaming everyone else for her "problems." I like to think that if you spun the camera 180 degrees from Rafi's drug shack, there would be like a whole future city 30 feet away with a Starbucks and like a nice lawn with a family having a picnic.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:17
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What I think is exacerbating the perceived pacing issues is that we're still hitting plot points that were pieced together by fans a year ago. Like people were saying it's probably about the Romulans, I bet Picard has a falling-out with Starfleet, he'll get a crew together for a rogue mission that will uphold his principles, etc. Not that the pacing issues aren't there, but it doesn't help that we just barely got to the point where the above premise is set on the actual show.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:21
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MichiganCubbie posted:The whole "these are the only Romulans assimilated" thing is really weird, and has to mean the only ones on this particular cube. What happened to all those Romulan colonies? I know we never definitively found out it was the Borg, but it was heavily, heavily implied. This might be a spoiler about what the showrunners are planning: Back in the TNG day, the Borg were at first going to be those neck-bugs from Conspiracy, and I believe the showrunners talked about how they're going to do something with those aliens on Picard. So maybe they'll turn out to be behind the disappearing colonies after all?
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Feb 7, 2020 18:22
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Minidust posted:What I think is exacerbating the perceived pacing issues is that we're still hitting plot points that were pieced together by fans a year ago. Like people were saying it's probably about the Romulans, I bet Picard has a falling-out with Starfleet, he'll get a crew together for a rogue mission that will uphold his principles, etc. FWIW, my GF who hasn't been exposed to any of that hasn't had any issue with the pace, except for the second episode feeling like it was basically "Quantum of Solace" in terms of just existing to connect the two other episodes. She's been intrigued the whole time. Completely unrelated, just want to highlight this line: "He even worked with the great  !"Never stop Spocking, Star Trek
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Feb 7, 2020 18:25
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davidspackage posted:This might be a spoiler about what the showrunners are planning: In fact, the Borg were innocent, set up from the start! It turns out, the Collective had been invaded by the Conspiracy aliens, and formed a "Collective" with a Queen (their species has queens maybe possibly so this is sensible to them) and the actual Borg Collective is a peaceful and exploratory peoples. Brawnfire fucked around with this message at 18:37 on Feb 7, 2020 |
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Feb 7, 2020 18:25
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davidspackage posted:This might be a spoiler about what the showrunners are planning: Maybe the Zhat Vahj are the bug people.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:27
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Borgs did nothing wrong
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Feb 7, 2020 18:29
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davidspackage posted:This might be a spoiler about what the showrunners are planning: That would be interesting, but, and I could be misremembering, in the beginning of Best of Both Worlds, don't we see another colony that was taken in the exact same way, like the entire thing was scooped up, and they explicitly say that that one was the Borg?
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Feb 7, 2020 18:31
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MichiganCubbie posted:That would be interesting, but, and I could be misremembering, in the beginning of Best of Both Worlds, don't we see another colony that was taken in the exact same way, like the entire thing was scooped up, and they explicitly say that that one was the Borg? It was Brainiac
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Feb 7, 2020 18:31
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I'm here for the borg invade the founders planet and cant figure out how to assimilate a changeling plot we'll get right??? It's (mainly) a joke but this show has been strongest when delving into the Borg/Romulan back stories rather than the clumsy Earth stuff. The references to her being the destroyer are particularly interesting. Like obviously destroyer can mean virtually anything but the dat vag guy saying she isnt what he thinks, i.e. not just a synth is pretty interesting bit of knowledge being droped. Also these writers are getting lazier. Another attack on earth against Picard. You think if he went up to Admiral loving Hubris and was like sooooooo a romulan just turned to goo on my floor he'd get an explanation? What if Pill went with him and was like why is starfleet security questioning random federation memebrs on earth. Just a whole lot o gaping plot holes
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Feb 7, 2020 18:34
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PostNouveau posted:I like to think that if you spun the camera 180 degrees from Rafi's drug shack, there would be like a whole future city 30 feet away with a Starbucks and like a nice lawn with a family having a picnic. Her neighbor is constantly pestering her that his exocomp would love to do some landscaping for her. They just want the neighborhood to look nice.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:34
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Drink-Mix Man posted:So I can't help but feel that if all the cliches and "setting breaking" elements everyone has been complaining about happened on DS9 in the 90's, everyone woukd have been fine with them. DS9 and TNG wouldn't have lasted more than a season if the modern internet existed - especially given how bad the first season of each was. . I imagine there are insane usenet fights about how much Picard sucks and how this isn't *MY* Trek. I know DS9 was called fake Trek because there wasn't a ship, though Voyager was highly anticipated. As I recall of course, this was, you know, 25 years ago. Anyway probably most people are fine with them (go to r/startrek they're like thanking CBS for making this show lol) but there is nothing people on the internet like to argue about more than which part of ST sucks the worst (it's TOS  ) Everyone likes the ST that was on when they were 13 the best, basically, everything before that is too dated, everything after is that fake Star Trek.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:36
