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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:It’s still extremely lol to me that the core ethos of both Star Trek shows in the last decade is a driving belief that a better future is not, in fact, possible We as a world don't think things can get better anymore, and it is reflected in our SciFi.
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Apr 7, 2020 20:42
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Peachfart posted:We as a world don't think things can get better anymore, and it is reflected in our SciFi. It doesn't help that when we evaluate some of our more "hopeful" sci-fi full of promise for the future, you can see that the values are actually some more of the stuff we've come to realize sucks on Earth, now put into space. More imperialism, more resource extraction, more control of society and the individual... it's hard to think that there's much to look forward to when even our positive ideas end up looking like eugenics and colonialism in retrospect... what horrors wait in the wings, if that's the case?
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Apr 7, 2020 20:48
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Peachfart posted:We as a world don't think things can get better anymore, and it is reflected in our SciFi. But the people in 1966 and 1986 did? I really don't understand this need to connect real world sentiments and events into everything. That's how you get stupid 9/11 episodes.
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Apr 7, 2020 22:47
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:It’s still extremely lol to me that the core ethos of both Star Trek shows in the last decade is a driving belief that a better future is not, in fact, possible I would say that the core ethos of both shows is that a better world, but unless people are vigilant in preserving that world, things like fear and hatred can creep back in.
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Apr 7, 2020 23:10
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That's being extremely generous to some bad television. Rich people ruin everything eventually.
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Apr 8, 2020 01:26
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I mean, what xerxus said is obviously what they are going for, though whether they actually hit that mark is obviously debatable
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Apr 8, 2020 02:42
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Peachfart posted:Klingons aren't blackface because they are playing aliens, not black people. You and others are way over thinking this. Klingons don't exist. "Gollywogs aren't real, so they're not racist!"
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Apr 8, 2020 05:24
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MrData posted:But the people in 1966 and 1986 did? I really don't understand this need to connect real world sentiments and events into everything. That's how you get stupid 9/11 episodes. I think there was definitely a sense in the 60s that the future would be better so long as we didn't nuke each other.
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Apr 8, 2020 11:19
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Drink-Mix Man posted:I mean, what xerxus said is obviously what they are going for, though whether they actually hit that mark is obviously debatable By now I suspect that many of modern Star Trek's producers don't actually care if anything they make has a coherent point so long as they reference some familiar nouns. There is no "core ethos" beyond "um please buy Product" and that's what's most obvious to me
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Apr 8, 2020 11:31
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MrData posted:But the people in 1966 and 1986 did? I really don't understand this need to connect real world sentiments and events into everything. That's how you get stupid 9/11 episodes. Nice username/post combo. All media is a commentary on real world sentiment. In Star Trek it's also pretty explicit. TOS has episodes about how the Cuban Missile Crisis creates no winners and how imperialist proxy wars are bad and also had the first on-screen interracial kiss. TNG is all about the optimism of the end of the cold war and the assumed end of history. DS9 is pretty heavily influenced by the fall of the Iron Curtain, the Balkan Wars, and the integration of Eastern Europe into the Western order. Voyager and Enterprise struggle to be about anything, but Battlestar Galactica is entirely about 9/11 and the Iraq war.
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Apr 8, 2020 11:32
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xerxus posted:I would say that the core ethos of both shows is that a better world, but unless people are vigilant in preserving that world, things like fear and hatred can creep back in. They say write what you know and, frankly, if there's one thing I imagine Alex Kurtsman knows? It's this.
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Apr 8, 2020 14:06
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Peachfart posted:Klingons aren't blackface because they are playing aliens, not black people. You and others are way over thinking this. Klingons don't exist. The humanoid race in 'Code of Honor' don't exist either - buuuuuut
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Apr 8, 2020 15:32
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I think there's a bit more to meeting the criteria of blackface than simply the use of skin-covering makeup that's in line with a darker skin tone, unless we're also saying anyone who's ever played a werewolf was also doing blackface. You either can look at intent (is the goal to impersonate a Black/African/African-American person or character) or you need to pull on a few more elements of the visual lexicon of minstrel era blackface, IMO. Fidel Cuckstro fucked around with this message at 15:58 on Apr 8, 2020 |
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Apr 8, 2020 15:54
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Still boggled that they ended up with a fleet that looks like low-effort fan art.
