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Dravs posted:Honestly, at the end of the day, is it worse to have a liberal centrist who passes some of your policies and generally does things like keep the NHS funded, or have a great party leader but the government is run by racist pedophiles who want to kill the poor? i do not believe that a labour remain candidate can win a majority unless something spectacular happens, in which case anyone wearing a red rosette could win a majority starmer's labour is effectively writing off most of the country outside of the cities, and are going to be competing with the lib dems for every swing vote they can get. but we'll see - at least the guardian set should be onboard now
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Apr 5, 2020 11:00
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drat i just had a blazing vision of the future for the next couple years
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Apr 5, 2020 11:09
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I get the impression Starmer is a very methodical, policy type guy who doesn't jump into things hastily This probably means he's not going to hammer the Tories on short notice though which makes me worry he will be seen as weak Also speaking of the media the BBC are going to be even more cowed than before because Boris is basically holding a gun to their head so don't look to mercy from them
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Apr 5, 2020 11:09
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V. Illych L. posted:i do not believe that a labour remain candidate can win a majority unless something spectacular happens, in which case anyone wearing a red rosette could win a majority Labour has been struggling in those areas for years before Brexit for a variety of reasons not least because they were sold down the river by Blair There was absolutely no guarantee that saying Labour would do Brexit would stop large numbers of them flipping It's also worth pointing out that the Labour membership was 90% remain voters and shutting that down would have killed any idea that Labour cared about internal democracy
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Apr 5, 2020 11:14
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multijoe posted:I don't think it's inconcievable that if the Tories really gently caress up the handling of the Coronavirus (which is looking extremely likely) that Starmer could present himself as a safe pair of hands to Murdoch and restart the old News Corp alliance, which I'd guess is his gameplan in writing his first article as leader in the Sunday Times. Again, that's not to say it would definitely work, but I can see the logic in going for it. You've got to be kidding me, thinking you can get Rupert Murdoch to stop being evil as gently caress.
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Apr 5, 2020 11:26
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MikeCrotch posted:Labour has been struggling in those areas for years before Brexit for a variety of reasons not least because they were sold down the river by Blair ok so this is talking about two separate things one is corbyn's labour's reluctant pivot to second ref. this, i agreed with for the reasons you outline, though it should've happened earlier and been held more consistently the second one is the doubling down on this tendency by electing the most prominent pro-EU guy in the party to lead it, who is a london politician from london. this is basically giving up any hope of competing in those areas, and constitutes a long-term pivot towards the cities *unless something extraordinary happens* in which case the leader is pretty much irrelevant starmer's path to government is not obvious, is what i'm saying, and so the electability argument for him fails in my opinion
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Apr 5, 2020 11:27
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V. Illych L. posted:starmer's path to government is not obvious, is what i'm saying, and so the electability argument for him fails in my opinion Liberals are politically blind idiots who confuse 'not obviously objectionable to the bourgeois and bourgeois sentiments' with 'capable of winning elections' which is why Corbyns popularity had to be treated as a cult rather than support for a political platform.
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Apr 5, 2020 11:33
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prefect posted:You've got to be kidding me, thinking you can get Rupert Murdoch to stop being evil as gently caress. Nah, I'm saying Starmer could be willing to compromise himself to the extent Blair did to get Murduch's backing. I mean look at this poo poo today with him bending over backwards to support the government's position, this is a man who's going to melt on levels not previously thought possible.
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Apr 5, 2020 11:42
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i think support for leveson is critical enough for the people starmer needs to vote for him that he can't really walk that back, and unless he does that he's never getting murdoch to back off, much less his support
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Apr 5, 2020 11:44
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V. Illych L. posted:i do not believe that a labour remain candidate can win a majority unless something spectacular happens, in which case anyone wearing a red rosette could win a majority Here’s my suggestion. The Various people of Britain if they wants a future need people in power who treat the media as the sub humans they are rather then with deference.
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Apr 5, 2020 14:41
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Lol just lmao that people are not getting that Starmers actual beliefs or policies make no difference what so ever. If Corbyn was a well spoken knight of the realm who had gone to Oxbridge and had some posho name and was prepared to lie to the media in interviews he would have been voted in by a landslide. The dumb dumbs that make up the majority of the electorate just want to be ruled by someone related to royalty because it makes them feel better to think there are a class of people who are simply better than they are and will make choices in their best interest. They don't want to have to think about this stuff too hard. This is extremely depressing for me and several times I have had to just walk away from all media because it has really been getting to me how loving stupid a large part of the country is.
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Apr 5, 2020 17:33
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Dravs posted:Lol just lmao that people are not getting that Starmers actual beliefs or policies make no difference what so ever. Yeah. The best you can hope for if you don’t actually work to both create your own local media orgs and launch an all out assault on the media is a new Blair. Good luck.
