Dwarf Fortress: The child punches the cave spider in the thorax, bruising the brain!

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Dwarf Fortress: The child punches the cave spider in the thorax, bruising the brain!

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Lawman 0: Aug 17, 2010

Zesty posted:

From the Kitfox Discord. For those not in the know, Mayday was hired by them to do some of the art. Not putting it in a giant quote so you can quote pieces of it if you like.

~~~ Quote Mayday

Time is still as subjective as ever
But I gotta say, that Toady's initial coding went much faster than I expected

SOMEONE ELSE: Figured out how to do the mine track ramps?

it's... not a great situation, my dude :smile:
let me show you

If you're interested, I'm working on an issue:

Do you think any tile will fit better than 21?
I already know what would be the "perfect" solution for it, but like I said, I don't want to keep expanding this ramp set -_-

I hope we can get more distinct differentiation between z-levels
my old mockup:

Sneak peek of multilevel in its current early stage.

Hooting, hollering at that multilevel

# ? Apr 1, 2020 00:44

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# ? May 19, 2024 00:45

Freakazoid_: Jul 5, 2013; Buglord

Zesty posted:

Sneak peek of multilevel in its current early stage.

# ? Apr 1, 2020 02:40

Zesty: Jan 17, 2012; The Great Twist

In the monthly report, ThreeToe is hinting that UI is one of the main things being worked on.

# ? Apr 1, 2020 21:45

Scarodactyl: Oct 22, 2015

Dear Mike Mayday,
It's been almost ten years, but I haven't forgotten.

It's time to Put. Them. In!

...OK actually maybe don't it's been ten years and they don't look so good anymore. I still like the plump helmetman though!

Scarodactyl fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Apr 1, 2020

# ? Apr 1, 2020 22:51

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

Scarodactyl posted:

...OK actually maybe don't it's been ten years and they don't look so good anymore

WRONG

# ? Apr 1, 2020 22:58

Schwarzwald: Jul 27, 2004; Don't Blink

Scarodactyl posted:

...OK actually maybe don't it's been ten years and they don't look so good anymore.

might want to fact check that one, chief

# ? Apr 1, 2020 23:38

Zesty: Jan 17, 2012; The Great Twist

Future of the Fortress is its usual boring mess of people asking about bugs and possible future features and Toady replying "Yeah, those are bugs and possible future features."

Here are the only vaguely interesting questions:

Will the premium release allow entities to appear to move smoothly between tiles?
I can't commit to that now or even say that it is likely. We're thinking about it, and there are various issues, but it is possible.

Are there any plans for expanding the animation of tiles? Similar to water flowing downstream or waves crashing on the beach in the current versions.
We have a few tests tiles here and there, but as with other (relatively) ambitious features we'll have to see how it turns out, and we won't be able to commit until we actually post stuff on the dev log, case-by-case.

:tootzzz:

# ? Apr 2, 2020 00:28

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

I had a kobold thief sneak in and try to steal a legendary hematite scepter that I lazily left in the trade stockpile. I have two entrances, one normal one with two 18x3x1 pits with drawbridges over them, the other one looks like a Saw/Takeshi's Castle crossover.

I hit the bridge lever to cut off the kobold and force him to use the other tunnel, where my axedwarves will wait in ambush, but guess what dumbass skimped out and used poor quality mechanisms on his vitally important security system! :suicide:

The kobold gets past the first bridge just as the military gets on the scene, one plucky recruit dashes out after the kobold, but just as the kobold nearly passes the second bridge, the mechanisms FINALLY latch, and the bridge hurls upward, turning the kobold into a fine mist and a pool of blood.

The recruit also fell and injured his arm, but laying a few tiles away soaked in blood was the hematite scepter perfectly unharmed. He didnt do all that much but the barracks are getting some solid gold weapon stands in honour of his spirit

# ? Apr 7, 2020 19:25

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

Will sieges ever break on their own? There's no way I can stand up to this zombie army right now and I'm starting to feel bad for all the passing bards and pilgrims that they're slaughtering.

# ? Apr 7, 2020 21:16

scamtank: Feb 24, 2011; my desire to just be a FUCKING IDIOT all day long is rapidly overtaking my ability to FUNCTION

i suspect that means i'm MENTALLY ILL

Danaru posted:

I had a kobold thief sneak in and try to steal a legendary hematite scepter that I lazily left in the trade stockpile. I have two entrances, one normal one with two 18x3x1 pits with drawbridges over them, the other one looks like a Saw/Takeshi's Castle crossover.

