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Raskolnikov38 posted:those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it Its 2020, and trump has a record, and people hate it. You won't allow yourself to accept it, but others can.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:27
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Yes, let us consult the ancient texts for wisdom in this time of crisis. Perhaps the steaming entrails of a live sacrifice could augur auspiciously.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:28
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How are u posted:Its 2020, and trump has a record, and people hate it. You won't allow yourself to accept it, but others can. oh is that why his approval rating ticked up a point?
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Mar 17, 2020 15:29
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BANNED USER posted:Am I doing this right? I want to say I'm doing this right. You are definitely doing this right. Please keep making more!
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Mar 17, 2020 15:30
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Halloween Jack posted:Only 6% of Americans could vote in 1790 and that's exactly the way they wanted it. The fact that so few people could vote back then, really is a HUGE difference to now. In 1790, they didnt need to consider the effect of a pandemic on an election because it wasn't a huge vector for transmission. Today, it's huge.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:30
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it is interesting to me that the biden apologists are now running 'anyone can beat trump' as their line it seems to run somewhat contrary to the electability case for biden
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Mar 17, 2020 15:32
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Raskolnikov38 posted:oh is that why his approval rating ticked up a point? Odd, I was assured by so many utterly correct bernouts that polls are neoliberal trickery.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:32
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Gatts posted:Lmao wtf Ohio Everything is shut down here right now. Schools, restaurants, any business other than medical or grocery. I suppose it's possible that the Republican Governor decided to torpedo his own economy to avoid having a primary but let's be honest, Biden was favored to win here and a delay to June could only provide time for the narrative to change.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:33
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V. Illych L. posted:it is interesting to me that the biden apologists are now running 'anyone can beat trump' as their line I'm not apologizing for Biden, he sucks and I want Bernie. He's what we've got, tho. Time to put your big boy underwear on and deal with it.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:34
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How are u posted:I'm not apologizing for Biden, he sucks and I want Bernie. He's what we've got, tho. Time to put your big boy underwear on and deal with it. nope, going to keep telling people not to vote for a guy who will make everything worse to keep out another guy who will make everything worse
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Mar 17, 2020 15:35
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How are u posted:I'm not apologizing for Biden, he sucks and I want Bernie. He's what we've got, tho. Time to put your big boy underwear on and deal with it. Lol, America is garbage but you just want it to stay that way so bad.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:36
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These mephitic vapors are assuredly deleterious to our collective health.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:40
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Heh, Trump is about to learn that it's impossible for a candidate to overcome their history and get elected in this country. *watches Biden get nominated while claiming he never wanted to cut Social Security, tugs collar*
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Mar 17, 2020 15:45
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How are u posted:Its 2020, and trump has a record, and people hate it. You won't allow yourself to accept it, but others can. Running for something is more effective than running against something. Biden can win, but it would really, really help his chances if his entire campaign wasn't a promise to not be uncouth. Just a single stance beyond the promise that it can totally be 2015 again. Watching one of the best chances in generations to really change things slip away as we instead go with the promise not to tweet mean dumbassery daily instead. This is fine. Gyges fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Mar 17, 2020 |
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Mar 17, 2020 15:47
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You can't see two feet in front of you if you think what is happening today is just going to blow over and everything will be chugging along like normal into November. Just straight up delusional. At the rate we're going not only is this primary not decided, there even being an election in November is not decided.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:49
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How are u posted:Its 2020, and trump has a record, and people hate it. You won't allow yourself to accept it, but others can. Delusion is the most powerful driver of Liberalism.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:54
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GoLambo posted:You can't see two feet in front of you if you think what is happening today is just going to blow over and everything will be chugging along like normal into November. Just straight up delusional. It's an extremely difficult situation. Shutting down all schools, restaurants, gatherings of more than 50 people. But also all adults go to these centralized voting locations--and the ones who go in the greatest numbers happen to be the ones who are by far the likeliest to die.
