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Stone Pitbull 141 posted:What is a really good Chikara Cibernetico? I feel like 2005 and 2006 were both really good. The CHIKARA Ciberneticos definitely did not make the long term impression on me I'd have expected given how much I liked them at the time. However, this Cibernetico from CMLL is so loving good and has so much hall of fame talent it is crazy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgwTqyLWJtk Negro Casas/Atlantis/Ultimo Dragon/El Dandy/Mascara Magica/Shocker/La Fiera/Brazo De Oro vs. El Hijo del Santo/Dr. Wagner, Jr./Felino/Scorpio, Jr./Black Warrior/Kevin Quinn/Satanico/ Silver King Should be illegal to have that many great wrestlers in one ring.
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Mar 6, 2020 04:49
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Stone Pitbull 141 posted:What is a really good Chikara Cibernetico? The BDK one is a lot of fun
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Mar 6, 2020 05:10
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Stone Pitbull 141 posted:What is a really good Chikara Cibernetico? 2005 was really good, helped by Larry Sweeney on commentary with Chikarason who sell the story really well. Be warned though, it does go an hour and a half. And yeah, 2010 is also pretty dope
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Mar 6, 2020 05:17
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Punch McLightning posted:WWE never became a five star contender until NXT got hot, New Japan was rebuilding, All Japan & NOAH were flailing some, lucha and the U.S. indies weren't regularly rated by Dave, and TNA was TNA. The Euro fans who were getting into NJPW and the PPVs on UStream really got things going.
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Mar 6, 2020 05:21
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Yeah, there was a period where the only things Dave rated consistently were WWE and TNA. I do worry that now, as over-emphasized his star ratings are, the fact that he’s really only reviewing major WWE, NJPW, and AEW shows consistently (off the top of my head) means things like AAA and OTT’s recent runs will not get as much exposure as they should.
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Mar 6, 2020 05:24
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Thanks. I'll get into those ones tomorrow.
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Mar 6, 2020 05:28
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Who are the most untrustworthy wrestlers ever? Like, their accounts of their lives or careers or other events are just incredibly and repeatedly false?
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Mar 6, 2020 05:34
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NikkolasKing posted:Who are the most untrustworthy wrestlers ever? Like, their accounts of their lives or careers or other events are just incredibly and repeatedly false? Virgil
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Mar 6, 2020 05:36
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NikkolasKing posted:Who are the most untrustworthy wrestlers ever? Like, their accounts of their lives or careers or other events are just incredibly and repeatedly false? Vince russo
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Mar 6, 2020 05:39
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It’s impossibly to tell if Hogan lies or just has lied so much he thinks it’s the truth.
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Mar 6, 2020 05:40
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NikkolasKing posted:Who are the most untrustworthy wrestlers ever? Like, their accounts of their lives or careers or other events are just incredibly and repeatedly false? Jake Roberts is untrustworthy in that when he was on drugs he'd lie and scam people, and now that he's clean he just makes up stories about his life for no reason when his actual life is interesting. Vampiro is a notorious bullshitter. Hogan published a memoir that was so full of lies that he later published another memoir promising the real story, and it was also mostly bullshit. Pretty much everything he says is a bizarre lie, from trying out for Metallica to fighting in shoots in Japan.
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Mar 6, 2020 05:41
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Punch McLightning posted:It’s impossibly to tell if Hogan lies or just has lied so much he thinks it’s the truth. MassRafTer posted:Jake Roberts is untrustworthy in that when he was on drugs he'd lie and scam people, and now that he's clean he just makes up stories about his life for no reason when his actual life is interesting. Are a lot of the old old guys really bad about this? Alvarez always talks about how Roddy Piper made up tons of stories about his childhood so you can't tell what is true or not. Maybe something about being from such an old school generation made them all fel compelled to bullshit 24/7.
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Mar 6, 2020 05:45
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MassRafTer posted:Jake Roberts is untrustworthy in that when he was on drugs he'd lie and scam people, and now that he's clean he just makes up stories about his life for no reason when his actual life is interesting. Feel like Teddy Hart is catching up fast
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Mar 6, 2020 05:54
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NikkolasKing posted:Are a lot of the old old guys really bad about this? Alvarez always talks about how Roddy Piper made up tons of stories about his childhood so you can't tell what is true or not. Well, for one thing, I don't think he's even Scottish.