I hit the bridge lever to cut off the kobold and force him to use the other tunnel, where my axedwarves will wait in ambush, but guess what dumbass skimped out and used poor quality mechanisms on his vitally important security system!

The kobold gets past the first bridge just as the military gets on the scene, one plucky recruit dashes out after the kobold, but just as the kobold nearly passes the second bridge, the mechanisms FINALLY latch, and the bridge hurls upward, turning the kobold into a fine mist and a pool of blood.

The recruit also fell and injured his arm, but laying a few tiles away soaked in blood was the hematite scepter perfectly unharmed. He didnt do all that much but the barracks are getting some solid gold weapon stands in honour of his spirit

5/5 story, thank U for sharing

# ? Apr 7, 2020 21:35

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

Started a new map and saw I had sandy clay, hell yeah infinite spikes and pots! :toot:

then after a quick lookup, sandy clay only counts as clay. Well at least I still get the pots.

Then I realized it was sandy clay loam, meaning I have nothing but disappointment :cripes:

at least the woods are dummy thicc so it's not like I cant just churn out barrels instead

# ? Apr 9, 2020 13:51

Zesty: Jan 17, 2012; The Great Twist

Devlog

quote:

As many of you know (and often already sort out with mods and so forth), the hills in DF can be confusing, especially when they are steep. Not just because of the ramps, which we showed you with the last set of pictures, but just wrapping your head around the three-dimensional map can be a bit much when it only shows you a cross-section at a time.

Here's a lot of what we've been working on recently. There have been additional attempts to sort out a few of the minor issues you see there with soil-edge-shading and so forth, and work is ongoing, but this helps a lot already!

Flashy Gif

Ha ha, here's a dev log foray into animated media, scrolling down a few levels.

Those images take place in deserts since our work on vegetation is in flux. We'll be able to show some pictures there later when it is ready.

We're experimenting with transparency for planned furniture. Here are two similar bedrooms.

Even in the new display, as some people noted last time with the domestic animals, we can't show the exact size of creatures - there's just not enough room in the tiles. However, we can bend the constraints of tiles a bit, as we did with workshops. Our currently specifications allow creatures like dragons to visually occupy most of six tiles (three wide, two tall), though the game logic is still the same (creatures are in one tile, sometimes many creatures.)

More great work from our artists! More to see next week! I hope all is well.

Zesty fucked around with this message at 08:19 on Apr 10, 2020

# ? Apr 10, 2020 00:07

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

A few questions about newer features, since I'm pretty sure the last version I played was 40d :shepface:

-How important are guildhalls? I'm hesitating to accept guildhall petitions because the big "THIS PETITION HAS BEEN ABANDONED" makes me assume it either gave bad thoughts to dwarves or it blocked me off of something.
-Taverns. Is there any real downside to having a big tavern instead of a big meeting hall? (Also I like that the barkeep doles out drinks, and one of the peasants I figured was useless turned out to be a legendary musician :v:

)
-Is it worth it to bring a dwarf with good axing and teaching skills because seriously these losers have been practicing with axes for like a year now and only a few got past dabbling.
-Aquifers are pretty great now, not really a question but I remember them being annoying enough to rummage through an initial file to delete the tag from everything.
-Long shot, any chance I can assign a wheelbarrow to a workshop? Its excruciating watching my Mason lug a rock he found god knows where as haulers speed by him with other rocks to the stockpile beside the workshop with literally hundreds of rocks god DAMMIT Bomrek

# ? Apr 12, 2020 00:57

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

Taverns are great, they attract visitors which makes things more lively and fun. A bard that came for my tavern ended up becoming a permanent resident and despite being complete garbage at playing music he was a professional spearman which was cool. Interesting guy to be sure

# ? Apr 12, 2020 01:32

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

I like the monster hunters that show up, rent a room, explore and map the underground cave for me, then wind up in my corpse stockpile a week or so later :v:

We'll engrave a slab for you, buddy, thanks for finding all the hematite

# ? Apr 12, 2020 01:38

Shady Amish Terror: Oct 11, 2007; I'm not Amish by choice. 8(

I know a couple of these at least. I think.

Danaru posted:

-Taverns. Is there any real downside to having a big tavern instead of a big meeting hall?

