|
Franchescanado posted:And I'd be happy to rewatch any of the RotLD more than any of the Final Destinations. I like FD2 & 5, but not nearly as much as RotLD 3, which is arguably the crowing achievement in Yuzna's aesthetic. I'm guessing you were fortunate enough to miss the two Return movies that came after 3. Don't watch them.
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 00:11
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 15:01 |
|
|
Sarx posted:By this logic Jaws would be here until almost the end. It's easily one of the best films in the series. If you ignore all of the bad parts of a franchise it's easy to make it look good. I'm not saying anyone should apply my criteria but I'd also watch Return of the Living Dead before Jaws. It also comes down to never really thinking Final Destination or it's sequels were that good.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 00:14
|
|
|
Working my way through Final Destination now I'm not impressed at all. 1 and 2 are fine but neither is anywhere near Return. 3 was total trash though and everyone seems to say 4 is "the bad one." Toss in that I think Return 3 is kind of worthwhile if not good and as bad as 2, 4, and 5 are I kind of am amused by the mad cap zombie zaniness. I guess what it comes down to is that I enjoy mad cap zombie zaniness more than mad cap slasher death zaniness. But I'll prioritize finishing FD this week so I can judge fairly. Maybe 5 will turn the tide? Aliens vs Re-Animator is the tough one for me. Aliens is unquestionably my preferred franchise, but Re-Animator feels like the truer horror. Its a really rare case where I enjoy the sci fi more than the straight horror. If there Beyond wasn't so not good or if Patchwork really was a Re-Animator sequel that might put it over the top but right now I dunno. I'm torn.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 01:59
|
|
|
Irony.or.Death posted:Same but the exact opposite. You, of all posters, I expected better from - this is tantamount to voting against From Beyond. I mean I don't like voting against Alien, but there's no choice this time. I love Re-Animator but I think Alien and Aliens are both better, then throw in Prometheus and I knew which way I had to vote. Re-Animator is no From Beyond my friend. I wish it was. Nothing is From Beyond.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 02:06
|
|
|
Basebf555 posted:I love Re-Animator but I think Alien and Aliens are both better, then throw in Prometheus and I knew which way I had to vote. While this may be true... I voted immediately for Re-Animator. No hesitation. I have a whole section of my bluray space dedicated to the Alien franchise complete with art I bought from local artists, but I will never help Herbert West
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 03:24
|
|
|
I voted Alien but I am going to watch Re-Animator tomorrow and give it a fair shake. I haven’t seen it in 15+ years and Alien + Aliens are fresh in my mind from a couple of weeks ago.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 04:28
|
|
|
TheBizzness posted:I voted Alien but I am going to watch Re-Animator tomorrow and give it a fair shake. I haven’t seen it in 15+ years and Alien + Aliens are fresh in my mind from a couple of weeks ago. If you can watch Bride of Re-Animator too. I prefer it over Re-Animator, as they really pushed the crazy zombie effects to the next level
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 04:50
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:Working my way through Final Destination now I'm not impressed at all. 1 and 2 are fine but neither is anywhere near Return. 3 was total trash though and everyone seems to say 4 is "the bad one." Toss in that I think Return 3 is kind of worthwhile if not good and as bad as 2, 4, and 5 are I kind of am amused by the mad cap zombie zaniness. I guess what it comes down to is that I enjoy mad cap zombie zaniness more than mad cap slasher death zaniness. But I'll prioritize finishing FD this week so I can judge fairly. Maybe 5 will turn the tide? Final Destination is a series I think I might like, on balance, more than NoES, which is my automatic answer for 'best slasher of all time,' it's a great franchise that as others have said is essentially the final evolution by removing the slasher themself from the slasher movie. The back half of 1 also has a lot of great dialog about predestination and free will, as filtered through teen horror kids. It's a really good series and the joyful surprise of the insanely convoluted kills is just the best. My only beef is that it does get a little long-in-the-tooth because everyone dies every time, so they have to re-investigate Death's Design and find it out in increasingly absurd infodumps each time, but this is handled great in 5 anyway. eta: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4a1TUszkMfI Not horror, but bracket-related. Jon Bois (PBUH) made an amazing video showing why #5 seeds never make it to the NCAA finals while 8 and 9 seeds do relatively well. (spoiler: they crash into #1 seeds in the 3rd round) Really neat video and worth your time (as is everything Jon Bois does) Shrecknet fucked around with this message at 05:23 on Apr 12, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 05:13
