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Mirconium posted:I'm just confused why the weird throttle cable cam thing isn't standard equipment on bikes. It's not like injection-molding a cam is harder than injection-molding a circle. What’s even easier than changing your injection molding is changing the acceleration curve for the throttle in software. Literally a software change. This is why I’m still a big proponent of carbs. Manufacturers are as lazy as they ever were. Nothing has changed. What was “brass plugs over the fuel mixture screws” and “lean jetting with huge flat spots” never changed, it just became “bad fuel maps with flat spots” and the brass plugs became “firmware you can’t change”. The difference being you could fix your carbs with a drill bit, maybe some washers and $10 worth of jets. It takes a powercommander for $300 to fix your fuel injection. This also brings up my other gripe. Why does powercommander have the market locked down? Someone needs to make the arduino of powercommanders and command the power back to us.
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May 9, 2020 22:23
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SEKCobra posted:
I honesty have no idea why they’re chosen as training bikes, they’re heavy and dumb. I found making sure the engine was at a higher rpm, 5-6k, and using the clutch exclusively as the ‘throttle’ was my “trick”. Dragging the rear helped too, but if you do you really need to keep the rpms up else you’ll stall. Also, for the U-Turn (in the UK), you don’t need to turn immediately from a stop, you can pick up a bit of momentum going forward before doing the whole shoulder check, stare at the examiners boots, full lock then turn. Horse Clocks fucked around with this message at 22:47 on May 9, 2020 |
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May 9, 2020 22:44
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Horse Clocks posted:Hey there 650-Honda-i4 training buddy! Yeah towards the end of my lessons I was starting to think I should just use higher rpms even if I feel like a dumbass that is overreving, but my instructor kept moving to other exercises whenever I was making any progress to get through the lesson plan. I do not have the option to start rolling, the whole deal is going from full stop immediately 90°. No U-turn tho.
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May 9, 2020 22:51
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:What’s even easier than changing your injection molding is changing the acceleration curve for the throttle in software. Literally a software change. Is this a potential issue in all fuel injected bikes or only if they are also ride-by-wire? My bike is fuel injected but has a mechanical throttle. The throttle feels pretty smooth to me, but I don’t have much of a data set for comparison.
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May 9, 2020 22:53
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Potentially all because even in FI bikes where the throttle is a cable attached to a butterfly, the bike is generally still in control of the fuel amount, timing and duration, ignition timing and secondary throttle valves (if equipped). So there is still lots of wiggle room to modify your throttle inputs
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May 9, 2020 23:42
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I mean I think the reason it's that way on manufacturer side is that the idle circuit is usually leaned way the gently caress out for emissions purposes, right? Then the lurch off idle is because the idle circuit stops, and suddenly you're on the "proper" fuel map, and bam, kick right in the rear end, because if you had the low-rpm fueling as lean as the idle, you'd just stall immediately with any load at all since the idle map can barely even spin the engine at idle. But yeah, having to buy a commander to fix that is indeed a righteous pain in the rear end. I sort of wonder if you could create a tiny little circuit that senses voltage on the idle circuitry and richen the mixture just at idle, since you could do that without a full-on commander for like 5 bucks in components. (just run an op-amp on the injector wire that senses the IAC voltage or something?), but that's not a project I'm willing to attempt on a bike that I'd rather continue running and remain suitable for resale.