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Mar 17, 2020 15:54
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Gyges posted:Running for something is more effective than running against something. Biden can win, but it would really, really help his chances if his entire campaign wasn't a promise to not be uncouth. Just a single stance beyond the promise that it can totally be 2015 again. Bernie and his campaign share some of the blame. The plan can't simply be to expect a bunch of moderates to stay in the race and split the vote until the end and then win the nomination with 30-35% of the vote. Biden didn't come into the race as this unstoppable juggernaut with a campaign infrastructure that was impossible to overcome. Figuring out how to expand the coalition is on Bernie and his advisers.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:02
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TyrantWD posted:Few people outside your camp believe those promises once you actually have a record of doing the exact opposite - especially when you did the opposite during the last 24-36 months. We had a massive wave election less than 18 months ago largely driven by Trump's record on healthcare. It's incredible that this must be said every month or so in this thread: Results of midterms are completely unrelated to results of reelection campaigns. Obama, Clinton, Truman, Roosevelt all lost more seats than Trump and still won reelection. TyrantWD posted:Bernie and his campaign share some of the blame. The plan can't simply be to expect a bunch of moderates to stay in the race and split the vote until the end and then win the nomination with 30-35% of the vote. Biden didn't come into the race as this unstoppable juggernaut with a campaign infrastructure that was impossible to overcome. Figuring out how to expand the coalition is on Bernie and his advisers. Bernie was in an impossible situation. There's a reason he went from overwhelming favorite to overwhelming underdog in 4 days. Had it been a 1 v 1 race from the start, Bernie probably wins this. Had it stayed a split vote till after super tuesday, Bernie probably wins. The party quickly coalescing around the candidate everyone thought was dead in the water required some extraordinary pressure and promises in the background (see even centrists freaking out over a Klobuchar vice presidency). Bernie should have been more aggressive with Biden in recent weeks, but it's not like that was the obvious thing to do when he was coming in 4th and 5th in the early states. joepinetree fucked around with this message at 16:08 on Mar 17, 2020 |
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Mar 17, 2020 16:04
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How are u posted:Its 2020, and trump has a record, and people hate it. You won't allow yourself to accept it, but others can. He's polling with or above Biden in the swing states that matter.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:07
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If the most powerful coalition in the Democratic Party are Biden supporters when Biden would be the most conservative Dem nominee since the Civil Rights era, maybe the party is insolvent as a vehicle for progressive thought.l
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Mar 17, 2020 16:08
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TyrantWD posted:Bernie and his campaign share some of the blame. The plan can't simply be to expect a bunch of moderates to stay in the race and split the vote until the end and then win the nomination with 30-35% of the vote. Biden didn't come into the race as this unstoppable juggernaut with a campaign infrastructure that was impossible to overcome. Figuring out how to expand the coalition is on Bernie and his advisers. I'd argue that the base cannot expand without outside influence like a plague. If you actually compare the campaign strategies of Bernie and Biden, it's fairly laughable. Biden flat out did not campaign in most Super Tuesday states, yet still had a massive victory. Bernie raises more money, has larger gatherings, a better platform, a more coherent message, a more magnetic personality, and is much better in a debate. He has EVERYTHING that should logically win him an election. Unfortunately, people are not rational beings. Liberalism is a farce.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:08
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Cpt_Obvious posted:Delusion is the most powerful driver of Liberalism. People are real dumb and are going to conflate what the local and state governments are doing with what Donny did. However we are still at the beginning of this thing, and if we are really keeping pace at 2 weeks behind Italy poo poo's going to get real bad pretty soon. Still, people are less likely to blame the President for a pandemic that his idiocy made worse than they are gas going up 2 cents. Because, man, people are real dumb. TyrantWD posted:Bernie and his campaign share some of the blame. The plan can't simply be to expect a bunch of moderates to stay in the race and split the vote until the end and then win the nomination with 30-35% of the vote. Biden didn't come into the race as this unstoppable juggernaut with a campaign infrastructure that was impossible to overcome. Figuring out how to expand the coalition is on Bernie and his advisers. Biden only made it to/through South Carolina because the media and the establishment would rather everything burn to ash than Bernie win. So they ignored everything they could to continue telling the people that Biden was the most electable. Yes, Bernie could have done things differently but the field collapsed from 6 people to 2 people in just over a day and everyone flocked to the guy who literally stayed home and did nothing for months and months.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:14
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How are u posted:I'm not apologizing for Biden, he sucks and I want Bernie. He's what we've got, tho. Time to put your big boy underwear on and deal with it.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:15
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For sanders to have real reach with the rest of the party he simply could not run on a left platform, because the rest of the remaining democratic party are hardcore neoliberals who take marching orders. There is no realistic outreach he could do, because the only reason this is happening is the entire party coalescing to stop the only actual left candidate. Clyburn is not going to jump ship because that is not what he is paid to do, pretending otherwise is deeply disingenuous.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:16
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Gyges posted:Still, people are less likely to blame the President for a pandemic that his idiocy made worse than they are gas going up 2 cents. Because, man, people are real dumb. About that...
