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https://twitter.com/Coldwar_Steve/status/1256660366853132289 The 9 bus runs from Reading station to Spencers Wood via Whitley Wood
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May 2, 2020 20:04
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The Question IRL posted:A new TV series called Upload is on Amazon Prime. https://youtu.be/IFe9wiDfb0E
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May 2, 2020 20:08
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Ms Adequate posted:Which of course makes us wonder, is 5 like this by nature? Or did something happen that hardened 5's heart, made them put up some defenses against the cruel world? Five was a witness when 7 8 9.
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May 2, 2020 20:09
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Five was the hardest boy band after East 17, but I'm sure they had their softer side too
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May 2, 2020 20:51
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These are the people that the Karen meme was made for: https://metro.co.uk/2020/05/02/mums-occupy-childrens-playground-protest-lockdown-12643715/ quote:We believe the number of people dead from Covid is exemplified (sic). Extra numbers are being added into Covid. We don’t want to be unlawfully rejected or kept inside. I blame mumsnet.
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May 2, 2020 20:57
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Darth Walrus posted:If the off-licence in town has closed for the duration, where's the best place to order some more unusual beers? I can get Delirium Tremens (the beer, not the beer consequence) off Amazon, but I'm on the lookout for better options than Jeff Bezos to keep my Belgian tripel stockpile up. Find out what local breweries are doing home delivery and support them. Might not be able to get belgium style beers bit hopefully there's some interesting stuff near you.
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May 2, 2020 21:31
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Some local non-chain pubs are doing takeaway from their partnered breweries if you show up with a 2 or 4 pint milk jug.
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May 2, 2020 21:33
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There now seem to be lots of mini local mumsets all over the country. The one here is most definitely a hive of melodrama created by the most petty, hysterical, curtain twitching morons that live
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May 2, 2020 21:33
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If you look for your local breweries then they’re tending towards free local delivery and probably have a selection of popular beers, In Hampshire you’ve got Tongham and Southwick doing that. Tongham has a drive thru
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May 2, 2020 21:44
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Guavanaut posted:These are the people that the Karen meme was made for:k Honest question, if people are saying "the Karen meme seems racially specific and is definitely misogynistic so please don't use it" what is the woke rationale for not respecting that?
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May 2, 2020 22:06
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You can't be racist against white people and it has a strong class element, but it is maybe a bit misogynist so I generally avoid it.
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May 2, 2020 22:07
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OwlFancier posted:You can't be racist against white people and it has a strong class element, but it is maybe a bit misogynist so I generally avoid it. Does that mean gammon is sexist against men?
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May 2, 2020 22:13
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Vitamin P posted:Honest question, if people are saying "the Karen meme seems racially specific and is definitely misogynistic so please don't use it" what is the woke rationale for not respecting that? The rationale is that the people saying that are wrong.
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May 2, 2020 22:13
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BoneMonkey posted:Does that mean gammon is sexist against men? Maybe? But I don't think ham faced tory assholes are particularly discriminated against, whereas the suggestion that being a horrible twat to service workers is inherently female coded is more iffy.
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May 2, 2020 22:14
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Vitamin P posted:Honest question, if people are saying "the Karen meme seems racially specific and is definitely misogynistic so please don't use it" what is the woke rationale for not respecting that? I'm sure there are men who act like Karen. What would they be called? Because as long as we have a name for them too, it's not misogynistic to call Karen Karen.
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May 2, 2020 22:16
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Jedit posted:I'm sure there are men who act like Karen. What would they be called? Because as long as we have a name for them too, it's not misogynistic to call Karen Karen. I guess you'd call them a "male Karen" which explicity proves my point.
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May 2, 2020 22:20
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To be clear I'm language libertarian I think the Karen meme is funny as gently caress and people acting offended by it shouldn't have any power to stop other people enjoying the joke, but that stance would also apply to Count Dankula. The rationale for saying some people don't get to do edgy humour and other people (coincidentally the wokes) do get to do edgy humour just seems so dishonest like namesake posted:The rationale is that the people saying that are wrong. ? Who the gently caress do you think you are? You aren't some loving authority make an argument.
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May 2, 2020 22:27
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I don't see gender, only the manager.
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May 2, 2020 22:27
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Jedit posted:I'm sure there are men who act like Karen. What would they be called? Because as long as we have a name for them too, it's not misogynistic to call Karen Karen. I propose Kevin.
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May 2, 2020 22:29
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https://twitter.com/means_tv/status/1256208829173444609 Next Friday you get to topple capitalism from the comfort of your living room!
