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Sorry that was a lot of words to get to my actual actual question. How exactly do the Ventrues discover their preferences? Do they drink blood until they find one type they don't vomit?
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Feb 28, 2020 18:00
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Everyone posted:Okay... and why do you believe that this "gentleman gamer lie maker-upper" is on this specific forum? I've read this thread
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Feb 28, 2020 18:05
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You are 100% better off with Metapod on your ignore list
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Feb 28, 2020 19:24
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Froghammer posted:You are 100% better off with Metapod and oberst on your ignore list EDIT: From last page about not going with clan sterotypes, my current vamp is a derby girl gangrel focusing on resilience and vigor to be the toughest, strongest monster on the street. And also a dot in animalisim because she's a goddamn princess. we're running with seven players so things are a little hectic, but this has been one of my favorite characters, no real long term plans or plots, just an adrenaline junkie leg breaker who enjoys being undead. I'm usually playing group leader types, so the chance to play the wildcard/ comic relief is a big change for me and I'm loving it. No idea how I'm going to build her up in play outside of boosting physicals and maybe adding celerity into the mix, although at that point I should have just made a deava. Maybe a fighting merit based on just smashing into stuff or professional wrestling from Hurt Locker. Soonmot fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Feb 28, 2020 |
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Feb 28, 2020 20:02
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One day I'll play my Gangrel info broker who hangs out with birds on rooftops (and spies through the eyes of birds).
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Feb 28, 2020 20:22
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Derek Fcking Carr posted:V5 is made by fans, and it oozes that out of every pore to a point where its kind of a problem. What's more, it's clearly made by fans who came in through bloodlines and never really engaged with a lot of the metaplot. As a result parts that don't really work for that view of what vampire is got cut out rather brutally. (Elders get sent to the middle east, and the Camarilla is no longer the supreme government of all vampiredom by its own reckoning but a country club for elders). Some of this depends on your taste whether you like it, (I personally think the change to the camarilla is an improvement.) some of it is just stupid (Knowing Tourette from Bloodlines is a merit on its own) Most people i've talked to that hate it had more issues with the fact that the guys running it were all but overtly alt-righters that seemed to get a thrill out of being as scummy as possible. This occurred alongside really changing up a lot of VtM mainstays and lore like removing the Sabbat. Also, a few people don't like how they ripped off a lot of concepts from Requiem while the devs all but outright trashed that game. It was just shithead move after shithead move, from the whole "If you come to our LARP event be prepared for sexual assault by proxy/actual assault" thing early on, to hiring on that one rear end in a top hat for the first visual novel (who was such a bastard I believe he and his cronies ran a Onyx Path writer out of the company only for White Wolf not to drop his rear end like they should have) to the constant back pats and nods to hateful alt right trolls and straight up out and out neo-nazi's, and generally just being as detestable as possible. Also, while it isn't to do with the game itself and is a personal and altogether minor quibble from what i've seen the art in a lot of the books kinda sucks. The core book at least had the decency to show vampire cosplayers and what looked like concept art for the book that somehow made it in. But I remember at least one book had what was basically an amateur photography class's contributions where they took pictures of things that had no relevance to the content whatsoever. Like, we're talking one picture was just straight up a building. Not like a creepy vampire infested building or something, but just straight up the side of a building. I may not have always been a fan of the black and white art or relentless 90's edginess of some of the older VtM books but at least they were trying to establish a look and theme for the setting for people coming in new to it. Visually a lot of the attempts at depicting the setting in V5 came across as someone wanting to clock out, go home, and just collect their paycheck.  .Apparently the Chicago book and parts of the Anarch (? Not sure if that's the one i'm thinking of.) fix this. But from what i've heard the Chicago book straight up uses old VtM art for some of the characters in some places. Edit: I want to add a caveat that stuff like the Geek and Sundry/LA by Night crew running a really good game for several seasons now seems to have done a lot to rehabilitate the image of the game as not being intended for awful pricks. So it's not like it's relentlessly bad. But holy crap did it get a bad start. Whoever is taking over from Swedracula and crew had better be prepared to have their work cut out for them going forwards. Archonex fucked around with this message at 22:41 on Feb 28, 2020 |
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Feb 28, 2020 20:35
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In addition to all those extremely valid points, the V5 fans who didn't care about how lovely it was really poisoned the well. However rehabilitated it gets, my first impression of the player base will always have been formed by the fanboys who dismissed its genuinely awful and harmful elements.
