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V. Illych L. posted:nobody ever changed society by making everyone moral people. it's a fallacy and in practical terms consumer focus always ends up boiling down to people being bad human beings for not living in a city centre Swedish LO published an investigation recently that said that environmental practices in the last 10 years or so have favoured city dwellers economically with a factor of 30:1. Thanks MP. Also probably a contributing factor to the constantly growing divide between big cities and smaller. Regarding environmentalism, Scandinavia doesn't matter, except as technology providers. Both Norway and Sweden gets most of their electricity from hydro or nuclear and population-wise we are a drop in the ocean. Which however doesn't mean we shouldn't work for better environment, just that the effect will be minuscule at best. Given the expected population growth until the end of the century, where Afrika is expected to grow with a billion and combine this with Roslings graphs on the increased welfare of the world and you have a combined effect that needs to be solved. The argument that the rest of the world shouldn't strive for Western worlds standards due to the environment doesn't really fly from a moral view. Especially since those Western world standards means better healthcare, better schools, better waste management, better power supply, which all generates CO2 unless something other than carbon power plants are introduced in a massive fashion. As example out of the 4-5 tons that is released per capita in Sweden, 1.5-2 are generated by all those things we find essential for a working society.
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Feb 17, 2020 08:02
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i actually tend to agree that foreign aid and international treaties etc are the best way to reduce emissions, but there is absolutely a place for national or regional efforts - in particular, stuff like habitat preservation and light pollution mitigation aren't really possible to do effectively elsewhere. still, i do believe that if we can show that we're holding up to our end of emissions reduction we speak with more credibility when talking to the really big players, especially ex-colonies like india or nigeria who have a justified skepticism at having to restrain their economic growth for the common good while we up here are living it up, and there are definitely savings to be made - so long as we're burning fossil fuels for energy, there are obvious targets. still, i would love to see environmental regulations on stuff like international shipping reform - there's so much to be saved just by restructuring some of the more perverse sides of international trade, and this is a business where such regulations can actually be made. in the long run, i'm skeptical of the feasibility of a sustainable economy under capitalism at all, but in the medium terms there are many obvious targets to cut which won't hurt that much.
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Feb 17, 2020 08:52
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SplitSoul posted:The only way your choice of bag is going to make a difference is if you use it to store the severed head of a fossil fuel CEO. 
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Feb 17, 2020 11:05
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Apraxin posted:jesus christ, the succ, it knows no boundaries 4 november: Kommer den vänsterextremistiska Sanders-regimen utgöra ett hot mot världssamfundet, och vilka åtgärder måste vi ta till för att förhindra framväxten av liknande extremistiska rörelser i Europa? SVT rapporterar.
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Feb 17, 2020 12:30
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PoontifexMacksimus posted:4 november: Swedish media basically copying US media wrt to Sanders ftw
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Feb 17, 2020 12:40
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norwegian press is pathetic on any sort of foreign affairs. apart from klassekampen they all just read the same selection of english and american newspapers (the telegraph, guardian, nytimes and wapo pr.much) and parrot what the op.eds there are saying. these people have as their jobs to just promulgate liberal establishment views back here
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Feb 17, 2020 12:48
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V. Illych L. posted:norwegian press is pathetic on any sort of foreign affairs. apart from klassekampen they all just read the same selection of english and american newspapers (the telegraph, guardian, nytimes and wapo pr.much) and parrot what the op.eds there are saying. these people have as their jobs to just promulgate liberal establishment views back here It's the same in Sweden, I've seen badly translated articles just copied straight from the guardian or NYT.
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Feb 17, 2020 13:28
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Same here. Politiken is even calling him "Borgmester Pete" and swooning over the seven languages. Although the Information editor had an infatuation with Warren for a long time, he's one of those dreadful "compassionate capitalism" types.
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Feb 17, 2020 13:36
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PoontifexMacksimus posted:4 november: I forgot which thread I was in for a second. But Buttmeister Geige resonating with Social Democrats makes a lot of sense, in that there's no real moral compass to either except to remain in power
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Feb 17, 2020 15:56
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Svenska "Bernie Bros" - vänsterns återvändande IS-krigare? Säpos talesman kommenterar,
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Feb 17, 2020 17:04
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Fader Movitz posted:It's the same in Sweden, I've seen badly translated articles just copied straight from the guardian or NYT. Things are pretty much hosed from the get-go when neither Public Service or DN, our biggest media actors, make an effort.