|
|
|
Shrecknet posted:Final Destination 1 inventing the "rogue ninja-quiet bus from offscreen plasters someone" jumpscare? Clear saying "Should've seen that coming!" from a ridiculous kayak attack by Death in 2 didn't elicit a chuckle? The match-cut from the tanning beds to the paired coffins in 3 didn't do anything for you? The way the series is just so gleefully mean with its ending stingers? Tony Todd hamming it up as Bluddworth? All of that, nothing? As I said, I think 1 and 2 are fine. 1 is actually pretty funny and I think is held together by Devon Sawa's frantic energy. 2 doesn't have that but it does at least try and tell some kind of story linking its plot to the first one and creating some kind of mythology and I think it holds together as an actual story. And yeah, the ending of 2 did in fact get a mean chuckle from me. What it amounts to is (a) I'm not personally especially entertaining by the mean splatter deaths and (b) even to the extent that I am I'm not really interested in watching a 90 minute film to see half a dozen of them unless you do something to hold it all together. 3 was terrible to me because it makes no effort to do anything between the deaths and wastes a really talented actress in Mary Elizabeth Winstead who probably could have carried the movie the way Sawa did if she was allowed to do anything besides cry. Its just a lazy run through the same plot points because the movie's rushing to those mean deaths and jokes and doesn't really care to give them a reason to be. So like if the series further falls apart in 4 I really can't see myself giving it the nod over Return unless 5 really, really salvages it. But I'll watch through the next few days and give it a chance so I can judge fairly. As I said I think the direct difference between the two might just come down to the fact that I find zany, trashy, zombie stupidness more entertaining than zany, trashy, slasher stupidness. But this forum has a much larger slasher fanbase so I expect FD to advance. STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 05:31 on Apr 12, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 05:23
|
|
|
Just skip 4 and look up the kills on YouTube, its utterly dire but 5 is revelatory
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 06:23
|
|
|
I paid to watch TFD (FD4) in theatres, in 3D, with these newfangled "motion activated seats" because I loving love this franchise. It's great in theatres but just a rote entry otherwise. RotLD captures something great, and is a milestone in horror comedy. But, I have to give credit for the FD series trying to keep a modicum of plot in each. 3 and 4 are probably the most setpiece > death > next, but 5 knocks the ball out of the park with the way it plays out. I'm not sure if it was meant to be a capstone to the franchise but what a way to go out.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 06:53
|
|
|
Shrecknet posted:Just skip 4 Yeah... I kinda can't do that. Besides, if I'm judging the franchises that means the low with the highs. No one's giving my favorite franchises the pass of ignoring their worst entries. But again, "just look up the kills on Youtube" speaks to my problem with the Final Destination franchise. I only care about your wacky comedy splattery gore kills if you give me a reason to care about them. Otherwise its just a special effects demo reel, not a movie.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 07:42
|
|
|
Shrecknet posted:The match-cut from the tanning beds to the paired coffins in 3 didn't do anything for you? The way the series is just so gleefully mean with its ending stingers? Tony Todd hamming it up as Bluddworth? All of that, nothing? The DVD has the choose their fate option of seeing what happens if everyone avoids Death and pretty much Death's the good guy. I remember the pervy guy if he avoids dying ends up getting arrested for doing upskirt shots.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 14:27
|
|
|
I know it's been mentioned but don't vote as if RotLD just has one good movie. Check out RotLD 3, which for me is better than anything in the Final Destination series. So the way I see it when you combine RotLD 1 and 3, it's doing laps around Final Destination. Not even close.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 15:39
|
|
|
Basebf555 posted:I know it's been mentioned but don't vote as if RotLD just has one good movie. Check out RotLD 3, which for me is better than anything in the Final Destination series. So the way I see it when you combine RotLD 1 and 3, it's doing laps around Final Destination. Not even close. Right on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8-DVXVdtZY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8-DVXVdtZY
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 15:49
|
|
|
SIDE-DEBATE: If it came down to Friday vs Return of the Living Dead, is this essentially a dance off? If so, does the tag team of the Part 4 and Part 5 dances beat the Graveyard dance?