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Feb 29, 2020 00:40
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Derek Fcking Carr posted:Sorry that was a lot of words to get to my actual actual question.
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Feb 29, 2020 00:50
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Nessus posted:I think it doesn't "set in" instantly so the young Ventrue can eat a couple of regular random people in their first nights. I read something like the sire takes the neonate out on a tour and they look for "the one" that they want the most, and that's the one they can eat. From there you can kind of trial and error whether you were into single moms, redheads, office workers, or Hungarian-Americans. Or if you're like Al Capone, it becomes almost all of those. His feeding restriction was young attractive Italian women. Not Italian-American even. They had to come from the motherland.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:08
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Ventrue feeding habits are simultaneously extremely advantageous and limiting for Vampire populations. In theory, you could have 100 Ventrue with 100 completely different feeding restrictions. In theory, this means a Ventrue-held city consists of perfect self-selected herds without the possibility of mutual predation outside of edge cases or Ventrue with very broad tastes (e.g. the ones who can eat any person of a specific gender vs the ones who can only eat lawyers, which will still have overlap), but in practice the actual availability of a given vessel on a given night is highly variable but not, outside of the homeless and other specific groups, particularly good, which renders cultivated herds vital but also makes Ventrue an enormous Masquerade threat.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:16
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Dawgstar posted:Or if you're like Al Capone, it becomes almost all of those. His feeding restriction was young attractive Italian women. Not Italian-American even. They had to come from the motherland. Another Chicago Ventrue could only feed on Vietnam veterans and all I could ever think was how hosed that guy was gonna be in the relatively near future.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:17
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TheKingslayer posted:Another Chicago Ventrue could only feed on Vietnam veterans and all I could ever think was how hosed that guy was gonna be in the relatively near future. Ventrue whose preferred feedstock become completely unavailable develop a new one over time, so he's only moderately hosed. Of course, the alternative is to simply feed on other vampires or find and ghoul Vietnam veterans, giving you a cadre of combat-trained blood donor bodyguards.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:56
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Loomer posted:Ventrue feeding habits are simultaneously extremely advantageous and limiting for Vampire populations. In theory, you could have 100 Ventrue with 100 completely different feeding restrictions. In theory, this means a Ventrue-held city consists of perfect self-selected herds without the possibility of mutual predation outside of edge cases or Ventrue with very broad tastes (e.g. the ones who can eat any person of a specific gender vs the ones who can only eat lawyers, which will still have overlap), but in practice the actual availability of a given vessel on a given night is highly variable but not, outside of the homeless and other specific groups, particularly good, which renders cultivated herds vital but also makes Ventrue an enormous Masquerade threat. Yeah. They make a deal of i tin the second Chicago book that it's really easy to hit a Ventrue where it hurts once you figure out their preference. Like to use Capone as an example again, one of the example tactics was hijacking the shipments of the girls as they came into the city. So at minimum you've got a very specific white slave trade in town uncovered which is all kinds of interest to people.
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Feb 29, 2020 04:21
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Loomer posted:Ventrue whose preferred feedstock become completely unavailable develop a new one over time, so he's only moderately hosed. the idea of his preferred feedstock changing is a miss on some good personal horror I think can you imagine the lengths a vampire would go to when he has no ability to sate that gnawing, screaming beast? Like that's super super good right there
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Feb 29, 2020 04:58
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TheKingslayer posted:Another Chicago Ventrue could only feed on Vietnam veterans and all I could ever think was how hosed that guy was gonna be in the relatively near future. That one reminds me of New Wave Requiem, the 80s setting book for nVampire, which presents the bizarre occult cul-de-sac of Playback, an alternate Auspex power that replaces The Spirit's Touch and allows you to read data or media stored magnetically, like on VHS or floppy disk, with a touch, but explicitly not optical or electronic media like CDs or flash drives. And a vampire who develops Playback instead of The Spirit's Touch can't go back to learn the Spirit's Touch instead. Some Mekhet, I guess, are mad to this day that Betamax never took off.
