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Hopes Fall posted:I've only made bread successfully once before. The top cane out very flat, but that taste was good, and the crumb a little dense. There's some pretty typical commentary on that: https://thebreadguide.com/why-does-my-bread-collapse-or-flatten/ I always assume overproofing, but I forget other people are afraid of wearing themselves or their equipment out so I am not good at guessing at underkneading. I also couldn't tell from a picture. However, dense crumb is definitely a thing from overproofed dough. That site also talks about mishandling high-hydration dough, which is only a problem if you're a freak making ciabatta and baguettes.
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Mar 26, 2020 06:53
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Stringent posted:Unfortunately mine end up looking like this: I don't think I'm allowed to talk about other people's biscuits, but I still want to speculate that it looks... wet? Was it raw? Also, was that done at a really high temperature? That's a big contrast between white/brown.
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Mar 26, 2020 06:55
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I'm starting to regret not buying that 30kg bag of flour, it's the only flour I've seen in weeks and now it's sold out
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Mar 26, 2020 10:08
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Stringent posted:This is the what a correctly made biscuit looks like: Ugh, lots of biscuits are great that don't look like that. Typically, biscuits come in three types: drop, flaky, pillowy. All of them are valid in god's eyes. Rocko Bonaparte posted:I don't think I'm allowed to talk about other people's biscuits, but I still want to speculate that it looks... wet? Was it raw? Also, was that done at a really high temperature? That's a big contrast between white/brown. These look like how drop biscuits cook, to me, which makes me wonder if there was a lot of dairy in them. Honestly, who cares, though, if they taste good? They look like they rose. Cut them apart, split them open, and slather with butter, jam, and/or gravy. I go back and forth and cook all kinds regularly. The last time I biscuited, I went for layers: 
mediaphage fucked around with this message at 12:01 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 11:56
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Rocko Bonaparte posted:I don't think I'm allowed to talk about other people's biscuits, but I still want to speculate that it looks... wet? Was it raw? Also, was that done at a really high temperature? That's a big contrast between white/brown. Nah, the insides are quite pleasant, but yeah it was cooked quite hot. I seem to get a better lift and fluffier insides cooking hot so I kept pushing it, but that batch I just pushed a little too far. This is what the insides look like: 
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Mar 26, 2020 12:22
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mediaphage posted:Ugh, lots of biscuits are great that don't look like that. They may be valid in God's eyes, but not mine.  And yeah, lots of dairy, it's a super wet dough, really hard to handle. If anyone's interested this is the recipe: 300g flour 70g butter 8g baking powder 227g milk 10g lemon juice 10g sugar 6g salt Swap the lemon juice and milk for buttermilk if you can get it, of course. *edit* I feel like since I posted the recipe I have to post a photo of not the ugliest batch I've made. 
Stringent fucked around with this message at 12:30 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 12:26
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Piss Meridian posted:I'm starting to regret not buying that 30kg bag of flour, it's the only flour I've seen in weeks and now it's sold out Same here in Brooklyn. Gotta venture further to find it which flies in the face of what I'm supposed to do... In other news I don't think I'm doing my starter correctly now. I've been reading/watching other tutorials and they say to discard most of the starter - which I haven't been doing. I'm on day 6 of adding 3 tbs of flour / 2 tbs of water and I see less activity now. There are bubbles on the top but that's about it. Should I discard most of it and feed it with larger quantities? Or start over with something like this: https://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/sourdough-starter-recipe ?
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Mar 26, 2020 13:38
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Stringent posted:They may be valid in God's eyes, but not mine. I really hate food gatekeepers. Does the biscuit taste good? It counts. Don’t be a douche. “Authenticity” is the worst part of food culture by far. That said, that’s just a pretty normal biscuit recipe. A cup of dairy isn’t a lot. Also, I’m curious as to the point of the lemon juice...if you were adding baking soda, I could understand. Otherwise, there doesn’t seem to be a reason to fake the buttermilk. Only half a stick of butter, though...I tend to make biscuits with almost twice that amount. Anyway I always bake biscuits hot. 425 is probably the lowest I’d go.
