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The saddest thing being that Season 4 is where they start to get a bit more serious with the character arcs, and you can start to feel the narrative arc of what the show should always have been about, which is how Earth went from being the new kids on the block to the centrepiece of this 'Federal UN in space'.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:03
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Tighclops posted:Enterprise was always doomed because UPN was doomed. It Enterprise got a 5th season it probably would have survived the jump from UPN to The CW and finished its 6th and 7th seasons there. It died because Les Moonves had been gunning for Star Trek as a franchise for years up to that point, but couldn’t kill it outright because Voyager was just popular enough to justify renewing it. Enterprise was hobbled from the start and only got weaker as the show went on.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:06
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How do we know the show would have switched networks like that? I could buy that happening now but how likely was that in 2005?
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Mar 8, 2020 21:08
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Enterprise was doomed because the Temporal Cold War was extremely dumb and boring and most of the cast were terrible and had no personality. The only good actors are listed below: Shran T'Pol(sorta) Phlox(when not committing genocide)
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Mar 8, 2020 21:11
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I don’t think there’s any scenario where Enterprise survives to a 5th season. Low viewer numbers, issues with UPN dying, Les Moonves hating it, even Berman and Braga clearly no longer gave a poo poo about the franchise continuing.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:12
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Tighclops posted:How do we know the show would have switched networks like that? I could buy that happening now but how likely was that in 2005? Most of UPN’s shows that were on the air at the time rolled over to the CW or VH1 when UPN went off the air, so Enterprise probably would have washed up on the CW alongside Veronica Mars, Everybody Hates Chris, Smackdown, and others.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:12
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I liked the third season, for the most part. It had weak episodes, sure, but it had a pretty decent narrative throughout the season, and a lot of the episodes were good.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:18
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I legitimately liked the Xindi as a Star Trek faction and an idea. One race made up of five different species each with their own culture trying to struggle together. A sixth species that’s extinct because they were dumb birds and focused on writing poetry or some poo poo instead of developing FTL travel to escape their dying homeworld. The fact that they actually played the Temporal Cold War angle smart for the first time and had them turn out to be future Federation members who were manipulated by future assholes to try and torpedo the Federation before it was even founded because it would benefit them 400 years in the future. The hosed up space magic of the spheres and the Expanse. There’s so much good stuff in there, it just needed better writers and a non-burnt out/non-hack showrunner.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:24
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Peachfart posted:Enterprise was doomed because the Temporal Cold War was extremely dumb and boring and most of the cast were terrible and had no personality. The only good actors are listed below:
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Mar 8, 2020 21:29
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Peachfart posted:Enterprise was doomed because the Temporal Cold War was extremely dumb and boring and most of the cast were terrible and had no personality. The only good actors are listed below: Scott Bakula is a national treasure and his gradual growing desperation during season 3 was pretty good. (Edit: To expound on this because I think they deserve it, Archer’s arc from giddy and enthusiastic “Wheeeee let’s go explore spaaaaace and see what’s out there and make new friends!” to “gently caress this loving poo poo. There’s a bunch of different assholes out here trying to kill us and we don’t even understand WHY. I just know we have to stop them at any cost even my morality. Spaaaaaaace sucks.” really works for me. It shares some similarities with The Sisko ((as do the Xindi with The Dominion)) but it’s different enough to be effective.) Tripp was ok too.  I’m finding the Voyager cast WAY more dull in comparison. Except for Emergency Acerbic Comment Hologram. Longbaugh01 fucked around with this message at 21:37 on Mar 8, 2020 |
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Mar 8, 2020 21:30
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nine-gear crow posted:I legitimately liked the Xindi as a Star Trek faction and an idea. One race made up of five different species each with their own culture trying to struggle together. A sixth species that’s extinct because they were dumb birds and focused on writing poetry or some poo poo instead of developing FTL travel to escape their dying homeworld. The fact that they actually played the Temporal Cold War angle smart for the first time and had them turn out to be future Federation members who were manipulated by future assholes to try and torpedo the Federation before it was even founded because it would benefit them 400 years in the future. The hosed up space magic of the spheres and the Expanse. Yeah, there’s good stuff in the Xindi season. They just desperately needed to take a cue from DS9 that if you’re gonna do this kind of “serious consequences in war” stuff, that’s fine, but you need to break up the brutal misery with little moments of hope and peace for the characters. It helped that DS9 was more of an ensemble, and so they were able to give us tons of little humanizing moments and show how each character was dealing with the war and coping with their situation. Because Enterprise was basically the Archer/T’Pol/Trip show we never got that. Archer is an angry rear end in a top hat the whole time and Trip is dealing with loss and struggling to keep the ship together. The season is exhausting and then you don’t even get a reprieve when it’s over because of the WW2 stuff. It’s a lot to ask of the viewer unless they’re extremely invested in the characters.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:35
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Longbaugh01 posted:Scott Bakula is a national treasure and his gradual growing desperation during season 3 was pretty good. Something to understand about the Voyager cast is that they were told explicitly by Rick Berman to under-emote in order to give the guest star alien characters more chance to shine each week. Instead of, you know, the people you were actually tuning in each week to see. Everyone on Voyager has great moments sprinkled throughout the show where they find a way to gnaw their way off of Berman’s leash, but they’re fleeting.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:35
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I liked the potential voyager had, particularly the Janeway/Belana dynamic that they dropped after their first episode together. Chakotay's entire character seems to be a guy who's just so loving relieved to not have to be in charge anymore. He's got a cushy job with command perks and left all his troubles in the alpha quadrant. "Why can't all the other Marquis just chill?" he wonders from his comfy bed? "It's all gravy, baby." This is a joke, before I get angry replies. Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Mar 8, 2020 |
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Mar 8, 2020 21:44
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Lizard Combatant posted:Chakotay's entire character seems to be a guy who's just so loving relieved to not have to be in charge anymore. He's got a cushy job with command perks and left all his troubles in the alpha quadrant. "Why can't all the other Marquis just chill?" he wonders from his comfy bed? "It's all gravy, baby." Mr. Chuck O’Tay is my new favorite Star Trak character.