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Feb 17, 2020 17:14
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MiddleOne posted:Things are pretty much hosed from the get-go when neither Public Service or DN, our biggest media actors, make an effort. NRK has a more-or-less explicit editorial line against going in-depth in domestic politics lol, many of their political correspondents are actually pretty capable people who end up having to summarise debates in terms of winners and losers and are shoved off-stage after a minute so so they don't vote people with ideological analysis or any exploration of policy
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Feb 17, 2020 18:02
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MiddleOne posted:Things are pretty much hosed from the get-go when neither Public Service or DN, our biggest media actors, make an effort. The sad part is that there are good journalists working for DN but their good articles are often paired with some kind of incredibly shallow, liberal "political analysis". I think a trend I've noticed is that journalists who speak other languages than english and write about non-anglophone things are generally much better than the fuckers who only know how to copy paste from the guardian et al. Conclusion: English slowly melts your brain!
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Feb 17, 2020 18:19
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yeah i haven't noticed the same tendency with le monde, which is the only non-scandi non-english news source i follow. we barely cover france, but when we do it's typically someone who's actually done some work - some of whom are admittedly posh types interning with the french MSM
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Feb 17, 2020 18:54
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The police seriously gave Circus Paludan permission to protest at the funeral of a Muslim child. I guess that'll teach all of us for thinking they couldn't possibly sink any lower.
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Feb 17, 2020 23:54
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Haha, the social democratic prime minister of Denmark is too afraid to give a talk on the commons on labour day. I mean, the previous social democratic government managed to out-neoliberal the neoliberals and this one is completely out-racisting the racists; but it’s hard for me to come up with a more devastating indictment of their policy choices than this. What a loving joke.
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Feb 18, 2020 12:16
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Turns out RUT-avdraget isn't helping anyone but the upper-middle class who uses it, who knew? https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/rut-avdraget-leder-till-arbetskraftsinvandring-och-kostar-staten-miljarder
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Feb 18, 2020 12:50
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Revelation 2-13 posted:Haha, the social democratic prime minister of Denmark is too afraid to give a talk on the commons on labour day. Same thing happened with Thorning, she went to Aarhus instead and received a warm welcome from the teachers' union (a sea of placards with a displeased emoji, while one dude opted for simply "JUDAS").
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Feb 18, 2020 13:28
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BigglesSWE posted:Turns out RUT-avdraget isn't helping anyone but the upper-middle class who uses it, who knew? Right wing government being poor at maths - news at 11. E: checked and lol, of course it was a motion from C originally, the party with the worst track record when it comes to financial stuff. lilljonas fucked around with this message at 13:57 on Feb 18, 2020 |
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Feb 18, 2020 13:55
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BigglesSWE posted:Turns out RUT-avdraget isn't helping anyone but the upper-middle class who uses it, who knew?
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Feb 18, 2020 14:07
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evil_bunnY posted:This was literally obvious the minute someone explained it to me. How the gently caress are lower middle class going to afford paying someone in the first place, even without the taxes? It and the mortgage interest deduction need to gently caress off forever. Yeah I just googled it now and my immediate response was “no poo poo this is dumb as hell”
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Feb 18, 2020 14:14
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There's something rotten in the state of Denmark, when the social democrats out-neoliberalism and out-racist the neoliberalists and racists.
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Feb 18, 2020 14:18
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teen witch posted:Yeah I just googled it now and my immediate response was “no poo poo this is dumb as hell” No you see if we just make sure that upper middle class people don't have to pay tax, it'll all trickle down and everyone benefits! 
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Feb 18, 2020 14:19
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Also, Berlingske, which receives 35 million in state-funding each year despite being wholly owned by a Belgian media concern, just let Vermund say that she'd expel anyone who picketed a funeral, while at the same time casting doubt on the legitimacy of the child funeral. Not like a journalist could have investigated that claim in minutes, just serve up the false narrative uncritically.
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Feb 18, 2020 14:42
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lilljonas posted:No you see if we just make sure that upper middle class people don't have to pay tax, it'll all trickle down and everyone benefits! Pissing on the poorer classes is one form of trickle down. Probably the intended one too.