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 16:00
|
|
Timeless Appeal posted:SIDE-DEBATE: The decision between those two franchises would have to be made based on which one had the best cyborg battle, imo.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 16:18
|
|
|
Debbie Does Dagon posted:If you can watch Bride of Re-Animator too. I prefer it over Re-Animator, as they really pushed the crazy zombie effects to the next level Hell yeah. The bluray Arrow put out for Bride is wonderful.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 16:33
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:The decision between those two franchises would have to be made based on which one had the best cyborg battle, imo. Jason X, Jaxon, does have magnetic nipples which is a pretty hard thing to top
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 17:02
|
|
|
I'm excited that this round seems to have two legit tossups given the competing support for both RotLD and FD and Alien and Re-Animator.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 17:34
|
|
|
Basebf555 posted:Check out RotLD 3 It's also, you know, not much of a comedy the way its predecessors are. FilthyImp fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Apr 12, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 20:02
|
|
|
I will say this though. While RotLD is definitely a more madcap zombie movie, and does have laughs, it's not as much of a comedy as I was initially led to believe. It gets pretty grim, especially the rigor mortis poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 20:54
|
|
|
Burkion posted:Jason X, Jaxon, does have magnetic nipples which is a pretty hard thing to top Also has the funniest and the meanest kills in the series. I'm talking about the sleeping bags and the poor girl who gets her face shattered.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 21:24
|
|
|
TrixRabbi posted:I will say this though. While RotLD is definitely a more madcap zombie movie, and does have laughs, it's not as much of a comedy as I was initially led to believe. It gets pretty grim, especially the rigor mortis poo poo. ROTLD is simultaneously a ton of fun and exceedingly bleak. It’s an amazing feat all around, nothing else I can think of walks that tightrope so successfully.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2020 22:21
|
|
|
Basebf555 posted:I know it's been mentioned but don't vote as if RotLD just has one good movie. Check out RotLD 3, which for me is better than anything in the Final Destination series. So the way I see it when you combine RotLD 1 and 3, it's doing laps around Final Destination. Not even close. I just watched RotLD 3 on your suggestion, and I strongly disagree that it's better than Final Destination 2 or 5 (the very high points of the series IMO), but I was absolutely not prepared for the incredibly dark and humorless, downright gothic tone of RotLD 3. River Man 
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:20
|
|
|
Return of the Living Dead 3 is hard to sell as horror comedy because it is so humorless and dire for so much of the runtime. Personally I hate it, but I think Yuzna's good movies are more flukes in a sea of trash and it's clear some other people see the reverse ratio. I much more enjoy the rube goldberg as a serial killer fun of FD than Yuzna's brand of "how over-the-top can this zombie bullshit be?" This did make me think though, are we counting the Zombi movies as part of Night of the Living Dead since they were created to be sequels to Dawn of the Dead? Sarx fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Apr 13, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:36
|
|
|
The whole Final Destination series could be edited down to one feature length kill compilation and nothing would be lost. It would save the audience a lot of time actually.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:31
|
|
|
Shrecknet posted:It's me, I voted for the SAW franchise, and my reasoning is very simple: they care. I'm late to this party, but this is a good post and Saw is definitely better. You touched on it in your post, but the way that Saw plays with its chronology is wild. It also gave us James Wan.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:54
|
|
|
and for that alone we must bury it
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 07:09
|
|
|
Sarx posted:This did make me think though, are we counting the Zombi movies as part of Night of the Living Dead since they were created to be sequels to Dawn of the Dead? I wouldn’t. I mean, first, by that logic RotLD is a sequel to NotLD and should be considered part of that series. But also so many of the Italian knockoff films weren’t even made as sequels but were standalone films that later got retired as a cash in on the Zombi success. At the same time, if we’re counting remakes in this then that actually does start posing some tough questions. Because NotLD is in the public domain there are a lot of unofficial remakes and sequels and I wonder if actually should those count? Are we only considering the Romero directed films? What about proper remakes like Dawn of the Dead ‘04? Yeah this one’s trickier than I thought.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 13:40
|
|
|