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Mar 8, 2020 21:48
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Don't touch your face Jim
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Mar 8, 2020 22:03
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Trip was all "I'm just a good 'ol southern boy in space" which got old incredibly fast. Archer was  personified.
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Mar 8, 2020 22:18
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Man all of this talk about Enterprise makes me realize I remember exactly nothing about it. A few weeks ago we happened upon the episode where Phlox refuses to give a plague cure to a pre warp civilization ("If only we had some sort of...directive"  ) and I spent most of it going "oh its that guy! I remember him! Kinda. He's got an accent so he's the engineer right? Wait security? OK" Could probably watch it again for the first time. I remember nothing about the Xindi or how it worked out
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Mar 8, 2020 22:22
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nine-gear crow posted:Most of UPN’s shows that were on the air at the time rolled over to the CW or VH1 when UPN went off the air, so Enterprise probably would have washed up on the CW alongside Veronica Mars, Everybody Hates Chris, Smackdown, and others. I had no idea, that's amazing thanks
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Mar 8, 2020 22:44
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Enterprise's Nazi aliens are great. TAS is canon ST IV is a great movie and one of the three best movies. Bride of Chaotica was my favorite Voyager episode forever. Still near the top. Camp is important for Star Trek. Comedy is important.
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Mar 8, 2020 22:46
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Arglebargle III posted:Farscape is on Amazon Prime. A programme with more integrity and courage in its vision than Star Trek has ever had. I'm not saying that to be facetious or inflammatory. If there's anyone here who hasn't watched it you should. The first season is rough as gently caress, but after that it does everything that the premise of Voyager promised and more on a fraction of the budget.
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Mar 8, 2020 23:22
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nine-gear crow posted:It Enterprise got a 5th season it probably would have survived the jump from UPN to The CW and finished its 6th and 7th seasons there. It died because Les Moonves had been gunning for Star Trek as a franchise for years up to that point, but couldn’t kill it outright because Voyager was just popular enough to justify renewing it. Enterprise was hobbled from the start and only got weaker as the show went on. There was basically no realistic scenario for Enterprise getting a fifth season. The ratings were in the toilet, far worse than even Voyager's, and the show got a fourth season by the skin of its teeth (it was very, very nearly canceled during the third). It would have basically needed to rebound to late TNG / early DS9 numbers to get a renewal for season 5, and the likelihood of that was roughly similar to, say, the odds of Donald Trump suddenly giving Obama the Medal of Freedom tomorrow.
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Mar 8, 2020 23:25
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Berman had also alienated the new execs completely by pretending he was still king of his own private realm. And that poo poo did not go down well because he was no longer king of anything.
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Mar 8, 2020 23:28
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nine-gear crow posted:People at the time were absolutely furious with how Season 3 ended I'm not some newb, I've watched every trek from Farpoint on in the week that it aired Season 3 ended just fine if you aren't into the meta narrative about executives and channel ratings and poo poo
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Mar 9, 2020 00:13
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Lovely Joe Stalin posted:A programme with more integrity and courage in its vision than Star Trek has ever had. I'm not saying that to be facetious or inflammatory. If there's anyone here who hasn't watched it you should. The first season is rough as gently caress, but after that it does everything that the premise of Voyager promised and more on a fraction of the budget. The first season of Farscape is fine. It’s certainly better than any season of Voyager
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Mar 9, 2020 00:14
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skasion posted:The first season of Farscape is fine. It’s certainly better than any season of Voyager That is entirely true. I should have said "rough as gently caress compared to season two onwards".