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Mar 6, 2020 11:56
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Jake pretty much said on Jericho's recent podcast "I had to lie to avoid molestation as a kid, then I became a serial liar forever"
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Mar 6, 2020 12:18
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Punch McLightning posted:Yeah, there was a period where the only things Dave rated consistently were WWE and TNA. Its a fact of life now that its impossible to watch everything that happens: not only are the big companies running more shows than they have ever (WWE are probably near 20 "big" shows a year if you combine main roster and the NXTs plus seven hours of first run TV excluding NXT UK and 205 Live; AEW have quarterly big shows and two hours of TV every week; New Japan run a load etc etc) and more from every scene is available than ever - in the early 90s most US wrestling TV was squashes and promos and an hour long and the Japanese promotions that aired generally only aired an hour a week of stuff and then their big shows would run as specials; now there are months where you can almost watch a New Japan card most days in month if you wanted. That almost forces the dude to cut back: especially since WWE (and now AEW) are what drive business. I struggle to keep up with Joshi which is a small scene where not a lot comparatively makes tape; its impossible to follow everything in Japan never mind adding the US and Mexico. In an ideal world what you'd get is him paying people who are experts in other scenes to cover things since there's a lot going on to talk about and it'd lead to higher quality coverage of them but instead what you get is very low effort things - either its surface deep ("I saw the Kaito Kiyomiya vs Kenoh match from the last NOAH show and it was 3.5 stars" with no explanation as to what sort of match it was and why he rated it that way comes to mind; that tells the reader nothing about it); outright wrong (not this week but the last three Observer before this week had basic things about Japan just be wrong: last week it was him writing about Hikaru Sato's anniversary show but then when writing about his career he basically wrote about Kohei Sato's career instead but then said that Hikaru Sato beat Kohei Sato for the Zero-1 Heavyweight Title which Sato has never wrestled for not indeed has he ever wrestled in Zero-1; a few weeks ago he managed to get All Japan and NOAH confused and say that the winner of the Global Junior League would challenge for the AJPW Junior Title; stuff that could easily be checked with a simple google search) or reports news that's he doesn't seem to have put a lot of effort into checking up on - the "Kagetsu left Stardom after being removed from power because she was like Bill Watts" story from a few months ago is a perfect example. I don't expect him to like watch all of this stuff since he can't; but I'd rather that he got people in that could cover it properly or just hand waved it entirely and not bother trying to cover things that he doesn't follow closely since it would benefit everyone. Especially since the Observer clearly isn't interested in paying people: and to get the level of dedication and quality you'd want you'd need to pay people: since it'd not be that far off a full time job. Its no secret that Dave's connections in lots of Japan especially are older and perhaps not fully connected to the whole scene anymore. That's the reason why DDT, the second biggest Japanese company in the West who've successfully ran shows in America, don't get any coverage and when they do its with a certain tone about them: since Dave doesn't take them seriously. Its why Joshi outside Stardom doesn't get any coverage even when Stardom wasn't meaningfully bigger than the other companies: his link to Japan was close to Rossy and he founded and owned Stardom. That's an explanation for lots of Observer blind spots: things like why they don't look at GCW a whole lot despite being one of the biggest American companies is because there isn't a connection there.
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Mar 6, 2020 12:45
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What happened with Scott Steiner, heard something happened at an Impact taping
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Mar 8, 2020 17:06
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El Gallinero Gros posted:What happened with Scott Steiner, heard something happened at an Impact taping He lost consciousness at the taping and had to have emergency heart surgery.
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Mar 8, 2020 17:11
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projecthalaxy posted:He lost consciousness at the taping and had to have emergency heart surgery. Holy poo poo! Was it cardiac arrest, or...?
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Mar 8, 2020 17:14
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El Gallinero Gros posted:Holy poo poo! Was it cardiac arrest, or...? I can't seem to find that, just that he is in stable condition after said collapse and surgery. But like, probably?
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Mar 8, 2020 17:17
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El Gallinero Gros posted:Feel like Teddy Hart is catching up fast that teddy hart best friends ep gives me flashbacks to being semi hostage at a psychopaths extremely tense dinner party once in college
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Mar 8, 2020 20:09
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shiksa posted:that teddy hart best friends ep gives me flashbacks to being semi hostage at a psychopaths extremely tense dinner party once in college The only episode of Best Friends I couldn't watch to the end. Just unsettling.
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Mar 8, 2020 20:15
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shiksa posted:that teddy hart best friends ep gives me flashbacks to being semi hostage at a psychopaths extremely tense dinner party once in college I'm going to need to know more about this dinner party
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Mar 8, 2020 21:12
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shiksa posted:that teddy hart best friends ep gives me flashbacks to being semi hostage at a psychopaths extremely tense dinner party once in college I firmly believe Teddy Hart was why they had tons of wrestlers on the floor for that episode. In case he flipped his poo poo.
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Mar 9, 2020 02:18
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I'm gonna need someone to elaborate here because uh... 
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Mar 9, 2020 02:57
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Can you explain the context? Like, I can see a round robin scoreboard at the start? Is it a tag team tournament?
