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Blockhouse posted:I am convinced most of the people on this forum have no idea who Tetsuya Nomura is The boogeyman.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:26
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Blockhouse posted:I am convinced most of the people on this forum have no idea who Tetsuya Nomura is lots of zippers, spiky hair, carries a giant key. pretty hard not to know who he is when he's been the protagonist of like five Kingdom Hearts games
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Apr 9, 2020 05:26
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Mechafunkzilla posted:Of course Aeris will die. The twist will be that Tifa also dies, pushed under Aeris right as she is impaled for the double yakitori. And then Cloud will finally be free to elope with Ftfy
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Apr 9, 2020 05:30
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lezard_valeth posted:I can see a Chrono Cross time travel bullshit going on, with Sephiroth/Jenova travelling back in time to try and change things, and the Planet sending the Whispers/Watchman of Fate to make sure everything stays on course. The thing is that the whispers force poo poo to happen that's different. They trap Wedge on a spot where he is guaranteed to fall into a subterranean lab beneath sector 7's slums and live. They're also whirling around Biggs when you locate him on the tower and he is revealed to live. They are not preserving the passage of time from the first game.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:33
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Mechafunkzilla posted:Of course Aeris will die. The twist will be that Tifa also dies, pushed under Aeris right as she is impaled for the double yakitori. And then Cloud will finally be free to elope with Sephiroth. I'm sorry but having playing FFVIIR there is no way that Cloud wouldn't move on to Rufus Shinra in a heartbeat. Their battle in-game was like five seconds away from makeouts at any given moment. JBP posted:The thing is that the whispers force poo poo to happen that's different. They trap Wedge on a spot where he is guaranteed to fall into a subterranean lab beneath sector 7's slums and live. They're also whirling around Biggs when you locate him on the tower and he is revealed to live. They are not preserving the passage of time from the first game. I got the impression Wedge just managed to escape. There's some indications he's been running into the ghosts multiple times since he survived. He was basically getting lucky until he wasn't. Biggs living may have something to do with defeating the Whispers. They absolutely are trying to at least preserve the idea of the timeline. Things can change as long as the pieces don't get too out of place. The reason they're bothering Aerith early on is because Cloud got sidetracked and if they hadn't slowed her down they wouldn't have bumped into each other. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 05:36 on Apr 9, 2020 |
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Apr 9, 2020 05:33
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ImpAtom posted:I'm sorry but having playing FFVIIR there is no way that Cloud wouldn't move on to Rufus Shinra in a heartbeat. Their battle in-game was like five seconds away from makeouts at any given moment. Yeah watched that earlier tonight. It was loving amazing.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:34
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A more boring take from the developers would be for them to be trying to reconcile the ending of FF7 and the spin-off nonsense that occured in it's wake. Like FF7 was a very ambiguous ending for the cast but also very explicit in showing that Midgar was abandoned and reclaimed by nature. When I first heard about Advent Children being set after FF7 I said, "What? In the loving ruins of Midgar where it looked like nobody had been for centuries when Red XIII ran by? You mean people survived and continued to live under that destroyed city and didn't leave immediately?" So is the remake going to be them trying to explain this unneccesary poo poo?
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Apr 9, 2020 05:36
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Weird BIAS posted:A more boring take from the developers would be for them to be trying to reconcile the ending of FF7 and the spin-off nonsense that occured in it's wake. Like FF7 was a very ambiguous ending for the cast but also very explicit in showing that Midgar was abandoned and reclaimed by nature. The Red XIII scene is 500 years later, it even says as much. Advent Children is set relatively shortly afterwards. It takes time to abandon a city when the vast majority of its population are poor as poo poo.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:38
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Weird BIAS posted:A more boring take from the developers would be for them to be trying to reconcile the ending of FF7 and the spin-off nonsense that occured in it's wake. Like FF7 was a very ambiguous ending for the cast but also very explicit in showing that Midgar was abandoned and reclaimed by nature. I love the end of FF7. Red runs by 500 years into the future. He's a demigod basically.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:39
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Weird BIAS posted:A more boring take from the developers would be for them to be trying to reconcile the ending of FF7 and the spin-off nonsense that occured in it's wake. Like FF7 was a very ambiguous ending for the cast but also very explicit in showing that Midgar was abandoned and reclaimed by nature. I figured people just abandoned Midgar over time because mako energy fell out of use and eventually the city just sorta died a slow death. The sequel spinoffs talk about how mako and materia are falling out of use with Shinra's collapse so I figure eventually Midgar just slowly stops being an important city and people abandon it.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:40
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I hated the ending as a kid because I misinterpreted it as everything being dead except RedXIII, who I never used anyways
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Apr 9, 2020 05:43
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Dandywalken posted:I hated the ending as a kid because I misinterpreted it as everything being dead except RedXIII, who I never used anyways Lol I thought this too and was like "ahhhh is this bittersweet?"