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Mar 26, 2020 13:52
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Doh004 posted:Same here in Brooklyn. Gotta venture further to find it which flies in the face of what I'm supposed to do... You should get a scale. But yeah, you get rid of most with a healthy starter. At least half building a new one. When I feed I keep 10g of starter and add 50g flour and 50g water
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Mar 26, 2020 13:57
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Rocko Bonaparte posted:There's some pretty typical commentary on that: Thanks for the link! From what I saw, it's almost definitely overproofing. I'm trying to find a sweet spot for preheating my oven to slightly warmer than room temp, for proofing purposes, and I was definitely a bit impatient. My house is pretty cold, rarely warmer than 65f this time of year, so I'm experimenting with preheating the oven to 170, then shutting it off for a bit beforehand. I think it was still too warm on the second rise.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:05
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There are a few reasons to throw away a bunch of starter. Over time, proteolytics and amylases will turn it into goo, microbial buildup means you’ll have increasingly larger populations competing for the same food, alcohol and waste production can stunt other growth, and you can select for a population of fast-rising yeasts. None of these are really required or problematic, just sort of tangential issues that are worth keeping in mind. When it comes to bread baking, you don’t really need a scale as you can pretty easily eyeball it, but a scale will make your efforts more repeatable. You don’t necessarily have to work with larger amounts, but they do provide you a buffer. Something to keep in mind - you can pour/spoon out anything you’d toss (as long as it doesn’t smell bad) and freeze it for use in batters and doughs, especially anywhere you’d use a biga/poolish/pâte fementée. Hopes Fall posted:Thanks for the link! From what I saw, it's almost definitely overproofing. I'm trying to find a sweet spot for preheating my oven to slightly warmer than room temp, for proofing purposes, and I was definitely a bit impatient. Unless you’re in a big hurry, you don’t need to warm anything for proofing at all. It’ll even do it in the fridge. It’ll be a little slower, but longer ferments almost always result in better bread. Also, if you’re ever worried about overproofing in the future, just knock it down and let it rise again for less time. mediaphage fucked around with this message at 14:12 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 14:09
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Doh004 posted:Same here in Brooklyn. Gotta venture further to find it which flies in the face of what I'm supposed to do... I'm on like day 10 of following this recipe and while the proto-starter isn't smelling bad (it's yeasty/vinegary) it's also not doubling in size or being very active. It gets a bit bubbly, that's it. Won't rise much more than a cm. I'm wondering if the yeast just isn't getting a foothold because the temp is too low and I discard and feed every 12 hours, so I branched out; I got one on the kitchen counter than I'm gonna hydrate a little less, stir and have a loose unsealed lid on and the recipe one in the bathroom at like 21-23 centigrade which I'm gonna feed 1:1:1 by weight, keep sealed (as per beer brewing standard) and not touch. We'll see how it goes. I really really want to try baking a no-knead sourdough bread with my very own yeast.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:12
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Anyone ever have Tuscan bread? In the bread bakers apprentice theres a recipe for Tuscan bread. Its saltless and you make a paste with flour and hot water then let it sit overnight before putting everything together and bake it. Sounds kinda interesting / I have hella free time so..