I think its actually pretty simple. George Romero made 7 films under the "Dead" banner including the '90 remake. That's his franchise. Beyond that there's 3 categories I do not count. 1) Russo's Return series, which is legally complicated but pretty clearly its own thing. 2) The knockoffs like Zombi that have nothing to do with Romero's original. 3) A few more modern remakes and homages that clearly try and hold true to Romero's stuff in ways but really have nothing to do with him. Snyder/Gunn's Dawn, Night of the Living Dead 3D, or the animated one but none of them actually involve Romero so I think its pretty easy for me to draw the line. 3) probably would have been a "small council" debate if we had gone that route but given how Romero made 7 films I think its only fair that its his franchise and that other stuff don't count.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 14:04
|
|
|
I think it's a little unfair to other franchises to get too precious with the Romero Living Dead films. I'm fine ignoring 3D because it borders on a fan film, but Snyder Dawn absolutely should count. Even if you don't care for it, it's a thoughtful remake in that it takes the premise of the original and actively reworks it. The wet fart Day of the Dead remake also probably counts.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 15:10
|
|
|
I actually really like the Snyder/Gunn Dawn. I just think there's one place to draw a really easy line that doesn't feel arbitrary or driven by personal tastes. I definitely don't think I'm helping the NotLD entry by discounting Snyder's Dawn or 3D but counting Diary and Survival of the Dead. But those are the Romero films so that's how I'm judging it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 15:22
|
|
|
I mean, NotLD is so tricky where we draw the line. This video bears posting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZoqZxgw7HU
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 16:48
|
|
|
I was similarly torn between Alien and Re-Animator. I think objectively Alien deserves it, but I voted with my heart and went Re-Animator in solemn remembrance of Stuart Gordon and also because I just love it a ton. There is something to be said about it being a pure horror franchise where the Alien movies swing more scifi and action.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 17:04
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:I think its actually pretty simple. George Romero made 7 films under the "Dead" banner including the '90 remake. That's his franchise. Beyond that there's 3 categories I do not count. I don't think you can use the authorship as the justification in what to include because so many of these series don't have consistent authors at the helm throughout them. I've been counting reboot attempts so far for things like F13, Halloween, and Nightmare. I feel like a franchise means anything bearing those names. I also am probably with you on not including Zombi 2-5 though. Since the connection is pretty nonexistent.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 17:43
|
|
|
Sarx posted:I don't think you can use the authorship as the justification in what to include because so many of these series don't have consistent authors at the helm throughout them. I think NotLD is a unique case because its public domain and for whatever reason we consider all these blatant knockoffs part of the conversation. Like Zombi shouldn't even be in question to me. It had nothing to do with NotLD, it was just a cheap advertising thing. That's like counting Asylum knockoffs as part of franchises. And similarly a lot of those modern "Night of the Living Dead X" things are essentially fan films that get to be released under the name because of the public domain thing. We're not counting weird rear end Jason knockoffs or homages to his franchise. I mean, if people want to count the Dawn and Day remakes on the grounds that they're "official" then I can't fight that. But I think they stick out like a sore thumb next to the 7 Romero films and its basically putting a studio's ownership rights over any kind of creative or story connection. Which like... ok, but I don't like it myself. And again, I like Snyder's Dawn. I just don't consider it remotely a sequel to Night of the Living Dead in any way, shape, or form.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 18:07
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:And similarly a lot of those modern "Night of the Living Dead X" things are essentially fan films that get to be released under the name because of the public domain thing. We're not counting weird rear end Jason knockoffs or homages to his franchise. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rM98xWLARPc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59Ecif8DsGc
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 18:23
|
|
|
I'll say that you can count all of the z-grade NotLD ripoffs as long you're willing to watch them all, and report back with proof.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 18:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 15:01 |
|
|
STAC Goat posted:Aliens vs Re-Animator is the tough one for me. Aliens is unquestionably my preferred franchise, but Re-Animator feels like the truer horror. Re-Animator is a horror comedy.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 18:45
|
|