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Feb 18, 2020 14:49
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Södersjukhuset i stabsläge en vanlig söndag.... Vi är hosed om Corona viruset väller in.
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Feb 24, 2020 19:29
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Fader Movitz posted:Södersjukhuset i stabsläge en vanlig söndag.... Vi är hosed om Corona viruset väller in. Lol, vi är hosed om alliansen får fortsätta bestämma i landstinget, helt oavsett. Med andra ord 
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Feb 24, 2020 19:58
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Fader Movitz posted:Södersjukhuset i stabsläge en vanlig söndag.... Vi är hosed om Corona viruset väller in. Sån tur att vi byggde NKS istället för att investera i SöS
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Feb 25, 2020 08:03
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Is the coronavirus transmissible by urine?
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Feb 25, 2020 13:47
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Mordekai posted:Is the coronavirus transmissible by urine? No. You're perfectly safe, Mr. President.
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Feb 25, 2020 14:03
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Feb 25, 2020 18:52
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Parties propose banning Antifa on the same day Identitarian fascists hold conference at Christiansborg. Makes sense. https://solidaritet.dk/oppositionen-vil-forbyde-venstrefloejsgruppe/
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Feb 27, 2020 20:14
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Number of Corona cases double in Sweden and Finland over night.
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Feb 27, 2020 20:34
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Hey Scandinavian thread! Sorry to barge into your thread, but I was wondering if you could point me in the direction of some information about your healthcare systems. In Chile, we are voting on adopting a new constitution, and today I got into an argument with some people campaigning in the street against adopting it. While defending their ideas, they mentioned that public services are always terrible, and our current constitution prefers private entities, which are better. They then proceeded to cite Nordic countries as a success story for the case of private systems (in this case, she was referencing healthcare specifically) I have absolutely no idea how your countries' various health systems work. I read the first few pages of this thread, and saw some of the general complaints about healthcare in some of your countries. Is there a good article/post/anything which summarizes a bit of how your different systems work, like private vs public importance, positives and negatives, etc? If I have another encounter with these people, I’d like some understanding to be able to discuss their points
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Feb 27, 2020 21:29
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A lot of foreign Libertarians will harp on the power of Scandinavian private enterprise. Even when the governments fervently controls the prices on stuff like rent, medicine, healthcare, power, fuel etc.
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Feb 27, 2020 21:46
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Redczar posted:Hey Scandinavian thread! Sorry to barge into your thread, but I was wondering if you could point me in the direction of some information about your healthcare systems. I think the other Scandinavian countries differ slightly in details, but it's broadly the same.
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Feb 27, 2020 21:53
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Sweden technically has private dental care. But the government sends out charts to private dentists. Telling them how much each procedure costs. And if they disagree then they can't participate in the "system" for the things that the government does cover.
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Feb 27, 2020 21:59
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really the gold standard of public service utility is british of all things, the classical NHS worked well enough as a baseline provider of all health care services under direct government control that it's taken over three decades of continual neoliberal rule to start extracting some serious profit from it, it was that popular also every scandinavian country has incomparably larger public sectors than chile (talking 25-30% of workforce vs, like 10%). scandinavian private sector to a very large extent functions very well because of two main factors: strong unions negotiating sectoral private sector agreements and a fairly large and very robust public sector. the role of the huge trade unions absolutely cannot be underestimated when talking about scandinavian private sector productivity. your guys are dogmatic idiots
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Feb 28, 2020 00:17
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really, the very special thing about the nordic model is the extremely high degree of unionisation driving the private sector in an absolutely merciless grind towards productivity gains. most of the literature on this is in one of our languages, because foreigners very often miss this crucial aspect (as do most scandinavians nowadays because we're basically becoming foreigners as well) but it's the one thing that's set scandinavia as a bloc apart from the rest of the world and it's directly contrary to a lot of people's expectations. big, strong unions in a social-democratic setting produces some of the most formidable capitalist economies in the world. not that this prevents us from selling it off for a quick buck...
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Feb 28, 2020 00:21
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Katt posted:Number of Corona cases double in Sweden and Finland over night. And that's how it'll keep going until it's taken seriously if the rest of the world is any indication.
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Feb 28, 2020 22:03
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