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Mar 26, 2020 14:19
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mediaphage posted:Unless you’re in a big hurry, you don’t need to warm anything for proofing at all. It’ll even do it in the fridge. It’ll be a little slower, but longer ferments almost always result in better bread. Also, if you’re ever worried about overproofing in the future, just knock it down and let it rise again for less time. Every single time I've tried a cold ferment it has failed. 0 lift and rock hard consistency, even on poo poo like pizza dough and overnight waffles. For whatever reason, the oven proof is the thing I've been halfway successful with, aside from the occasions that counter-proofing has worked because it was A. Uncomfortably warm in the house, or B. I was cooking/boiling water/creating lots of ambient heat at the same time anyway.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:20
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mediaphage posted:I really hate food gatekeepers. Does the biscuit taste good? It counts. Don’t be a douche. “Authenticity” is the worst part of food culture by far. Agreed, I hate it when people try to dictate what my personal preferences should be.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:27
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Tom Smykowski posted:Anyone ever have Tuscan bread? A bakery I used to work at made a version of that bread. We just used a biga for it and baked it as huge 2 kg boules. It's good for soaking up soups and sauces. We'd use leftovers cut up for panzanella salad.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:27
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Stringent posted:Agreed, I hate it when people try to dictate what my personal preferences should be. Thumposaurus posted:A bakery I used to work at made a version of that bread. We just used a biga for it and baked it as huge 2 kg boules. It's good for soaking up soups and sauces. We'd use leftovers cut up for panzanella salad.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:33
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Hopes Fall posted:Every single time I've tried a cold ferment it has failed. 0 lift and rock hard consistency, even on poo poo like pizza dough and overnight waffles. For whatever reason, the oven proof is the thing I've been halfway successful with, aside from the occasions that counter-proofing has worked because it was A. Uncomfortably warm in the house, or B. I was cooking/boiling water/creating lots of ambient heat at the same time anyway. You might consider adding a pinch of bakers yeast, then. It’ll still be sourdough. Stringent posted:Agreed, I hate it when people try to dictate what my personal preferences should be. I get you’re trying to be snarky with regards to my post, but I never suggested you weren’t making “proper” breads.
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Mar 26, 2020 14:36
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Submarine Sandpaper posted:You should get a scale. But yeah, you get rid of most with a healthy starter. At least half building a new one. When I feed I keep 10g of starter and add 50g flour and 50g water Scale is arriving today! Took a week a half on Amazon but it also isn't essential to keeping people alive, so I'm fine with being patient! I'll discard half of this guy and see how it does today. Nice piece of fish posted:I'm on like day 10 of following this recipe and while the proto-starter isn't smelling bad (it's yeasty/vinegary) it's also not doubling in size or being very active. It gets a bit bubbly, that's it. Won't rise much more than a cm. I'm wondering if the yeast just isn't getting a foothold because the temp is too low and I discard and feed every 12 hours, so I branched out; I got one on the kitchen counter than I'm gonna hydrate a little less, stir and have a loose unsealed lid on and the recipe one in the bathroom at like 21-23 centigrade which I'm gonna feed 1:1:1 by weight, keep sealed (as per beer brewing standard) and not touch. Yeah I figured the still cooler early sprint weather wasn't helping a ton. Hope it works out  *edit* Trip report from the Wegmans in Brooklyn: completely sold out of all flour and yeasts 
Doh004 fucked around with this message at 14:43 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 14:40
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I've made all kinds of "real" biscuits (and like all kinds), but the one I recommend most often is this extremely basic, unhealthy one. https://www.instrupix.com/butter-swim-biscuits/ I halve it and make it in a loaf pan. You can also include herbs, spices, cheese, etc. The amount of butter gets it closer in texture to Red Lobster biscuits.
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Mar 26, 2020 15:19
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i like nice words
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Doh004 posted:It has not done that yet. So stay the course and keep adding the 3tbs flour/2tbs water daily? It took me about 10 days to get a starter that was actually rising and falling regularly. Feed it 2x a day if you can until then, and rye flour is the best for starting your starter if you have it. My starter has been going for about a year now, and when it is on the counter I feed it 1 to 2 times a day, in these amounts: 100g water 50g whole wheat flour 50g AP flour 50g previous day's starter Ishamael fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 15:36
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Anne Whateley posted:I've made all kinds of "real" biscuits (and like all kinds), but the one I recommend most often is this extremely basic, unhealthy one. https://www.instrupix.com/butter-swim-biscuits/ Lol, that looks fun I'll have to give it a shot.
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Mar 26, 2020 15:55
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Anne Whateley posted:I've made all kinds of "real" biscuits (and like all kinds), but the one I recommend most often is this extremely basic, unhealthy one. https://www.instrupix.com/butter-swim-biscuits/ No more unhealthy than any other good biscuit, imo. It’s basically drop biscuits. Bet they’re delicious.
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Mar 26, 2020 15:59
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Tom Smykowski posted:Gatekeeping stringy smh My passions got the best of me and I forgot the impartially required of me as the Arbiter of Biscuits. I'll try to do better going forward.