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Apr 9, 2020 01:00
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Are those two pylons even the same angle? It's cgi, how do you make it look lopsided?
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Apr 9, 2020 04:27
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Lens distortion. It's especially noticeable when you cut out a small piece of a wide shot. It's not something wrong though it's just recreating how real lenses work. Your eyes do the same thing but your brain kinda smooths it out. You may notice that shapes in your peripheral vision are distorted if you pay attention.
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Apr 9, 2020 04:52
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Lopsided looking nacelles can just be treated as a nice homage to TNG.
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Apr 9, 2020 05:07
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Like  but the Enterprise
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Apr 9, 2020 13:10
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Arglebargle III posted:
Hang on that's an Avenger Class Battlecruiser from STO but worse   Hold on let me play with the alternate ship parts you can put on the avenger and make a frankenstein ship   Ew that is a nasty combo. Also I'm guessing the ship that the designer plays with. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 11:46 on Apr 10, 2020 |
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Apr 10, 2020 11:39
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Somebody did a mock-up of what the fleet should've been. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED-YjeKywZc
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Apr 10, 2020 12:53
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Thom12255 posted:Somebody did a mock-up of what the fleet should've been. The fact that in the show Starfleet doesn't arrive with the romulans firing on the planet and the lead starfleet ship swooping in directly between them out of nowhere and catching the shot on their shields is a loving travesty. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 13:41 on Apr 10, 2020 |
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Apr 10, 2020 13:29
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Thom12255 posted:Somebody did a mock-up of what the fleet should've been. That's the good stuff.
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Apr 10, 2020 14:10
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Thom12255 posted:Somebody did a mock-up of what the fleet should've been. Terrible. I don't see any Mirandas.
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Apr 10, 2020 14:33
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That's so much better. How cool would that be, but with some Galors or Vorchas thrown in, too?
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Apr 10, 2020 14:59
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I would have been perfectly content if Picard consisted of Jean Luc chilling with his friends in his vineyard, ala Making It or Hyori's Bed and Breakfast. 
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Apr 10, 2020 17:01
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Looks to the Moon posted:I would have been perfectly content if Picard consisted of Jean Luc chilling with his friends in his vineyard, ala Making It or Hyori's Bed and Breakfast. Yeah, a series about the Picard from TNG would have been pretty nice, but then you wouldn't have seen [rolls dice] the Romulan warbird from TOS, or [rolls dice] the Borg do... something, or how about [rolls dice] Seven of Nine from Voyager (Hey Alex, why is that on the chart?) and [rolls dice] "new character: roll twice on character trait chart" maybe develop into a relationship!
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Apr 10, 2020 18:09
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Pinterest Mom posted:Terrible. I don't see any Mirandas. They set the "explode on impact" dial just a little bit too sensitive so they all blew up when the spacedock doors opened with a big heavy ka-chunk to let the fleet out.
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Apr 10, 2020 18:16
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8one6 posted:Yeah, a series about the Picard from TNG would have been pretty nice, but then you wouldn't have seen [rolls dice] the Romulan warbird from TOS, or [rolls dice] the Borg do... something, or how about [rolls dice] Seven of Nine from Voyager (Hey Alex, why is that on the chart?) and [rolls dice] "new character: roll twice on character trait chart" maybe develop into a relationship! Bad fanfiction already exists, they didn't have to film it! In my headcanon the series began and ended when Picard spoke French to Number One (dog). That was the high point for me.
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Apr 10, 2020 18:32
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Thom12255 posted:Somebody did a mock-up of what the fleet should've been. Haha this rules
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Apr 10, 2020 22:11
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Thom12255 posted:Somebody did a mock-up of what the fleet should've been. Where are all the ships made from cast-off bits of other models kits?
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Apr 11, 2020 00:11
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Fidel Cuckstro posted:Haha this rules No it doesn't. It just reuses old designs. As the franchise got a bigger budget starfleet was shown to be designing new ships like every 2 years. We went from 'there's like 5 galaxy class and the rest are mirandas' to 'now we have Akiras, Nova's, Steamrunners, Sovereigns, Defiants, Intrepids'. This poo poo sucks and it's exactly the problem with its blinkered fanbase. No imagination. You only look backwards.
