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You probably don't have to worry about that. Apparently Brucato hates the core premises of Mage, so the Technocracy will stick but there will likely also be some Third Way evil conspiracy that's just as unlikeable. And 50 new pages of Merits and Flaws.
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Apr 21, 2020 16:42
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Clearly it値l introduce a fourth faction, the Techgnosocratic Pact, based on maker culture, decolonized Indigenous techbros, and vapourwave aesthetes.
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Apr 21, 2020 17:07
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Everyone posted:Maybe they can come back as a Wraith? Given oWoD weird, wacky mix of powers death seems like it's only slightly more final than in a comic book. Why would I reward my player for being an utter moron
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Apr 21, 2020 17:10
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The fact that everybody in the RPGnet thread is saying "I want support for a more science-positive game with Technocratic heroes" I'm not sanguine.
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Apr 21, 2020 17:17
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Loomer posted:Clearly it値l introduce a fourth faction, the Techgnosocratic Pact, based on maker culture, decolonized Indigenous techbros, and vapourwave aesthetes. Loomer having backdoor access to the design docs, I see.
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Apr 21, 2020 17:41
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Rand Brittain posted:The fact that everybody in the RPGnet thread is saying "I want support for a more science-positive game with Technocratic heroes" I'm not sanguine. I HATE ideology!!
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Apr 21, 2020 17:53
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That Old Tree posted:You probably don't have to worry about that. Apparently Brucato hates the core premises of Mage, so the Technocracy will stick but there will likely also be some Third Way evil conspiracy that's just as unlikeable. And 50 new pages of Merits and Flaws. M20 already sort of did this by blaming most of the Technocracies evil doing on some kind on internal "corruption", i.e. "The Nephandi did it".
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Apr 21, 2020 18:26
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I just had the thought they're probably not going to do anything cool with Threat Null and that makes me sad.
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Apr 21, 2020 18:43
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Free Gratis posted:I have a hard time imagining any M20 product not featuring Brucato as a writer. I'm probably going to hate this book because I've disliked the apologia the Technocracy has got over the years. I imagine they're going to lean on Brian Campbell, who wrote for both the original GttT and the Technocracy chapter in M20 (you can tell because the text gets to the point and is full of usable plot hooks, rather than rants about eating pizza) to write a lot of it - of course, Brian Campbell is perhaps the central driving force behind the less evil (and therefore playable) Technocracy, so it's probably not what you're looking for anyway.
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Apr 21, 2020 20:25
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Metapod posted:Why would I reward my player for being an utter moron Lol you must be a bad ST to take your players out of the game like that. Letting PCs get harmed or inhibited in any way is bad because that might forcibly arrest the roleplay
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Apr 21, 2020 21:46
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Had a great scene in my mage game. My matter/forces science TA moros needed some information on some college students who suffered mysterious comas and split off from the cabal to investigate on his own. He smartly changed his clothes into hospital scrubs and made a fake ID which, along with a security badge pickpocketed by another cabalmate, got him into the ER of the hospital and computer access. So far, so good. His computer skills enables him to locate the info he needs and he also discovers a recent admit with the same symptoms. He goes to check on her, uses some mage sight and the soul marks spell when he notices something wrong with her. All good use of magic. Then, as he's leaving, about to get away scott free, I have a nurse walk in and nod a greeting to him, knowing the player won't pass this bait. Of course he doesn't, he asks the nurse about the patient which makes the nurse take a closer look at him. Of course, the player didn't have a real ID to model his fake one on, so the ID doesn't hold up to inspection, he tries to spin a story about being a transfer, but fails his roll. Nurse calls for security. Now, the character has the giant merit and is very strong and tough, but instead of just running out any of the four exits I detailed, maybe using some space or forces to speed himself up or slow pursuers down, he opts to TURN INVISIBLE! The spell garners 2 paradox, and he opts to contain it, but rolls 0 again, along with an exceptional success on the spell casting roll. So along with seeing a big giant dude turn invisible, the nurse is also subjected to his nimbus tilt, and a nimbus flare that she can SEE thanks to the paradox. The exam room takes on the effects of his long term nimbus (oxidation of materials), she takes a penalty to wits and suffers integrity loss, and my player is absolutely DEVASTATED. Not just the player, but the group as a whole, suddenly realized that mages are actually monsters that hurt people without meaning to. We're still playing out the scene, but it was amazing and wonderful. Three others of the cabal used time magics to fast forward a crafts roll to make Frozen Cosplay so they could infiltrate the hospital as a pretend kids charity, but right as they were trying to lead the hospital lobby in a sing-a-long, this all went down and they had to flee.
