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Tiggum posted:Picard needs a ship so OK, he hires Rios. But he's a chartered pilot, so why is he risking his life for this crackpot mission? Raffi believes in the conspiracy but she was ready to abandon it to reconnect with her son. She only came along for the ride to Freecloud. So why didn't she just take a different ship? This can't be the only one available. And why now? Picard offers her evidence that the conspiracy is real and that galvanises her to... give up?] This one is easy if you've ever interacted with people like Raffi. She's giving up on the conspiracy to try to reconnect with her son because there is a baby on the way. But she's not really giving up on the conspiracy, she's just putting on a front. Give her a few weeks and she'll be back in the thick of it and ignoring all three of them, and her son knows it. This is in addition to whatever fancy drugs she could get on Freecloud that aren't even Federation legal (I am not a writer on the show but drugs that "expand you mind" that she would take to try to crack the conspiracy better would be the obvious choice of fake things to get her addicted to) She hitched a ride on the ship because it was free and she was going to hire Rios anyway because of the baby and her need to stay off the grid (she will undoubtedly think they have been after her the past 16 years because she knows stuff), and there is no way she wasn't already working on things just off camera, we saw as much when Picard gave her a data dump. We even got a new thing, the Conclave of Eight, which is either MJ13 levels of crazy conspiracy, or even better, international conspiracy between different big powers with Klingon/Romulan/Tholian/Gorn/Cardassian members.
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Feb 23, 2020 20:05
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Catfish Noodlin posted:Do you really think the show is just going to be a gritty exploration of Picard realizing how out of touch he is to the morally ambiguous and messy realities of the world? I think it's pretty clear that the arc of the story is going to be that Picard is unambiguously correct and good with a moral that history isn't the inexorable march towards progress and that you need to guard and be vigilant about society losing its way rather than retreating from that in the face of setbacks. They've done "stay vigilant or it will all go to poo poo" stories in the past without walking away from the positive, aspirational future into a web of cliches lifted from other shows that have gotten popular over the past decade. my guess is the first season will culminate in a big Picard speech meant to get across what you're talking about and the rest of the conclusion will be as unsatisfying as the last five episodes have been. Hopefully they've learned from Discovery but I'm honestly kind of expecting the message to be muddled by the end here. Say what you want about fully automated luxury gay space communism, but somehow exploring that or attempting to at least in some way would have been a braver choice then boldly going where Battlestar Galactica went 15 years ago
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Feb 23, 2020 20:15
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SpeakSlow posted:Oh come on. Let's not be defensively obtuse. Run a few pages back and you'll see it. No seriously, what are you talking about? I went back and skimmed about 15 pages and didn't spot anything, unless you're somehow confusing people using terms like "framing" for literal camera angles?
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Feb 23, 2020 20:33
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Lizard Combatant posted:No seriously, what are you talking about? Oh come on now, haggling definitions like we were discussing the misuse of the term "assault rifle"? Was hoping to get someone to define their criticism and engage in discussion, but all I get is more handwaving and obtusiveness. I mean, "posting on the internet" and all, but figured at least a few would be interested in defining the methods and reasons for critique here.
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Feb 23, 2020 20:56
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SpeakSlow posted:Oh come on now, haggling definitions like we were discussing the misuse of the term "assault rifle"? Was hoping to get someone to define their criticism and engage in discussion, but all I get is more handwaving and obtusiveness. Wait... So you do actually think when someone talks about how a character is framed they're literally talking about how the camera operator/DP composed a shot? I'm being sincere here, if I've missed a whole bunch of posts where people are genuinely discussing camera angles, then simply quoting them would clear up any confusion. Unless that's not what you meant by: SpeakSlow posted:So could someone tell me why there's a marked focus on camera angles in the thread? Seriously curious. In which case you're going to have to rephrase.
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Feb 23, 2020 21:04
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Lizard Combatant posted:Wait... So you do actually think when someone talks about how a character is framed they're literally talking about how the camera operator/DP composed a shot? Either you are being trolled or you are accidentally bullying an autistic person, either way I think you should probably disengage.
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Feb 23, 2020 21:25
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SpeakSlow posted:So could someone tell me why there's a marked focus on camera angles in the thread? Seriously curious. 