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Mar 26, 2020 16:01
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Ishamael posted:It took me about 10 days to get a starter that was actually rising and falling regularly. Feed it 2x a day if you can until then, and rye flour is the best for starting your starter if you have it. I don't have any Rye or Whole Wheat as they seem to be sold out entirely near me. That said, I just placed an order with the Walmart gods for some Rye so we shall see if it actually gets delivered...
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Mar 26, 2020 16:17
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Biscuits chat. I read this article the other day. https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2018/11/better-biscuits-south-thanksgiving/576526/
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Mar 26, 2020 16:18
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Doh004 posted:I don't have any Rye or Whole Wheat as they seem to be sold out entirely near me. That said, I just placed an order with the Walmart gods for some Rye so we shall see if it actually gets delivered... Man this has been frustrating, I can’t even get in the berries to mill cheese eats mouse posted:Biscuits chat. I read this article the other day. I am pretty skeptical; I use canadian flour which is even harder, and still make good biscuits. White lily does make a good biscuit tho. Also if you were that hard up, pastry flour and cornstarch exists everywhere to mix in mediaphage fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 16:24
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cheese eats mouse posted:Biscuits chat. I read this article the other day. As much as I hate anyone who the Atlantic would publish, I agree that White Lily is primo biscuit flour. I always pick up a bag when I'm back in the US. *edit* poo poo I just realized I'm gatekeeping editorial magazines. Buy an Atlantic subscription by all means if you're so inclined, that was just my personal opinion. Stringent fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 26, 2020 16:24
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Doh004 posted:I don't have any Rye or Whole Wheat as they seem to be sold out entirely near me. That said, I just placed an order with the Walmart gods for some Rye so we shall see if it actually gets delivered... Good luck! You can make it out of AP flour too, but rye gets going faster. Once it is established, mine looks like this after doubling: 
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Mar 26, 2020 16:25
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Piss Meridian posted:I'm starting to regret not buying that 30kg bag of flour, it's the only flour I've seen in weeks and now it's sold out Search for local, hipster flour mills near you and you might be surprised. If you're posting in this thread then you're definitely the type to enjoy playing around with that. An example: https://bartonspringsmill.com/collections/all-grains/products/rouge-de-bordeax-wheat?variant=16611412607066 These operations might be waiving shipping near where they are too.
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Mar 26, 2020 17:27
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mediaphage posted:You might consider adding a pinch of bakers yeast, then. It’ll still be sourdough. That's with yeast. I haven't attempted sourdough yet.
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Mar 26, 2020 18:03
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Hopes Fall posted:That's with yeast. I haven't attempted sourdough yet. Oh, my bad, sorry. That’s very strange, then. What kind of ratios are you using? I find it very strange that you can’t get it to rise at all unless it’s in a warm spot. When I use standard yeast, it even rises okay in the fridge.
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Mar 26, 2020 18:13
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Hi goons with spoons! I love to cook, there’s something about standing in my kitchen drinking good beer while everything smells good and turns into food. I’ve been wanting to get my foot into baking and the current weird state of the world is giving me tons of time to get started. I’ve made two attempts so far. As you can see, I didn’t learn about slicing to control expansion until after these. Another interesting tidbit is that it’s a crapshoot what ingredients I can find in the local store. For instance, the only flours I can find are all purpose and whole wheat. Whole wheat  First time ever trying baking so I’m going to say it came out fine. I used King Arthur whole wheat flour, yeast, an egg, canola oil, a little 2% milk, sugar and salt. Working the dough was sticky and almost frustrating, I’m assuming due to the liquid content. After some practice and a light touch, I was able to knead it while keeping my hands and board lightly dusted. Eventually it smoothed up and I could handle it without it trying to eat my hand. I did shape it for the pan poorly as it came out a little heavier on one end. Oops. It came out of the oven smelling a little... bitter? Sour? Not a strong or bad smell but as it cooled it started to smell great. I assume that’s normal as it finishes cooking the inner bits and expels moisture? I made a thick beef stew and cut the loaf into large slices for dipping. It went together well, good for mopping.  Not whole wheat bread. I don’t know, regular? White?  I don’t know what to call this because I can’t find white bread (or any kind of bread) flour so I used all purpose. This time I used half a cup of milk mixed with warm water and a few tablespoons of softened butter instead of oil. The dough was much easier to work with and shape, especially using what I had learned previously. It even came out kind of symmetrical. I do let these cool on a rack by the way, I don’t take the pictures until slicing time. This bread, once cut, tasted so good. Soft and warm in the middle, flaky on the outside. I was really happy with myself and, having a few great beers in my stomach, decided to make a sandwich with roast beef, a little ham and some pepper jack.  Let me tell you about this sandwich. I loved this sandwich. Anyways that’s where I am now and I would love to talk about bread with you guys.