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Apr 22, 2020 01:25
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Metapod posted:Why would I reward my player for being an utter moron Reward? What reward? Instead of starting up as a new Vampire that gets rapidly pulled into the characters' Coterie, he's now a completely different Supernatural with all kinds of different, weird problems that they probably aren't going to be able to help him with a lot. Instead of letting him role up another character, you can use the lovely afterlife of Wraith to torture him even more. And also bring in some other cool poo poo from another game into your campaign. Soonmot posted:Had a great scene in my mage game. My matter/forces science TA moros needed some information on some college students who suffered mysterious comas and split off from the cabal to investigate on his own. He smartly changed his clothes into hospital scrubs and made a fake ID which, along with a security badge pickpocketed by another cabalmate, got him into the ER of the hospital and computer access. That is kind of beautiful. Do you think they'll try to help/fix to poor nurse they screwed up only to accidentally screw her up even worse (possible Banisher Awakening?) or maybe they'll try to help her and actually succeed, in which case they might get a Contact or Ally. Or maybe just the good feeling of having helped a presumably basically nice person (she is a nurse, after all) deal with poo poo she really wasn't set up to deal with.
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Apr 22, 2020 01:48
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They'll probably try to help but screw things up more. They're on a timetable. The premise of this chronicle is that they awakened (during a oneshot i ran) while fighting a cult that was bringing across an abyssal entity styling itself Lord Boreas, god of winter. Now they receive visions of other abyssal intrusions along the same lines. So they're trying to figure out what "god" is coming, what cult is helping it, and how to stop it. They've discovered that the coma patients, some of the smartest students at MIT, are infected with abyss tainted bacteria that's transferring their lifeforce, mind, and soul someplace out. The process seems to take about a month and they have a kid on death's door right now. They also know that a rash of violence is also linked to the god, and that an attack is going to take place tonight. These along with about half a dozen (so far) clues to follow up on. This being a travel chronicle and knowing they'll be moving on in a week or so makes me wonder how much work they'll put into cleaning up their messes, especially when dealing with the time crunch.
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Apr 22, 2020 01:58
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Is it true this creator of VTM, Rein-Hagen or whoever, denies any influence from Anne Rice? Been talking on Reddit and here about how the 90s was conspiracy central. WoD, X-Files, Matrix, Deus Ex, many others.... When discussing the influences on Vampire the Masquerade Anne Rice and late 80s goth culture were also invoked as prominent influences on the franchise but I was told the creator of VTM says Anne Rice had no influence on the story.
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Apr 22, 2020 07:48
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NikkolasKing posted:Is it true this creator of VTM, Rein-Hagen or whoever, denies any influence from Anne Rice? Now it is true that V:TM doesn't really track the power levels in later entries, but "Interview with the Vampire" could be modelled pretty effectively with VTM.
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Apr 22, 2020 07:53
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Wikipedia says he intentionally didn't read Anne Rice's work until "very late" in the development process, but doesn't deny their influence via trickle down through other media that he did consume. Eh, I'm willing to believe him on this. We get subtly influenced by so much stuff that half the time we don't even realize it and it's not like her work was the only Sexy Goth Vampires in town. I could easily see him wanting to eschew Rice's work to avoid the "you just copied her" accusations. V:tM is an insane grab bag of all it's past and contemporary Vampire media, combined with Lovecraft and Christian heresy fan fiction, and I'm sure if we really put the screws to it then Anne Rice wouldn't sit that much higher over any other given work.