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May 10, 2020 00:05
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Mirconium posted:I mean I think the reason it's that way on manufacturer side is that the idle circuit is usually leaned way the gently caress out for emissions purposes, right? Then the lurch off idle is because the idle circuit stops, and suddenly you're on the "proper" fuel map, and bam, kick right in the rear end, because if you had the low-rpm fueling as lean as the idle, you'd just stall immediately with any load at all since the idle map can barely even spin the engine at idle. that’s more or less what you do on the LC8. $20 dongle and it fixes the stupid super lean fueling under 4000rpm or whatever it is. way smoother and way cooler
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May 10, 2020 01:33
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SEKCobra posted:I do not have the option to start rolling, the whole deal is going from full stop immediately 90°. Same in my part of australia and I had the exact same problem. I was overthinking it and trying to do all kinds of poo poo when it's as simple as looking where you want to go and riding the bike there. I know, I know, it sounds glib and not helpful, but I literally spent a full loving hour sweating in 35 degree heat and failing at it over and over again while I tried to think about what I needed to be doing, and came home sure I'd never pass a test. Next day I went out and just kinda did it because I'd unfucked my brain and realised that the instructions I had "Look through the turn (with your whole head!), counterbalance , take off, use the clutch" which is also what people here told me, were literally 100% of what I needed to be doing. If your problem is the same as mine, you're overthinking your legs and hands and body and forgetting to keep your eyes/chin up and turn your head. Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 03:54 on May 10, 2020 |
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May 10, 2020 03:51
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Yeah, echoing the “turn your head” advice. Point your chin in the direction you need to go. Your chin, not eyes or nose. Pointing your chin forces your head up along with turning your head, so it becomes a much more active motion than just looking where you need to go. Exaggerate that motion to the point you feel self conscious about it. If you do that every time, there will be a point fairly soon where it feels like your head turning is what turns the bike. Also watch some footage of professional riders on say the corkscrew at Laguna Seca. You’ll see them come through the first turn, then they all pop upright on their bikes while their head swivels all the way through the apex of the next turn, then again for the next. All 20 or so of them in synchrony, it’s kind of mesmerizing and sends the point home about how much of a part the head plays in body positioning. Or watch some Japanese moto gymkhana videos, that is both some exaggerated body positioning and stellar riding.
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May 10, 2020 05:01
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Yeah one of the things I have noticed working really well is that head positioning stuff, didn't know I could apply it to this tho. My instructor never mentioned any of this of course. Am I supposed to work more through leaning the bike or turning the front?
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May 10, 2020 07:49
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Seriously don't overthink how you're making it happen, just turn your head, don't look down, and keep your revs up. That said, you're not going to make the turn unless you lean somewhat. My instructor demonstrated this to me by standing next to the bike on the left, turning the bars full lock to the right, and walking it through the turn (and running out of space without finishing). Then he stood on the right side and leaned it over to the right and walked it all the way through the turn with stacks of room to spare.
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May 10, 2020 08:41
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I'm currently trying to find a way to train some more without a bike. I'll see if I can approximate it with my bicycle or something. This is what I am struggling with btw: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Fz8hPUfo1c SEKCobra fucked around with this message at 15:08 on May 10, 2020 |
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May 10, 2020 09:40
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I'm pretty sure at the MSF class they taught us to turn the wheel before taking off, but that guy doesn't do that and he's fine. I may be wrong on that, I don't consciously think about it, but basically you're just making a right turn at a stop sign here. Are you going too wide and not keeping it within the cones?
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May 10, 2020 16:29
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SEKCobra posted:I'm currently trying to find a way to train some more without a bike. I'll see if I can approximate it with my bicycle or something. The advice given to you previously in this thread - turn your head and look where you want to go - will 100% help you get through this exercise. From your posts it very much seems like you're overthinking what is required to make this turn. Pull up to the stop. Put the bike in first gear. Turn your head to the right and look in the direction you want to go - preferably at an object 20+ meters distant from you, or at the horizon, not at the ground right next to your bike. DO NOT LOOK AT THE CONES. Apply a little throttle, slip the clutch and go, just like you would if you were pulling away slowly from a stop without turning. If you're not yet able to pull away from a stop without thinking about the throttle, clutch, etc., practice riding away from a stop until you can manage the controls "automatically" without focusing on them. Then come back to the turn from a stop and practice looking through the turn. Jazzzzz fucked around with this message at 17:08 on May 10, 2020 |
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May 10, 2020 17:03
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The first couple of posts with tips were good but I think you should stop reading this thread for a while now that it's everyone giving their own slight variation on the same feedback. There is no magic secret to the maneuver -- riding is a muscle memory thing and you just need to go out and do it because your body needs time to develop the skill. Eventually it will work. Not instantly, but it will happen. Quit thinking about it and quit worry about whether you're not getting it. I spent many hours flying the airport pattern with my flight instructor trying to figure out how to land a plane, a seven minute cycle for less than ten seconds of practice in the flare each time. I knew everything about the maneuver in my head, I had read every tip sheet and watched every YouTube, I'd flown with a couple of different instructors and gotten their perspectives, I had drilled it in my chair at home and would run through it in my head on the way to the airport. No matter how prepared I was, I struggled with doing it right until one day when I just...got it. Some mind-body connection was made and everything started to work. There was no mental epiphany, no secret, no realization, just my brain and body working something out behind the scenes. The same thing will happen with you and this maneuver, but you gotta be like my flight instructor -- not getting frustrated, not thinking things are going wrong, not looking for some secret you're missing -- just shrugging and saying "okay, once more around, we'll just keep at it until it clicks"
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May 10, 2020 18:20
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Oh absolutely, the feedback has been great and I think I can totally work with what you guys said. I just need to find a way to train some more, I might end up having to pay for more lessons and just not give a gently caress what the instructor says or try to get one of the others to do the lesson, but biking is pretty much just handled by the owner.
