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icantfindaname posted:https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/02/18/fix-primaries-let-elites-decide/ When bernie gets the nomination, I'm sure we'll see an "is democracy really necessary?" article sometime in the summer.
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Feb 19, 2020 13:26
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Meatball posted:When bernie gets the nomination, I'm sure we'll see an "is democracy really necessary?" article sometime in the summer. It will be a reversal of Popper's paradox of tolerance - any democracy which allows the tyranny of socialism cannot be a true democracy and must be fashed into submission
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Feb 19, 2020 13:27
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TyroneGoldstein posted:I don't know how old you are...so forgive me if you're over 35-ish, this ain't for you (hopefully)... but it's almost impossible to explain to someone who didn't come of age at least by the back half of the 1990's how utterly air tight and enforced the bullshit American Lore was to the in-group (white people) in this country. Remember recently as Watchmen dropped, how utterly baffled people were that they never knew about what happened in the Greenwood section of Tulsa? Yeah, that's the essence of The Thing in a nutshell. poo poo like that was utterly and completely hidden, I'm talking completely abstracted, away from the typical white person unless they were literally academically tasked with learning about it. Gonna hate myself for diving into a R&M reference: The reference fits, because it's also used in much the same sort of lens. "No, let's remember him for what he stood for." Is the quote used at the end of the episode, and it zooms back to show a statue of the king smiling like a creep while holding a kid by the shoulder. For everyone, the 'secret' is ruined by even a cursory examination of any evidence, and is only kept a secret due to the majority of people rejecting reality and denying the terrible history that happened. Which, when placed next to the truth of how we view the Founders and the country itself is how quite a few people deal with the truth: America was founded on and held aloft by corpses; of people, of nations, of societies and of promises broken. And though, through tremendous efforts over centuries of labor and bloodshed, we have become a slighty more perfect union, we are absolutely nowhere near done with what needs done. And though there are many countries that have a similar background, it doesn't excuse the people who look back and strip away all the negatives to try to puff themselves up. George Carlin had a great phrase for it: It's called the American Dream. Because you have to be asleep to believe it.
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Feb 19, 2020 13:33
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litany of gulps posted:I never really understood how much South Bend influenced the politics of our day until I started delving into South Bend history. Did you know that in 2015, the population of South Bend increased by 286, the largest one-year growth in over 20 years? Who was responsible for that? You guessed it. Pete Buttigieg. That's weird. I thought he was gay.
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Feb 19, 2020 13:35
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Pretty sure that for how little faith I have in the average American voter, I have even less in the elites. Like holy loving hell. The elites get where they are by being exploitative and purely self-absorbed and you just want to hand over all the power to them? Good loving god WaPo.
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Feb 19, 2020 13:43
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icantfindaname posted:https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/02/18/fix-primaries-let-elites-decide/ The mcmagic of op eds
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Feb 19, 2020 13:45
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I like how increasingly more often you just see rich people lose their poo poo over anything that tries to limit their wealth and power in the tiniest of ways.
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Feb 19, 2020 13:49
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https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/02/sanders-demolishes-bloomberg-buttigieg-and-klobuchar-head-to-head-says-new-poll.htmlquote:Yahoo News and YouGov are out with a new poll showing that Sanders beats all of his top competitors in head-to-head races. He currently wins at least 53 percent of the vote against Bloomberg, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar, none of whom break more than 38 percent. The matchup is closer with Biden, who gets 44 percent versus 48 percent of Sanders. But the tightest race is with Warren, who trails him 42 percent to 44 percent, with plenty of undecideds. Very interesting (and encouraging to a Warren supporter like myself.) though i really dont understand the thought process of like a 1st Choice KLOBSTER 2nd Bernie voter (insert 1st choice as needed)
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Feb 19, 2020 13:53
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J.A.B.C. posted:This has to be the worst endorsement of Preferential Voting that I have ever seen. Just, holy gently caress, saying it out loud these days. The article is a loving mess but it's marginally better than the headline made it seem.
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Feb 19, 2020 13:57
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quick reminder that Fred Hiatt is the opinion editor of WaPo and he suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks to this day im pretty sure he hasn't met a defense of the Iraq war he hasn't wanted to immediately publish I don't understand how someone who keeps writing editorials that directly contradict his own papers newsroom keeps his job.