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Apr 9, 2020 05:44
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ImpAtom posted:The Red XIII scene is 500 years later, it even says as much. Midgar is abandoned in Advert Children. They built a whole new city called Edge in like two years and moved everyone there.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:44
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e: beaten ^^^^^^^^^ As far as I remember, the whole fighting in AC takes place in a city near Midgar called Edge. They then later move the fight to Midgar via the highway chase, and during it you can see that the whole place is abandoned. Even more so during the final Cloud vs Sephiroth fisticuffs where they are just throwing buildings at each other.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:47
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I thought AC and DC were set 1-2 years off from the ending not including the 500 years part. Having a game about eco terrorists end with no human characters being shown in the aftermath of a near world ending event is kind of a major thesis statement that AC walks back by existing. Unless the point is some other event happens to make Midgar into an overgrown houseplant you'd think Barret's coal would just replace things in the universe and allow for Midgar to continue in some form. AC existing basically says, "Oh and people survived I guess. But at some point they leave Midgar? I dunno who cares ACTION." OhFunny posted:Midgar is abandoned in Advert Children. Ahh this is what I was forgetting. I guess most of my point was less about Midgar physically existing and more that people exist in the eco terrorist game's ending now, we know that, it wasn't known in the game on release.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:47
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ImpAtom posted:I got the impression Wedge just managed to escape. There's some indications he's been running into the ghosts multiple times since he survived. He was basically getting lucky until he wasn't. Wedge is pinned by the whispers with his cats in the scene of the plate falling, right on the spot the hole opens up. It makes sure cloud gets to see the Shinra lab, but it's nothing compared to Hojo's and there's no real reason the whispers would save Wedge. Biggs may have gotten lucky, but once again he's just alive back with his old gf at the orphanage and he had swirling whispers on the tower.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:58
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Here's how AC fits into the FF7 timeline and mythos: don't worry about it
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Apr 9, 2020 06:00
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JBP posted:Wedge is pinned by the whispers with his cats in the scene of the plate falling, right on the spot the hole opens up. It makes sure cloud gets to see the Shinra lab, but it's nothing compared to Hojo's and there's no real reason the whispers would save Wedge. Biggs may have gotten lucky, but once again he's just alive back with his old gf at the orphanage and he had swirling whispers on the tower. So what I'm getting from all of this is gently caress Jessie?
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Apr 9, 2020 06:01
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lezard_valeth posted:So what I'm getting from all of this is gently caress Jessie? no, but not for lack of trying
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Apr 9, 2020 06:04
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I think it's funny that the characters get a vision of Red XIII running from the og ending and he says grimly "this is what will happen if we don't change the future". Like, what will happen, you'll do cardio? They don't even see Midgar or anything ominous in that vision.
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Apr 9, 2020 06:10
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lezard_valeth posted:So what I'm getting from all of this is gently caress Jessie? I think she also had them hanging around but the last you see if her is on the tower.
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Apr 9, 2020 06:11
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Extremely minor note, but I really like how they modernized the barrel puzzle by replacing them with chandeliers.
