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Jaded Burnout posted:I've received delivery of a piece of woodworking machinery and I'd like to double check that I'm not about to do something stupid when powering it. All you need is an IEC60309 pigtail connector. Or buy the correct receptacle for it. They're really nice. https://www.stayonline.com/power-cords/iec60309-power-cords-international-92417.asp I realize this is spendy. H110Hawk fucked around with this message at 00:19 on Feb 21, 2020 |
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Feb 21, 2020 00:15
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Is this the right style adapter? Seems slightly more reasonably priced. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Adapter-Caravan-Camping-Ceeform-Schuko/dp/B0759FXWC1
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Feb 21, 2020 03:29
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Nevets posted:Is this the right style adapter? Seems slightly more reasonably priced. Looks correct at a glance. I was surprised by the price point as well but I knew stayonline would have it as an example. Never heard of it called ceeform, heard "commando plug" in Amsterdam, but it looks like and I assume actually is iec-60309 316. Is that a brand like Hubbell?
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Feb 21, 2020 04:10
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H110Hawk posted:Looks correct at a glance. I was surprised by the price point as well but I knew stayonline would have it as an example. Never heard of it called ceeform, heard "commando plug" in Amsterdam, but it looks like and I assume actually is iec-60309 316. Is that a brand like Hubbell? So, bearing in mind I only started looking into this yesterday, apparently the UK one is different to the European one, but now that I look for some kind of secondary source on that I can't fnid one so maybe they're the same. This is the appropriate pigtail: https://www.amazon.co.uk/PowerMaster-818738-Lead-Converter-Socket/dp/B003IJI4G2 I'm less worried about physically connecting it as I am about confirming I'm doing the right thing electrically.
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Feb 21, 2020 05:55
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Jaded Burnout posted:So, bearing in mind I only started looking into this yesterday, apparently the UK one is different to the European one, but now that I look for some kind of secondary source on that I can't fnid one so maybe they're the same. This is the appropriate pigtail: https://www.amazon.co.uk/PowerMaster-818738-Lead-Converter-Socket/dp/B003IJI4G2 https://www.ceesockets.com/knowledge/what-is-ceeform-cee-form-fully-explained/ This implies it's all just newer versions of the same standard. It will be easier to judge once you get the device and can post a picture of the plate and the plug, including the imprinted model of the plug.
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Feb 21, 2020 06:15
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H110Hawk posted:https://www.ceesockets.com/knowledge/what-is-ceeform-cee-form-fully-explained/ Gotcha. H110Hawk posted:It will be easier to judge once you get the device and can post a picture of the plate and the plug, including the imprinted model of the plug. It's downstairs, so I can post a photo later. Could you clarify, though, does the plug actually matter? I assumed it was irrelevant if you know the power draw of the machiine.
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Feb 21, 2020 06:25
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Commandos like that are standard for 'industrial' machines (I think bs7671 specifies them for certain environments), they're way more durable for a workshops etc, sometimes they'll come with extra interlocks and stuff for IP. If it's new though I'd avoid chopping it off for warranty reasons. Like others have said the adaptor should do what you need but the 13A plug top will get a bit warm and the plug fuse might pop occasionally at the upper ends on a lathe or whatever it is you've bought.
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Feb 21, 2020 12:36
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kecske posted:Commandos like that are standard for 'industrial' machines (I think bs7671 specifies them for certain environments), they're way more durable for a workshops etc, sometimes they'll come with extra interlocks and stuff for IP. If it's new though I'd avoid chopping it off for warranty reasons. Like others have said the adaptor should do what you need but the 13A plug top will get a bit warm and the plug fuse might pop occasionally at the upper ends on a lathe or whatever it is you've bought. I wasn't planning on cutting it off, but since I have 13A plugs handy it seemed like a decent option given it's held on via plastic clips. But I can get an adapter delivered this evening for £6 total so may as well. Thanks for the heads up on the socket stuff, sounds like it'll be fine, as the machine (jointer) is trade rated and I'm not a trade user, so it's unlikely to get the sort of duty cycle that you'd see in an actual workshop, nor as likely for the plug to take damage. This particular machine shouldn't even hit 10A so hopefully that's enough headroom. They have other models with larger cutters that are rated higher.
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Feb 21, 2020 12:51
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Is this where I talk about US power connectors and start fanboying about Neutrik PowerCon? Forget the US/UK receptacle debate, it's a 20A rated connector with breaking capability before it an even be removed from the socket.
