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NikkolasKing posted:My understanding is that Reigns was over and was talented but was pushed too hard and fast. He sounds a lot like Diesel in 1995. We all know Kevin Nash can be a popular star but not in the way Vince booked him. Vince seems to have one idea for his Top Guy and he wants to force everyone into it, even if it prevents the would-be Top Guy from getting over like they should. I don't know if it's for everyone but the moment for me where Reigns went from "he's pretty good I guess" to "they want me to love him and it's making me hate him" was the 2015 Rumble. Bryan had started to get some real heat behind him and had a good "fighting from underneath" storyline going on Smakdown. Having him only last ten minutes in the Rumble and be eliminated in the first half of the match put people's noses out of joint. Reigns bore the brunt of that in his victory and I think never fully recovered. part of the problem for me is that I've always through Reigns would be a much better heel than he is a face. And pushing him as a face just makes me think the company doesn't like me.
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Feb 14, 2020 14:54
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NikkolasKing posted:My understanding is that Reigns was over and was talented but was pushed too hard and fast. He sounds a lot like Diesel in 1995. We all know Kevin Nash can be a popular star but not in the way Vince booked him. Vince seems to have one idea for his Top Guy and he wants to force everyone into it, even if it prevents the would-be Top Guy from getting over like they should. Depends on where you are Like in the 80s, an all japan women's show was like 99% women and girls plus Dave Meltzer, Terry Funk and Fumi Saito
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Feb 14, 2020 14:55
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Silly Burrito posted:My future wife and I went to a Thunder taping in Baton Rouge in the late 90s. At some point they pulled down Ric Flair's trunks so that his bare rear end was in view of us all. That was a standard Flair spot. Hell, there was a WWF cage match of Piper vs Rude, where the back of Rude's tights were pulled down at the beginning, and he kept them down the whole match.
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Feb 14, 2020 15:25
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Standard heel HBK spot, as well, although he probably stole it from Flair
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Feb 14, 2020 15:31
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Triple H got in on it too for a while.
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Feb 14, 2020 15:47
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i read some people talking about vampiro. are there any other notable wrestlers who were never trained to wrestle and never bothered to pick it up through experience either, yet still didn't wash out of the business? please hold the jokes. this is very important
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Feb 14, 2020 15:50
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Was Vampiro actually untrained? I think he just got over while he was really green and never got good.
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Feb 14, 2020 15:55
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I know Janela was untrained when he first started out, but I'm not sure if he had any formal training in between then and now.
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Feb 14, 2020 15:58
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Halloween Jack posted:Was Vampiro actually untrained? I think he just got over while he was really green and never got good. He was apparently trained a little in Canada while setting up rings for a promotion, then started wrestling at 16. So, maybe enough training to be safe and learn the basics but not like super extensive training if those implications are to be believed. Vampiro in WCW was one of my favorite things as a teenager. I don't really remember any matches of his, but his whole look and mystique kicked loads of rear end for the weirdo goth kid.
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Feb 14, 2020 16:05
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Cavauro posted:i read some people talking about vampiro. are there any other notable wrestlers who were never trained to wrestle and never bothered to pick it up through experience either, yet still didn't wash out of the business? please hold the jokes. this is very important Konnan, actually.
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Feb 14, 2020 16:07
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MassRafTer posted:Konnan, actually. 
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Feb 14, 2020 16:10
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Halloween Jack posted:Was Vampiro actually untrained? I think he just got over while he was really green and never got good. Bryan says Vampiro told him or said somewhere that he never learned to take a "flat back bump." That was apparently a big problem for him. They roll a lot in lucha instead I think he mentioned?
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Feb 14, 2020 16:10
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Ganso Bomb posted:He was apparently trained a little in Canada while setting up rings for a promotion, then started wrestling at 16. So, maybe enough training to be safe and learn the basics but not like super extensive training if those implications are to be believed. Every time I think "I don't really get Darby Allin" I just decide that its whatever the gently caress I was responding to with Vampiro as a teenager and I'm just too old to see it now. But maybe I should have been applying that to "I don't really get Joey Janella"?
