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The Lord Bude posted:Somebody remind me again how he managed to win a season? because they voted david out
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Feb 28, 2020 08:50
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It's never a great idea to betray someone while keeping them in the game, let alone keep an infamous scrambler like Adam. He's probably out of his league here but it's a dumb risk. Hyped to see Natalie get another token after Old Man Ethan fails to find the clues.
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Feb 28, 2020 09:25
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Honestly, I think Adam's biggest blunder is not talking to Denise about it. We've seen Adam talk Denise out of potential mistakes. We saw him discussing with Denise about putting the target on Parvati. What we didn't see is him telling Denise that he's thinking of talking to Ethan and Rob about it, because she could have talked him down. That might also be a signal that Adam is definitely playing a bit of a selfish game too. Denise has to recognize that at the end of the day, he could cut her.
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Feb 28, 2020 10:10
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Adus posted:it would definitely kill the "rob isn't actually very good and only won RI because he was surrounded by goats" argument. i really don't understand how he's still here. I wouldn't claim Rob isn't good at the game (he's one of the best), but I'm leading the charge on the "only won RI because he was surrounded by goats" argument for sure. That said, if he pulls this one off, he is beyond reproach and unquestionably the best to ever play by a wide margin.
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Feb 28, 2020 15:29
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ApplesandOranges posted:Honestly, I think Adam's biggest blunder is not talking to Denise about it. We've seen Adam talk Denise out of potential mistakes. We saw him discussing with Denise about putting the target on Parvati. What we didn't see is him telling Denise that he's thinking of talking to Ethan and Rob about it, because she could have talked him down. I think that's exactly what it was. He didn't tell her specifically because he didn't want her to be in on it
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Feb 28, 2020 15:35
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Yeah. I don't think Adam is necessarily a "bad" player, he's just not nearly as good a player as he thinks he is. He was trying to puppetmaster the entire tribe and be good with everyone to the point where he even tried to manipulate Rob. And yeah, he left Denise hanging with that but Adam clearly never took Denise seriously as a partner. And by doing that he gave Denise all the signal she needs to know that. What's remarkable is that Adam never seemed to consider that Rob would do exactly what he did and just blow Adam's poo poo up and stick with Parv. I think that probably goes to Adam's lack of self awareness. Its the old thing where people expect others to behave the way they behave. So Adam had no loyalty to anyone was being a complete snake so he just assumed Ethan and Rob would do the same thing and blindside Parv. And THAT was stupid. And yeah, now the rub is that Adam kind of needs to go next because no one trusts him and he's a desperate enough player to do just about anything. If you let him linger around there's no telling how that will go. STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Feb 28, 2020 |
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Feb 28, 2020 16:37
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A lot of it also goes to how good other players are, at least at getting people to believe they are telling the truth when they talk about how SOLID they are Adam only made such a bold move because he thought Rob would have no outs because his voting bloc was secure
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Feb 28, 2020 17:28
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Well his voting block WAS secure. They just changed up because he went and exposed the target so it was no longer a blindside and they had to worry about idols and powers. I'll defend Adam that he's not as bad as he was this week, but I don't think you can really make excuses for his play this week. It was real, real bad and only "makes sense" in that he was arrogant enough to think he could play everyone.
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Feb 28, 2020 17:32
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He has ideas that may verge on good but lacks any of the charisma required to pull them off.
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Feb 28, 2020 18:06
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SweetJahasus posted:He has ideas that may verge on good but lacks any of the charisma required to pull them off.
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Feb 28, 2020 18:57
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SweetJahasus posted:He has ideas that may verge on good but lacks any of the charisma required to pull them off. It's not a charisma problem. Again, he has enough charisma to make people like and trust him, even people who did not like or trust him when they first met. Honestly, it's probably an arrogance problem. I think that's something a lot of the one-time players could struggle with this season; what they did worked, so there's no reason for them to change anything or self examine. Why wouldn't it work again? Tony needed Game Changers to humble him for this season so he can actually buckle down and play well. This season is probably going to be a bit humbling for Adam, though let's be real, I don't see him getting a chance to put the lessons he learns into practice.