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May 10, 2020 22:11
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I’m going off the board with the only thing I learned from Star Wars. Close your eyes and reach out with your feelings to make the turn.
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May 10, 2020 22:43
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Jazzzzz posted:DO NOT LOOK AT THE CONES. The guy taking the test before me looked at the cones and you'll never guess where the bike went.
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May 11, 2020 06:51
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SEKCobra posted:Oh absolutely, the feedback has been great and I think I can totally work with what you guys said. I just need to find a way to train some more, I might end up having to pay for more lessons and just not give a gently caress what the instructor says or try to get one of the others to do the lesson, but biking is pretty much just handled by the owner. I just wanted to reiterate that at low speed, the clutch is your throttle. Lots of bikes are a bit poo poo with throttle response just off idle, so you give it more throttle and slip the clutch as much as you need to give the desired result. Bike clutches are mostly wet clutches and can be slipped a lot with no problems, unlike the dry clutches in cars. Also I don’t know if it’s taught differently where you are but when I did my training in Australia, we were trained to come to a stop having kicked the bike down to first before stopping, left foot goes on the ground, right foot is on the back brake. Doing that, your back brake is already available instantly upon take off. It doesn’t sound like you’re doing that (and the demo video above didn’t show that behaviour either).
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May 11, 2020 08:39
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Others said the same thing. I did my big A on the same bike (Hi Eurobuddy!) Rev the bike, slip the clutch, drag the rear brake and turn your head all the way you can, and it will go well. You can do it!
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May 11, 2020 18:46
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SEKCobra posted:I can't get on the brake fast enough for this, the test is to start at the side of the 4m wide lane and immediately turn. Just keep a little pressure on the back brake all the way through the move. You should be pulling off from having only your left foot down anyway, so this shouldn't be a problem (and TBH I'd question how good your instructor is if he isn't telling you to keep the back brake on for slow speed moves). The CB isn't a twitchy supersport, so the thing of it jumping anywhere over 3k is definitely just a technique problem, not a bike problem. Don't twist your wrist - start with your palm very slightly lifted off the throttle with your thumb hooked around the throttle, and just lower your palm and push forward with your thumb to roll the throttle on as slowly as you like - don't actually grip the throttle. This will also keep your throttle at a set RPM even as you turn the bars, which is the other big problem people have with low-speed, especially right, turns. The technique is a bit hard to describe with text (or even show with a drawing), but you can probably get the idea by trying to turn the throttle (with the bike off at first!) while resting your fingers on the front brake lever without moving them back and forth. Once you're out of low speed then you can grip the throttle and twist your wrist to accelerate out. As others have said, the speed control is actually coming from your clutch rather than from your throttle (on almost all modern bikes you can ride them perfectly well, if slowly, without ever touching the throttle) so work on your clutch technique too. Most learners make the mistake of trying to use a precision grip - like pinching - rather than a strong grip, like making a fist. Ironically the precision grip is less precise in this situation because you're having to use almost the entire strength of the grip, rather than a small proportion. The lever should slide up and down your fingers as you open and close the fist - the easiest way to enforce this is making sure the lever is tight into the base of your thumb, with your thumb pointing forward, rather than having your thumb on the lever. You could also (although it's slightly trickier to do unless you're lucky with hand size and lever placement) try holding the clutch lever with your fingertips wrapped around and moving your wrist up and down - some people find this easier because then the movements of right and left hand are proportional, if opposite - the technique is described as like trying to wring out a towel. (Counter-)leaning can help but is an extra variable to worry about, so leave that until you've got the basics right - look where you want to go, take your time, and *relax*.