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Apr 22, 2020 13:36
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Isn't Anne Rice incredibly litigious against derived works? That's as good a motive as any to deny connections whenever you're on the record.
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Apr 22, 2020 13:56
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Tulip posted:Isn't Anne Rice incredibly litigious against derived works? That's as good a motive as any to deny connections whenever you're on the record. She's a straight up boogeyman to the fan fiction community and older writer's talk of her like a folk myth to the younger generation. She also really hates negative amazon reviewers. I think V:tM predates her reign of terror though, and it never outright used any copyrighted material like her characters.
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Apr 22, 2020 14:07
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The story Rein-Hagen was telling last I saw was that he and Stewart Wieck saw "The Lost Boys" and really wanted to make a game about hunting vampires, and upon realizing that that would be kind of limiting decided to make a game about playing vampires instead.
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Apr 22, 2020 15:08
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I'm wondering if you guys could help me a bit. My group just had their first Changeling game, and while I'm not the Storyteller, I thought of this thread when we were having trouble with Hedge Navigation. I've made a spreadsheet that will give us the hedge dice pool and the number of successes the hedge and the group needs to navigate, but the problem that comes up is how to determine the player dice pool and the edge. Like in our last session, we ended up going with our best dice pool, Presence + Persuasion, to "convince" the hedge that we belong on the dreaming roads. Should the players be able to just declare what dice pool they're using with one sentence justification of it? And we have no idea on how to determine the Edge as well. Pressing time limit, knowing the environment, dangerous environment, those things are already factored in the number of successes that you need to do the hedge navigation, as part of the general chase modifiers. Does anyone have any good ideas on how to quickly determine the edge? Another thing as well, I'm a Storyteller for a Chronicles of Darkness game for the same group, and I've been designing a ghost-hunting mystery cult, and I've been thinking of adding 1-2 dot Supernatural Trait (Gnosis, Blood Potency, Wyrd, Pilgrimage...) for the 5-dot rank in the cult. This would be just used for resistance rolls, and I could also "downgrade" it so it is only effective against ghosts. I know Mortals do not have it according to the rules, but extra dice to resist supernatural effects, or to withstand spells and such seems like a good effect. I'm just wondering if this would be too overpowered or not.
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Apr 22, 2020 15:14
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NikkolasKing posted:Is it true this creator of VTM, Rein-Hagen or whoever, denies any influence from Anne Rice? V:tM 1st Edition has the Anne Rice books down as the very first entry in the list of works that influenced it, so... bullshit?
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Apr 22, 2020 16:39
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I read the OP but I知 still a little confused. I want to pick up the Promethean sourcebooks, but I noticed drivethrurpg has the Second Edition Promethean Core. Can I play the second edition using New World of Darkness rules or do I need to also get Chronicles of Darkness? Are the sourcebooks even compatible with second edition? Edit: I should mention I already have first edition Promethean. Thirteen Orphans fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Apr 22, 2020 |
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Apr 22, 2020 17:03
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Thirteen Orphans posted:I read the OP but I知 still a little confused. I want to pick up the Promethean sourcebooks, but I noticed drivethrurpg has the Second Edition Promethean Core. Can I play the second edition using New World of Darkness rules or do I need to also get Chronicles of Darkness? Are the sourcebooks even compatible with second edition? Second edition is a massive upgrade and has everything you need to play the game. First edition requires the New World of Darkness core, i believe. The source books are compatible, but there's going some funkiness around the edges.
