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SoftNum posted:The only game of that era that doesn't get consistently poo poo on by the board game haute bourgeoisie is Carc and I don't know why: Carc is one of only 2 of my early games in the hobby that I still really like (the other being Agricola) but we mostly play 2p with only the River and Abbot expansions. Our games usually devolve into a lot of playing chicken on various scoring opportunities and it makes nearly every turn engaging. Sure you still get the throwaway tile draws sometimes, but that really is part of the game in that it forces map expansion and opens more opportunities for all players.
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Apr 12, 2020 17:19
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Samurai is likely the better alternative to Carc. At first I'm tempted to say T&E, but I think Samurai's usage of influence is closer to Carc's majority scoring.
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Apr 12, 2020 17:22
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There are definite similarities of the game of chicken present in all three, same with Blue Lagoon. Especially at 3 and 4 you quickly realize your tokens are headed to a standoff with 1-2 other players and someone is getting cut off.
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Apr 12, 2020 17:29
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I would say Go, T&E, and Hive are all similar, depending on which aspects of the game you are prioritizing. Go in particular has the trading of tempo across different battlefields you are describing. e: And as far as some number of your turns (I would argue about half) being just expanding the map is fair, it makes the game go and I agree.. but it's like being the cave in Vast at that point. And it's still not super interesting. Also in 3+ it makes for some forced kingmaking in a lot of positions (but tbf most people don't try and defend carc as anything except a 2p experence) SoftNum fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Apr 12, 2020 |
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Apr 12, 2020 17:34
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Chill la Chill posted:When a friend asks you to get some lunch and says they want to get McDonald's, is it wrong to suggest an alternative burger place that has much better quality? How about a better film than the latest disney marvel release? There's this idea that no game is better than a bad game, and it's perfectly fine to refuse an offer to play CAH or Catan when you can think of better alternatives. So what you're saying is that what you want out of lunch is more important than what they want? I mean, sometimes I really want McDonalds' fries. (In fact, lemme get two large fries at this drive-thru. Gotta keep my strength up!) They're almost the perfect combination of grease, sugar, salt, and carbs. And you basically cannot get them anywhere else, nor can you feasibly make them at home. The tools required* to make those particular fries just aren't really publically available, nor really worth it when you can just, you know, roll on over to the restaurant. It is perfectly fine to refuse to play a given game if you don't want to, but often the game itself isn't really the reason you're being invited and judging your participation on your perception of the game's quality...Well, anyway. I guess my point is that no, the idea that 'no game is inherently better than a bad game' is both pretentious and shortsighted. Games in general aren't solitary experiences, even solo games. Why else would we be compelled to share our experiences if not for wanting that social component that board games in particular excel at? To discount it entirely seems...counterproductive. Even when assessing a game's quality, despite there not being a great numerical or measurable way to express it. * - they're double-blanched, for one, and mostly cooked before they ever hit the fryer. The caramelization of the sugar in the second blanch is part of what makes them more consistently crispy and for longer than other fries and especially the ones you make at home. But I digress.
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Apr 12, 2020 17:42
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Just eat KFC instead.
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Apr 12, 2020 18:17
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Carc pro tip: draw a new tile at the end of your turn instead of the beginning. Less downtime, better knowledge of alternatives if your planned spot gets stolen.
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Apr 12, 2020 18:20
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these analogies about fast food suck
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Apr 12, 2020 18:29
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Snooze Cruise posted:these analogies about fast food suck like soda through a straw
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Apr 12, 2020 18:47
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Infinitum posted:I'll trade you a Sheep for these 2 screenshots Unless there is a deluxe version that i'm not aware of, that board is 100% product of the TTS mod and is not included in the game. The game itself is fine but without any extra cards it's entirely to easy for the marshal to win. The fugitive is heavily reliant on bluffing but resources are to hard to come by to bluff enough. Meanwhile all the marshal has to do is just keep draw from the middle pile before the fugitive is even close and will severally limit the fugitive's option. Losem fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Apr 12, 2020 |
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Apr 12, 2020 18:54
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Redundant posted:Game night tomorrow is looking like it will be Catan. I've somehow never bothered to play it despite it being a "timeless classic", and I'm not entirely convinced it will stand up to more modern games which have refined their systems, but my friends deal with my more outlandish gaming suggestions so I can take my medicine and roll some dice to get some resources (or maybe not). Definitely worth playing just so you can see what the fuss was/is about. It isn't horrible by any stretch but can drag at times and is prone to spiteful non-trades when people feel jilted. And then when people get mean about the robber... I get a Catan craving every now and then.
