|
Proteus Jones posted:They've been pretty consistent in this thread that if they don't like something nobody else should either. Saying somebody else has bad taste isn't the same thing as saying they can't have bad taste.
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 20:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 22:44 |
|
|
Ok I just read that first chapter too and I'm thinking Omi was reading it incorrectly Thomas didn't take a break in the run to tell him, he announced it while they were running, which would definitely throw you completely out of that mindset. Harry didn't jump down his throat in his response, he was joking about it throwing him off. He immediately goes into asking Thomas about it. It's the exact same thing I would do to my brother if he just dropped that in the middle of us doing something.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 21:53
|
|
|
Yeah I disagree with Omi's reading as well, here is the link for anybody having trouble finding it. My read is it's kind of a gutpunch, of mixed emotions for Dresden but he definitely isn't genuinely mad at Thomas and they immediately go into jokey banter.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 22:11
|
|
|
That's way better then, if I'm picking up on the wrong thing- being miffed at him talking at all and throwing off his tempo is totally cool. But between that and the "sorry to spoil your man time" bit in his reply, I was interpreting it as "I wanna be a tough man guy who's quiet and grunts a lot, and my bro is trying to talk about women and relationships." I'm super-happy to be crazy if that's totally off-base.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 22:28
|
|
|
Omi no Kami posted:That's way better then, if I'm picking up on the wrong thing- being miffed at him talking at all and throwing off his tempo is totally cool. But between that and the "sorry to spoil your man time" bit in his reply, I was interpreting it as "I wanna be a tough man guy who's quiet and grunts a lot, and my bro is trying to talk about women and relationships." I'm super-happy to be crazy if that's totally off-base. Yeah that absolutely reads as banter, not harry legit expressing anger
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 22:39
|
|
|
Omi no Kami posted:That's way better then, if I'm picking up on the wrong thing- being miffed at him talking at all and throwing off his tempo is totally cool. But between that and the "sorry to spoil your man time" bit in his reply, I was interpreting it as "I wanna be a tough man guy who's quiet and grunts a lot, and my bro is trying to talk about women and relationships." I'm super-happy to be crazy if that's totally off-base. IDK it's kind of more like imagine you're just off in a calm serene world not really thinking about anything enjoying the peace, total zen state and then somebody drops some real deal life changing information on you? Suddenly you're going from a million miles away from anything and you're yanked back into the present with the whole weight of the world back on you and probably a nasty reminder of a lot of recent pain and heartache to boot. Just a total mix of fear,sadness, maybe anger and joy or happiness. Would kind of stop you in your tracks. And from there we get Dresden's first choice whenever he feels vulnerable which is to deflect with a joke.(This is arguably a very masculine response as a way to avoid talking about emotions but it's "normal" and a real  not really something I can lay at Butcher's feet)I can easily imagine the same kind of "oh poo poo, but I'm happy for you, but is it okay?" kind of conversation with my own brother like Daric. I can understand your he's trying to be a tough guy interpretation but it doesn't really fit to me. Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 03:46 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 22:40
|
|
|
jivjov posted:This seems oddly hostile. If you're not enjoying a series...just move on? I don't think there's anything wrong about not enjoying the series. This is not the Love Dresden Or Else thread. Other people have expressed disdain for various books without being ran out of the thread for it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 23:22
|
|
|
Not liking the books is fine. There's no need to be a jerk about it, though.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 23:27
|
|
|
Hmm yeah, I'm definitely off then- and glad to be wrong- grumpy stoic guy is way more fun than grumpy caveman dude.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 23:30
|
|
|
Kchama posted:I don't think there's anything wrong about not enjoying the series. This is not the Love Dresden Or Else thread. Yeah, feel free to dislike all day long. But the whole "the whole series should completely burn out and die" schtick is weird
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 23:32
|
|
|
jivjov posted:Yeah, feel free to dislike all day long. But the whole "the whole series should completely burn out and die" schtick is weird Ornamented Death posted:Not liking the books is fine. There's no need to be a jerk about it, though. That's fair. I meant to say something about that but got lost on my own point.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2020 23:38
|
|
|
The existence of the White Court and trying to make any of them sympathetic characters ought to drat the series by itself.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 01:45