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Feb 22, 2020 02:09
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Jaded Burnout posted:It's downstairs, so I can post a photo later. Could you clarify, though, does the plug actually matter? I assumed it was irrelevant if you know the power draw of the machiine. Largely just trying to be complete. I wouldn't worry too much assuming the inrush current isn't too high because UK outlets or plugs have fuses in them as I recall? I also just want to see the plate and your machine because cool new toys.
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Feb 22, 2020 02:16
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GWBBQ posted:Is this where I talk about US power connectors and start fanboying about Neutrik PowerCon? Forget the US/UK receptacle debate, it's a 20A rated connector with breaking capability before it an even be removed from the socket. Do you have a link to the specific model? I'm only seeing results for connectors without breaking, which aren't as fun.
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Feb 22, 2020 03:13
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B-Nasty posted:Do you have a link to the specific model? I'm only seeing results for connectors without breaking, which aren't as fun. Looks like it's the PowerCON TRUE1 ?
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Feb 22, 2020 04:52
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H110Hawk posted:https://www.ceesockets.com/knowledge/what-is-ceeform-cee-form-fully-explained/ seconding desire to see the motor nameplate to give a truly definitive answer
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Feb 22, 2020 05:28
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shame on an IGA posted:seconding desire to see the motor nameplate to give a truly definitive answer OK excuse my ignorance, but what is this "plate" you speak of? There's a sort of mini spec sheet in steel riveted on to the machine, I suppose there could also be one on the motor..
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Feb 22, 2020 12:23
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H110Hawk posted:because UK outlets or plugs have fuses in them as I recall? Yes that's right. So when we're talking about the "16A" plug that comes attached, it's not the amperage that it'll melt at necessarily, that's the fuse that's in it. The standard UK plug comes with a 13A fuse, hence we refer to them as 13A plugs. No fuse in the sockets.
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Feb 22, 2020 12:25
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Jaded Burnout posted:OK excuse my ignorance, but what is this "plate" you speak of? There's a sort of mini spec sheet in steel riveted on to the machine, I suppose there could also be one on the motor.. That's the one. Probably has the model number and serial number on it too.
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Feb 22, 2020 17:07
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H110Hawk posted:That's the one. Probably has the model number and serial number on it too. Gotcha. I'll post it in a bit.
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Feb 22, 2020 19:12
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Jaded Burnout posted:Gotcha. I'll post it in a bit. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rating_(electrical) - "plate rating" etc is slang for this stamped piece of metal. (Sorry for the disjointed posts, I am laid up with a bad back.) The reason I asked to see the stamp in the plug is if you bought it used it's a good idea to make sure you aren't the first one to try and change how it plugs in, and the person before may have been a moron.
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Feb 22, 2020 19:21
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H110Hawk posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rating_(electrical) - "plate rating" etc is slang for this stamped piece of metal. (Sorry for the disjointed posts, I am laid up with a bad back.) The reason I asked to see the stamp in the plug is if you bought it used it's a good idea to make sure you aren't the first one to try and change how it plugs in, and the person before may have been a moron. Ah right. No, it's a new machine.
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Feb 22, 2020 19:45
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H110Hawk posted:That's the one. Probably has the model number and serial number on it too.  The number of typos both on this plate and in the manual is not hugely heartening.
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Feb 23, 2020 16:33
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Jaded Burnout posted:
Maybe it just means Lai zhou Futian was spending their QA budget on more important stuff...
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Feb 23, 2020 19:03
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One can only hope.
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Feb 23, 2020 19:14
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I've got a light socket in my apartment for which the pull cord is gone and there's no switch so it's constantly on. I'm not terribly inclined to do any repairs on this place myself and while I could probably get the landlord to do it but  . Is there a safe / proper way to close off an energized light socket so I don't have to deal with having one just above head hight?
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Feb 24, 2020 00:09
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ItBreathes posted:I've got a light socket in my apartment for which the pull cord is gone and there's no switch so it's constantly on. I'm not terribly inclined to do any repairs on this place myself and while I could probably get the landlord to do it but What do you mean "close off"? You could get a light socket switch for it if you want to make it functional again: https://www.amazon.com/GE-Adapter-Polarized-Workshop-54180/dp/B002DN2OIS or you could use something like a light socket plug to "cap it off" if you feel that is necessary - or just a blown lightbulb.