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Feb 19, 2020 14:02
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bobjr posted:I like how increasingly more often you just see rich people lose their poo poo over anything that tries to limit their wealth and power in the tiniest of ways. But! Number go UP! If Number go down I’m moving to Galts Gulch
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Feb 19, 2020 14:04
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:I don't understand how someone who keeps writing editorials that directly contradict his own papers newsroom keeps his job. for whatever hosed up reason, this is a feature not a bug and it's shared by the NYT and WSJ. editorial boards exist to give cushy jobs to republicans and transphobes and Race Scientists and poo poo
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Feb 19, 2020 14:08
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eke out posted:for whatever hosed up reason, this is a feature not a bug and it's shared by the NYT and WSJ. editorial boards exist to give cushy jobs to republicans and transphobes and Race Scientists and poo poo Well if they aspire to push the “show both sides” bullshit and one side literally has zero facts at their disposal, I guess it makes sense they live in the editorials. 
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Feb 19, 2020 14:10
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bobjr posted:I like how increasingly more often you just see rich people lose their poo poo over anything that tries to limit their wealth and power in the tiniest of ways. Because there's nothing else to them. This is our greatest homegrown gift to the concept of culture: Society functions for nothing else than the accumulation of things for things sake. I'd say it's a deep rot, but how can it be rot when it is the literal framework? You have multiple generations of people at this point that only got educated because it would lead to a better job. It wasn't about becoming a good thinker. It wasn't about living a fulfilling life. It was about getting a better job and accumulating things so you could say to other humans "I have these things." Think about that.
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Feb 19, 2020 14:11
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tbh for the lower class its less about 'having things' and more about 'literally being able to live comfortably.'
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Feb 19, 2020 14:13
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Endorph posted:tbh for the lower class its less about 'having things' and more about 'literally being able to live comfortably.' I am not disagreeing with that at all. Masses suffering is the end result of our inhumane consumption slobbery.
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Feb 19, 2020 14:14
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bobjr posted:I like how increasingly more often you just see rich people lose their poo poo over anything that tries to limit their wealth and power in the tiniest of ways. Conversely I hate how increasingly more often you see poor people lose their poo poo over anything that tries to limit the wealth and power of rich people in the tiniest of ways. It's so exhausting and disheartening to see people from my own family, loaded down with medical and student debt, get angry at anything remotely built to *help them* because god forbid the rich don't get richer and contribute literally nothing to society. Like. Jeff Bezos just bought the most expensive property in LA and it cost him one-eighth. Of a PERCENT. of his net worth. And so many people are just okay with that. Like to put that in proportion, say you have $10,000. Jeff just spent the equivalent of $12.50 on that scale. Say that same person with $10k buys the new Samsung Galaxy S20-- just the base model, for $1000. Quite a hearty luxury for 10% of their funds. Proportionally to Bezos, 10% of what he has is around $10,000,000,000. He basically bought that property for the proportional cost of going out to McDonald's for two. Why the poor are not violently opposed to the rich getting richer and not pushing to tax them massively just sickens me.
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Feb 19, 2020 14:23
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This is from last page but ok yea a lot of Oliver’s jokes don’t hit and are cringe worthy but every now and then he does a sketch and knocks it out of the park. His Bob Murray broadway musical is something else https://youtu.be/jqt5iE1vhFw Overall John Oliver = good and is worth watching because he does go into depth on a lot of really important topics.
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Feb 19, 2020 14:42
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Solaris 2.0 posted:Overall John Oliver = good and is worth watching because he does go into depth on a lot of really important topics. yeah in terms of comedy news shows he's obviously at the top of the heap, as he's the only one willing to consistently spend 20 minutes of airtime on like... medical debt or the ways prisons contract with private companies to steal even more money from families of the incarcerated or many other topics that no one would touch for even a minute, much less an in-depth feature. i'm willing to forgive the cringey Drumpf-type segments for the amount of money and research they regularly devote to things that actually matter and aren't covered elsewhere. also he might be the only socialist with a show on cable (maybe hasan minhaj is? idk)
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Feb 19, 2020 14:58
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HONG KONG SLUMLORD posted:Well if they aspire to push the “show both sides” bullshit and one side literally has zero facts at their disposal, I guess it makes sense they live in the editorials. Yeah, striving for false balance between the reality-based community and a bunch of snowflakes who will scream endlessly about being silenced if they're not given space on a platform to spread their trash is what gets you the modern Op-Ed section.