|
|
|
biracial bear for uncut posted:The existence of the White Court and trying to make any of them sympathetic characters ought to drat the series by itself. There is a lot of media, especially stuff that started 10+ years ago, that has problematic aspects, especially when it comes to sex/gender/sexuality etc. Criticism of those is fine, but people are allowed to enjoy things with problematic content without feeling like someone’s jumping all over them.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 02:09
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F17zuaRJG0U here's the trailer if no one's seen it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 03:46
|
|
|
DreamingofRoses posted:There is a lot of media, especially stuff that started 10+ years ago, that has problematic aspects, especially when it comes to sex/gender/sexuality etc. Criticism of those is fine, but people are allowed to enjoy things with problematic content without feeling like someone’s jumping all over them. I don't think he's saying that the White Court is problematic in that sense. I think he's saying that they're shittily written and just plain suck entirely, and that they act more like villains than good guys. Whichhhh I can't disagree with. It's actually what made me quit at Summer Knight! The Pro-Harry faction doesn't want to protect him from the Red Court's wrath over him causing lots of incidents with them and the bad blood boiling over to them attacking other wizards out of any sentiment that he's a good guy or that he's innocent or that he had good reason to do it. It's instead a combination of personally liking Harry and not caring if lesser beings die in his place and not wanting to give a precedence for if THEY had hosed with the Red Court knowingly and brought wrath upon the White Council that the White Council would turn over the Full Wizards (namely, them) who caused such strife. And I specify 'Full Wizard' because that's the objection they give. They don't want a Full Wizard to be turned over. If you're not a 'Full Wizard' then they'd gladly throw you to the vampires. Kchama fucked around with this message at 03:51 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 03:48
|
|
|
You're confusing the White Court and the White Council. But to your point, that's something Dresden and others criticize the White Council for fairly regularly in later books. I've said it before, but you're arguing from a grossly incomplete picture. Don't read books you don't like, but also try to avoid speaking with authority when you've only read 20% of the series. Just to drive this point home, you just wrote a couple hundred words about a topic no one was talking about because you're entirely ignorant about the White Court as they aren't introduced until after the point you stopped reading. Ornamented Death fucked around with this message at 03:59 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 03:56
|
|
|
Kchama posted:I don't think he's saying that the White Court is problematic in that sense. No offense, but Bear is talking about the White Court vampires which are basically succubus/incubus and off and on allies/frenemies of Dresden one of which is Dresden's half-brother Thomas Raith they're not great because of all the uhh rape(I'm not trying to be glib I just don't have the energy for this argument right now), and not the White Council which is the wizard clubhouse that Dresden is a member of that we're supposed to have mixed feelings about. Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 03:58
|
|
|
Hub Cat posted:No offense, but Bear is talking about the White Court vampires which are basically succubus/incubus and off and on allies/frenemies of Dresden one of which is Dresden's half-brother Thomas Raith they're not great because of all the uhh rape, and not the White Council which is the wizard clubhouse that Dresden is a member of that we're supposed to have mixed feelings about. Yeah that's fair, I misread. I had just woken up when I read that post, so forgive me. Ornamented Death posted:You're confusing the White Court and the White Council. Nah, the idea that I can't talk about it unless I read every book of a story is stupid. I was explaining exactly what turned me off about the books and made me stop reading. I don't need to read fifty more books to find out something about Harry's buddies. It shouldn't have sucked then. Also, the White Court, from everything I heard, would have made me stop reading too.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 04:03
|
|
|
I didn't say don't talk about it, I said don't speak with authority. It's cool, you don't like how the White Council is portrayed in the earlier books because they come off as dickish at best, if not downright evil. But that's the whole point. It's hard to argue the writing is bad when the author makes you feel about a group exactly the way he wants you to feel. You're making these sweeping statements about the series with virtually no context. Edit: I guess my bigger issue is that I don't get why some people spend so much time talking about books they don't like. I didn't like the Felix Castor books, but outside of mentioning why maybe once a year when a new poster asks about that series, I just ignore the posts about those books and skip that part of the conversation. I don't understand the urge to constantly poo poo on something other folks enjoy. Ornamented Death fucked around with this message at 04:39 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 04:19