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Feb 24, 2020 00:22
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ItBreathes posted:I've got a light socket in my apartment for which the pull cord is gone and there's no switch so it's constantly on. I'm not terribly inclined to do any repairs on this place myself and while I could probably get the landlord to do it but Don't just take the bulb out or the electricity will leak out
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Feb 24, 2020 00:48
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devicenull posted:Don't just take the bulb out or the electricity will leak out It's very much at a hight where you could easily stick your hand into it by mistake. I figure they've got to make caps of some kind for light sockets. Motronic posted:What do you mean "close off"? You could get a light socket switch for it if you want to make it functional again: https://www.amazon.com/GE-Adapter-Polarized-Workshop-54180/dp/B002DN2OIS or you could use something like a light socket plug to "cap it off" if you feel that is necessary - or just a blown lightbulb. That would work too.
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Feb 24, 2020 02:14
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Can someone tell me how stupid my plan is? I currently have a 240V 30A breaker in my main panel for an electric brewing setup (effectively, a water heater). It was cheaper to get a spa panel with a 50A GFCI breaker and a 30A non-GFCI breaker than just a 30A GFCI breaker, so that 30A breaker is supplying a 50A GFCI breaker with 10ga wire. I now want to run another outlet for a table saw. I'm fine with those being on the same circuit and just not using them at the same time. The table saw pulls about 13A at 120V, so it should pull less than that at 240V. Can I put a 20A (or maybe even 15A) breaker in the spa panel, supply it with the same 30A circuit, and then run it to an outlet on the opposite wall (call it a 30ft run) with 12/3?
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Feb 24, 2020 22:40
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Yeah, that should work fine. Just make sure you decide between 120V or 240V and use that all the way down the line. So you could put a 20a single pole breaker in the panel and run 12/2 to a regular outlet and wire your saw for 120V, or you could put in a 20a double pole breaker and run 12/3 to a 240V outlet and wire your saw for 240V. (You could probably just use 12/2 for the 240V as well since I doubt your saw uses a neutral in the 240V config.) Does the saw have to be on a GFCI too? You might be back in the same boat you were earlier with that unless I'm misunderstanding how you have your homebrew setup wired.
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Feb 25, 2020 00:23
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Nevets posted:Yeah, that should work fine. Just make sure you decide between 120V or 240V and use that all the way down the line. So you could put a 20a single pole breaker in the panel and run 12/2 to a regular outlet and wire your saw for 120V, or you could put in a 20a double pole breaker and run 12/3 to a 240V outlet and wire your saw for 240V. (You could probably just use 12/2 for the 240V as well since I doubt your saw uses a neutral in the 240V config.) Does the saw have to be on a GFCI too? You might be back in the same boat you were earlier with that unless I'm misunderstanding how you have your homebrew setup wired. The saw shouldn't have to be on GFCI now. It's theoretically easier on the motor to run it on 240V, and I currently only have one 15A circuit for all my basement outlets (except this homebrew setup), so it's pushing it to run even a shop vac at the same time as the saw.
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Feb 25, 2020 00:57
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Hubis posted:Looks like it's the PowerCON TRUE1 ? 
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Feb 25, 2020 08:02
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GWBBQ posted:Why did they discontinue them? looks like for a new version https://www.neutrik.com/en/neutrik/products/powercon/powercon-true1-top
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Feb 26, 2020 02:18
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I was sent here from the Fix-it-fast thread:H110Hawk posted:Head on over here https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3090739 and make an effort post with your sketches (maybe get it to a scale where it all fits on a single page), take a picture of the panel with the door open, if you know how to do it safely - with the cover off, and a picture of the general room you're working with and they can take it from there. Do you have a general level of comfort with electrical work as is? Have you replaced outlets before? Light switches? What tools do you have? That sort of thing. Depending on what you find in the panel you might be able to get some more juice out of it with very little effort so you can do things like get a dedicated circuit rolling for your dust collector, then just run 1 tool at a time on top of that. I'm trying to add some outlets and lighting to my garage so I can use it as a shop space. Its a two car garage arranged lengthwise, and I'll only ever have one car in it. Here's a mediocre sketch of the space (top view):  - Current layout is on the left, target new on the right. The garage extends off the bottom of the page but that's all car space and I don't want to mess with. - I want to add one outlet (right side), and remove one light and replace it with 3 new ones. Again the lower light (light 1) is right over the car and I don't want to change it. - The dashed line is the lower ceiling you can see in the further pictures. Its a duct covered in drywall. Breaker on left side of picture, shop space past plastic sheets:  Shop space itself, with new lighting locations crudely noted, plus existing and planned outlet locations:  Here's the breaker box followed by current circuit setup:   I have 20A for the garage currently, which is really only enough for one power tool at a time (I said 15A in the other thread, sorry). Someone in the other thread suggested conduit and surface mounting everything, which I'm perfectly fine with. This is only ever going to be a work space so I don't care about appearances much. I'm a little confused what the 20A+20A in locations 12 and 10 are for. I have gas furnace and water heaters, and the furnace has its own breaker. Do furnace blowers pull that much current? I've got a pretty good assortment of hand tools although not much electric specific. I have some hand-me-down wire strippers and a stash of wire nuts from something I can't remember. I've done some light fixture replacements before but nothing more intense than that. I'm very interested in learning though since I finally own my own place and want to do as much maintenance as possible myself.