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Apr 12, 2020 18:55
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SoftNum posted:The only game of that era that doesn't get consistently poo poo on by the board game haute bourgeoisie is Carc I also don't get the appeal of Carcassonne, but there's plenty of other games from early board game times that I still love and would play anytime: Ra, T&E, Caylus, Puerto Rico, Power Grid, El Grande. I think most of these are also considered good to great by the wider polity of boardgaming. Fart Car '97 posted:5-6 player catan has a rule that states that every player has the opportunity to build at the end of a turn, before the next turn begins, precisely to avoid the scenario you described. People's complaints about getting unlucky with dice, or being that one guy that gets hosed are completely valid. But you all just didn't read the rules. Yeah, this explains a lot. I was taught the game, I never actually read the rules, but that's how it's been played forever at my LGS. Probably a Monopoly type situation where everyone learned to play from someone else without reading the rules and it just stuck. FWIW, I've also played with 4p game and still don't like it.
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Apr 12, 2020 18:58
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silvergoose posted:like soda through a straw Lol
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Apr 12, 2020 19:02
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Ojetor posted:I also don't get the appeal of Carcassonne, but there's plenty of other games from early board game times that I still love and would play anytime: Ra, T&E, Caylus, Puerto Rico, Power Grid, El Grande. I think most of these are also considered good to great by the wider polity of boardgaming. I forget Ra and T&E are as old as they are so those are good points. IDK if Caylus counts since it's pretty far after the rest of those. I never hear about El Grande so IDK what to make of it. And people poo poo on Puerto Rico and Power Grid like all the time, which is partially my frustration cause I love Power Grid and people are like "but maaaaaaath". (FWIW imo there's no reason to play puerto rico since rftg and san juan and 'grick and such exist.)
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Apr 12, 2020 19:09
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Carcassonne's only saving grace is that it's relatively short so you can power through a round of it to indulge your friends who have invested in memorizing the entire tile bank and then play a better game afterward.
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Apr 12, 2020 19:12
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SoftNum posted:I never hear about El Grande so IDK what to make of it. Many people still consider it best in class for area control/majority but like many of the old classics it has pretty strict player count requirements.
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Apr 12, 2020 19:16
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El Grande is still one of the best pure area majority games. Carcassonne is still a good intro game because it has so few rules. It's about as rules heavy than Kingdomino.
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Apr 12, 2020 19:16
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The strangest thing about Catan, beyond its endurance, is that there are tournaments of it. Tournaments! How? Why? Who? Etc?
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Apr 12, 2020 19:39
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Mojo Jojo posted:The strangest thing about Catan, beyond its endurance, is that there are tournaments of it. Tournaments! How? Why? Who? Etc?  There are tournaments for Monopoly and Rock Paper Scissors, so nothing surprises me.
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Apr 12, 2020 19:55
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food court bailiff posted:Carcassonne's only saving grace is that it's relatively short so you can power through a round of it to indulge your friends who have invested in memorizing the entire tile bank and then play a better game afterward. I find the Carc iPad app that shows that tile bank to be pretty solid, I've binged it on flights before. Makes it way more cut throat.
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Apr 12, 2020 19:57
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Chill la Chill posted:When a friend asks you to get some lunch and says they want to get McDonald's, is it wrong to suggest an alternative burger place that has much better quality? How about a better film than the latest disney marvel release? There's this idea that no game is better than a bad game, and it's perfectly fine to refuse an offer to play CAH or Catan when you can think of better alternatives. Counter-proposing a better X when someone is trying to invite you to a specifically chosen activity is incredibly presumptuous and rude between anything other than close friends. If you don't like McDonald's, the graceful response is "No thanks."
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Apr 12, 2020 20:31
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Infinitum posted:I'll trade you a Sheep for these 2 screenshots Can you link the workshop pages for these two games?
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Apr 12, 2020 20:59
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SoftNum posted:(FWIW imo there's no reason to play puerto rico since rftg and san juan and 'grick and such exist.) That being said Puerto Rico has bad issues with seating order imbalance, and auctioning off seating order only exacerbates the bigger issue of varied skill levels affecting how the game plays out (if there is a lower skill player at the table, the person downstream from them will almost certainly win). But if you’re exploring with a consistent group over repeated plays, it still totally has a place IMO.