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Feb 28, 2020 20:21
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Rob is not winning poo poo this season, it is clear he is not dictating the vote on Sele and it is only by the grace of the other players on the tribe that he and Parvati are still in. He also completely blew the pregame making an enemy out of Sandra when that could have been easily avoided. I doubt he lasts much longer in this season.
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Feb 28, 2020 20:29
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Spergatory posted:It's not a charisma problem. Again, he has enough charisma to make people like and trust him, even people who did not like or trust him when they first met. Honestly, it's probably an arrogance problem. I think that's something a lot of the one-time players could struggle with this season; what they did worked, so there's no reason for them to change anything or self examine. Why wouldn't it work again? Tony needed Game Changers to humble him for this season so he can actually buckle down and play well. This season is probably going to be a bit humbling for Adam, though let's be real, I don't see him getting a chance to put the lessons he learns into practice. I mean, its technically true that a more "charismatic" player MIGHT have been able to play everyone. We've seen some people do something like it. But yeah, that's not really the issue. Its just an arrogant play to assume you can manipulate everyone on the tribe in different directions and no one will talk to anyone. It assumes you're the smartest person on the tribe. And on occasion the actual smartest person on the tribe pulls it off. But its always a cocky, reckless move and Adam was doing it all in direct defiance of what he was saying was common thought that you gotta upset someone to pull off a blindside. He just thought he was clever enough to break the odds. But yeah, I agree. Its just a case of Adam coming off winning so there was no real knocking him off his pedastal vs a guy like Tony who got knocked down and now realizes he ain't king poo poo.
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Feb 28, 2020 20:39
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something people are missing when they're saying "why not simply take out Rob and Parvati" is that in a game like this, Rob and Parvati's glowing targets become resources. They're shields, especially in a bad swap situation. if any of the new school players are in trouble post-swap, they can simply point to Rob or Parvati and say "but do you really want them to make the merge???". also, by taking out Ethan, Rob and Parvati have been isolated, almost declawed completely. one of them still might go if Sele goes to tribal before the merge, though. Jeremy and Adam would probably prefer Parvati to go, but Michele, Denise, and Ben would vote out Rob, and I think ultimately Jeremy would go with the majority and Adam is now in no position to dictate the vote, and would just be an additional number. I kinda hope Dakal goes to tribal, though, because they've been getting too comfortable.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:11
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There's definitely some of that too. Jeremy lost his first season because he took out the bigger target ahead of him and became the big target. Michelle won by playing under the radar of even TV. Denise won playing behind Malcolm. We see players preserve big targets every season because they want to hide behind them. And Rob is definitely the biggest target. I also think people are kind of short changing Parv by not seeing her as as big a target as Rob. One of them called her more dangerous than Rob and I don't know that I disagree with that. She's a drat good player and master manipulator in her own right and she was the target until Adam told them. As I said before I think the shift to Ethan was just shifting to a softer target in case someone pulled an idol.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:27
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Spatula City posted:also, by taking out Ethan, Rob and Parvati have been isolated, almost declawed completely. Only if there isn’t a tribe shuffle in the next episode or two, which seems highly unlikely.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:36
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We do seem overdue for a shuffle, but maybe they're throwing them a curve. But if Rob's tribe keeps losing it seems like you gotta do it just to shake stuff up.
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Feb 29, 2020 03:40
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That has me wondering how they'll divide up the tribes. At the start, it was plainly pre-arranged and just given the nature of this season I assume swaps will be as well. Often, though, tribe swaps and stuff are implied to be random. Is that purely for conceit of the show and producers always discuss and decide tribe mix-ups? Do they sometimes actually just leave it up to randomness or is it a blend, let it be random unless there's something they really don't like. If everyone drew their original tribes, they'd do redraw(but not show as one) until enough folks switched up?