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Apr 11, 2020 13:51
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Many of those new ships exist retroactively by their design. Like despite being introduced in First Contact the Akira is clearly a contemporary of the Galaxy, while the Nova is a contemporary of the Sovereign. Or in DS9 they introduce the Centaur, which is shaped like the Miranda but uses Excelsior parts - we're meant to assume that Centaurs have been floating around for decades and were made soon after Excelsior was, not that they're brand new. A lot of the explosion of designs later on in the 24th century kinda fills out the past rather than assuming that Starfleet went crazy in the design department a year before First Contact came out. You're right that there should be some new classes and a new 2399 aesthetic and design style, but Starfleet has been shown to keep ships for a long time, and the bulk of the fleet should absolutely be recognisable. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Apr 11, 2020 |
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Apr 11, 2020 13:58
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Also even an all old-ships fleet is more believable and way more enjoyable to look at than an all same-ships fleet that we barely got to see
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Apr 11, 2020 14:07
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Before the show ends for good, I just wanna have one holodeck scene with Picard on the bridge of the D, kind of like that Scotty TNG episode, preferably in full-on garish 1987 lighting.
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Apr 11, 2020 14:07
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The Bloop posted:Also even an all old-ships fleet is more believable ... than an all same-ships fleet I think Chabon said on insta that the all-similar-ships fleet was part of a big rush rebuild-the-fleet thing of cranking out mass produced midsize ships after the Dominion wiped out like two thirds of Starfleet, but to be fair he uses the Dominion War as an excuse for a lot of changes in Picard considering it's never mentioned.
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Apr 11, 2020 14:11
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MikeJF posted:Many of those new ships exist retroactively by their design. Like despite being introduced in First Contact the Akira is clearly a contemporary of the Galaxy, while the Nova is a contemporary of the Sovereign. Or in DS9 they introduce the Centaur, which is shaped like the Miranda but uses Excelsior parts - we're meant to assume that Centaurs have been floating around for decades and were made soon after Excelsior was, not that they're brand new. A lot of the explosion of designs later on in the 24th century kinda fills out the past rather than assuming that Starfleet went crazy in the design department a year before First Contact came out. Look at that dude's posts in this thread they are literally all extremely negative and angry/whiny about "Trek fans want everything to be the saaaaame"
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Apr 11, 2020 14:15
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MikeJF posted:I think Chabon said on insta that the all-similar-ships fleet was part of a big rush rebuild-the-fleet thing of cranking out mass produced midsize ships after the Dominion wiped out like two thirds of Starfleet, but to be fair he uses the Dominion War as an excuse for a lot of changes in Picard considering it's never mentioned. That's clearly a dumb production excuse for cheaping out Did the Dominion also remove their ability for a good camera angle
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Apr 11, 2020 14:19
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The Dominion war forced the Federation to swap out to cheaper, less-powerful weapons capacitors in order to boost production numbers. The unfortunate result? The kitten-weak phaser sounds of present day.
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Apr 11, 2020 14:22
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The Bloop posted:That's clearly a dumb production excuse for cheaping out Oh a hundred percent. I wonder what usable classic ship assets the current FX house actually has. Do they have a screen-ready Sovereign? Did that survive in a convertable format? What about other ships? I expect the Galaxy at the start was probably the model they bought from Richter to fill in the holes in TNG-HD. I know Drexler said the Intrepid 3D model on Voyager wouldn't have held up to HD. Most of the First Contact ships were lost or never designed for close-up work, it's why we mostly saw Akira on DS9, but those were built in 96, it might be impossible to get them into modern software now. (Of course they could probably buy most of the ships in high quality from fans if they really wanted, like they did the Galaxy, but I bet they hate that idea) MikeJF fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Apr 11, 2020 |
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Apr 11, 2020 14:28
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MikeJF posted:Oh a hundred percent. As I recall the only First Contact CG model that was lost was the Norway class. Paramount asked ILM to hand over its CG files to the effects company working on DS9 at the time--Digital Muse, I think?--and then there was a computer glitch or some poo poo.
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Apr 11, 2020 15:29
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