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Feb 19, 2020 15:00
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TyroneGoldstein posted:I don't know how old you are...so forgive me if you're over 35-ish, this ain't for you (hopefully)... but it's almost impossible to explain to someone who didn't come of age at least by the back half of the 1990's how utterly air tight and enforced the bullshit American Lore was to the in-group (white people) in this country. Remember recently as Watchmen dropped, how utterly baffled people were that they never knew about what happened in the Greenwood section of Tulsa? Yeah, that's the essence of The Thing in a nutshell. poo poo like that was utterly and completely hidden, I'm talking completely abstracted, away from the typical white person unless they were literally academically tasked with learning about it. This is so true. I remember when I was a kid and I asked a question, and I asked A LOT of questions, my dad will tell me to go "get the encyclopedia" which was just a collection of facts we got duped into buying from a door to door salesman when my parents were younger. Which also was never updated, i.e. we never bought the updates. I hated reaching on that top shelf mainly because I felt I was the only one that had to do it. I had to find the answer and tell him. Now I LOVE reading wikipedia on something I come across that sounds vaguely interesting. It is underappreciated how uninformed you were allowed to be before the 2000s, especially in the south. tl;dr; - if someone is in their 30s and not curious about something assume they are an idiot. syntaxrigger fucked around with this message at 15:03 on Feb 19, 2020 |
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Feb 19, 2020 15:01
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the cleaning of house of anyone that dared speak out (even if they didn't testify and just did it through emails within the chain of command in the most moderate way imaginable) continues https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1230107761565978625
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Feb 19, 2020 15:06
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syntaxrigger posted:This is so true. I remember when I was a kid and I asked a question, and I asked A LOT of questions, my dad will tell me to go "get the encyclopedia" which was just a collection of facts we got duped into buying from a door to door salesman when my parents were younger. Which also was never updated, i.e. we never bought the updates. I hated reaching on that top shelf mainly because I felt I was the only one that had to do it. I had to find the answer and tell him. Now I LOVE reading wikipedia on something I come across that sounds vaguely interesting. Weirdly, the more information that is easily available, the bigger the backlash against intellectualism and "seeming like a know-it-all" grows. Information being broadly available just removes another barrier for incurious types to seek out facts, which (because they don't want to put in that modicum of work and feel like its ready availability is "being shoved in their faces") makes them double down on more and more irrational reasons to stay proudly ignorant. I think that's where poo poo like antivaxx and flat-earth and so on are coming from, in part. People look at Wikipedia and they don't see an emergent free resource of (mostly) impartial and true and well-attested information, what they see (because as often as not it contradicts their preconceptions) is another giant conspiracy by liberals and intellectuals to undermine what THEY KNOW to be true.
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Feb 19, 2020 15:15
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SidneyIsTheKiller posted:Because of the tweets: The damage is already done. He accomplished what he set out to do.
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Feb 19, 2020 15:16
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Triskelli posted:But! Number go UP! If Number go down I’m moving to Galts Gulch
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Feb 19, 2020 15:19
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Doctor Butts posted:The damage is already done. He accomplished what he set out to do. This is also basically what happened with Sessions, isn't it? He got to crack down on immigration and weed and then let himself be pushed out.