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Feb 29, 2020 03:55
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Call me a rube but I'm not terribly convinced they are pre-arranged. I mean, I'm sure the entire "pick a rock" thing can be entirely staged for TV and in reality they can be just sending them to corners. But have players like said that? Just because some splits and team ups were convenient doesn't mean it was all pre-arranged. Its a small group with a lot of connections. There were always going to be connections and stories. I mean I could by that Jeff made sure Rob got the first buff and Sandra got the last one or something like that. But I think you have to convince me that the whole thing is set up. That just seems overly rigged and kind of largely unnecessary. We've seen all sorts of screwy draws and every manner of convenient and inconvenient break.
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Feb 29, 2020 04:13
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It’s my understanding (someone correct me if I’m wrong) that game show rules require them to have the major twists written out in advance, although they can write themselves in some wiggle room, but they’re generally bound to what they wrote. Twists, merges, tribe reshuffles, final 2/3, jury size, etc are all documented somewhere in some form pregame (this event happens in this form at this time/when this condition is reached) so that if there’s a lawsuit they can protect themselves. (“Jeff/Production kept reshuffling the tribes until I was away from all my allies and then I lost!”) To that end, stuff that says random is random, and there have been multiple instances of random swaps and stuff creating deeply unfair and/or uninteresting situations, but they’re stuck with it.
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Feb 29, 2020 04:14
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STAC Goat posted:Call me a rube but I'm not terribly convinced they are pre-arranged. I mean, I'm sure the entire "pick a rock" thing can be entirely staged for TV and in reality they can be just sending them to corners. But have players like said that? Just because some splits and team ups were convenient doesn't mean it was all pre-arranged. Its a small group with a lot of connections. There were always going to be connections and stories. When Jeff passed out the buffs, they were wrapped but labeled with each person's name. He said "find your name and take it".
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Feb 29, 2020 04:18
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I don't think these shows technically abide by those old "GameShow" rules. I can't really explain why though. Its just something I've been told/read. But I also don't think this stuff is nearly as choreographed as fans convince themselves it is. I do think producers put their thumbs on the scales and tweak things and make on the fly calls depending on how stuff is going. And they even sometimes have their favorites and sometimes unfairly treat them differently. But like, I think once fans start thinking stuff is just set up or straight rigged it gets kind of tinfoil hatty. People hear that like individual shots or lines are "reshot" or staged and then they just assume everything is. I think they just don't grasp how awkward and unnatural these productions are and how like the fortuitous thing actually does happen sometimes, especially in small groupings. Pinterest Mom posted:When Jeff passed out the buffs, they were wrapped but labeled with each person's name. He said "find your name and take it". I did not know that. Ok, that's different. I am not a smart man.
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Feb 29, 2020 04:18
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STAC Goat posted:I did not know that. Ok, that's different. I am not a smart man. I think it got lost in the chaos of the first episode and wasn’t really important enough to include but the very first “twist” was that a lot of the contestants, if you watch some of their pre-game video, had been duped into thinking the tribes were men vs. women. They segregated them all by gender a couple days and sent them out on the boats together — during the pregame stuff they seemed to know who was playing from their own gender then not the other. There was a lot of day zero personal strategizing about potential alliances and early targets that went out the window when the new balanced tribes were revealed.
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Feb 29, 2020 04:24
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I caught the gender fakeout. I guess I just missed the names. I assumed it was just the usual "grab a buff." I have a bad habit of not hearing what show hosts say for some reason. I tend to rewind the challenge rules like 3 times. It makes a lot of words I posted look kind of silly. Ah well. Not the first time.