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Mar 26, 2020 18:48
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Those look awesome! You don't always have to slice, I mean, both of those look completely fine tbh.
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Mar 26, 2020 18:53
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Rocko Bonaparte posted:Search for local, hipster flour mills near you and you might be surprised. If you're posting in this thread then you're definitely the type to enjoy playing around with that. I'm by no means local to these people, but I just threw an order at them for some Whole Wheat Flour (and some more Rye because why not). Hope it works!
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Mar 26, 2020 19:33
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mediaphage posted:Oh, my bad, sorry. That’s very strange, then. What kind of ratios are you using? I find it very strange that you can’t get it to rise at all unless it’s in a warm spot. When I use standard yeast, it even rises okay in the fridge. Well, my last loaf was the King Arthur Sandwich bread recipe, with AP flour and melted butter. I think I have a bread curse.
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Mar 26, 2020 19:38
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Hopes Fall posted:Every single time I've tried a cold ferment it has failed. 0 lift and rock hard consistency, even on poo poo like pizza dough and overnight waffles. For whatever reason, the oven proof is the thing I've been halfway successful with, aside from the occasions that counter-proofing has worked because it was A. Uncomfortably warm in the house, or B. I was cooking/boiling water/creating lots of ambient heat at the same time anyway. Is your yeast old/are you adding water too warm and killing off most of it?
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Mar 26, 2020 20:36
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Hopes Fall posted:Every single time I've tried a cold ferment it has failed. 0 lift and rock hard consistency, even on poo poo like pizza dough and overnight waffles. For whatever reason, the oven proof is the thing I've been halfway successful with, aside from the occasions that counter-proofing has worked because it was A. Uncomfortably warm in the house, or B. I was cooking/boiling water/creating lots of ambient heat at the same time anyway. Since Flash Gordon Ramsay brought this up, I thought about that a little too. Have you proofed the yeast to see how it's doing? How much salt are you adding as a percentage of the weight of the flour? How is the yeast introduced to the salt? Are you using tap or filtered water? I don't think you should have to resort to such heat to kick your yeast in the rear end. I've had my pizza dough rebel in the fridge when I was trying to slow it down. It gave no shits about that fridge. A normal thing for me would be: 160g type 00 flour per pizza I want to make 55% hydration so 88g (or ml) tap water. 65% hydration if I'm using TAM-105 type 00. 1% salt so, like, 1.6g salt. I think the pizza thread was talking about something like 3% salt and I just can't do it. It's just too much. 1% dried baking yeast (1.6g) Yeast is briefly hydrated in water but I don't have proofing concerns. salt is tossed into flour in mixing bowl and stirred. Water is all dumped to one side and then party time.
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Mar 26, 2020 21:01
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In the spirit of loving up, the coches showed up the other day ... and my wife gad them tossed into the washer. So now we're trying to stretch them back out and iron them in hopes of restoring them. Fortunately, I didn't start flouring them.
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Mar 26, 2020 21:03
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As far as I'm aware, the yeast is fine. I made an ok loaf a bread a few days back with it, and delightful yeasted pancakes for Shrovetide. I use double filtered tap water; we're on a well so it's pretty hard. Once through a pur faucet, then once through a Brita pitcher. The water is warm, not hot, when I use it, and the yeast proofs fine. It gets all happy and bubbly; and then I add flour and the bread gods frown on me. I know nothing of percentages. I just follow recipes.
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Mar 26, 2020 21:15
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