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Feb 14, 2020 16:15
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STAC Goat posted:Every time I think "I don't really get Darby Allin" I just decide that its whatever the gently caress I was responding to with Vampiro as a teenager and I'm just too old to see it now. Janela is more of an a acquired taste compared to Darby. Janela's gimmick outside of "clearly has no regard for body" is sleazy 80's guy. Darby's is more of the recent strain of punk culture, although his name consists of two 80's punk guys.
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Feb 14, 2020 18:23
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did blue meanie ever have a good match?
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Feb 14, 2020 18:42
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Low Desert Punk posted:did blue meanie ever have a good match? That time he got to pin JBL clean. Because its like the one time JBL actually got in trouble for his poo poo.
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Feb 14, 2020 18:48
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The chair shot from Stevie to JBL ... 
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Feb 14, 2020 18:50
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Did he pin JBL clean? All i can think of is him pinning JBL after Stevie made an honest effort to relocate JBL's brain into his shoes.
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Feb 14, 2020 18:50
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No, Batista came out at the end, hit JBL with a spinebuster, then placed Meanie on top of him.
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Feb 14, 2020 18:56
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Davros1 posted:The chair shot from Stevie to JBL ... Will never get tired of that clip.
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Feb 14, 2020 18:56
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The only bad thing about the Stevie chair shot is that Meanie followed it up with a very safe and professional DDT instead of planting that fucker on his head
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Feb 14, 2020 19:04
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From what I understand, JBL beating the poo poo out of Meanie was because Meanie called him a locker room bully earlier. Like, what the gently caress?
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Feb 14, 2020 19:05
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Pope Corky the IX posted:From what I understand, JBL beating the poo poo out of Meanie was because Meanie called him a locker room bully earlier. Like, what the gently caress? The best way to prove to someone you aren't the thing they said you were is by being the thing they said you were. Duh!
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Feb 14, 2020 19:08
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"Teaching respect" is a big thing for adult bullies, they don't care about being a bully, just that they were accused of something
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Feb 14, 2020 19:59
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Meanie makes me sad because like he got in good shape for awhile there and now he's not.
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Feb 14, 2020 20:42
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I think I'm finally gonna get into ECW. I never saw any of it back in the day and have always been curious. Bryan and Vinny talk about how Mike Awesome was made to look super short next to people like Nash. His kayfabe height was 6'6 apparently but he was nowhere near that. Does anybody know how tall he was legit? Is there like a big list of wrestlers' real heights out there anywhere? Awesome was ECW Champion. So was Bam Bam, right? Was being ECW World Champion a notable thing? Bam Bam Bigalow has to be one of the bigger names to never have world titles in WWF or WCW but maybe a world title in another promotion is still something.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:33
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I went most of my childhood thinking Sting was a small guy.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:38
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NikkolasKing posted:I think I'm finally gonna get into ECW. I never saw any of it back in the day and have always been curious. The ECW title didnt change that often and the TV title changed even less often. At least when I was watching as a kid I thought they were super important. Also Mike Awesome's reign was my favorite. The tag titles too were really well protected.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:59
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NikkolasKing posted:I think I'm finally gonna get into ECW. I never saw any of it back in the day and have always been curious. It really wasn't that big of a deal. There were times where it was the focus of the company and felt super important, but at other times whatever Sabu was doing would be way more important. (The Cactus Jack and Benoit feuds in 94, the FTW title later on, especially when he feuded with Taz are good examples of this.) By the time Taz won it they had no idea what to do and the title was an after thought with Taz squashing Candido to defend against Buh Buh Ray Dudley later on in the show, or Tajiri in a midcard match. They tried to make it more of the focus when Awesome won it, probably to build to RVD's eventual title win but Awesome leaving killed it dead. Bam Bam held the title very briefly, his run in Japan was way more significant than his ECW run, or really any of his US work.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:44