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Feb 29, 2020 04:27
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STAC Goat posted:Call me a rube but I'm not terribly convinced they are pre-arranged. I just checked again and Jeff had a platter with wrapped bundles, each with a name written on it. He tells them to grab the bundle with their name on it, and inside is their bandana. This season was plainly pre-arranged for at least the initial tribes, they made no claims of it being random. Past seasons, who knows, probably and hopefully not, but this time at least they deffo decided beforehand. edit: Whoops, left this reply window open so long it was already addressed. Khanstant fucked around with this message at 05:13 on Feb 29, 2020 |
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Feb 29, 2020 04:43
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Khanstant posted:I just checked again and Jeff had a platter with wrapped bundles, each with a name written on it. He tells them to grab the bundle with their name on it, and inside is their bandana. They allow merge tribes to be random, but they definitely haven’t had initial tribes be random. Either they have some sort of player draft or it’s preordained. They couldn’t keep the initial gender balance otherwise.
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Feb 29, 2020 05:24
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garthoneeye posted:They allow merge tribes to be random, but they definitely haven’t had initial tribes be random. Either they have some sort of player draft or it’s preordained. They couldn’t keep the initial gender balance otherwise. Yea they can keep it balanced. Just 1 set of bluffs for the women, 1 set of buffs for the men. Each set is even split. At least with the 20 player seasons, works perfect.
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Mar 1, 2020 10:41
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I hope they have a gender fluid or neutral person soon.
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Mar 1, 2020 21:46
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The racewar season except it's male, female, neither, and both
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Mar 1, 2020 21:50
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I still can't believe they thought that was a good idea
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Mar 1, 2020 21:51
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I liked it just because it was the only survivor season with only 6 white people.
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Mar 1, 2020 22:26
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Billy Garcia was the true winner of Survivor Race Wars because he found true love.
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Mar 1, 2020 22:30
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... from the Raro Tribe??
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Mar 1, 2020 22:41
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The Walrus posted:I liked it just because it was the only survivor season with only 6 white people. I contend it was ultimately kind of good because the final morale was that the white lady hosed over everyone to go back to the white people and then the last white guy weaseled over out of self preservation and then the minority of POC left just teamed up and kicked their asses anyway. The only lasting problem is casting Candace as a "Hero". She literally started a mutiny!
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Mar 1, 2020 22:46
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The Walrus posted:I liked it just because it was the only survivor season with only 6 white people. Fiji had the same ethnic breakdown as Cook Islands did!
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Mar 2, 2020 02:18
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STAC Goat posted:I contend it was ultimately kind of good because the final morale was that the white lady hosed over everyone to go back to the white people and then the last white guy weaseled over out of self preservation and then the minority of POC left just teamed up and kicked their asses anyway.
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Mar 2, 2020 03:41
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The Walrus posted:I liked it just because it was the only survivor season with only 6 white people.
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Mar 2, 2020 04:25
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Pinterest Mom posted:Fiji had the same ethnic breakdown as Cook Islands did! It was supposed to be what Cook Islands was, but one woman dropped out literally at the last second (the night before) due to a panic attack and they didn't have a replacement ready so they just scrapped it. STAC Goat posted:The only lasting problem is casting Candace as a "Hero". She literally started a mutiny! Mutiny aside, there's nothing heroic about her. The fact that she was cast yet again remains almost as much of a mystery as being cast the second time (and looking like a complete fool in that second iteration).
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Mar 2, 2020 16:41
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I get that she was cast because they needed a woman and she's blonde and beautiful and a doctor so she's a "hero". But it just seemed so silly to me when I watched, especially since I think you could have easily justified Sandra as a 'hero". And of course the season had her literally trying to get the heroes' poo poo together while Candace once again betrayed them. So it just always struck me as so drat funny. Of course then everything would be different.
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Mar 2, 2020 17:13
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A lot of the hero casting for HvV was weird. I mean, Stephanie and Sugar were heroes. Steph is most famous for being an rear end in a top hat and Sugar is most famous for crying on Gabon's exile and then ruining the end of that season. Very heroic. I guess you could make the argument that Palau Stephanie was "heroic" in that she was the final member of her tribe but I mean....maybe I have a different definition of a hero than a cockroach who wriggled out of a poo poo situation. (and keep in mind she spectacularly lost Guatemala because the jury all didn't like her).
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Mar 2, 2020 17:23
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