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Feb 19, 2020 15:19
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haveblue posted:This is also basically what happened with Sessions, isn't it? He got to crack down on immigration and weed and then let himself be pushed out. not really, he refused to do the blatantly-interfering-in-the-DOJ-solely-to-protect-Trump thing that Trump kept ordering him to do, which Barr is actively doing Barr hasn't accomplished poo poo and he isn't resigning, this is is a bullshit PR campaign he is actively pushing, that the terrible journalists covering the DOJ are abetting, meant to make it seem like he has principles and is actually Very Concerned despite the fact that he's the most dangerous partisan hack in the DOJ in modern history. don't buy the hype
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Feb 19, 2020 15:22
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J.A.B.C. posted:George Carlin had a great phrase for it: It's called the American Dream. Because you have to be asleep to believe it. Yeah this along with "The American Okey-doke" from the same special, his last, proved that even though his heart was failing, his mind was sharp and pointed right up until the very end. EDIT To contribute, I consider myself to be a pretty typical white suburban dude who spent the first 8 years of life in former Confederate states, and the rest of my childhood/young adulthood split between Arizona and California and for all the school districts I attended, they all had a pretty common, sanitized version of American history that they would teach. I had a pretty liberal World History teacher Freshman year and she tried to add to the text where she could but I flat never heard about things like the Tulsa Race War, and certainly never learned how the things like building interstates in cities were often done in a way to intentionally block off and section up thriving black parts of cities, ruining their identities as neighborhoods forever and scattering their residents, until the internet came along and I cared enough to look. The incuriousness of a lot of folks, especially Boomers who do not want to ever change their 2D view of history is often what disappoints me most about this society. The youth though, they seem to want to know things and that is a very good start, and a vast improvement on their predecessors. Examples: all the "world history" was about Europe, not Africa, Asia or South America. We only learn about China when Mao came along, only about Vietnam when we started going to war there. The Civil Rights movement was boiled mostly down to "well, bad stuff happened, the KKK existed, but then because of Rosa Parks and MLK we passed a law and it's over now the end" which obviously ignores the climate of the early 1900s (I remember the surge in KKK membership being mentioned but pretty much as a footnote and nothing else about that era) and the real struggle for black civil rights since Reconstruction. Lots of blind spots and convenient oversimplifications, basically. VH4Ever fucked around with this message at 15:44 on Feb 19, 2020 |
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Feb 19, 2020 15:27
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ZobarStyl posted:I distinctly recall the early aughts when the music industry's profits plummeted in the face of new technology, rendering their entire business model obsolete and leading them to demand taxes on blank CD-R's. I remember being struck by how it was apparently fine under capitalism to demand a payment from entire separate industry because your profits have ebbed from their historical highs. We're seeing the mask not just slip but fully come down now, with oligarchs openly attempting to purchase the presidency the exact moment the slightest hint of them paying their share comes up. The vehemence with which they will fight tooth and nail against the slightest hint of socialism stands in naked contrast to how silent they are about human beings in goddamn cages. This is a much bigger question obviously (and for a different thread or something) but I keep wondering "how do you do communism 'right'"? In the sense of no celebrity-worship/personality-cult/giant statues and portraits everywhere, a variety of consumer choice in the marketplace, a vibrant leisure and entertainment culture (i.e. rock stars/Hollywood), bacon double cheeseburgers, all the things everyone has spent generations being taught that socialism will cruelly take away from their lives? And how do you keep the entire society bought into the concept without a Stasi and a gulag system suppressing counterrevolutionaries? Is it even possible?
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Feb 19, 2020 15:50
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Data Graham posted:This is a much bigger question obviously (and for a different thread or something) but I keep wondering "how do you do communism 'right'"? In the sense of no celebrity-worship/personality-cult/giant statues and portraits everywhere, a variety of consumer choice in the marketplace, a vibrant leisure and entertainment culture (i.e. rock stars/Hollywood), bacon double cheeseburgers, all the things everyone has spent generations being taught that socialism will cruelly take away from their lives? Capitalism can not be defeated, but that does not make communism a powerless idea; on the contrary, the hermeneutic aspect of communist thought grows stronger as capital does.
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Feb 19, 2020 16:00
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Data Graham posted:This is a much bigger question obviously (and for a different thread or something) but I keep wondering "how do you do communism 'right'"? In the sense of no celebrity-worship/personality-cult/giant statues and portraits everywhere, a variety of consumer choice in the marketplace, a vibrant leisure and entertainment culture (i.e. rock stars/Hollywood), bacon double cheeseburgers, all the things everyone has spent generations being taught that socialism will cruelly take away from their lives? my cynical answer is no, as greed is innate in us and perverts any system. well regulated capitlism under a socialist derived govt seems to be the best path to coralling the worst of its harms. let the greedy have their avenues for their ambitions, just dont let them gain enough power to gently caress over everyone else. bascially Huey Long's comments from his share the wealth speech. "Giv’em a yacht! Giv’em a Palace! Send ‘em to Reno and give them a new wife when they want it, if that’s what they want." Let them run their companies and poo poo, but if they rest of us have healthcare, are safe, and can have a job with a good wage, poo poo won't be that bad.