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Feb 29, 2020 06:24
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Arivia posted:the idea of his preferred feedstock changing is a miss on some good personal horror I think
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Feb 29, 2020 06:33
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Nessus posted:I think you basically have to go into torpor from hunger before it happens, so it's not like you get off easy. Yeah, you pretty much have to starve to death repeatedly before your restriction shifts, so in many respects it's even worse. You have that desperation over and over, the gnawing hunger and agony night after night. Then you wake thanks to someone feeding you, only to vomit it back up because it isn't time yet if it's mortal blood, or to discover you can't eat anyone and must starve again if it's vampiric, until finally - after years, decades, centuries, it's impossible to know which it will be - you can eat again. Centuries of impossible, desperate hunger, all denied the sweet release of death.
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Feb 29, 2020 06:42
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Loomer posted:Yeah, you pretty much have to starve to death repeatedly before your restriction shifts, so in many respects it's even worse. You have that desperation over and over, the gnawing hunger and agony night after night. Then you wake thanks to someone feeding you, only to vomit it back up because it isn't time yet if it's mortal blood, or to discover you can't eat anyone and must starve again if it's vampiric, until finally - after years, decades, centuries, it's impossible to know which it will be - you can eat again. Centuries of impossible, desperate hunger, all denied the sweet release of death.
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Feb 29, 2020 06:48
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I Am Just a Box posted:That one reminds me of New Wave Requiem, the 80s setting book for nVampire, which presents the bizarre occult cul-de-sac of Playback, an alternate Auspex power that replaces The Spirit's Touch and allows you to read data or media stored magnetically, like on VHS or floppy disk, with a touch, but explicitly not optical or electronic media like CDs or flash drives. And a vampire who develops Playback instead of The Spirit's Touch can't go back to learn the Spirit's Touch instead. Holy poo poo, I've never heard of this and it sounds amazing. A lot of NWoD missed me so it's always neat to find out about books like Slashers/Threat Recognition Guide etc. Arivia posted:the idea of his preferred feedstock changing is a miss on some good personal horror I think This conversation made me think of one of the more horrific feeding restrictions from Chicago, Horatio Ballard's. He can only feed from the children in his family but there's a bit in his entry that mentions all the kids have to spend one week a year with him and it makes my skin crawl.
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Feb 29, 2020 09:49
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Loomer posted:Yeah, you pretty much have to starve to death repeatedly before your restriction shifts, so in many respects it's even worse. You have that desperation over and over, the gnawing hunger and agony night after night. Then you wake thanks to someone feeding you, only to vomit it back up because it isn't time yet if it's mortal blood, or to discover you can't eat anyone and must starve again if it's vampiric, until finally - after years, decades, centuries, it's impossible to know which it will be - you can eat again. Centuries of impossible, desperate hunger, all denied the sweet release of death. Okay that’s pretty great.
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Feb 29, 2020 09:51
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The most nuts feeding restriction in a 'the devs didn't think this through way' was Bobby "The Hurricane" Weatherbottom, 1990's style super hacker, who could only feed one one person and she was a vampire. Now, he loved her (or at least lusted) so he didn't care abou tthe Blood Bond but taken to a natural conclusion that doesn't end well for either of them.