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Feb 23, 2020 21:49
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Tighclops posted:They've done "stay vigilant or it will all go to poo poo" stories in the past without walking away from the positive, aspirational future into a web of cliches lifted from other shows that have gotten popular over the past decade. my guess is the first season will culminate in a big Picard speech meant to get across what you're talking about and the rest of the conclusion will be as unsatisfying as the last five episodes have been. Hopefully they've learned from Discovery but I'm honestly kind of expecting the message to be muddled by the end here. Yes, but I think the underlying idea is that it's supposed to serve as a thinly veiled commentary on the present. Institutions have faltered, things are getting bad, and have the potential to get worse, and the answer is meaningful engagement and not principled retreat into your own personal comfort. Is that substantially different from stories they've told before? No, probably not on a broad level, but I think it is meaningfully different from DS9(War is hell), TNG(here's how fully automated luxury gay space communism handles a relatively narrow range of problems), and Voyager(uhh I have no loving idea I've only watched the first episode). I don't know if it's a season 1 story or a series long timeframe, but I'd tend to imagine that you're going to end this story with a clear recognition of the wrongs against Romulan refugees and/or synths and improvement of their material conditions and circumstances, and maybe even a hook for a post-Picard/post-Discovery return to the serial classic Star Trek stories everyone is still clamoring for after these shows.
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Feb 23, 2020 21:52
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A Dramatic camera angle
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Feb 23, 2020 21:54
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HD DAD posted:Travis Mayweather just appears to be piloting the La Sirena in several scenes. He says nothing, and no one acknowledges him. Only if he only appears to one person as a ghost and stares at the person, silently screaming "help me" or something.
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Feb 23, 2020 22:46
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Horizon Burning posted:People are going to look back on this little time period of media, where everything has to be super didactic and beat you over the head with a Very Important Message About Hope Because The Orange Man Won as one of the most embarrassing time periods in pop culture writing. It'll be up there with Post-9/11 Insanity and the 2007 Writer's Strike as having a deleterious effect on the stories people were telling. It's like people need their entertainment media to swaddle them in clothes and pat them on the back and tell them, hush hush, that it'll be okay. But like, not by creating new media - no, that'd be a financial risk. By taking old properties and twistin them so you can Make A Point. Just going to +1 this, I hope to Christ Bernie wins so I can point out that Americans have spent the last four years functionally crazy because the wrong team won the Superbowl and it warped everything around it. Its been endlessly tedious.
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Feb 23, 2020 23:49
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Lol I bet you guys would have been complaining about all the Vietnam allegories in the 60's and 70's
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Feb 24, 2020 00:20
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Drink-Mix Man posted:Lol I bet you guys would have been complaining about all the Vietnam allegories in the 60's and 70's People are going to look back on this little time period of media, where everything has to be super didactic and beat you over the head with a Very Important Message About Hope Because The Sweaty Man Won as one of the most embarrassing time periods in pop culture writing. etc., etc.
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Feb 24, 2020 00:24
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Tiggum posted:
If this doesn't change, I'm going to be forced to agree with everyone saying that this show is throwing the character of Picard under the bus. Why surround him with these people? They're not necessarily there because they believe in the mission or his authority, they're there to follow an old fuddy-duddy whom they used to respect, but no longer. Hopefully once they get to the cube in the next episode, things will begin to fall into place. Otherwise, I may end up taking the same message away from this show that I did from my brief time watching Rick and Morty: "No, you can't have heroes, and in fact you are stupid for even wanting them."
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Feb 24, 2020 00:44
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I watched the first episode of The Terror and that is just a masterclass in editing and writing working together. Thanks to whoever recommended it.
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Feb 24, 2020 01:30
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I thoroughly enjoyed this episode. They're doing a surprisingly good job of throwing nods to characters from the previous shows without pointing spotlights at them and waiting for applause. And the ongoing look at life outside of the Federation carpet showrooms and sweaty Klingon abattoirs continues to be refreshing.marktheando posted:Goon face blindness strikes again I would like to applaud the inhabitants of this loving awful thread for being so attuned to the ideals of Roddenbery that they can't see the difference between the Greek and Indian races.
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Feb 24, 2020 04:09
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HidaO-Win posted:Just going to +1 this, I hope to Christ Bernie wins so I can point out that Americans have spent the last four years functionally crazy because the wrong team won the Superbowl and it warped everything around it. Its been endlessly tedious. Ah yes, why can't Star Trek take the enlightened perspective that politics is purely a team sport and it doesn't matter who wins?
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Feb 24, 2020 05:44
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I think the problem with this episode is that it basically killed the momentum of the 4 episodes before it. I get that they wanted to do a rando planet episode to explore life outside Federation reach and wanted to go with an old school ridiculous undercover op episode as a throw back to previous series. But the plotting was weird, fridge-ing a character to give 7 motivation, and just a janky plot that went piratically nowhere kinda just made this a bad episode. Also, the problem we have in modern tv and this type of trek is serialization. We have to take the series as a whole because everything interlocks with each other and if they fail to stick the landing it makes watching the previous episodes feel useless. I'm still enjoying it but yikes, that episode was bad. That being said, I'd watch a series with Rios as Captain of the Enterprise F. Pragmatically moral Captain I guess?
