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tramp is cool and people make a stupid face when you talk about it
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Apr 27, 2020 19:10
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Arcteryx Anarchist posted:idk that first part and the second part sound synonymous ah, i see this sounds like "lisp culture" to you because you're dumber than a sack of hammers. you could have pointed that out earlier and we could have avoided this digression
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Apr 27, 2020 19:15
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hifi posted:tramp is cool and people make a stupid face when you talk about it the name is apt, but also, kinda gross
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Apr 27, 2020 19:15
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oh no I've offended the Cult I hope they don't black bag me in the middle of the night 
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Apr 27, 2020 19:16
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Arcteryx Anarchist posted:oh no I've offended the Cult I hope they don't black bag me in the middle of the night if lisp programmers tried to kidnap you, six different teams would show up to your house in one night five of them would have really cool vans, one would arrive by ornithopter, but all six would leave the actual removal of the target as an exercise for the reader
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Apr 27, 2020 19:18
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if emacs programmers tried to kidnap you, it would all be very well-executed, but you might end up dead after you fell through the rusty hole in the van body
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Apr 27, 2020 19:19
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idk I feel like all of the vans would be more like something wayne szalinski built
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Apr 27, 2020 19:19
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if emacs users tried to kill you there would be a very informative github and mailing list with the plan but then the gun they used to shoot you wouldn't actually work. then you'd actually die from boredem as they explained to you that actually it was supposed to not work and would break decades of some dude's codebase to make it work and why would anyone use vscode's gun when theirs had smart syntax highlighting for 69 languages and could check your email
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Apr 27, 2020 19:40
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eschaton posted:the right way to do this would be to just start building out an editor in Common Lisp atop the CLIM command infrastructure, which is another way of saying “adding features to DREI” I'm the one who wrote DREI during my misspent youth, and I (now) think Emacs is much better, partly because of its ghetto design.
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Apr 27, 2020 23:19
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i don't think i would admit this on a public forum known for its savage denizens
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Apr 27, 2020 23:23
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I gave vscode another try. it can’t even handle the case where tab stops don’t match indentation lol (yeah it’s a case that shouldn’t matter but existing code exists and most people don’t take kindly to prs that change half the lines in every single file without any visible effect unless you use one specific hipster editor)
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Apr 28, 2020 08:26
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the point of bringing up vscode was not so much that it is fantastic (but it is pretty good), but that it has gained a ton of popularity while, i think, pretty clearly drawing heavily on emacs for inspiration. specifically a pretty comprehensive platform abstraction but everything on top intermeshing extensions (and the way the hooks work is pretty emacs-like as well), and a headline feature being very comprehensive tramp-like primitives (including, where applicable, transparently managing subprocesses on the remote). it is certainly not a very traditional ide, in that it has a very weak idea of workspaces and projects, mostly just knowing how to invoke commands (e.g. just invoke your build system), leaving it to extensions to parse and understand the build system config and log output and whatnot. it is not necessarily the goal of emacs to be super-popular with everyone, but most of what vscode does really well is stuff that was already in emacs wheelhouse, but the popularity arose out of adding a lot of creature comforts.
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Apr 28, 2020 09:26
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vscode lets you version-control its project-level configuration. other ides let you do this too, of course, but vscode puts a lot more thought into it. you can attach a list of recommended extensions to a workspace and then write a config that enforces formatting style on save (as well as displaying various highlights from linters and such). so it's pretty good for that reason alone.
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Apr 28, 2020 14:00
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as an old emacs fan though what i really like is that the default is just to open a directory (local or ssh or in a container or so) and it gives you a file list, an editor, it attempts to figure out if there is an scm it has an extension for in there, and attempts some sensible live errors and code completion (e.g. just blindly run pylint on any python file). plus extension suggestions for stuff it knows it could know about. then you can keep adding configuration to basically achieve something that works like a modern ide, but the up-front investment is basically nil. and specifically it is stuff emacs could in all essentials do an age ago, but with worse defaults and a myriad of ux annoyances until you've fiddled with it at length. e.g. for most newer users emacs would be improved by having a tiny well-styled dired frame for the current working directory on launch.