Not really; it ties up your worker count some in staff and parties, but they generate good thoughts, attract interesting guests, and are borderline essential for keeping dwarves sane. Last I knew they were also the way to keep vampire forts functioning, since apparently dwarves might not get thirsty, but they'll still socially drink and benefit from the alcohol just fine. You can close off taverns to outside guests, even, if the visitors are a problem.

Danaru posted:

-Long shot, any chance I can assign a wheelbarrow to a workshop? Its excruciating watching my Mason lug a rock he found god knows where as haulers speed by him with other rocks to the stockpile beside the workshop with literally hundreds of rocks god DAMMIT Bomrek

Short answer, no, as far as I know resource gathering is still a problem you kind of have to work around manually. Dwarves look for resources in terms of absolute distance to the object before attempting pathfinding (and I don't think they even care about the z-axis during the initial search), so if you have a rock several levels down under the workshop, they'll go for that over the rock three steps away. The usual way to fix this is to be conscious of where work stations and resources are relative to the rest of the fort. You can either have workshops clustered around the center of the fort with stockpiles radiating out around them so that the nearest resource is nearly always in the stockpile between them and the rest of the fort, on average, workshops off to one otherwise unused side where the resources will always be in the stockpile between them and the rest of the fort, or workshops surrounded by stockpiles, which can be a little hit or miss but is the laziest option and therefor the one I usually choose.

The fancy way of solving this problem is to assign work burrows and individually permit or deny access to the surface or mines to dwarves based on their jobs, so you don't have masons running down to the magma forges for boulders, or whatever.

I believe the same problem also applies to food stores and is solved the same way; place raw ingredient stockpiles on the far side of the kitchens from the rest of the fort and prepared meals in the kitchen or near stockpiles will nearly always be closer, resulting in fewer 'tired of just eating raw plump helmets because I'm a moron' bad thoughts.

# ? Apr 12, 2020 03:03

Zesty: Jan 17, 2012; The Great Twist

More Mayday on Discord. Collection of messages, some paraphrased so you get the general idea but don't need to read a long rear end conversation.

Mayday posted:

I'm having a hard time with grasses
we're in a strong disagreement over what direction to take
this Stonesense screenshot show what I'm most afraid of

I feel like I should be looking for a solution that keeps the meadows muted, but still conveys the richness of the flowers
when you're dealing with a whole screen like that, to me it's a mess
But of course I want to have a good dose of variation
I don't believe in visual variation just for variation's sake
if it's detached from gameplay
It needs to look better
If you're adding visual variation that makes the game looks worse, then what's the point?
Of course I'm only talking about situations which don't impact gameplay

There are some ~30 types of grasses, I don't believe we can produce that many sprites of high quality, each with its own 4 variants

Here's the look I currently have, without all of Meph's variants

each grass is using one set of 4 sprites and heathers are using another set of 4

-

"It will be a job for the beetle generator" - Tarn Adams, 2020

-

And yes, the plan is to make the fog dark when underground

# ? Apr 12, 2020 21:40

Pickled Tink: Apr 28, 2012; Have you heard about First Dog? It's a very good comic I just love.

Also, wear your bike helmets kids. I copped several blows to the head but my helmet left me totally unscathed.

Finally you should check out First Dog as it's a good comic I like it very much.; Fun Shoe

Shady Amish Terror posted:

Short answer, no, as far as I know resource gathering is still a problem you kind of have to work around manually. Dwarves look for resources in terms of absolute distance to the object before attempting pathfinding (and I don't think they even care about the z-axis during the initial search), so if you have a rock several levels down under the workshop, they'll go for that over the rock three steps away. The usual way to fix this is to be conscious of where work stations and resources are relative to the rest of the fort. You can either have workshops clustered around the center of the fort with stockpiles radiating out around them so that the nearest resource is nearly always in the stockpile between them and the rest of the fort, on average, workshops off to one otherwise unused side where the resources will always be in the stockpile between them and the rest of the fort, or workshops surrounded by stockpiles, which can be a little hit or miss but is the laziest option and therefor the one I usually choose.

The fancy way of solving this problem is to assign work burrows and individually permit or deny access to the surface or mines to dwarves based on their jobs, so you don't have masons running down to the magma forges for boulders, or whatever.

I believe the same problem also applies to food stores and is solved the same way; place raw ingredient stockpiles on the far side of the kitchens from the rest of the fort and prepared meals in the kitchen or near stockpiles will nearly always be closer, resulting in fewer 'tired of just eating raw plump helmets because I'm a moron' bad thoughts.