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Feb 24, 2020 06:03
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Lovely Joe Stalin posted:I would like to applaud the inhabitants of this loving awful thread for being so attuned to the ideals of Roddenbery that they can't see the difference between the Greek and Indian races. turns out star trek 'optimism' was just a very optimistic view of colonialism.
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Feb 24, 2020 06:06
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Lovely Joe Stalin posted:I would like to applaud the inhabitants of this loving awful thread for being so attuned to the ideals of Roddenbery that they can't see the difference between the Greek and Indian races. Get hosed, you boring idiot. Yeah, no one could possibly have seen a resemblance between those two women in that scene without being racist. Oh and Zadegan's background is Iranian, not Indian. If that ever actually mattered to you. Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 07:00
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what has happened to this thread oh my goodness
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Feb 24, 2020 07:20
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Dr. Fishopolis posted:what has happened to this thread oh my goodness Well, let's see, it was a thread about [checks notes], hmm, yes, "Star Trek".
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Feb 24, 2020 07:21
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Dr. Fishopolis posted:what has happened to this thread oh my goodness We appear to be caught in some kind of shitposting anomaly, Captain.
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Feb 24, 2020 07:27
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Big Mean Jerk posted:We appear to be caught in some kind of shitposting anomaly, Captain. Full reverse, Mr. Crusher. Mr. La Forge, reroute auxiliary power to the probation buttons. Ban + Month on my mark. Engage!
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Feb 24, 2020 07:31
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What if Picard just stopped appearing in Picard entirely and they never addressed it
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Feb 24, 2020 07:33
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kidkissinger posted:I watched the first episode of The Terror and that is just a masterclass in editing and writing working together. Thanks to whoever recommended it. Yo. Glad you liked it!
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Feb 24, 2020 08:00
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I really do not like that they integrated the supernova destroying Romulus from JJTrek into this show. I was hoping we could excise those movies from continuity. JJ freely admits he used it as a launchpad to get to direct Star Wars and as such there’s very little ST sensibility in them. I don’t like “JL”. I don’t like how slow, repetitive and often pointless the plot is. I’m don’t like the scenes with Soji and the Romulan. The dialogue is usually really poorly written. And in general I don’t really like the tone they’ve gone with either here or with Disco. I’ll keep watching but I wouldn’t necessarily recommend someone see it if they haven’t already started. Maybe things will get better in the back half of the season. Josh Lyman fucked around with this message at 09:40 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 09:25
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Mooseontheloose posted:I think the problem with this episode is that it basically killed the momentum of the 4 episodes before it. I get that they wanted to do a rando planet episode to explore life outside Federation reach and wanted to go with an old school ridiculous undercover op episode as a throw back to previous series. But the plotting was weird, fridge-ing a character to give 7 motivation, and just a janky plot that went piratically nowhere kinda just made this a bad episode. Holy poo poo, what the gently caress kind of TV-tropes take is this even?
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Feb 24, 2020 10:09
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Finally got to watch the ep, tried watching it last week with my kid but had to turn it off because she was understandably terrified at the sudden eyeball torture scene.
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Feb 24, 2020 11:17
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Alchenar posted:In both instances he arguably deliberately sets in motion both events. He sets up the confrontation at the cafe, and then, aside from going "yeah take those two phaser rifles you've told you me you need for... reasons" and looking right at Seven as she visibly charges them up, he's operating the transporter controls as he beams her back into the room where Bjayzl is. Picard's whole thing as a captain is being a diplomatic, cultured officer and gentleman who uses violence only when necessary, but when going so makes clear he's not a pushover. Seems consistent that he's not unaware of the realities of the universe, but prefers to use violence when necessary and no further, and chides people who get too enthusiastic about escalation and brutality- that using your sword to threaten an angry if justified ex-senator at a bar would be more acceptable than wuxia beheading him without warning, and while he doesn't seem against the idea of giving a crime boss in charge of horrific vivisection her just desserts, he's probably right in that revenge isn't going to give Seven her satisfaction. That said though, in both cases they aren't in the Federation or even another major power's territory- they're on the frontier where might makes right, and vigilante justice is basically the only justice. Picard isn't used to being on the fringes.