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Feb 29, 2020 14:06
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Dawgstar posted:The most nuts feeding restriction in a 'the devs didn't think this through way' was Bobby "The Hurricane" Weatherbottom, 1990's style super hacker, who could only feed one one person and she was a vampire. Now, he loved her (or at least lusted) so he didn't care abou tthe Blood Bond but taken to a natural conclusion that doesn't end well for either of them. It's worse than that. Amanda Cersey was a human, not a vampire. It sounds the same but the difference is that if your feeding restriction is 'this vampire', it's actually not a restriction at all, as Ventrue can always drink vampire blood without difficulty. At the time, there weren't any hard rules on how fast a human regains blood but for 2nd edition it was set at 1BP a day, but the practical reality of this and the tack I take in Anthropovoric Predation Models of the Late Anthropocene is that this is unsustainable over the long term. In Weatherbottom's case, this means either a lot of blood transfusions (not actually a good thing for a human) for Amanda, or Bobby having no choice but to feed on other vampires to supplement his diet. EDIT: An incredibly horrifying thing to see happen to a loved one comes from the extra load of constant blood loss, and it's a form of leukaemia. Overstress the system by requiring it to constantly replace blood and eventually the bone marrow basically just breaks down and you die as it stops producing blood cells - it's one of the essentially inevitable long-term outcomes of polycythemia vera, which unfortunately a close family member of mine has, where various kinds of it set in due to the combination of treatment regimen (lots of bleeding) and drug interactions. So even if Bobby doesn't overdo it by accident one day and frenzy on Amanda, and even if she can regen a blood point a day, the extra strain is potentially going to condemn her to an incredibly awful death. Loomer fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Feb 29, 2020 |
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Feb 29, 2020 15:00
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The idea that someone on this forum is slandering Matt Dawkins on Facebook because We Hate Vampire The Masquerade Fifth Edition is laughable, and honestly kind of insulting. I don't let the game occupy that much of my headspace, it doesn't deserve it. Also, there are actual reasons to mock Dawkins that you don't need to make up false "Larp Creep" accusations. Like him inserting his bad lovecraft fanfiction into a CofD Product and contributing to the complete tonal mess that was the Insatiables.
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Feb 29, 2020 16:38
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Loomer posted:It's worse than that. Amanda Cersey was a human, not a vampire. It sounds the same but the difference is that if your feeding restriction is 'this vampire', it's actually not a restriction at all, as Ventrue can always drink vampire blood without difficulty. At the time, there weren't any hard rules on how fast a human regains blood but for 2nd edition it was set at 1BP a day, but the practical reality of this and the tack I take in Anthropovoric Predation Models of the Late Anthropocene is that this is unsustainable over the long term. In Weatherbottom's case, this means either a lot of blood transfusions (not actually a good thing for a human) for Amanda, or Bobby having no choice but to feed on other vampires to supplement his diet. Good catch. I was confusing her with Lodin's progeny Lorraine for some reason.
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Feb 29, 2020 17:01
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It's me, I'm the one spreading vicious lies and slander about Matt Dawkins. I'm not sorry and I'm not stopping.
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Feb 29, 2020 17:44
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The phrase ‘late anthropocene’ fills me with significant fear, so congrats Loomer. I assume that’s meant in terms of the occult apocalypse just around the corner for Old WoD, or is it just generally concerning?
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Feb 29, 2020 17:55
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Kurieg posted:Also, there are actual reasons to mock Dawkins that you don't need to make up false "Larp Creep" accusations. Like him inserting his bad lovecraft fanfiction into a CofD Product and contributing to the complete tonal mess that was the Insatiables. Oh my lord, did he say somewhere that he was the one who wrote the Blind Man? Because the Blind Man was easily the worst of a crop that was already bad enough to contain ~Null Snyper~ Internet Scourge
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Feb 29, 2020 20:18
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The funny thing is I like LA By Night but I'm sure as gently caress not going to discuss it in a thread where the only two people to talk to about it are the weirdos running some kind of dumb trolling campaign.
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Feb 29, 2020 20:19
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Truly, LA By Night is the Homestuck of streamed RPGs
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Feb 29, 2020 20:50
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I Am Just a Box posted:Oh my lord, did he say somewhere that he was the one who wrote the Blind Man? Because the Blind Man was easily the worst of a crop that was already bad enough to contain ~Null Snyper~ Internet Scourge My favorite thing out of that book will always be the Sexy Snake.