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Apr 9, 2020 06:32
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JBP posted:Wedge is pinned by the whispers with his cats in the scene of the plate falling, right on the spot the hole opens up. It makes sure cloud gets to see the Shinra lab, but it's nothing compared to Hojo's and there's no real reason the whispers would save Wedge. Biggs may have gotten lucky, but once again he's just alive back with his old gf at the orphanage and he had swirling whispers on the tower. Right, but we've seen Wedge push through Whispers before. The Whispers are not actually that capable of stopping things. (It's also worth noting two out of three cats seem to be dead.  ) The Whispers don't seem to care about Cloud finding the lab until he seems about to stumble on to something and then they kick them all out. With Biggs I genuinely think the idea there is that he was supposed to die and the protagonists actions have changed that. He didn't survive in the original timeline and he is alive in this one but we only see him alive after they defeat the Whispers. I assume this also plays into what happened with Zack. (Because that sure fucks time pretty bad.)
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Apr 9, 2020 07:10
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Game isn't even officially out yet and we are already deep in crazy man theorycrafting. Nomura you've done it again oh you 
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Apr 9, 2020 07:37
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Dandywalken posted:I hated the ending as a kid because I misinterpreted it as everything being dead except RedXIII, who I never used anyways Actually Kitase confirmed that 500 years post FF7 that humanity has gone extinct. So yeah, it's still Bad End quote:EGM: At the very end of FFVII, we see the epilogue to the whole story that takes place 500 years later, so really, you still have another 497 years’ worth of games and movies to fill in....
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Apr 9, 2020 07:48
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lezard_valeth posted:Game isn't even officially out yet and we are already deep in crazy man theorycrafting. Nomura you've done it again oh you I'm really excited for this to be available to all goons. This is an all goons game for good or ill.
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Apr 9, 2020 07:55
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Onmi posted:Actually Kitase confirmed that 500 years post FF7 that humanity has gone extinct. So yeah, it's still Bad End i never took that as 'bad end' necessarily. i always saw it as 'humanity was sacrificed by the planet to stop meteor, and also because the planet cannot survive while humans are alive'.
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Apr 9, 2020 09:01
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Onmi posted:Actually Kitase confirmed that 500 years post FF7 that humanity has gone extinct. So yeah, it's still Bad End drat, Kitase is death crew as gently caress.
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Apr 9, 2020 09:06
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If Zack is alive I reckon he'll replace Cloud for a while at some point because they wouldn't have to reprogram everything. I could see either Cloud dies and Zack fills that role in your party lineup, or you play Zack for a while and he dies saving Aerith. But that's probably not sufficiently in tune with Nomura Thought.
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Apr 9, 2020 09:22
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Zack's going to tear through an entire division of troops and then the time-ghosts are gonna show up and pull away all but two of them after he dies so he looks like a fuckin' chump.
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Apr 9, 2020 09:35
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Nessus posted:If Zack is alive I reckon he'll replace Cloud for a while at some point because they wouldn't have to reprogram everything. I could see either Cloud dies and Zack fills that role in your party lineup, or you play Zack for a while and he dies saving Aerith. But that's probably not sufficiently in tune with Nomura Thought. The thing with Zack is there's no way of knowing if he's actually alive if that was even the timeline, or what the heck. There's stuff like the Stamp thing we've referenced, but even then, the Cloud we have, clearly, did succeed Zack, because he's got a fractured psyche and the Buster Sword. But also I'm fuckin' excited to see where the heck they go! Spoiler tags have spoilers
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Apr 9, 2020 09:45
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They really need to get that one gal who wrote the scenario for Shadowbringers to add some subtlety to the whole thing, or someone who can add some much need substance to the whole "destiny!" spiel. My problem with the additions is that one scene on the bridge right before the final sequence of ultra anime happens - it's eight minutes of a bunch of people saying absolutely nothing of substance. If you were reading the raw dialogue without the faces, the names or the voices, you would have no idea how many people there are, what their motivations are, who they are. Nothing. Except for that one off-hand "daddy's coming back home" comment. There aren't gloves thick enough to handle all the edge of that scene. I guess that's why it's called the edge of creation.