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Apr 28, 2020 14:37
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:a tiny well-styled dired frame Speaking of this, vinegar is an excellent dired replacement that ive found to be a lot easier to read
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Apr 28, 2020 14:45
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the funniest thing about vscode is that they didn't learn from emacs they chose a hilariously rotten foundation for the editor (electron) and a language that is fundamentally and unavoidably single-threaded throughout its runtime (v8) it's pre-bitrotten, without waiting 30 years for cruft to pile up
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Apr 28, 2020 19:05
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:the funniest thing about vscode is that they didn't learn from emacs but you see, because js is event-based, go play outside Skyler fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Apr 28, 2020 |
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Apr 28, 2020 19:14
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trip report: installed fedora 32 from the software center. everything's fine e: i'm liking the mac rip-off lock screen The_Franz fucked around with this message at 22:46 on Apr 28, 2020 |
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Apr 28, 2020 22:36
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used vscode for a couple months but eventually switched back to emacs since i couldn't deal with the input lag anymore at least with emacs it only gets sluggish if youre holding it wrong, whereas vscode is just like that all the time at this point i think the only IDE i'd actually recommend is jetbrains' stuff
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Apr 29, 2020 01:06
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Progressive JPEG posted:the only IDE i'd actually recommend is jetbrains' stuff
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Apr 29, 2020 01:15
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vscode isn't like, the dumbest thing you could use. at least it is open source and the extension mechanism kinda works. emacs is just a better vscode than vscode. it's not bad versus good, it's ok versus better. jetbrains is closed source but the vendor seems secure and has a viable business model so, that seems fine too. what's really criminally dumb is closed source one man projects with no viable business model. remember when everyone went batty for sublime text? or bbedit? or whatever the fad was before that
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Apr 29, 2020 01:17
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vscode is not good but its absolutely better than emacs. its why sublime text was such a big deal. The ability to get a non-Linux text editor on Linux was game changing cause it meant linux users could edit text without it being a huge pain in the dick for the first time ever.
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Apr 29, 2020 01:27
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vscode isn't perfect and it's using electron and everything, but I still think it's kind of in a sweet spot where it's open source, has good extensibility so it can support new/niche languages, and is easy to use.
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Apr 29, 2020 01:40
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i'd rather use notepad thru wine than vs code
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Apr 29, 2020 01:41
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hifi posted:i'd rather use notepad thru wine than vs code whoa now, let’s not say things we can’t take back...
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Apr 29, 2020 02:18
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The_Franz posted:whoa now, let’s not say things we can’t take back... i would literally rather use microsoft comic chat through wine than slack and i mean it
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Apr 29, 2020 02:34
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does slack still have the IRC gateway?
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Apr 29, 2020 02:45
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https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1255231101578219521
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Apr 29, 2020 02:55
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pseudorandom name posted:does slack still have the IRC gateway? no. you're stuck using irc client plugins (specific to the individual client) that just use the slack API to create an IRC-like interface
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Apr 29, 2020 03:02
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i'm always a little surprised to hear about input lag on vs code because it's always run fine for me. i abandoned vim for development almost immediately when using it. jetbrains products are all great until you're forced into the nightmare realm of updating js because the front end dev is out
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Apr 29, 2020 06:28
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Rufus Ping posted:Alt+6 and ctrl+u, lol ctrl +k and ctrl+u are documented right there on that bottom bar along with like 6 of the other non-standard control keys Which makes 8 reasons to use nano
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Apr 29, 2020 07:21
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sure it’s a bit weird that you control speed with a wheel and heading with foot pedals, but there’s a big sticker covering half the windshield that explains the controls so this is the best choice for inexperienced drivers
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Apr 29, 2020 08:23
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Soricidus posted:sure it’s a bit weird that you control speed with a wheel and heading with foot pedals, but there’s a big sticker covering half the windshield that explains the controls so this is the best choice for inexperienced drivers vim is like putting someone in one of those really old cars with controls that don't resemble anything modern with no instructions or labels on anything and then laughing at them when they don't know that to make it go they need to push forth rapidly on the crowbar of embrayage while simultaneously pulling the lever on the left and depressing the second of four pedals
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Apr 29, 2020 09:08
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I think a more accurate description is if there was a lever that changed the behavior of the steering wheel if the lever is up, the steering wheel changes the gear if the lever is down, the steering wheel actually steers the car you best be drat careful about the position of the lever if you are not paying full attention to driving and you have a habit of switching gears (like using a lower gear on a mountain or something) how far can we extend this metaphor
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Apr 29, 2020 09:27
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Apr 29, 2020 10:01
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mystes posted:vscode isn't perfect and it's using electron and everything, but I still think it's kind of in a sweet spot where it's open source, has good extensibility so it can support new/niche languages, and is easy to use. If I need to quickly change something in a config file vscode is very needs suiting Jetbrains for everthing else
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Apr 29, 2020 12:24
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modal editing is good when the Carp attacks your wrists to be fair
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Apr 29, 2020 14:27
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el dorito posted:I think a more accurate description is if there was a lever that changed the behavior of the steering wheel  press f6 to go and ctrl u to stop
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Apr 29, 2020 16:14
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nerds love to whip up an unbelievably rickety and complex pile of poo poo of a working environment, and then when it doesn't work, they immediately blame "computers"
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Apr 29, 2020 16:29
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carry on then posted:nerds love to whip up an unbelievably rickety and complex pile of poo poo of a working environment, and then when it doesn't work, they immediately blame "computers" agreed, expecting sound to work on linux and getting it to work is a giant complicated mess and probably shouldn't be bothered with
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Apr 29, 2020 16:31
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