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Mar 9, 2020 03:10
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Stone Pitbull 141 posted:What is a really good Chikara Cibernetico? I recall 2007 being really good. 2009 had a fun gimmick where they took 8 tag teams and split them into two Cibernetico teams. And yeah, 2010 was more or less the climax of the BDK angle. I really enjoyed the 2018 one where it was Team Chikara vs. Team Beyond.
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Mar 9, 2020 03:13
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Stone Pitbull 141 posted:I firmly believe Teddy Hart was why they had tons of wrestlers on the floor for that episode. In case he flipped his poo poo. I like that this could mean he freaks out or that he just starts jumping off from things and they want guys to catch him.
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Mar 9, 2020 03:32
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ShootaBoy posted:I'm gonna need someone to elaborate here because uh... In the backround of the Teddy Hart episode of the Best Friends shoot interview there were a ton of wrestlers just chilling on the floor (only ones I remember were Ricochet and Drew Galloway.) Gavok posted:I recall 2007 being really good. 2009 had a fun gimmick where they took 8 tag teams and split them into two Cibernetico teams. And yeah, 2010 was more or less the climax of the BDK angle. I really enjoyed the 2018 one where it was Team Chikara vs. Team Beyond. Thanks for the years Chikara Expert Gavok. I'll check those out.
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Mar 9, 2020 03:33
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Gaz-L posted:Can you explain the context? Like, I can see a round robin scoreboard at the start? Is it a tag team tournament? Apparently it was part of the Nippon TV Cup Junior Heavyweight Tag League 2007, as was the match that immediately followed it: Kotaro Suzuki & Ricky Marvin vs. The Briscoes in a time limit draw I Before E fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Mar 9, 2020 |
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Mar 9, 2020 04:26
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ShootaBoy posted:I'm gonna need someone to elaborate here because uh... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3YgpUgQ980 easier to just show you
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Mar 9, 2020 04:45
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Chucky T: "I feel like your life and my life are really loving different." At 1:30 is when it pans over and you see like 10 wrestlers there in case poo poo goes down. Glass Punkbull 141 fucked around with this message at 05:17 on Mar 9, 2020 |
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Mar 9, 2020 05:12
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The Aussies have a term for guys like Teddy Hart that seems to sum things up well: loose unit. A bit less flattering than wildcard, while still getting across the point. I’ve only seen the YouTube version of that interview but it was more than enough
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Mar 9, 2020 05:50
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I was definitely not someone who sought out indie stuff in the 2000s, I think the most I'd ever seen is one of the Joe/Punk 60 minute draws and a Danielson match or two, but I'd always heard about how Teddy Hart basically made himself impossible to book by any promotion and wondered what he could possibly be like, but never bothered looking any of his matches or promos or interviews up. Later I'd see a bit of him and yeah he definitely earned that.
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Mar 9, 2020 05:51
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El Gallinero Gros posted:I'm going to need to know more about this dinner party 
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Mar 9, 2020 05:51
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i was like haha this video is pretty whatever, teddy hart is kind of a dipshit then he threw out the hard r and the hard f and ya im out dawgs.
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Mar 9, 2020 06:00
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Hoooooly poo poo 
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Mar 9, 2020 06:45
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Here's a question for the more deep-dive historians on this forum: is there any documented history of Japanese pro wrestling before WWII? The narrative I've always heard is that it got introduced to the country by Americans during the post-war occupation, then caught on and spun off into its own thing with Rikidozan and Co. leading the way, which seems to make sense. But I sometimes question the accuracy of that neat-and-tidy story since many countries have a history of worked wrestling dating back to the 19th Century. Was Japan really that late to the game? Benne fucked around with this message at 08:33 on Mar 9, 2020 |
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Mar 9, 2020 08:27
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Benne posted:Here's a question for the more deep-dive historians on this forum: is there any documented history of Japanese pro wrestling before WWII? Basic info has Rikidōzan debuting in 1951 and starting JWA (as an affiliate of the NWA) in 1953. I’ve studied a fair bit about the Meiji era (which is late 19th century) but haven’t seen anything about importation of pro wrestling — other sports were imported at the time (notably baseball) and seen as a positive for teamwork and militarism, and there’s history of American ball players visiting before WWII, but nothing for wrestling. My theory: wrestling *in the US and Europe popped out of the carnivals and traveling fairs, which in Japan are still associated with Shinto even now and likely were less of a modernization focus. Sports could add into schools. As well, sumo was associated with those shrines. Meanwhile, after WWII, you have Americans now in charge post-war, and an even greater influencer: television. While Japan was late to pro wrestling, it became a TV staple early on. harperdc fucked around with this message at 08:46 on Mar 9, 2020 |
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Mar 9, 2020 08:42
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Did Cody ever have a feud, or even work a couple of matches with CM Punk? I always remember them being at different levels on the card.
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Mar 9, 2020 08:45
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