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Mar 9, 2020 00:48
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BesKS-bCDbo
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Mar 9, 2020 02:29
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Discovery has been renewed for season 5. No, that's not a typo. Season five is officially a go, even though season 3 hasn't aired and season 4 doesn't even start production until summer. https://thegww.com/exclusive-star-trek-discovery-renewed-for-season-5-at-cbs-all-access/
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Mar 9, 2020 03:02
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Powered Descent posted:Discovery has been renewed for season 5. No, that's not a typo. Season five is officially a go, even though season 3 hasn't aired and season 4 doesn't even start production until summer. Assuming the rumor is true... Looks like CBS is trying to stockpile for a writer's strike.
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Mar 9, 2020 03:22
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Maybe our friends on TNG were wrong all along
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Mar 9, 2020 03:54
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Dude needs to go back to making funny TNG edits instead of endlessly bitching about NuTrek in clipshow format 
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Mar 9, 2020 04:06
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Powered Descent posted:Discovery has been renewed for season 5. No, that's not a typo. Season five is officially a go, even though season 3 hasn't aired and season 4 doesn't even start production until summer. I'm so glad we have noted web site thegww.com definitively confirming that information without any sources at all.
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Mar 9, 2020 04:42
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pyrotek posted:I'm so glad we have noted web site thegww.com definitively confirming that information without any sources at all.  space.com also mentioned it.
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Mar 9, 2020 04:48
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The original story comes from WeGotThisCovered, which all but confirms that it’s bullshit clickbait. That said, I don’t doubt that Disco will get a season 5, unless All Access shuts down sometime between now next year, so it’s a pretty safe bet and they get to claim they were right after the fact. That’s what WGTC does all the time, they just claim exclusives on no-brainer “leaks” or make up poo poo wholesale and claim their inside source was mistaken when the leak has been disproven. They do this constantly with Star Wars “news”.
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Mar 9, 2020 05:05
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Big Mean Jerk posted:The original story comes from WeGotThisCovered, which all but confirms that it’s bullshit clickbait. Isn't that site like barely half a step up from Bounding Into Comics in terms of posting credible stories? Only without the (overt) misogynist and alt-right bend of BIC?
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Mar 9, 2020 05:41
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nine-gear crow posted:Isn't that site like barely half a step up from Bounding Into Comics in terms of posting credible stories? Only without the (overt) misogynist and alt-right bend of BIC? Yeah, it’s total garbage. As is Cosmic Book News. I see those four sites pop up all the time with leaks and exclusives.
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Mar 9, 2020 05:45
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Late to the discussion, but I thought the Troi and Riker 'Tragic loss of a child' thing was also explicitly designed as a way to explain why they wouldn't immediately mount the saddle to join Picard in his quest, for which I thought it actually worked, given if this was TNG or the movies that's exactly what they'd do. Though absolutely agree with the exhaustion of every character in this show needing to have some sort of a tragic backstory.
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Mar 9, 2020 06:56
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Arglebargle III posted:Farscape is on Amazon Prime. It isn't here. Does Prime have different content per country or something?
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Mar 9, 2020 07:49
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Thad Riker's purpose was also to show how unique features from every type of life form can benefit others. If only Soji's positronic brain had existed not too long ago, poor Thad would still be around. I mean, sure, they could have just used disassembled B-4's positronic matrix, but who wants to go all the way back to Earth? Besides, if they turned on even just his head for only a fraction of a second, he could go super saiyan and blow up the planet, just ask Commodore Oh. drat you disease with a super-specific cure that I guess happened to be tested on B-4, Lore, Data, or maybe super-secretly on Juliana Soongbot before the ban! Speaking of Juliana Soongbot, is she still around? Starfleet would be aware of her existence, right? Do you think they diverted all the resources they were using to save the Romulans to hunting her down and deactivating her? pyrotek fucked around with this message at 08:17 on Mar 9, 2020 |
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Mar 9, 2020 08:12
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pyrotek posted:Speaking of Juliana Soongbot, is she still around? Starfleet would be aware of her existence, right? Do you think they diverted all the resources they were using to save the Romulans to hunting her down and deactivating her? Oh drat. I hadn’t even thought of her! The writers of Picard probably haven’t either or choose not to.
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Mar 9, 2020 08:22
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pyrotek posted:I mean, sure, they could have just used disassembled B-4's positronic matrix, but who wants to go all the way back to Earth? Besides, if they turned on even just his head for only a fraction of a second, he could go super saiyan and blow up the planet, just ask Commodore Oh. drat you disease with a super-specific cure that I guess happened to be tested on B-4, Lore, Data, or maybe super-secretly on Juliana Soongbot before the ban! It's worse than that, they only needed a small component of a positronic brain, the kind that would be in every single synth on Mars and used throughout the Federation, and it's the kind of thing they've even used in Star Trek 30 years prior for medical purposes (in ds9) if you want to get all canon about it. It should be established medical practise by this point. Basically the point is that there's literally zero chance of it becoming sentient. And it'd be like any other controlled substance in medical facilities. Hence what I meant about it feeling like a ban on medical isotopes as a result of denuclearisation.
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Mar 9, 2020 08:28
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