Last I played, which was a very long time ago mind you, you could set stockpiles to feed other stockpiles. So you'd have one stockpile set to take from anywhere, and you'd put it outside the work area but close-ish-by, and then place a second 3x3 or 5x5 stockpile linked to that first stockpile that only accepted from that first one, and install it either one z above or below the workshop with a stairwell leading directly to it. I believe you could also specify that the the workshop only draws from specific stockpiles, but it has been a very long time for me.

# ? Apr 13, 2020 10:33

So Math: Jan 8, 2013; Ghostly Clothier

News! drat, those stockpiles look nice.

Toady One posted:

Happy birthday to me! And appropriately enough, here are our first procedural creature pictures.

As you can see here, they reflect a lot of what's going on in the descriptions (horn character and number, tail character and number, hairiness, skinlessness), but because we glue them together from parts that need to be reused, they don't reflect absolutely everything (joints, howling.) With their much greater diversity, depicting forgotten beasts and demons will require more forms and effort, but similar principles should work out.

Here's some additional detail for creatures - differentiation based on 'caste' information. Now more domestic animals can be distinguished by their images.

And finally, the next iteration on stockpiles. We're still working with these, and signage etc. for custom stockpiles in particular. As usual, we worked on some other things that aren't quite ready (more with trees, wagons, and so forth.)

Edit: Removed image leech :cripes:

So Math fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Apr 18, 2020

# ? Apr 17, 2020 23:54

TOOT BOOT: May 25, 2010

I was wondering how they'd deal with procedural creatures. They did more than I thought and I'm pretty okay if the graphics don't match the description too closely.

# ? Apr 18, 2020 00:06

counterfeitsaint: Feb 26, 2010; I'm a girl, and you're
gnomes, and it's like
what? Yikes.

Sorry for making that post, but as I understand it, it's been a few weeks (months?) since the last big release, is lazynewbpack and all the essentials updated? And on a scale of "Inevitable existential dread" to "great fun" how playable is the latest version?

# ? Apr 18, 2020 00:16

scamtank: Feb 24, 2011; my desire to just be a FUCKING IDIOT all day long is rapidly overtaking my ability to FUNCTION

i suspect that means i'm MENTALLY ILL

counterfeitsaint posted:

Sorry for making that post, but as I understand it, it's been a few weeks (months?) since the last big release, is lazynewbpack and all the essentials updated? And on a scale of "Inevitable existential dread" to "great fun" how playable is the latest version?

peep dis

# ? Apr 18, 2020 01:27

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

scamtank posted:

peep dis

Holy poo poo tilesets have evolved over the years :vince:

# ? Apr 18, 2020 02:19

counterfeitsaint: Feb 26, 2010; I'm a girl, and you're
gnomes, and it's like
what? Yikes.

Danaru posted:

-Is it worth it to bring a dwarf with good axing and teaching skills because seriously these losers have been practicing with axes for like a year now and only a few got past dabbling.

Also I'm hoping this gets an answer because I've had this problem since danger rooms started busting everyone's joints up.

# ? Apr 18, 2020 05:33

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

counterfeitsaint posted:

Sorry for making that post, but as I understand it, it's been a few weeks (months?) since the last big release, is lazynewbpack and all the essentials updated? And on a scale of "Inevitable existential dread" to "great fun" how playable is the latest version?

I'm having a lot of fun, in my last fort one of my migrants was a necromancer and when another necromancer invaded and killed a bunch of my dwarves this necromancer just kept bringing them back. They didn't do anything though and died real easy so he was kind of a poo poo necromancer to be honest

# ? Apr 18, 2020 06:02

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

There are so many drat necromancers it's not even funny. Sometimes they just come into the bar to chill out, and when a fight breaks out they resurrect people as zombies. They don't cause trouble or anything they're just there

# ? Apr 18, 2020 06:05

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

LIke honestly if you're looking for dead bodies, yeah you could covertly start a massive war or go gravedigging, or just hang out with the dwarves because they die all the time and get some booze while you're at it.

# ? Apr 18, 2020 06:06

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

counterfeitsaint posted:

Also I'm hoping this gets an answer because I've had this problem since danger rooms started busting everyone's joints up.

just start a couple of dwarves training early on and when they're, like, legendary teacher/student/discipline throw some more dwarves at them until you have an army

the effects of these skills snowball extremely quickly once you have them in place, it's just the initial hump that's kind of slow

(and even then not really, you just have to plan ahead instead of going "oh god i need an army, time to start training one!")