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Feb 29, 2020 21:01
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I Am Just a Box posted:Oh my lord, did he say somewhere that he was the one who wrote the Blind Man? Because the Blind Man was easily the worst of a crop that was already bad enough to contain ~Null Snyper~ Internet Scourge I would now really like a list of every Insatiable and their writer, so we can proper mock them all. Some things deserve light-hearted mockery and also to never see the light of published day.
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Feb 29, 2020 21:02
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Blockhouse posted:The funny thing is I like LA By Night but I'm sure as gently caress not going to discuss it in a thread where the only two people to talk to about it are the weirdos running some kind of dumb trolling campaign. No, please do talk about it, but just ignore them. There is no reason why we shouldn't have good faith discussions about V5 in here.
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Feb 29, 2020 21:14
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I Am Just a Box posted:Oh my lord, did he say somewhere that he was the one who wrote the Blind Man? Because the Blind Man was easily the worst of a crop that was already bad enough to contain ~Null Snyper~ Internet Scourge He did but I can't remember where. Basically the insatiables were five otherwise unrelated monsters from five different authors that they tried to stitch together into a unified splat.
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Feb 29, 2020 21:18
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Soonmot posted:No, please do talk about it, but just ignore them. There is no reason why we shouldn't have good faith discussions about V5 in here. I think last night's episode is maybe the first time I really got what the deal with the Tremere in V5 was, beyond just the basic blood wizard thing. They're people who are just now discovering there's a world beyond the hosed up ways of the Pyramid and trying to readjust, building tools that they had never needed until this point.
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Feb 29, 2020 23:16
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Joe Slowboat posted:The phrase ‘late anthropocene’ fills me with significant fear, so congrats Loomer. Both!
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Feb 29, 2020 23:25
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ElNarez posted:I think last night's episode is maybe the first time I really got what the deal with the Tremere in V5 was, beyond just the basic blood wizard thing. They're people who are just now discovering there's a world beyond the hosed up ways of the Pyramid and trying to readjust, building tools that they had never needed until this point. There have been Anarch Tremere since at least Revised.
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Mar 1, 2020 00:13
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Does V5 just leave the blame on the Pyramid itself, or does it recognize that occultists are usually loving lunatic wackjobs and have a worldview that has a tendency to cultivate whatever underlying nascent personality disorders a person may have into fullblown status, and that the problem isn't just the Pyramid but the bulk of the Clan, who've been selected precisely because they had the potential to be even more psychopathic than the average vampire? I say this as an occultist myself, incidentally - this isn't some 'ooh magic evil' woo so much as hard-won experience.
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Mar 1, 2020 00:35
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MonsieurChoc posted:There have been Anarch Tremere since at least Revised. I meant more in the larger context of the fall of the Pyramid destroying all the Tremere blood bonds. Loomer posted:Does V5 just leave the blame on the Pyramid itself, or does it recognize that occultists are usually loving lunatic wackjobs and have a worldview that has a tendency to cultivate whatever underlying nascent personality disorders a person may have into fullblown status, and that the problem isn't just the Pyramid but the bulk of the Clan, who've been selected precisely because they had the potential to be even more psychopathic than the average vampire? I say this as an occultist myself, incidentally - this isn't some 'ooh magic evil' woo so much as hard-won experience. Also, yeah, the bit of fiction at the beginning of the Tremere writeup in the V5 corebook is about Shrekt, Carna and a representative of House Goratrix talking about the kind of people they're recruiting now that the Pyramid is gone, with Carna talking about how maybe recruiting beyond the total assholes is key to the clan's survival.
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Mar 1, 2020 01:07
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ElNarez posted:I meant more in the larger context of the fall of the Pyramid destroying all the Tremere blood bonds. But occultism makes you an rear end in a top hat in the same way the internet makes you stupid. It's inevitable.
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Mar 1, 2020 01:19
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Loomer posted:But occultism makes you an rear end in a top hat in the same way the internet makes you stupid. It's inevitable. That’s a mean thing to say about Phil “Satyros” Brucato
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Mar 1, 2020 02:09
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