|
|
|
Ornamented Death posted:Edit: I guess my bigger issue is that I don't get why some people spend so much time talking about books they don't like. I didn't like the Felix Castor books, but outside of mentioning why maybe once a year when a new poster asks about that series, I just ignore the posts about those books and skip that part of the conversation. I don't understand the urge to constantly poo poo on something other folks enjoy. I’m with you there. I have no use for Felix Castor either. I just kind gloss over whenever those books are brought up.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 05:07
|
|
|
The part about the white council that you will have missed is that you’re seeing them from Harry’s point of view in the earlier books and Harry doesn’t exactly have the whole picture nor does he understand the dimensional politics that the Council has to deal with. These topics come up a lot more in the later books and give you a better understanding of why they are the way they are.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 05:13
|
|
|
I feel like Kchama is taking the wrong view towards the Council in Summer Knight, I've never had the impression that we're supposed to agree with the Council turning over Dresden, it's seemed pretty clear in the book that this would have been a cowardly and desperate move to assuage the fear/anger of the hoi polloi over the war(this was way more than some small time fighting, the White Council sustained serious losses as part of the Red Court's opening salvo) and maybe buy the Council enough time to marshal their forces for when the Red Court cooks up another casus belli. Like it's an intentional political move to either kick the can down the road making the rank and file happy and safe(with the implication that the Council has put off dealing with the Red Court's belligerence for far too long already) and/or give them the leverage to twist Dresden's arm into doing a dangerous task as penance which if successful will allow them to regain their footing. You're supposed to feel that it's paternalistic, craven, bureaucratic, and pragmatic and that they don't care about the moral correctness or justification of Dresden's actions merely their affect of endangering every wizard(and to be clear they only care about Wizards) and most importantly the Senior Council members(I don't think it could be any more clear that parts of the Senior Council view Dresden as a impetuous child maybe a half-step above being a Warlock at best and a full on enemy agent at worst). The only reason they don't turn over Dresden outright is that it would engender the "What if I'm next?" fear among the younger council members that look up to Dresden, and the Senior Council(at least the Merlin)seem savvy enough to recognize appeasement as a temporary solution at best. So I guess tl;dr you kind of have the measure of the White Council(although the details don't really feel accurate to me  ) but them being unlikable in Summer Knight is intentional and not really a writing flaw at least to me.
Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 07:43
|
|
|
Hub Cat posted:I feel like Kchama is taking the wrong view towards the Council in Summer Knight, I've never had the impression that we're supposed to agree with the Council turning over Dresden, it's seemed pretty clear in the book that this would have been a cowardly and desperate move to assuage the fear/anger of the hoi polloi over the war(this was way more than some small time fighting, the White Council sustained serious losses as part of the Red Court's opening salvo) and maybe buy the Council enough time to marshal their forces for when the Red Court cooks up another casus belli. Funnily you actually have the exact wrong impression of my stance. Which is that I was condemning Harry's friends, the guys we're suppose to believe as the Good Guys in the White Council, because they were willing to serve up people they considered less human, but not Harry. Merlin just wanted to throw him to the wolves for starting the whole thing and, as far as I can tell, to give them a reprieve. Which, correct or not, was slightly less of a hosed up sentiment. Ornamented Death posted:I didn't say don't talk about it, I said don't speak with authority. It's cool, you don't like how the White Council is portrayed in the earlier books because they come off as dickish at best, if not downright evil. But that's the whole point. It's hard to argue the writing is bad when the author makes you feel about a group exactly the way he wants you to feel. You're making these sweeping statements about the series with virtually no context. I was talking about a single scene, wherein it made me not wish to continue. I was not referring to the entire series, or the future that I have not seen, etc etc etc etc etc. It's baffling that I even have to make that point. Also after getting it shoved into my face how WONDERFUL And THE BEST EVER that Dresden Files are, I frankly enjoy complaining about it. Daric posted:The part about the white council that you will have missed is that you’re seeing them from Harry’s