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Feb 26, 2020 07:29
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That's a double pole breaker, it supplies 20a at twice the voltage. Pretty typical for utilities.
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Feb 26, 2020 13:32
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Seems like the easy option would be to replace the existing garage breaker with a double breaker like you already have for the kitchen, and run your new receptacle from that. If you aren't opposed to conduit on the surface, you can put a junction box at the existing light and run conduit from there to the other two light locations. That's what I did when I upgraded from one light to four in my garage.
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Feb 26, 2020 14:33
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oXDemosthenesXo posted:I was sent here from the Fix-it-fast thread: If your furnace is gas the blower is usually only 15a or 20a single pole. Do you have central air? That's most likely what 10-12 are. You've got a lot of tandem breakers already. You're up to 16 circuits (actually 18 but that's next). Max is 20 for your service. You could probably add another tandem to the garage. However, 1-3 says Dryer but it appears that something else is on that - it looks to be double-tapped. I would correct that. You have two pieces of machinery on the same breaker. They make tandem 2-poles. However, I'd identify the other circuit, find out it';s amperage, and install another 2-pole for that. You'll have to re-arrange some things in there.
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Feb 26, 2020 15:39
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Ferrule posted:If your furnace is gas the blower is usually only 15a or 20a single pole. Do you have central air? That's most likely what 10-12 are. Does this sound about right? 1. Correct double tap. Figure out what offending circuit is powering. Remove offending circuit. Convert one of the non-garage breakers to tandem. Move offending circuit to new tandem slot. 2. Change garage circuit to tandem. Run new tandem circuit to new garage receptacle. Based on what you said this maxes out the box, which is fine for now. Is any of this difficult or dangerous to do? Other than don't touch the mains live wires, and turning off the breakers before removing and swapping circuits around, what do I need to know?
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Feb 28, 2020 04:46
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IOwnCalculus posted:
I like this idea. I'll be converting 1 light to 3, and not reusing the existing light. For a shopping list I've got: - 1x junction box (min 3 way). Is there any difference between plastic and metal conduit and junction boxes? - 3x lighting of my choice + mounting - Enough conduit to make the three connections - Conduit brackets - Wire. What type? There's a bewildering array of acronyms to choose from. What gauge? - Wiring diagram. Will I be making all the connections directly wire-wire with wirenuts or something, or do I need to find a terminal to go with the junction box?
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Feb 28, 2020 04:54
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Either metal or plastic boxes work, but you want to use the same for both conduit and boxes. Pick which type of conduit you want to use and then get the boxes that match it. For wire you'll want THHN, they sell it in spools of individual wires in different colors, or a spool with white/black/green already twisted together. You'll need 12 gauge if your lighting is running on a 20a breaker or you plan on using the circuit to add outlets later on, otherwise you can use 14 guage. You can get solid core or stranded, the difference is price and flexibility, with the stranded being much easier to pull through conduit. If you've never pulled wire before you'll also need to get a fishtape, and I'd recommend getting some pull line to leave in the conduit alongside the wire in case you ever have to add some more. If you have any connections between stranded and solid core wire make sure you have some wire nuts that are rated to join both. I like WAGO 221's but they are pricey. You don't need special connections between the wires and the box, just a green box grounding screw for metal boxes if you go that way. Depending on which conduit you use you will have to get the fittings to properly join the box to the conduit, though.
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Feb 28, 2020 14:08
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Nevets posted:If you've never pulled wire before you'll also need to get a fishtape, and I'd recommend getting some pull line to leave in the conduit alongside the wire in case you ever have to add some more. Eh, a DIYer only needs fish tape if there's any corners and/or he's using really soft stranded wire. Otherwise, it can be pushed.
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Feb 28, 2020 23:59
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kid sinister posted:Eh, a DIYer only needs fish tape if there's any corners and/or he's using really soft stranded wire. Otherwise, it can be pushed. Use a Shopvac to suck a pull string through. Tie a plastic bag to the end of the string so it can be sucked through... Old trick, but works well.
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Feb 29, 2020 16:53
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