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May 2, 2020 22:29
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You can make the argument that it fills a linguistic need by highlighting the power relationship between customers and service workers and how it is often abused, and that people who use it primarily mean it in that way and may be ignorant of other interpretations, or feel that the thing they're using it to communicate is more important than those other interpretations, and that both of those probably mean it's not worth going off on people who use it most of the time. But I guess I've not personally felt that way so I don't feel much need to use it. Sad Panda posted:https://twitter.com/means_tv/status/1256208829173444609 Huh, I didn't realise they'd got it published so widely. Or that it looked that good. Wonder if it'll raise their profile a bit. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 22:33 on May 2, 2020 |
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May 2, 2020 22:31
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sassassin posted:I don't see gender, only the manager. 
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May 2, 2020 22:33
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Vitamin P posted:Honest question, if people are saying "the Karen meme seems racially specific and is definitely misogynistic so please don't use it" what is the woke rationale for not respecting that? It's also worth noting that 'Becky' never got the same kind of outrage that 'Karen' did. Beckys tend to be younger and more working class than Karens. It's also also worth noting that everyone mad about Karen found 'Shaneequa' for all black women hilarious or at the bare minimum never spoke up when it was joked about. (Also it pisses off Spiked, or at least makes them performatively outraged, which points to it being right.) sassassin posted:I don't see gender, only the manager. 
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May 2, 2020 22:51
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Guavanaut posted:*channels Frantz Fanon* Within a gendered society which is also comfortable with many of the less overt ideas of white supremacy, the socially approved ways for white women to perform white normality will differ from the socially approved ways for white men to perform white normality, e.g. the contrast between calling the cops on black people for having a picnic vs. verbally confronting them in a racialist manner yourself. This also intersects with differences between the middle class performance of whiteness and the working class performance of whiteness. So long as these exist it's worthwhile having words to distinguish them. *channels a normal person* You've folded the misogynistic elements into the racial bit, it's neat rhetoric but you've dodged the stronger half of the Karen critique, if women are saying "we're asking you to stop using this sexist insult of the whiney nagging woman" and your reply is "lol no nice try bitch but I see your white normality behaviour" then you haven't actually addressed their point, you've dismissed it so you can keep doing the funny meme you like under a mask of anti-racist performative intellectualism THAT YOU EVEN ADMITTED WAS PERFORMATIVE AT THE START OF YOUR POST Guavanaut posted:It's also worth noting that 'Becky' never got the same kind of outrage that 'Karen' did. Beckys tend to be younger and more working class than Karens. Isn't Becky just a lesser Stacey? If there's some other element then fair play I've never heard it but there's no element of it that would provoke any outrage, and again your obfuscating the sexism but with age and class this time. Guavanaut posted:It's also also worth noting that everyone mad about Karen found 'Shaneequa' for all black women hilarious or at the bare minimum never spoke up when it was joked about. Well yeah obviously, I'm sure a lot of people complaining about Karen are terrible people but 99% of all the people that try to shut down language are terrible people. I do appreciate you and OwlFancier responding in good faith btw.
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May 2, 2020 23:13
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Vitamin P posted:*channels a normal person* You've folded the misogynistic elements into the racial bit, it's neat rhetoric but you've dodged the stronger half of the Karen critique, if women are saying "we're asking you to stop using this sexist insult of the whiney nagging woman" and your reply is "lol no nice try bitch but I see your white normality behaviour" then you haven't actually addressed their point, you've dismissed it so you can keep doing the funny meme you like under a mask of anti-racist performative intellectualism THAT YOU EVEN ADMITTED WAS PERFORMATIVE AT THE START OF YOUR POST It isn't, white feminism is as bad as brocialism. Vitamin P posted:Isn't Becky just a lesser Stacey? If there's some other element then fair play I've never heard it but there's no element of it that would provoke any outrage, and again your obfuscating the sexism but with age and class this time.
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May 2, 2020 23:20
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Guavanaut posted:shows that the latter is the hiss of privilege scratched. Nice.
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May 2, 2020 23:25
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Guavanaut posted:I don't see anyone calling black or Asian women Karens, so the question of whether there's a misogynistic element folded into the racial bit is a bit like "is it misogynistic to shut down white feminism?" Yeah this is irreconcilable then. You've obliquely recognised the sexism but then justified it by saying 'it's okay though because it's against white women', my critique put the sexism as the most legitimate contention and had the racism as an added negative element rather than a justification for the former. And yeah again we have irreconcilable differences. The Bernie Bro poo poo and "brocialism" in broad was a deliberate top-down meme to undermine the women, poc and older people that supported Bernie or any distributive movement using the lovely radlib moral framework capital is currently forcing on us.
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May 2, 2020 23:32
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Calling "Karen" a misogynist slur is the same as calling the discussion of toxic masculinity misandrist (a fave of the alt right). It's the behaviour that's being criticised, but as Guava said we're in a society that loves to strictly demarcate behaviours between the genders, and those on the left are equally critical of men who use direct violence rather than calling the manager. Also Karen refers to an actual person, so I don't see an issue with using it for men and women exhibiting the same behaviour.