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Apr 12, 2020 21:10
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Magnetic North posted:
There's an esports version of Farming Simulator now. There's no more surprises to be had.
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Apr 12, 2020 21:35
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Playing Catan was fine, I made some bad early decisions in the first game (terrible second settlement placement) which cost me dearly but I managed to drag it back to second place. Second game was closer but some sketchy trading gave the one experienced player a runaway lead and the game ended fairly early. I can see how it drew a lot of people to the hobby but can also appreciate that it has been surpassed by other games. It was still a fun and enjoyable experience with friends and a casual way of spending a lockdown evening. We're a group of friends so I'm not going to poo poo on their choices or refuse to play (unless it's CAH, then maybe I will politely decline) since I'm more interested in chatting to them and the game is just the facilitator for that. Next time I will make the choice and I expect them same sort of acceptance from them even if they think it's a bit heavy/thinky. Compromises aren't the end of the world and Catan is still a pretty good game.
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Apr 12, 2020 22:43
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CAH is worse than Catan by a lot, it has many sins and among the worst is how it only ends when a majority of the group gets bored of it which, depending on how drunk everyone is, can be a long, long time after the first person gets bored of it
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Apr 12, 2020 22:54
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CAH is barely a game, but at least Catan doesn't have "ironic" racism
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Apr 12, 2020 22:58
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canyoneer posted:CAH is barely a game, but at least Catan doesn't have "ironic" racism Instead it has veiled racism via colonialism?
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Apr 12, 2020 22:59
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silvergoose posted:Instead it has veiled racism via colonialism? The puerto rico post is a few posts up hth.
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Apr 12, 2020 23:10
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silvergoose posted:Instead it has veiled racism via colonialism? It's not explicit, just heavily implied!  I'm getting dragged by a bunch of brain geniuses on Facebook right now for saying that CAH is a garbage game for garbage people. Someone suggested that the game is only racist if you play it with racist people, which is a pretty interesting take for a game that includes Holocaust references and a "big black dick" card
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Apr 12, 2020 23:19
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canyoneer posted:It's not explicit, just heavily implied! Even if you ignore the more problematic aspects of CAH, it's still just apples to apples where you don't get to write the jokes. The punchlines are in the game. You don't get to be funny, it's funny for you.
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Apr 12, 2020 23:23
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SoftNum posted:The puerto rico post is a few posts up hth. I mean that's less veiled. canyoneer posted:It's not explicit, just heavily implied! Yeah I basically meant heavily implied by "veiled".
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Apr 12, 2020 23:35
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canyoneer posted:CAH is barely a game, but at least Catan doesn't have "ironic" racism
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Apr 12, 2020 23:43
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Just played my first 4p game of root, on TTS - Cats, Birds (me), Alliance, and Otters. Alliance won, but everyone else was 1 turn from victory. Every game I had played before that was 2p. Jesus that's a good 4p game.
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Apr 13, 2020 00:12
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I prefer Onion Rings.
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Apr 13, 2020 00:19
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That reminds me. Do any of you Root players prefer to play as Vagabond? I don't think that I've seen anyone who plays as or against it.
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Apr 13, 2020 00:23
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Trying to compare lunch with playing a board game is super dumb.
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Apr 13, 2020 00:24
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CommonShore posted:Just played my first 4p game of root, on TTS - Cats, Birds (me), Alliance, and Otters. Alliance won, but everyone else was 1 turn from victory. Every game I had played before that was 2p. Now do it again with Moles instead of Cats! Best mix I've played so far. Shadow225 posted:That reminds me. Do any of you Root players prefer to play as Vagabond? I don't think that I've seen anyone who plays as or against it. One of our players likes it because she likes to go low conflict with heavy questing and gifting players cards for items. She always waits until really late game to stab someone and it's pretty good. We don't mind the Vagabond like many seem to (beyond me thinking he's boring to have in the game compared to other factions). Bottom Liner fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Apr 13, 2020 |
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Apr 13, 2020 00:25
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silvergoose posted:Instead it has veiled racism via colonialism? The island in catan has no indigenous population. Pretty sure it's hard to be racist against an uninhabited island.
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Apr 13, 2020 01:32
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CRISPYBABY posted:It's kinda funny that you can just assume any "classic" (pre bg boom) game is bad and it usually works. I know exactly what you mean, and although it's literally all I bang on about in this thread, it really does make Dune all that more impressive!
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Apr 13, 2020 01:42
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