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I don't find it hard to believe that they're taking containment seriously now. Everyone I know in China has experienced quarantine and screenings. I don't believe they've eliminated it, and it doesn't excuse the initial fuckups, but trying to keep it under control? Sure.
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Apr 16, 2020 23:28
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It comes back to lying. Management want low numbers, lying is the easiest way. When has China ever been seriously honest with itself let alone the outside world. Assume guilty until found innocent. They did this to themselves.
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Apr 16, 2020 23:47
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I honestly don't know what point you're trying to make. That they're not doing anything at all? They clearly are, unless you think every single China expat is a tankie lying about their tests and quarantines. If your point is just that their claim of no more corona cases is false, well, yeah. Nobody here is arguing with that, it's obvious.
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Apr 16, 2020 23:51
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Grand Fromage posted:I honestly don't know what point you're trying to make. When you lie constantly and unapologetically people are going to begin to assume that you are always lying even if you are telling the truth. This is literally an Aesop moral and it 100% applies to the CCP
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Apr 17, 2020 00:01
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It seems China's online Moron squads gotten out of control and is running amok on Euro social media. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/15/france-summons-chinese-envoy-after-coronavirus-slur
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Apr 17, 2020 00:03
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No it not that they aren't doing anything, it's easy to imagine a good chunk of it is security theatre. Are the tests actually being done or are they getting thrown out. Are the tests reliable? Are the reported numbers anywhere close to the truth? Do the people they drag off even infected? Which test are they using? I am not saying the ex pats are lying. What they see and what might actually be happening are two different things. This is what happens in an environment of zero trust.
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Apr 17, 2020 00:03
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BrainDance posted:You're a fool for using an OS where that's even a thing, especially if you're in a place like China. gently caress that bullshit. It's very unlikely that anyone but a professional can maintain information security in China over long periods. And even if you do use entirely self-imported, carefully-selected hardware and software, over an actually-secure VPN, from a secure location, then all you're going to do is trip some "srs bsns" notification somewhere, and get a visit. Because I can't imagine there would be more than a few dozen non-diplomatic staff in China with the ability and motivation to pull that off, and they're either criminals or spies or a bit obsessed, and those categories are collectively small enough and worrying enough to be worth a visit.
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Apr 17, 2020 01:51
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Grand Fromage posted:I honestly don't know what point you're trying to make. That they're not doing anything at all? They clearly are, unless you think every single China expat is a tankie lying about their tests and quarantines. If your point is just that their claim of no more corona cases is false, well, yeah. Nobody here is arguing with that, it's obvious. yea i regard blistex as a pretty level headed guy who just shares the word on the street from his relatives and old friends, guy has no reason to bullshit us trying to make china look good. i don't doubt they're happening and that the prc really does want to resolve a problem that's causing a trouble for their ruling authority. whether or not these ground level efforts are being done with a touch of 差不多 remains to be seen
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Apr 17, 2020 02:29
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Blistex posted:This is just my opinion, but the fact that Jilin City of all places is getting this kind of treatment is telling that Xi is serious right now you probably don't want to be the official that derails his plans. If China is getting the kind of results that I think they are, then they're poised to get a big head start over the US and a lot of other nations, and be in a position to make big gains. Hell, this might end up working out for them in the end, as it's hitting their olds the hardest, people that their kids and the state no longer have to care for, and that frees up a lot of money to go to more useful places. Shumagorath fucked around with this message at 02:38 on Apr 17, 2020 |
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Apr 17, 2020 02:29
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Shumagorath posted:What kind of head start would they be able to get with no other markets available to buy their stuff? Or is it just the case of some domestic consumption being better than none at all? China has plenty of domestic demand to meet too. Judging by the air pollution a lot of the factories are definitely running again.
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Apr 17, 2020 02:32
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oohhboy posted:No it not that they aren't doing anything, it's easy to imagine a good chunk of it is security theatre. Are the tests actually being done or are they getting thrown out. Are the tests reliable? Are the reported numbers anywhere close to the truth? Do the people they drag off even infected? Which test are they using? Thanks oohhboy, this is what I was trying to convey with my smartass comment to Blistex, nothing more. Now post that suit.
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Apr 17, 2020 02:43
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I miss when these threads were mostly funny china poo poo instead of scary china poo poo
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Apr 17, 2020 02:52
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d0s posted:I miss when these threads were mostly funny china poo poo instead of scary china poo poo Classic comedy from a simpler time.