# ? Apr 18, 2020 11:46

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

It just feels so wrong having a squad with less than ten people :saddowns:

# ? Apr 18, 2020 12:00

Comrade Koba: Jul 2, 2007

I could never get the hang of training, so I usually just settle with making a large tavern and wait for military dudes to show up and petition for citizenship (which usually doesn't take long), then I just put them in squads. Are there any drawbacks to this apart from not getting to choose which types of soldiers I get and being unable to assign them to non-military duties?

# ? Apr 18, 2020 12:46

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

It's not a bad idea but once you figure out the magical button combination that actually gets your dwarves to start training (I genuinely forget what it is offhand :shepface:

) you can basically sequester off ten cheese makers who turn themselves into axe tornadoes for the price of ten bars of iron and a few years

(Please also put armour on them but like, that didnt sound as good and also I'd have to do math)

# ? Apr 18, 2020 12:57

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Comrade Koba posted:

I could never get the hang of training, so I usually just settle with making a large tavern and wait for military dudes to show up and petition for citizenship (which usually doesn't take long), then I just put them in squads. Are there any drawbacks to this apart from not getting to choose which types of soldiers I get and being unable to assign them to non-military duties?

military training scales infinitely (well, for some skills. in true dwarf fortress fashion it's almost completely arbitrary and on a skill-by-skill basis)

dwarves that have been practicing martial arts for 20 years and are like legendary +500 can do really stupid poo poo

# ? Apr 19, 2020 06:33

my dad: Oct 17, 2012; this shall be humorous

If you want to understand what kind of stupid poo poo:

In addition to just increasing the accuracy of your wrestling "attack", wrestling skill means you're on par with larger, stronger enemies when determining your ability to inflict and resist wrestling moves. It's not THAT big of a deal normally (which is why in the Arena tournament, Panty Thief the Yeti could turn people into pretzels with fairly rudimentrary wrestling skills) - but since it scales indefinitely, insanely highly leveled wrestlers can juggle trolls and give forgotten beasts a run for the money.

You can get some interesting results with hammers and spears with their respective skills for similar reasons.

# ? Apr 19, 2020 06:46

Zereth: Jul 9, 2003

A very good way to train it in adventure mode used to be to find a zombie and break all their joints and then just put them in a chokehold and choke them forever, since none of this could kill them but it did make them nearly harmless.

I don't know if this still works, haven't tried in some time.

# ? Apr 19, 2020 07:17

So Math: Jan 8, 2013; Ghostly Clothier

I remember there used to be an adventure combat guide that suggested training by sneaking up on a wild bird and repeatedly picking them off the ground and placing them again. You could even assign a macro to it.

# ? Apr 19, 2020 07:29

Shady Amish Terror: Oct 11, 2007; I'm not Amish by choice. 8(

So Math posted:

I remember there used to be an adventure combat guide that suggested training by sneaking up on a wild bird and repeatedly picking them off the ground and placing them again. You could even assign a macro to it.

Chicken catching as part of a training montage shortcut to ultimate kung-fu power. All DF needs now is procedurally-generated wire-fu moves for procedurally generated styles and DF can cover emulating an entire style of cinema. There's even already barebones secretive plots and revenge arcs.

# ? Apr 19, 2020 10:20

counterfeitsaint: Feb 26, 2010; I'm a girl, and you're
gnomes, and it's like
what? Yikes.

I didn't realize until this page that Dwarf Fortress was a legitimate anime. In hindsight the signs were there all along.

# ? Apr 19, 2020 11:23

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

counterfeitsaint posted:

I didn't realize until this page that Dwarf Fortress was a legitimate anime. In hindsight the signs were there all along.

it's had tentacle demons for like a decade now

# ? Apr 19, 2020 13:17

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

counterfeitsaint posted:

I didn't realize until this page that Dwarf Fortress was a legitimate anime. In hindsight the signs were there all along.

If your throwing skill is high enough you can decapitate people with spinning water

# ? Apr 19, 2020 15:59

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# ? May 19, 2024 00:45

GorfZaplen: Jan 20, 2012

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

it's had tentacle demons for like a decade now

I kind of preferred the old demon style, hell is cool and all but the tiny demon prisons had a lot of flavor. Hopefully they make a comeback in the big lore update.

# ? Apr 19, 2020 16:01

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