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Feb 24, 2020 11:46
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Mooseontheloose posted:I think the problem with this episode is that it basically killed the momentum of the 4 episodes before it. I get that they wanted to do a rando planet episode to explore life outside Federation reach and wanted to go with an old school ridiculous undercover op episode as a throw back to previous series. But the plotting was weird, fridge-ing a character to give 7 motivation, and just a janky plot that went piratically nowhere kinda just made this a bad episode. Brawnfire posted:What if Picard just stopped appearing in Picard entirely and they never addressed it I wouldn't mind a bottle episode featuring Seven & The Fenris Rangers, but that ain't gonna happen in a 10-episode season. Binary Logic fucked around with this message at 12:00 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 11:57
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Ghost Leviathan posted:
Picard spent a lot of time outside Federation space while captaining the Enterprise.
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Feb 24, 2020 12:05
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Binary Logic posted:This type of modern Trek serialization is a strength not a problem. TOS, TNG (and even more, Voyager) were ridiculous in that almost every episode ended after 42 minutes with a hard reset back to established parameters as if nothing had happened, and then the next week any injuries/damage to ship and crew disappeared, never to be spoken of again. Yeah I don't think serialisation is inherently a problem, if you gave the best writers in the 90s TNG room the freedom to do a 10 episode full season arc I think you'd probably get a pretty great story out of them. Hard resets were a network mandate (and certainly favoured by Berman) looking to keep the shows syndication friendly, TNG had to fight for it's 2-parters until the network realised their popularity and DS9 eventually left them with no choice. But I also think this limitation enabled creativity too, yes you get filler or dodgy episodes but you also got interesting risks that the network probably would never commit a full season to. It's ironic that Berman then went on to commission Voyager, which on paper feels like it should have been the most serialised show of them all (2 very disparate crews having to work together and continuously adapt, cut off from the Federation - the Voyager ship and crew at the end of the show could have looked unrecognisable to how they began) but we all know how that ended up. Serialisation does limit the freedom to go hog wild and explore 20 different ideas a season, but the expectation is still to have a contained arc per episode that furthers a larger narrative. Each episode so far has certainly had a story arc for Picard, but the larger plot and Soji's elements in particular do seem quite disjointed and under developed. Possibly because they only had so much material written for it before Picard arrives and a flabby opening 3-parter intro. Binary Logic posted:I wouldn't mind a bottle episode featuring Seven & The Fenris Rangers, but that ain't gonna happen in a 10-episode season. I think you could have fleshed out the cube plot (and removed the repetitive bits) and had all of it so far as it's own stand alone episode (following an edited down amalgamation of eps 1, 2 & 3) and ending with the reveal of Narek's ulterior motivations and the federation spy connection to bring it all back home. Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 12:29 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 12:21
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Lizard Combatant posted:I think you could have fleshed out the cube plot (and removed the repetitive bits) and had all of it so far as it's own stand alone episode (following an edited down amalgamation of eps 1, 2 & 3) and ending with the reveal of Narek's ulterior motivations and the federation spy connection to bring it all back home. Indeed, but I get the feeling the suits didn't want them to go an episode with out 'Did you realise there's BORG in this show?!" Tellingly the last episode, the first one without any cutaways to the Artifact, is the one where the ex-Borg play a prominent role.
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Feb 24, 2020 12:30
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Indeed, but I get the feeling the suits didn't want them to go an episode with out 'Did you realise there's BORG in this show?!" Tellingly the last episode, the first one without any cutaways to the Artifact, is the one where the ex-Borg play a prominent role. Possibly, but you could still end the amalgamated first ep with a teaser for it (which is what they did anyway). You could have also had Seven's plot introduced a little earlier so it felt like their stories were more naturally converging on Freecloud, but then you wouldn't get that surprise* reveal at the end of episode 4 to hook you for next week. (*surprise only to anyone who didn't watch any promotional material) Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 12:35 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 12:33
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Lizard Combatant posted:Get hosed, you boring idiot. Some people are just really desperate for an own I guess
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Feb 24, 2020 13:40
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Lizard Combatant posted:Get hosed, you boring idiot. I wasn't calling anyone a racist, you melon. Maybe after ten pages worth of posts in a month you need to come up for air, because you're on a hair trigger. Like Worf presented with a viewscreen.
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Feb 24, 2020 13:52
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Big Mean Jerk posted:We appear to be caught in some kind of shitposting anomaly, Captain. Back us off, goons. Nice and slow.
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Feb 24, 2020 14:14
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Can we transport the shitposters directly to the enemy ship?
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Feb 24, 2020 14:20
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egon_beeblebrox posted:I enjoy "Star Trek."
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