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Apr 17, 2020 02:55
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Atopian posted:It's very unlikely that anyone but a professional can maintain information security in China over long periods. You're not hiding from governments even in America. Maybe especially not in America. That's uncomfortable but unnecessary to worry about for the majority of people (and I wouldn't be doing the expat thing if you did need to, basically because of what you said). That's not the threat. The paranoid part of me does think local police while travelling are kind of a threat, though. Today it's sketchy app that gets installed on your phone for checking out Urumqi, tomorrow it's sketchy spyware on your laptop you travel with. Similar things can already happen crossing borders between western countries. I also kind of suspect that if that ends up happening they aren't going invest much time in targeting anything besides Windows. Then you end up with a cop who doesn't care/know all that much and an 'I dunno man, it's a weird computer!' But I'm not gonna die on the 'this is definitely gonna happen' hill. But you are not going to toss up any red flags practicing some basic security and not using Windows. Huawei is a major contributor the the Linux Kernel, there are plenty of Debian contributors in China, etc etc. The point is, Windows is still for suckers.
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Apr 17, 2020 02:56
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Your choice of OS doesn't matter if you end up getting questioned in the land of No Why. It barely matters in the west.
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Apr 17, 2020 03:01
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Now would be a great time for Haier to come back.
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Apr 17, 2020 03:31
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Sounds like CCP dealing internally with alot of power vacuums atm
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Apr 17, 2020 03:33
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The CCP is well-known for sucking.
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Apr 17, 2020 03:47
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Here is a question only very slightly related to CCP lies: What is the Chinese literacy rate? What are the official numbers? What are the real numbers? Are those official numbers only for Mandarin? What about Cantonese? What about all the other regional languages? I ask because one of Cuba, (another bunch of filty commos) greatest boasts is it's 98% literacy rate. And surely the CCP would not allow itself to not be the bestest and cleverest communist nation in the world would it?
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Apr 17, 2020 04:12
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Bring back the sexpat posting about wandering around drinking half n half being bloated and his extreme disregard for other humans
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Apr 17, 2020 04:18
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Shumagorath posted:Your choice of OS doesn't matter if you end up getting questioned in the land of No Why. It barely matters in the west. "Ah hah, I'll use this obscure Linux distro!" /Has computer seized by random bored cop, never sees it again/ Please note this applies to drat near any country now.
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Apr 17, 2020 04:27
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Shumagorath posted:What kind of head start would they be able to get with no other markets available to buy their stuff? Or is it just the case of some domestic consumption being better than none at all? Cutting off the potential for other nations to establish, and then completely move to domestic or outsourced (not Chinese) production. One of these industries that I'm sure they don't want to see start up is the PPE sector. If they can meet demand, with an accepted standard of quality (not the scam company stuff) and still undercut everyone, then they might not have to worry about countries like Spain or Brazil or the UK starting their own factories to compete. Also getting domestic production/consumption up and running gets them a head start to start using their money to buy foreign interests that are in tough financial straits. Maybe that company that's sitting on some tech they have wanted for a while is ripe for the This is just speculation, but I want to reiterate that I am not championing China, just relaying what my family (in China) is saying. The White Dragon posted:whether or not these ground level efforts are being done with a touch of 差不多 remains to be seen My father in law actually knows people who have been taken (after being tested and showing Covid) to a nearby (previously closed, but now reopened) hospital in Futia. They were there for the better part of a month before being released. Back then it was just the temperature test, and wait for symptoms to show up before confirming, so he is inclined to believe that efforts in his area are legit. Now everyone in essential or going near essential workers and infrastructure gets a nose swab. Since his old nickel mine that he retired from a few years back is deemed essential, hundreds of miners are tested (nose swab) then housed in the (previously closed, but now re-purposed elementary school) and they have not seen their families in nearly a month. I'm not saying that there isn't some number fudging going on, but from what I have heard (like I said before) I can totally see the current curve in China being legit (but maybe a few thousand higher).