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Apr 22, 2020 17:36
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Iced Cocoa posted:Another thing as well, I'm a Storyteller for a Chronicles of Darkness game for the same group, and I've been designing a ghost-hunting mystery cult, and I've been thinking of adding 1-2 dot Supernatural Trait (Gnosis, Blood Potency, Wyrd, Pilgrimage...) for the 5-dot rank in the cult. This would be just used for resistance rolls, and I could also "downgrade" it so it is only effective against ghosts. I know Mortals do not have it according to the rules, but extra dice to resist supernatural effects, or to withstand spells and such seems like a good effect. I'm just wondering if this would be too overpowered or not. Yeah, that'd be fine. Thirteen Orphans posted:I read the OP but I知 still a little confused. I want to pick up the Promethean sourcebooks, but I noticed drivethrurpg has the Second Edition Promethean Core. Can I play the second edition using New World of Darkness rules or do I need to also get Chronicles of Darkness? Are the sourcebooks even compatible with second edition? "New World of Darkness" and "Chronicles of Darkness" are the same thing; CofD is a rebranding of the intellectual property. All of the Second Edition CofD corebooks (except Demon) contain a full ruleset to run the game. You could lose your First Edition World of Darkness Rulebook and only have the Promethean Second Edition book and you would still be able to run the game out of just the one book. Sourcebooks are a mixed bag. Settingwise they're mostly compatible, especially Promethean, whose setting hasn't changed much at all between editions. Mechanically, Promethean 2e changes a lot of basic Promethean-specific systems, like how Transmutations work and are organized, making stat blocks and expanded rules hard to transfer over. Additionally, in the case of Promethean, a lot of the expanded material and new concepts introduced in the 1e supplement books are folded into the 2e Promethean corebook: Extempore, Unfleshed, the Refinements of Bronze and Silver, Transmutations of Benefice and Contamination and so on, are all folded into the Second Edition corebook. I personally feel Promethean is the second-weakest second edition update and the closest to being a downgrade from the first edition, but it's really a judgment call on your part here.
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Apr 22, 2020 17:45
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I'm running Promethean 2e right now. The book by itself has everything, including a full set of core rules. I've been using the Night Horror book as well because one of my players is a Zeky. It's also useful for mining for antagonists, there's a couple of fun ones. E: haven't played PTC 1st so I can't compare in that direction, but PTC has already rocketed to my absolute favorite *OD set. It's not even close how much better the characters and conflicts feel compared to Mage or Vampire. Tulip fucked around with this message at 18:00 on Apr 22, 2020 |
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Apr 22, 2020 17:58
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Thanks! Any idea if the rules for creating new lineages in Saturnine Nights are compatible with 2nd edition?
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Apr 22, 2020 19:07
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There's not really many rules in that section of Saturnine Night so much as thematic guidelines, which certainly apply fine in Second Edition. The actual rules would be the modifiers for a Promethean trying to serve as the genitor of a different Lineage, which are fine, and the limitations on supernatural beings serving as demiurges, which are also probably fine. Second Edition also provides additional guidelines for designing a new Lineage in the form of the Extempore, which are effectively not a Lineage but a collection of rare and independent Lineages.
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Apr 22, 2020 19:26
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I Am Just a Box posted:There's not really many rules in that section of Saturnine Night so much as thematic guidelines, which certainly apply fine in Second Edition. The actual rules would be the modifiers for a Promethean trying to serve as the genitor of a different Lineage, which are fine, and the limitations on supernatural beings serving as demiurges, which are also probably fine. Second Edition also provides additional guidelines for designing a new Lineage in the form of the Extempore, which are effectively not a Lineage but a collection of rare and independent Lineages. Thanks so much! Good to know. I think I値l just be picking up the second edition.
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Apr 22, 2020 19:28
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Free Gratis posted:She's a straight up boogeyman to the fan fiction community and older writer's talk of her like a folk myth to the younger generation. She also really hates negative amazon reviewers. Well yeah, she would threaten fanfic writers with legal action at the drop of a hat. She occasionally shares screeds about how anyone who gives a negative review is a bully and would regularly sic her fans on them.