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Please do not gloss over wrestle mania main eventer bam bam bigelows contributions
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Feb 14, 2020 23:58
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give me bam bam over triple h any day tbh
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Feb 15, 2020 00:00
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Bam Bam vs LT was good 
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Feb 15, 2020 00:04
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NikkolasKing posted:I think I'm finally gonna get into ECW. I never saw any of it back in the day and have always been curious. Can I just urge you that, if you're going to go throw ECW TV try to find rips of the originals rather than the dubbed mess that is the WWE Network versions and the music ECW used was a big part of their presentation and I think it hurts a rewatch to not have Misirlou playing over the Pulp Fiction promos (does the Network even have the Pulp Fiction promos? I forget), and there's no real point to The Sandman without Enter Sandman. Obviously it's  so I can't just link you to stuff but I do think that the presentation is such a big part of ECW's feel & success that you need to try experience it fully if at all possible. Blows that music licensing fucks with the Network versions so much.And yeah, Awesome was probably more like 6'3 from what I understand. By no measure a short dude but it's wrestling. The thing to remember about ECW (especially if you start from the first episodes of their TV) is that it's a north-eastern indie. Yeah, it was trying to be more than that at the end but it's an indie with weekly local TV that focused on running in Philly & the Delaware Valley area and used a lot of the talent other north-eastern indies would use. Prepare yourself for some Tony Stetson & Larry Winters & Tommy Cairo. For some Stevie Wonderful & Jay Sully on commentary. So just go in with appropriate expectations, this is a decade before workrate indies were a thing but the TV is fun to watch. There is so much to say for 1 hour weekly TV in wrestling, even if it's not great it's still so much easier & more pleasant to sit through and thus easier to focus on the positives, because the negatives aren't eating up the best part of 3 hours of your night. Oh yeah, and prepare for walk & brawls. That part of ECW's reputation is definitely earned, there were so many walk & brawls. But I do recommend people watch ECW TV who haven't. It was far from perfect but it's fun.
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Feb 15, 2020 00:05
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 I just noticed they have the same haircut  lol Rick Rude owned and wish he was still around  
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Feb 15, 2020 00:54
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I love the stagehand up there who should be leaving, but gently caress if they're going to miss the Rick Rude swivel
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Feb 15, 2020 05:43
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NikkolasKing posted:I think I'm finally gonna get into ECW. I never saw any of it back in the day and have always been curious. Watch Hardcore TV from the beginning of 1995 through to Barely Legal in 1997 That's all golden and you'll see Raven's entire first run
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Feb 15, 2020 06:02
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The stupid opinions thread has been talking about botches which had me thinking: What are your favorite examples of "good botches" that ended up elevating a match or storyline moment? The best recent one I can think of was a G1 undercard tag from last year, where Okada whiffed SANADA by a mile with his dropkick but popped up and hit it a second time. They turned that into a cool little mini-story where SANADA had the dropkick scouted, which played into their next match when he kept dodging it.
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Feb 15, 2020 06:33
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i liked when bret hart forgot to give up and then did all that crazy stuff after from being so embarrassed
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Feb 15, 2020 06:37
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Benne posted:The stupid opinions thread has been talking about botches which had me thinking: What are your favorite examples of "good botches" that ended up elevating a match or storyline moment? I don't watch Chikara so I don't know if this was legit or if it was the plan from the start but in King of Trios 2015 AJ botched a Phenomenal Forearm on the first night and over the rest of the weekend he would either hesitate and decide not to do it or attempt and botch it again, finally hitting it on the last(?) night. Whether or not that first one was intentional, they made a fun little story out of it.
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Feb 15, 2020 06:41
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I remember the candido title defense because it aired during the live preview to the show on the Barker channel so there was a last second hook of WHAT WILL THE MAIN EVENT BE? ORDER RIGHT NOW
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Feb 15, 2020 07:31
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