point of view in the earlier books and Harry doesn’t exactly have the whole picture nor does he understand the dimensional politics that the Council has to deal with. These topics come up a lot more in the later books and give you a better understanding of why they are the way they are. Like I said to the other guy, I actually was agreeing more with the Merlin, since it was the people siding with Harry who's issue was that it'd involve giving a Full Wizard to the vampires, with the distinct implication that Harry's pals would be totally fine with throwing a hedge wizard or whatever they're called to the vamps. And frankly, Dresden did a lot to stir up the Red Court trouble, so I was frankly not shocked that a bunch of people wanted to expel him and have him fend for himself. Also it's blatantly obvious that the council guys including the Merlin who don't like Harry are being set up as future villains, and I'm guessing they pretty much spend all of their time being mean jerks to Dresden. Like I'd be shocked if we find out that Ancient Mai and the Merlin don't spend their time threatening Dresden and trying to get him into White Council Trouble in the future. If you wanna spoiler text me being wrong about this, go ahead. I'd be glad to read it. EDIT: Okay I'll be fair. Yeah the White Council under The Merlin is very blatantly suppose to be Political Villains that are likely secret traitors or just jerks who work against the hero so he can have a threat he can't just punch, but it's played off in exactly the way I hate in other stories too. Like the Honorverse loves it even more and it's just completely aggravating there. It's less so here but I dunno, I just get tired of the whole "Hero is held back by his 'allies' he must work with and are jealous/hate him for petty reasons" deal. Kchama fucked around with this message at 09:10 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 09:03
|
|
|
Apologies, but your first post was hard for me to parse so I just kind of winged it. I'm not really sure who the "less humans" you feel that Dresden's friends(I'm assuming you mean Ebenezar, Martha Liberty, and Listens-to-Wind) are serving up to the vampires are? I would have to pull out the book to get the details but my recollection is that they thought offering Dresden up to be killed would be shortsighted and cowardly, plus you know they emotionally like Dresden and don't want to see him killed or turned into a vampire? I've never gotten the impression that they're okay with nonwizards being killed.(I guess Eb flattens a bunch of staff and probably some townsfolk when he drops a satellite on the Red Court but that was later and complicated? Immoral? The black staff stuff is kinda poop imo) The Merlin wants to strip his title because it would solve his political problems as Dresden would no longer have any rights under the Unseelie accords and he could wash his hands of the whole deal(in fact they would have a duty to turn him over as a criminal). Basically Eb and friends use the bureaucratic process to prevent the Merlin from stripping Dresden's title and therefore the Council protection accorded to all full Wizards, to save him from being used as a peace offering to the Red Court. The Wizard title is only used in that it has utility and power under the Wizard rules. Going from this to assuming they would be okay with title less hedge wizards being killed by vampires seems like way too much of a logical leap and I'm not sure I understand what you're basing it on. (Like bad example but if you had a lawyer that used your citizenship to keep your government from murdering you because its illegal to murder citizens I don't see how that becomes your lawyer thinks it's okay to murder noncitizens) Arthur Langtry(The Merlin) is more complicated later on(although it's more a subtle kind of thing) but Ancient Mai is just a one-note background character she really doesn't come up again as far as I remember except as background. I would not be surprised if the Merlin comes around as kind of an acquaintance or unfriendly ally in the next couple books especially now that he doesn't really have direct power over Dresden. Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 11:28
|
|
|
kchama's right that wizards don't really seem to give a crap about non-wizards, that's the whole point of the Paranet in later books. That's the frustrating thing about their posts: valid complaints are made, but literally everything being complained about is revisited and addressed (to varying extents) in later books. Once again, don't read books you don't enjoy, but at the same time recognize how irritating it can get for people that have read them all to keep pointing out that these problematic situations are acknowledged (at least) and dealt with. And the response, at least lately, is to fall back on "well I'm just talking about this one scene!" and that's missing the forest for the trees. Yes, the scene where the Council discusses whether or not to hand Dresden over to the vampires is problematic on a number of levels. Yes, pretty much all wizards have little or no concern about non-wizards. But these are necessary scenes that set up multi-book plotlines. By comparison, notice that no one really argues about what a shitshow the White Court vampires are. A lot of stuff surrounding them is just horrible, and it's clear Butcher didn't think through the implications of having Thomas be a major character and ally to Dresden. It's a problematic aspect of the series that stops a lot of readers cold and that's 100% understandable. Which is not to say your reasons for stopping are any less valid, kchama, it's just that many of your issues with the series are addressed later and some posters (and I'll include myself here) are perhaps a little too quick to harp on that.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 12:06