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Feb 19, 2020 16:15
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Data Graham posted:This is a much bigger question obviously (and for a different thread or something) but I keep wondering "how do you do communism 'right'"? In the sense of no celebrity-worship/personality-cult/giant statues and portraits everywhere, a variety of consumer choice in the marketplace, a vibrant leisure and entertainment culture (i.e. rock stars/Hollywood), bacon double cheeseburgers, all the things everyone has spent generations being taught that socialism will cruelly take away from their lives? Ultimately it has to come from the people. No government structure can stand against a populace and/or governing elite no longer inclined to support its principles, as has been proven in the US recently. And the best way to keep the faith of the people is to deliver what the people want. The global turn towards authoritarianism can be directly blamed on the endemic, systemic corruption of government by the people for the people in liberal democracies. The USSR would probably be alive today if it could have delivered on its promises to its people, even if it remained a violent imperialist state.
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Feb 19, 2020 16:18
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Data Graham posted:This is a much bigger question obviously (and for a different thread or something) but I keep wondering "how do you do communism 'right'"? In the sense of no celebrity-worship/personality-cult/giant statues and portraits everywhere, a variety of consumer choice in the marketplace, a vibrant leisure and entertainment culture (i.e. rock stars/Hollywood), bacon double cheeseburgers, all the things everyone has spent generations being taught that socialism will cruelly take away from their lives?
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Feb 19, 2020 16:22
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Framboise posted:Like holy loving hell. The elites get where they are by being exploitative and purely self-absorbed and you just want to hand over all the power to them? Good loving god WaPo. What we're talking about and what the US needs as corrective action literally is the complete and utter dissolution of the ultra-wealthy 'elites'. Of course they're going to use all of their money and every iota of their power to fight against that.
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Feb 19, 2020 16:27
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VH4Ever posted:To contribute, I consider myself to be a pretty typical white suburban dude who spent the first 8 years of life in former Confederate states, and the rest of my childhood/young adulthood split between Arizona and California and for all the school districts I attended, they all had a pretty common, sanitized version of American history that they would teach. I had a pretty liberal World History teacher Freshman year and she tried to add to the text where she could but I flat never heard about things like the Tulsa Race War, and certainly never learned how the things like building interstates in cities were often done in a way to intentionally block off and section up thriving black parts of cities, ruining their identities as neighborhoods forever and scattering their residents, until the internet came along and I cared enough to look. The incuriousness of a lot of folks, especially Boomers who do not want to ever change their 2D view of history is often what disappoints me most about this society. The youth though, they seem to want to know things and that is a very good start, and a vast improvement on their predecessors. quote:Examples: all the "world history" was about Europe, not Africa, Asia or South America. We only learn about China when Mao came along, only about Vietnam when we started going to war there. The Civil Rights movement was boiled mostly down to "well, bad stuff happened, the KKK existed, but then because of Rosa Parks and MLK we passed a law and it's over now the end" which obviously ignores the climate of the early 1900s (I remember the surge in KKK membership being mentioned but pretty much as a footnote and nothing else about that era) and the real struggle for black civil rights since Reconstruction. Lots of blind spots and convenient oversimplifications, basically. The biggest failure of my schooling, to me, was not explaining the Great American Plague of the 1500-1600s, an event which has determined the shape or our modern world more than about anything else, but if we note it we remember that Native Americans exist and that's bad because then we have to answer how Europeans treated them and how we still treat them and oops, now we're uncomfortable.
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Feb 19, 2020 16:31
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This is good news https://twitter.com/joshgerstein/status/1230145812925177863?s=21
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Feb 19, 2020 16:32
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FlamingLiberal posted:This is good news I assume there's no time for the Supreme Court to take this up and kill it before November?
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Feb 19, 2020 16:42
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I figured people don't like the 1619 project because they would have to admit that there's a reason black people are hosed in America. Pretending that stuff didn't happen is key to pretending that black people have it hard because of (insert racist reason here).
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Feb 19, 2020 16:43
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theflyingorc posted:I assume there's no time for the Supreme Court to take this up and kill it before November? I want to say: SCOTUS takes the summer off and starts their term on the first Monday in October, and then they need time to hear the case and deliberate by which time voting registration is already locked in. But in a post Bush v. Gore world: Who knows, if they want to interfere in a Florida presidential election it’s not like there isn’t precedent for it.
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Feb 19, 2020 16:59
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theflyingorc posted:I assume there's no time for the Supreme Court to take this up and kill it before November? They can stay the decision until the case is heard.
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Feb 19, 2020 17:01
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