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May 2, 2020 23:37
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Vitamin P posted:And yeah again we have irreconcilable differences. The Bernie Bro poo poo and "brocialism" in broad was a deliberate top-down meme to undermine the women, poc and older people that supported Bernie or any distributive movement using the lovely radlib moral framework capital is currently forcing on us. Doesn't have anything to do with Hillary only losing because of the Bernard Brothers Online, except when extremely liberal people try to force it. Tarnop posted:Calling "Karen" a misogynist slur is the same as calling the discussion of toxic masculinity misandrist (a fave of the alt right). It's the behaviour that's being criticised, but as Guava said we're in a society that loves to strictly demarcate behaviours between the genders, and those on the left are equally critical of men who use direct violence rather than calling the manager.
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May 2, 2020 23:41
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I will say that I think the modern left is a lot better about intersectionality than it has been historically and that's a good thing but yeah there are a few weird groups of bellends lurking around. And obviously the... right wing of the left I guess are really poo poo at it. Though I would be loathe to call them left frankly, they're just a different shade of gammon.
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May 2, 2020 23:44
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I guess Trad Left, Orthodox Marxist, and anything that looks like an adjective that a splinter group of Catholics who split off because the Pope stopped burning people for heresy would use.
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May 2, 2020 23:48
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Vitamin P dropped some of the most obvious bait I've ever seen on here, don't loving engage with that bullshit
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May 2, 2020 23:49
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Does Orthodox Marxist mean something other than just agreeing with the points marx made? Cos I think I scored pretty high as one on that quiz thing.Coohoolin posted:Vitamin P dropped some of the most obvious bait I've ever seen on here, don't loving engage with that bullshit He's kind of right though? At the very least the karen meme is very imperfect in what it actually says even if you're inclined to give people the benefit of the doubt when they use it, which I generally am. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 23:52 on May 2, 2020 |
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May 2, 2020 23:50
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Also "Karen is a misogynist slur" is only a conversation because the Venn diagram of lovely newspaper columnists and Karens looks like a loving polo
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May 2, 2020 23:51
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Guavanaut posted:Brocialism exists. It's in the SWP rape circles and whatever it was that the LibCom guy was doing and every MRA that supports hair thin socialism that benefits them but no further, or pines nostalgic for the days when a household could live on a single income while ignoring that it usually happened because one party was doing 12 hours of work for no pay. Sexism within nominally leftist spaces obviously exists, just like uncritically using the term brosocialist to defend a lovely radlib perspective is obviously reductive and serves capital. Just admit that you want to have fun with the Karen meme and that language should be a source of joyful expression, stop trying to rationalise it to being coherent within the wokescold framework because it isn't.
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May 2, 2020 23:52
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OwlFancier posted:Does Orthodox Marxist mean something other than just agreeing with the points marx made? Cos I think I scored pretty high as one on that quiz thing.
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May 2, 2020 23:57
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Guavanaut posted:Yes but especially the bits about being really homophobic and probably dodgy about immigration, if 90% of the people who proudly call themselves one above all other labels is anything to go by. Ah that kind, fair enough.
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May 2, 2020 23:59
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OwlFancier posted:I will say that I think the modern left is a lot better about intersectionality than it has been historically and that's a good thing but yeah there are a few weird groups of bellends lurking around. And obviously the... right wing of the left I guess are really poo poo at it. Though I would be loathe to call them left frankly, they're just a different shade of gammon. Does the class-reductionist leftist that denies intersectionality is a thing actually exist in any meaningful sense though? I'm closer to that than most posters here but even though I think economic circumstance is the most meaningful intersection by far that doesn't mean poo poo isn't observably much more difficult if you're disabled or an ethnic minority or not cis-normative.
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May 3, 2020 00:01
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Vitamin P posted:Does the class-reductionist leftist that denies intersectionality is a thing actually exist in any meaningful sense though? I'm closer to that than most posters here but even though I think economic circumstance is the most meaningful intersection by far that doesn't mean poo poo isn't observably much more difficult if you're disabled or an ethnic minority or not cis-normative. isn’t that still the Morning Star / CPGB line? that talk of intersectionality is just distraction from the real class issue
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May 3, 2020 00:08
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I'm not au-fait with the theory of the left but when it comes to this kind of stuff I generally think. 1) Class > all. Fix that and it get better for us all and offers new opportunities for the particular causes you might care about. 2) however you can fight for more than one thing, so support our LGBTQ, our BAME AND any other comrades and in turn they shouldn't forget class as the great Uniter of us all Am I off base?
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May 3, 2020 00:09
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