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Apr 22, 2020 20:30
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Which of the mage books do deep dives on spell casting, specifically what each practice is capable of.
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Apr 22, 2020 20:34
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Soonmot posted:Which of the mage books do deep dives on spell casting, specifically what each practice is capable of. That was Tome of the Mysteries, but that probably isn't very helpful any longer.
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Apr 22, 2020 20:38
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Soonmot posted:Which of the mage books do deep dives on spell casting, specifically what each practice is capable of. Practices start on p123 of the 2e core. I don't believe there's anything that goes into a more specific description of it, but I could be wrong. There's also some hints about spell creation in the creative thaumaturgy instructions in the same part of that chapter.
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Apr 22, 2020 22:11
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I ended up doing a deep dive on what Practice does what for a bunch of 1E houserules and they predicted pretty well, but not completely, what ended up happening in 2E, and also make now-useless distinctions between what's Covert and what's Vulgar. If I had to change one thing going back it would be to make a bigger distinction between symbols (which should be ruled by Prime) and language (which should be ruled by Mind).
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Apr 22, 2020 22:33
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Ferrinus posted:I ended up doing a deep dive on what Practice does what for a bunch of 1E houserules and they predicted pretty well, but not completely, what ended up happening in 2E, and also make now-useless distinctions between what's Covert and what's Vulgar. If I had to change one thing going back it would be to make a bigger distinction between symbols (which should be ruled by Prime) and language (which should be ruled by Mind). Was this you?: https://m45t1g05.blogspot.com/2019/06/1-mage-awakening-2e-13-practices-of.html I've been using this, along with the brief descriptions from the mage book Jhet mentioned. I'll check out Tome of Mysteries, but the biggest difference between the editions is that 1E cared about covert vs vulgar like oWoD mage? I never actually played 1st edition, just Ascension and, now, 2E Awakening.
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Apr 22, 2020 23:27
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Soonmot posted:Was this you?: https://m45t1g05.blogspot.com/2019/06/1-mage-awakening-2e-13-practices-of.html Nope, I did these. Sorry about any remaining typos: https://the-act-of-hubris.obsidianportal.com/wikis/acanthus https://the-act-of-hubris.obsidianportal.com/wikis/mastigos https://the-act-of-hubris.obsidianportal.com/wikis/moros https://the-act-of-hubris.obsidianportal.com/wikis/obrimos https://the-act-of-hubris.obsidianportal.com/wikis/thyrsus There's a fair amount of totally-useless-to-2E (arguably to 1E) houserule terminology sprinkled in here but it might be of use to somebody! EDIT: Oh yeah general practice rundown here: https://the-act-of-hubris.obsidianportal.com/wikis/arcadia-spell-design Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Apr 23, 2020 |
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Apr 23, 2020 00:13
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Dienes posted:Well yeah, she would threaten fanfic writers with legal action at the drop of a hat. Is there a good writeup on her rampages somewhere? I'm in the mood for SALT tonight.
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Apr 23, 2020 01:11
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Oberst posted:Lol you must be a bad ST to take your players out of the game like that. Letting PCs get harmed or inhibited in any way is bad because that might forcibly arrest the roleplay What? This loving dipshit deserved it let me tell you what what he did and a little background to set the scene. This player wanted to make a character representing of him so I let him make a paraplegic Chinese malk as he is a paraplegic with an interest in Chinese history. I really thought he could handle it he is veteran player he understands better than anyone the limits of a wheelchair and yet this guy would use obfuscate to move into the middle of the battlefield to yell a one liner in Chinese before doing his sneak attack. Now what youre probably thinking is this is going to end with some sick battle that ends in bad dice luck. You are very wrong he first makes an enemy out of the Chicago malk primogen by attacking him at the primogens own party then a session passes the group does the task that needed to be done but he had to use a lot of blood to do it. It was like 1 am plenty of moon left and he decides to go to his haven okay that's fine i give this guy two good chances to feed on the way home but decides against it. Again that's fine maybe he wants to feed on a specific person nope he went straight to bed at hunger 5 wakes up fails his rouse goes straight to torpor in a house he specifically told me that no one in the coterie would know about with a powerful enemy on his rear end.