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Mar 17, 2020 16:17
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Gyges posted:Running for something is more effective than running against something. Biden can win, but it would really, really help his chances if his entire campaign wasn't a promise to not be uncouth. Just a single stance beyond the promise that it can totally be 2015 again. It's not fine, it's awful, and I hate that it is happening. Bernie would have been absolutely a breath of fresh air, and I'm pretty loving depressed about it.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:18
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Is there a good response to Biden’s creepy behavior around women? “Trump does it too” doesn’t work if it just means they stay home instead, and I have no idea how much video they have they could just play on blast for months.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:21
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GoLambo posted:For sanders to have real reach with the rest of the party he simply could not run on a left platform, because the rest of the remaining democratic party are hardcore neoliberals who take marching orders. There is no realistic outreach he could do, because the only reason this is happening is the entire party coalescing to stop the only actual left candidate. Clyburn is not going to jump ship because that is not what he is paid to do, pretending otherwise is deeply disingenuous.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:22
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https://twitter.com/ABC7Chicago/status/1239933498644971522?s=20
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Mar 17, 2020 16:22
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It's about time to ditch the strategic voting bullshit and start building an actual Progressive/Socialist party organization from the individual state level up, until it can seriously challenge in national-level elections. Yeah it will hurt for some number of election cycles, but it's better than ceding the overton window to conservatives, again, for the second thirty-year window in a row. The only other option is accelerationism and revolution, which our inverted totalitarianism has proven itself resilient to.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:26
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How are u posted:It's not fine, it's awful, and I hate that it is happening. Bernie would have been absolutely a breath of fresh air, and I'm pretty loving depressed about it. OK, let me try to appeal to your pragmatism then. If you Vote Blue, No Matter who, then the democratic party has no reason to cater to your demands. They have no reason to offer you the health care reforms, economic reforms, and social reforms that we need. They will only offer you garbage, and you will vote for it.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:26
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Halloween Jack posted:V. Illych L. has tried to explain to people that politics is about coalitions of interests and that Bernie could never have "won over" the Party by being nice to them. I'm afraid everyone ITT already either understands this or doesn't want to. If Bernie had started winning primaries with margins like Joe's on Super Tuesday then he could have "won over" the Party (nice or mean) because he'd have proved his theory of the case and successfully enacted a revolution in the Democratic party. It didn't happen. I hate that it didn't, but it didn't.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:28
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bobjr posted:Is there a good response to Biden’s creepy behavior around women? “Trump does it too” doesn’t work if it just means they stay home instead, and I have no idea how much video they have they could just play on blast for months. There is no defense of Biden's "Tactile Nature" and attempting to is a fool's errand. Well, unless you want to go full Al Franken and start screaming about how those bitches should be glad that such a great man took time out of his busy day to grope them, I guess.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:31
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Kulkasha posted:It's about time to ditch the strategic voting bullshit and start building an actual Progressive/Socialist party organization from the individual state level up, until it can seriously challenge in national-level elections. Yeah it will hurt for some number of election cycles, but it's better than ceding the overton window to conservatives, again, for the second thirty-year window in a row. Get Trump out of office, then do this. All you folks who spent the last year yelling about how only Bernie can save us from climate change somehow simultaneously think that 4 more years of Trump is NBD all of a sudden. Joe will be better than Trump on climate change, there is no reality based argument otherwise. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 17, 2020 16:31
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Kulkasha posted:It's about time to ditch the strategic voting bullshit and start building an actual Progressive/Socialist party organization from the individual state level up, until it can seriously challenge in national-level elections. Yeah it will hurt for some number of election cycles, but it's better than ceding the overton window to conservatives, again, for the second thirty-year window in a row. As I was saying in the Protest Voting thread, in the short term, you can argue the point either way. But as soon as you start thinking beyond a single election cycle, #VoteBlueNoMatterWho is empirically been a failure since at least 2004.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:32
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How are u posted:It didn't happen. I hate that it didn't, but it didn't. Huh, weird.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:35
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bobjr posted:Is there a good response to Biden’s creepy behavior around women? “Trump does it too” doesn’t work if it just means they stay home instead, and I have no idea how much video they have they could just play on blast for months. Yes. "This child molesting police state warmonger that wants to destroy safety nets and give more handouts to the banks that prop him up should be worked against, and possibly imprisoned, for working to destroy the country for 40 years at the behest of his corporate masters." Is a good response.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:35
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Cpt_Obvious posted:OK, let me try to appeal to your pragmatism then. my only issue with this is the democratic party will still not cater to our demands and instead push even farther right to try and cannibalize more of the republican party instead
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Mar 17, 2020 16:35
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How are u posted:All you folks who spent the last year yelling about how only Bernie can save us from climate change somehow simultaneously think that 4 more years of Trump is NBD all of a sudden.
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Mar 17, 2020 16:36
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