|
|
|
I agree that wizards don't care about non-wizards, but I don't see how that specifically applies as a reason to dislike the Dresden defense league of Ebenezar etc. but not the Merlin and his supporters.Kchama posted:Funnily you actually have the exact wrong impression of my stance. Which is that I was condemning Harry's friends, the guys we're suppose to believe as the Good Guys in the White Council, because they were willing to serve up people they considered less human, but not Harry. Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 12:33 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 12:18
|
|
|
Hub Cat posted:I agree that wizards don't care about non-wizards, but I don't see how that specifically applies to the Dresden defense league of Ebenezar etc. and not the Merlin and his supporters. It's not that it doesn't apply to both groups, it's that such a position is not unexpected from those set up in opposition to Dresden, but is concerning to see coming from his allies. The underlying assumption is that, as Dresden's allies, these people are the good guys. Outside of Ebenezer, that assumption isn't really supported by the text at that point, but it's a reasonable one to have based on genre tropes. Edit: Just to be clear, since there's been a lot of back and forth, this is an issue with Butcher's ideas being more clever than his writing could support at the time. Ornamented Death fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Mar 25, 2020 |
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 12:29
|
|
|
Kchama posted:I don't think he's saying that the White Court is problematic in that sense. Nope, that's literally what I'm saying. Thomas should've been destroyed in the first book he appeared in, and I don't really give a drat if Butcher wrote in a free pass to their existence by having an angel tell Dresden that Thomas should be pitied in Ghost Story or not (that just makes the White God--lol at that in-universe name for him from Mab, by the way--look like even more of an rear end in a top hat than he is in the way he's depicted in real life).
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 14:46
|
|
|
biracial bear for uncut posted:Nope, that's literally what I'm saying. Thomas should've been destroyed in the first book he appeared in, and I don't really give a drat if Butcher wrote in a free pass to their existence by having an angel tell Dresden that Thomas should be pitied in Ghost Story or not (that just makes the White God--lol at that in-universe name for him from Mab, by the way--look like even more of an rear end in a top hat than he is in the way he's depicted in real life). That's maybe a reference to a proto-slavic "pantheon" of the gods Chernobog and Belobog. You're probably passingly familiar with Chernobog (literal translation "Black God") from various sources (maybe up to and including Fantasia), but there may* have been worshipped an equivalent-but-opposite sun diety named Belobog ("White God"). Butcher has already done the "some mythological figures are really other mythological figures swapping hats" play, so this isn't an impossible stretch, just a bad one. It's blatant Christianization of what was absolutely a limited, regional, and very polytheistic tradition from a region that practiced a heavily animist type of polytheism.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 16:21
|
|
|
I am happy to be getting two books, but what are the thoughts on the trailer? I was thoroughly unimpressed, and not excited to any additional extent by it. The only part that really sticks with me is Dresden watching his daughter sleep.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 17:44
|
|
|
biracial bear for uncut posted:Nope, that's literally what I'm saying. Thomas should've been destroyed in the first book he appeared in, and I don't really give a drat if Butcher wrote in a free pass to their existence by having an angel tell Dresden that Thomas should be pitied in Ghost Story or not (that just makes the White God--lol at that in-universe name for him from Mab, by the way--look like even more of an rear end in a top hat than he is in the way he's depicted in real life). Yeah I was dead tired and thought you meant White COUNCIL not White COURT sorry. Ornamented Death posted:It's not that it doesn't apply to both groups, it's that such a position is not unexpected from those set up in opposition to Dresden, but is concerning to see coming from his allies. The underlying assumption is that, as Dresden's allies, these people are the good guys. Outside of Ebenezer, that assumption isn't really supported by the text at that point, but it's a reasonable one to have based on genre tropes. YEah yeah you get it! That's why I was complaining. The Merlin and his gang having that position is expected as they're clearly villianous types. Sorry for being unclear, Hub Cat. Also I'll address your other post later, Ornamented Death, and more of this one, I gotta run to work literally now. Sorry.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 17:48