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Apr 23, 2020 06:17
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Metapod posted:What? This loving dipshit deserved it let me tell you what what he did and a little background to set the scene. This player wanted to make a character representing of him so I let him make a paraplegic Chinese malk as he is a paraplegic with an interest in Chinese history. I really thought he could handle it he is veteran player he understands better than anyone the limits of a wheelchair and yet this guy would use obfuscate to move into the middle of the battlefield to yell a one liner in Chinese before doing his sneak attack. Now what youre probably thinking is this is going to end with some sick battle that ends in bad dice luck. You are very wrong he first makes an enemy out of the Chicago malk primogen by attacking him at the primogens own party then a session passes the group does the task that needed to be done but he had to use a lot of blood to do it. It was like 1 am plenty of moon left and he decides to go to his haven okay that's fine i give this guy two good chances to feed on the way home but decides against it. Again that's fine maybe he wants to feed on a specific person nope he went straight to bed at hunger 5 wakes up fails his rouse goes straight to torpor in a house he specifically told me that no one in the coterie would know about with a powerful enemy on his rear end. Surely in this case the answer is 'nobody knows about this house so that character is in torpor for a while, maybe have that player play a ghoul or some other indirect connection to their character trying to find where they got taken in torpor' Truedeathing them is such a waste of an amazing story opportunity, and also, jesus gently caress talk to your players. Tell them 'hey this isn't how I imagine Vampire working, maybe recalibrate your assumptions' because like, passive-aggressively going 'you made bad decisions so now you lose your character' is just tedious and makes you look like a tool. You can let them know directly 'hey that's a really dangerous/self-destructive move' and if they forge ahead with that knowledge you have been given their express permission and interest to dunk on the character, and now it's not just you being a power-hungry jerk to someone who had a different image of the setting than you. You twit. Imagine if you played in a game of Vampire someone was GMing who expected every vampire character to be a goofy I Vant To Svck Yovr Bluuuuud caricature and have anyone who wasn't killed by a ghoul hit squad: Would you say 'well I guess I was a moron for playing the wrong kind of vampire' and admit they were wiser and more correct? No, you'd be pissed off because you got punished for having a different idea of what the setting should look like. Talk to your players. Make sure you're on the same page. If they're not on the same page, then that's an OOC problem, and cannot be solved with IC punishment. How is this something you need to be told? loving hell.
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Apr 23, 2020 07:26
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Yeah, so there was a deep-dive on Practices in 1e in Tome of the Mysteries, but it's now wholly outdated, as 1e was full of cases where spells would be promoted or demoted dots based on perceived game balance, while 2e went for sticking to hard "this practice is at this dot level no matter what" and relied on the new Paradox system to make certain effects harder. Even when it required certain tortured methods, like the way "Portal" type Space effects are now built as a Reach effect on Colocation, just so that we could keep them at Space 3 and Teleportation at Space 4. Due to it also having the equally-detailed and now equally-not-useful discussions of Wisdom, crafting, archmasters, antimonian spells, TotM is probably the second least useful 1e book. Almost everything in it has now been covered in 2e, which is to be expected given that it was 1e's Player's Guide equivalent and we've had a Player's Guide equivalent in Signs of Sorcery and a Monster Manual in Nameless and Accursed.
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Apr 23, 2020 08:23
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In my campaign you get punished for actively going into torpor in an unknown location by yourself when you knowingly have a powerful enemy hunting you. And hell he could have survived if the coterie didn't yell hey we're here when they went to save him.
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Apr 23, 2020 16:10
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