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Apr 17, 2020 04:50
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I don't think countries are going to change their minds back about PPE; that's now the national security concern it always should have been, and even our dullard premier sees that as a way to repatriate manufacturing. China will be lucky to hold onto other industries critical to western economies and avoid becoming the next Soviet Union. I personally think we're headed for a second Cold War; not one with a threat of nuclear exchange but two divided global markets with incompatible technological standards.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:02
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I'm not sure about major economic shifts away from outsourced manufacturing, but stuff like pharmaceuticals and medical PPE being manufactured locally is probably going to happen, at least to a degree. It may spur other things though, there was already a shift in some sectors that had automated so much that it was cheaper to build robot factories at home than continue manufacturing in China. My understanding is that's true for a fair amount of manufacturing now but since the supply chains and groundwork were already established in China, they just couldn't be bothered uprooting all that. This might encourage it. Ultimately whatever makes the company owners the most money is what they'll do, but if they were looking for an excuse to get out of China, they have a great one now.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:06
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I can't remember where I read it (probably CBC) but companies are finally looking at alternate sources for rare earth metals. If something that low-margin is up for review, manufacturing isn't a stretch. I'm probably too optimistic believing companies will stop thinking "well everyone else gets totally hosed by 51% control and mandatory IP sharing, BUT WE WILL BE DIFFERENT AND GET OUR NEXT BILLION CUSTOMERS!" Edit: I mean for gently caress's sake I used to be a just-in-time shopper because I lived a few blocks from a 24/7 grocer that closed maybe five days a year, and I'm never going to operate like that again. Shumagorath fucked around with this message at 05:14 on Apr 17, 2020 |
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Apr 17, 2020 05:11
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People are certainly realising that the global economy is based around everything working perfectly and cannot handle anything going wrong - which is why I never liked just-in-time manufacturing in the first place.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:12
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Grand Fromage posted:Ultimately whatever makes the company owners the most money is what they'll do, but if they were looking for an excuse to get out of China, they have a great one now. This is what I'm thinking, but not in the hopeful way. I can see the majority of production staying in China if they rebound fast enough and keep the price low, as it all comes down to the shareholders, and whatever makes them the most money this fiscal quarter is what's going to happen.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:19
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Megillah Gorilla posted:People are certainly realising that the global economy is based around everything working perfectly and cannot handle anything going wrong - which is why I never liked just-in-time manufacturing in the first place. Yeah I think just in time manufacturing is done, or at least going to be heavily modified. Turns out building every single system on the assumption that A) nothing ever breaks and B) you can trim the redundancy and run everything at 99% capacity all the time wasn't the best idea, who could have imagined.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:22
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Moonshine Rhyme posted:Bring back the sexpat posting about wandering around drinking half n half being bloated and his extreme disregard for other humans R Guyovich ate a permaban tho
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Apr 17, 2020 05:26
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WarpedNaba posted:R Guyovich ate a permaban tho LOL, like that tankie ever had sex.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:30
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I would've more cast doubt on whether he ever left his house, much less his country.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:47
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China doesn't really have a sustainable Rare Earth monopoly. Rare Earth can be found just about anywhere, it's not rare like precious metals are. The problem is it is diffuse rather than concentrated in veins. So you find a place with slightly higher concentrations and dig it all up, process a heck of a lot of tonnes and dump the absolutely toxic useless mess somewhere. China being China doesn't care about pollution so it's production doesn't have the environmental cost factored in. https://geology.com/articles/rare-earth-elements/ When China drove up the price it made outside mines viable again.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:47
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This argument about whether china is at fault for the United States corona virus outbreak reminds me of the second sino japanese war. In the late 19th century china had the most powerful modern fleet Of any east Asian Nation.The government Raised a large sum of money for expanding and operating that fleet. The Empress Embezzled the entire sums And used it to Expand the winter palace instead.Training and supply for the fleet was cut To the bone.The story goes that they couldn't even afford real shells. They purchased concrete filled training shells so the crews could practice loading and unloading the guns. When the japanese attacked The Chinese navy was still More powerful on paper. But those battleships steamed out Still with Dummy artillery shells and poorly trained crews. The japanese sank the whole fleet over the course of 2 days.
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Apr 17, 2020 05:55
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Arglebargle III posted:MY GIMMICK IS POSTING GIBBERISH
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Apr 17, 2020 06:07
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Blistex posted:LOL, like that tankie ever had sex. I dunno, he hosed plenty of goons in his time.
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Apr 17, 2020 06:56
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Marcade posted:I dunno, he hosed plenty of goons in his time. 
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Apr 17, 2020 07:09
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Shumagorath posted:I can't remember where I read it (probably CBC) but companies are finally looking at alternate sources for rare earth metals. seafloor of japan pacific ocean side lol
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Apr 17, 2020 07:33
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I would blow Dane Cook posted:Now would be a great time for Haier to come back. "I come back to you, now, at the turn of the tide"
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Apr 17, 2020 11:11
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The point is, whose fault was it that the fleet sank? The empress blamed the Japanese and the admirals and the sailors.
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Apr 17, 2020 13:42
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Arglebargle III posted:The point is, whose fault was it that the fleet sank? The empress blamed the Japanese and the admirals and the sailors. It was the cold water, not good for hullty
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Apr 17, 2020 13:56
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