|
|
|
Olesh posted:That's maybe a reference to a proto-slavic "pantheon" of the gods Chernobog and Belobog. You're probably passingly familiar with Chernobog (literal translation "Black God") from various sources (maybe up to and including Fantasia), but there may* have been worshipped an equivalent-but-opposite sun diety named Belobog ("White God"). Butcher has already done the "some mythological figures are really other mythological figures swapping hats" play, so this isn't an impossible stretch, just a bad one. It's blatant Christianization of what was absolutely a limited, regional, and very polytheistic tradition from a region that practiced a heavily animist type of polytheism. This is a universe where Names explicitly have power even when you have no intent to invoke them - Dresden is warned at one point that he's already said "Mab" twice in a conversation, and a third repetition would be a very bad idea. So it is a good idea to avoid any of the dozens of names traditionally associated with that specific deity. Can't just call Him "God", because there are small-g gods running around to muddy the issue, and the other term used -The Almighty- could be unpalatable to an immortal like Mab. Christianity delves heavily into lamb metaphors (and thus an association with wool, which is whitish), and uses white in other contexts as well. That makes it as good a specifier as any.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 17:53
|
|
|
The weirdest thing about the White Court was when the story very briefly expanded them beyond House Raith to include other Houses that feed on different negative emotions like terror. They even had one vampire switch houses. That implies Thomas doesn’t actually need to feed on lust specifically, and could at least try to switch to a less creepy way of existing. But those other 2 families were basically wiped out one book after being introduced and now we’re back to just sex vampires.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 18:08
|
|
|
gerg_861 posted:I am happy to be getting two books, but what are the thoughts on the trailer? I was thoroughly unimpressed, and not excited to any additional extent by it. The only part that really sticks with me is Dresden watching his daughter sleep. Having a trailer on Youtube for a book populated by a bunch of your cosplayer buddies is neat from a "it's nice this guy is helping his friends out by giving them a job" perspective but it's hilariously dumb from just about any other viewpoint I can take on it. There are literally porn videos with higher production values than that trailer, after all.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 18:23
|
|
|
Subvisual Haze posted:The weirdest thing about the White Court was when the story very briefly expanded them beyond House Raith to include other Houses that feed on different negative emotions like terror. They even had one vampire switch houses. That implies Thomas doesn’t actually need to feed on lust specifically, and could at least try to switch to a less creepy way of existing. The other emotions are fear, despair, and anger though so is lust really worse than those?
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 18:30
|
|
|
Subvisual Haze posted:The weirdest thing about the White Court was when the story very briefly expanded them beyond House Raith to include other Houses that feed on different negative emotions like terror. They even had one vampire switch houses. That implies Thomas doesn’t actually need to feed on lust specifically, and could at least try to switch to a less creepy way of existing. I mean the 'less creepy' ways of feeding still include emotional and physical torture. At least with 'lust' you have the (lovely) plausible deniability of it being entirely consensual encounters like Butcher is trying to push. (Just ignore the time Thomas raped and murdered teenagers??)
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 18:39
|
|
|
Daric posted:The other emotions are fear, despair, and anger though so is lust really worse than those? One of the incognito vampires was a horror movie director. Hanging around spooky movie showings seems like a less destructive way to exist.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 18:39
|
|
|
Subvisual Haze posted:One of the incognito vampires was a horror movie director. Hanging around spooky movie showings seems like a less destructive way to exist.
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 18:52
|
|
|
Merry Gentry 1: 300 pages in, and the queen is dressing up her royal guard like sexpot strippers and I suspect the purpose is so she can gift all of them to Merry for loving purposes. Also, one dude's abs were described as cobblestone abs. I'm having a great time reading it, but not for the reasons LKH intended. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 19:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 22:44 |
|
|
StrixNebulosa posted:Merry Gentry 1: 300 pages in, and the queen is dressing up her royal guard like sexpot strippers and I suspect the purpose is so she can gift all of them to Merry for loving purposes. Dude had psoriasis?
|
|
#
?
Mar 25, 2020 19:32
|
|