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Apr 5, 2020 17:36
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Looking forward to the no agreement on 1/1/21 while still in the throes of 'Roni.
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Apr 5, 2020 17:39
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Meanwhile, in Ireland, the PM is going to work a shift a week in a hospital https://twitter.com/IrishTimes/status/1246852785821421568?s=20
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Apr 5, 2020 18:51
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Captain Splendid posted:Meanwhile, in Ireland, the PM is going to work a shift a week in a hospital If it's for real and not just a publicity stunt, that's pretty good of him.
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Apr 5, 2020 19:14
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i mean he's registered now, so if it's publicity they've broken the law to do so https://www.medicalcouncil.ie/public-information/check-the-register/search-results/?regno=184039&doctorid=30030137
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Apr 5, 2020 19:38
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Lol
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Apr 5, 2020 19:53
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prefect posted:If it's for real and not just a publicity stunt, that's pretty good of him. It's impossible to know for sure what the intent was behind it, but even if it is a publicity stunt it's taking the load off another doctor for a shift 
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Apr 5, 2020 19:54
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On the talk of electoralism, it's important to remember that the victories won by labour parties across Europe in the 20th century, even such as they were, did not come about through polite competition in the marketplace of ideas, vying for the attention of atomized individuals with the rationality of your model of governance. That's liberal bourgeois electoralism and will only produce liberal politics. The only way socialism can advance in liberal democracies is by bypassing liberal power structures and liberal media, disciplining the working class electorate to vote in lock step for their class interests. A labour party that's still competing for those votes on election day has already failed.
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Apr 5, 2020 20:06
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PoontifexMacksimus posted:On the talk of electoralism, it's important to remember that the victories won by labour parties across Europe in the 20th century, even such as they were, did not come about through polite competition in the marketplace of ideas, vying for the attention of atomized individuals with the rationality of your model of governance. That's liberal bourgeois electoralism and will only produce liberal politics. This. If you Re worrying about the power of the media and not creating your own. You have failed.
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Apr 5, 2020 20:14
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Covid 19 will probably kill the physical paper production industry dead and restarting it will be openly propaganda so there's that opportunity at least to establish online distribution of news and ideas.
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Apr 5, 2020 20:15
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Dravs posted:Lol just lmao that people are not getting that Starmers actual beliefs or policies make no difference what so ever. i don't think tony benn would've been treated with much less hostility by the press than corbyn was
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Apr 5, 2020 20:18
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https://twitter.com/new_number_2/status/1246862127111036928?s=20
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Apr 5, 2020 20:58
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prefect posted:If it's for real and not just a publicity stunt, that's pretty good of him. His government just came third in the election we had less than 2 months ago, corona has been the biggest boost to their polling in 5 years. They are the party of austerity though so maybe he can see first-hand the effect his policies had on our health service. breadshaped has issued a correction as of 21:12 on Apr 5, 2020 |
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Apr 5, 2020 21:09
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Corbyn shouldn't have insisted that the Protocols of the Meetings of the Learned Elders of Zion be reproduced in its entirety in the last manifesto
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Apr 5, 2020 21:15
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rip in peace bojo
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Apr 5, 2020 21:25
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https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1246893898963849222?s=20
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Apr 5, 2020 21:29
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im the downing street aide that elbowed aside an elderly man struggling to breathe in order to free up the bed for johnson
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Apr 5, 2020 21:31
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Is he finally getting his stiff upper lip?
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Apr 5, 2020 21:32
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Inexplicable Humblebrag posted:im the downing street aide that elbowed aside an elderly man struggling to breathe in order to free up the bed for johnson No need for delegation here 
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Apr 5, 2020 21:39
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Getting intubated as a precaution is going to be very uncomfortable
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Apr 5, 2020 21:53
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🔜⚰️
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Apr 5, 2020 21:55
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i cant believe that bojo is literally, actually, non-jokingly dead, completely dead rn, ripped from the mortal cool by coronavirus
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Apr 5, 2020 21:56
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https://twitter.com/nickeardleybbc/status/1246904496669839361?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw lmao
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Apr 5, 2020 22:04
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Getting hospitalised as a direct result of your own incredibly stupid policy decision really is one for the history books. Honestly what a loving remarkable way to eclipse Cameron & May as the most incompetent clown PM in history.
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Apr 5, 2020 22:08
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pity it can't have also happened to a few other world leaders imo
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Apr 5, 2020 22:23
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just another way bojo is more hapless than trump
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Apr 5, 2020 22:28
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redleader posted:pity it can't have also happened to a few other world leaders imo I pray for Jair Bolsonaro's death regularly.
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Apr 5, 2020 22:30
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Dmitri-9 posted:I pray for Jair Bolsonaro's death regularly. I mean...I like to think I would never wish death upon another human being, but I can't really deny that his death would be a net positive for the world.
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Apr 5, 2020 22:44
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lol what a fool
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Apr 5, 2020 22:48
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