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Apr 9, 2020 10:25
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Blattdorf posted:They really need to get that one gal who wrote the scenario for Shadowbringers to add some subtlety to the whole thing, or someone who can add some much need substance to the whole "destiny!" spiel. My problem with the additions is that one scene on the bridge right before the final sequence of ultra anime happens - it's eight minutes of a bunch of people saying absolutely nothing of substance. If you were reading the raw dialogue without the faces, the names or the voices, you would have no idea how many people there are, what their motivations are, who they are. Nothing. Except for that one off-hand "daddy's coming back home" comment. Yeah lol it's amazing
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Apr 9, 2020 10:27
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All I want in the sequel is for the plot ghosts to move Aerith around as if she was a life net so that she can be in position to be stabbed by Sephiroth.
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Apr 9, 2020 13:00
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Spermando posted:All I want in the sequel is for the plot ghosts to move Aerith around as if she was a life net so that she can be in position to be stabbed by Sephiroth. Weekend at Aerith's
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Apr 9, 2020 13:12
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The original intent of the ending was absolutely that Holy eliminated all human beings
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Apr 9, 2020 13:48
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Even if that was the intent, Holy was localized over Midgar, and there are plenty of humans who live elsewhere on the planet. But at the same time, if we were supposed to read the ending as Holy killing everyone, it's really confusing to have that serene image of the Lifestream coming up to save everyone, complete with triumphant music, with Aeris's smiling face being the last thing we see before the credits. Maybe Holy was going to kill all the humans along with Meteor, since it identified them as threats to the planet, but it seems like the Lifestream/Aeris put a stop to that. Now, whether humanity is extinct by 500 years later, who knows. I'm honestly not sure if Kitase was joking or not about humanity all being dead in that one interview, given the context of his answer, but it's certainly possible I guess. I always read that scene as being about the way of life that Midgar represented being dead--nature has overtaken the biggest symbol on the planet of a way of life that was sucking the planet dry. Whether or not humans still exist at that point is ambiguous, I suppose, but it never really seemed like an apocalyptic image to me in the context of the rest of the ending.
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Apr 9, 2020 14:14
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Harrow posted:Even if that was the intent, Holy was localized over Midgar, and there are plenty of humans who live elsewhere on the planet. But at the same time, if we were supposed to read the ending as Holy killing everyone, it's really confusing to have that serene image of the Lifestream coming up to save everyone, complete with triumphant music, with Aeris's smiling face being the last thing we see before the credits. Maybe Holy was going to kill all the humans along with Meteor, since it identified them as threats to the planet, but it seems like the Lifestream/Aeris put a stop to that. There's a lot of implication in the text of "poo poo's going to die and there's really gently caress all we can ACTUALLY do about it." Bugenhagen especially says a lot in that vein. That everyone's going to die out anyway. And, as poo poo as it is, Dirge of Cerberus continues that line of thought, saying the ultimate goal of the planet is to die and join the Cosmic Lifestream (The Cosmicstream?) something something Chaos, something something end of all life. Like... it's a pretty FF7 'theme' that is "struggling against the inevitability of death" Kinda depressing thinking of it like that though, honestly.
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Apr 9, 2020 14:19
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Yeah, though you have a point that there's a very strong "death is inevitable" theme running throughout the original FFVII. Somehow the idea that no matter how well events go in FFVII itself, all the humans (and who knows about the rest of the animal life on the planet) will be dead by 500 years later, seems to sorta cheapen the whole thing. Like the best you can do in this grand, apocalyptic adventure is delay the inevitable, and not even for a length of time longer than Red XIII's lifespan. I never played Dirge of Cerberus but it sounds like it's not even a "humanity is gone and that's good for the planet, we're the virus" or whatever thing--it sounds like the planet itself is on its way out. Still, maybe that's the point.
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Apr 9, 2020 14:22
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Japanese devs seem to be much less reverent to canon than western ones, feels like they'll often just say "yea sure" to whatever theory they think sounds neat at the time. The dirge thing was like... once all the life on the planet dies out of natural causes, the planet will gather up the lifestream and take it off into space. The bad guy's plan was trying to make this happen now rather than in a million of years by tricking the planet into thinking an extinction event already happened. Avalerion fucked around with this message at 14:44 on Apr 9, 2020 |
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Apr 9, 2020 14:40
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