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While I enjoy the lack of war crimes in Picard it's falling into the same trap Abrams Trek did of spending an inordinate amount of time on Earth, which Discovery at least did not I just want a strange new world or two is that too much to ask
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Feb 7, 2020 18:37
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MichiganCubbie posted:The thing that I don't get is that Vulcans and Romulans split in 370 AD. That's basically 2000 years before the TNG era. How did they diverge so much in look, as to have the heavy brows? They should still basically look identical, but for stuff like beign taller or shorter because of different gravity. Evolution isn't the only reason they could diverge! After hundreds (thousands?) of years of living in close proximity to Remans, it's probably a fair bet that just about every Romulan is at least 1/16th Reman or something.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:37
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cheetah7071 posted:While I enjoy the lack of war crimes in Picard it's falling into the same trap Abrams Trek did of spending an inordinate amount of time on Earth, which Discovery at least did not What next, seeking out new life and new civilizations? This is a slippery slope toward split infinitives. Pinterest Mom posted:Evolution isn't the only reason they could diverge! After hundreds (thousands?) of years of living in close proximity to Remans, it's probably a fair bet that just about every Romulan is at least 1/16th Reman or something. It is canon that every humanoid species in the galaxy has a common ancestor...an ancestor with the smoothest forehead of them all - the female changeling.  I totally forgot how much of a dickhead she was quote:In the final draft of the script, she was described as "a humanoid – in fact, one of the coolest humanoids we've ever seen, with a face wise and tragic and light-hearted all at once." Uh zoux fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Feb 7, 2020 |
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Feb 7, 2020 18:40
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Oh by the way, my SO and I both laughed and went, "Straight up, Vasquez Rocks!" when that caption showed up. Good poo poo.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:43
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cheetah7071 posted:While I enjoy the lack of war crimes in Picard it's falling into the same trap Abrams Trek did of spending an inordinate amount of time on Earth, which Discovery at least did not I don't mind that it's on Earth, I mainly mind that it's only showing how rich people live. And I do think that Raffi is living off her Baby Beluga money and riching it up with her trailer. It looks trashy to us, but for them that's a vintage 20th century trailer and she's some history hipster thinking she's all that because she's got some really old thing. Like when people spend a bunch of money on an old razor or some chair that someone threw out 70 years ago. Is how Dahj lives the normal thing for people on Earth? Does everyone get a decently sized apartment with ikea furniture?
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Feb 7, 2020 18:44
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Every script I wrote for Star Trek, I would describe any new species I introduce as "the coolest-looking humanoid ever" in case the makeup people take it to heart and loving crush it and I get paid royalties for the rest of my life for inventing the Halphaloids, the coolest aliens ever who got their own TV show and 4 spinoff movies.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:45
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Cojawfee posted:I don't mind that it's on Earth, I mainly mind that it's only showing how rich people live. And I do think that Raffi is living off her Baby Beluga money and riching it up with her trailer. It looks trashy to us, but for them that's a vintage 20th century trailer and she's some history hipster thinking she's all that because she's got some really old thing. Like when people spend a bunch of money on an old razor or some chair that someone threw out 70 years ago. Is how Dahj lives the normal thing for people on Earth? Does everyone get a decently sized apartment with ikea furniture? The trailer didn't look trashy to me. Both me and my SO we like, "I wouldn't mind living there." I've seen expensive vacation AirBNBs that were basically that.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:46
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I'm afraid the title of "coolest humanoid ever" is taken Drink-Mix Man posted:The trailer didn't look trashy to me. Both me and my SO we like, "I wouldn't mind living there." I've seen expensive vacation AirBNBs that were basically that. Yeah it struck me more as a call-back/homage/cliche of the crackpot conspiracy theorist who lives in an Airstream in the desert in like a million movies/TV shows.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:47
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Typical french chateaus have phasers (which look like guns again now) hidden under every surface. Gotta be prepared for the impending RaHoWa.
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Feb 7, 2020 19:38
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I couldn't really tell what was going on in a lot of the action scene. People just kinda appear and move 10 feet between shots and stuff like that. Where did Dr. Allison Pill get her rifle? It was just like that dude shows up out of nowhere and then she shoots him from off-screen and then she acts like it ain't her gun. She pulled it off a dead guy?
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Feb 7, 2020 19:41
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