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May 11, 2020 22:51
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Thoughts on cheap but safe degreasers to use on a bike that I won't have to wait in the mail for 2 weeks for? Internet sez pinesol is probably too harsh. Autozone down the street probably has car soap but that seems too mild since I won't be able to get into all the nooks and crannies and scrub crap out.
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May 15, 2020 19:00
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Mirconium posted:Thoughts on cheap but safe degreasers to use on a bike that I won't have to wait in the mail for 2 weeks for? Simple green? I know a lot of folks use dish soap too.
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May 15, 2020 19:05
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Pine-Sol is not too harsh. Who told you that? What sort of damage did they say it would cause? If you leave rubber parts sitting in pine-sol overnight they may swell, so don't do that, but it's harmless to metal. Dish soap is fine, but the chemical structure of pine oil is close to many of the aromatic compounds in petrochemicals that form the sticky varnish buildup, so it's very effective especially on fuel system components.
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May 15, 2020 19:11
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Sagebrush posted:Pine-Sol is not too harsh. Who told you that? What sort of damage did they say it would cause? Pinesol site says not to use it on cars directly, saying that it can damage the finish. I assume that means it can gently caress up clearcoat?
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May 15, 2020 19:20
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Isn't simple green bad for aluminum if you let it sit on it for too long? I always heard it was fine if you washed it off right away, but I always avoided it for that reason in case I missed some
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May 15, 2020 19:32
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I use 409 pretty liberally whenever I need to work on the bikes. My dirtbikes used to get "409 baths" where I just cleaned all the plastics and stuff with 409 and paper towels to make it pretty.
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May 15, 2020 19:45
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I use Zep Engine Degreaser, the concentrated purple stuff. It dulls paint and aluminum sure, but goddamn it gets the grease off and I don't care what my KLR looks like.
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May 15, 2020 20:21
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What do I need to change sprockets on my Honda CTX700ND? I bought a new front, a new rear, and a new chain, but I don't have a center stand or spools/track stand. I've got my socket set + basic tools + PB Blaster, but worried that I'll need an impact wrench.
Bernie Panders fucked around with this message at 20:41 on May 15, 2020 |
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May 15, 2020 20:22
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Mirconium posted:Thoughts on cheap but safe degreasers to use on a bike that I won't have to wait in the mail for 2 weeks for? A mixture of Pinesol and Simple Green will get a lot of poo poo off. Aerosolized engine degreaser like Gunk will get most of what the Pinesol and Simple Green leave behind. Anything else will take scrubbing and additional Gunk treatments. Don't let any degreasers get into your bearings (wheel, swinger, shock mounts, steering) or electrical stuff, and you'll be fine.
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May 15, 2020 20:30
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Are your local places out of degreaser or what? I’ve found that bike (bicycle) shops are good for chain degreasers, wax etc.
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May 15, 2020 20:57
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Bernie Panders posted:What do I need to change sprockets on my Honda CTX700ND? I bought a new front, a new rear, and a new chain, but I don't have a center stand or spools/track stand. I've got my socket set + basic tools + PB Blaster, but worried that I'll need an impact wrench. You can get away with a breaker bar and an assistant to do the front sprocket nut but it's not easy, so an impact gun is ideal but not mandatory. You'll also need an angle grinder or chain breaker to get the old one off. You'll also need a chain riveter to fit the new one unless the new one is both the perfect length and has a clip type master link. Being unable to get the back wheel off the bike is gonna be your biggest problem I think. Well that and not being able to adjust the chain straight. Really a paddock stand should be something you get with your first bike like a helmet and jacket, they aren't really optional if you aren't blessed with a center stand.
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May 15, 2020 21:02
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Mirconium posted:Pinesol site says not to use it on cars directly, saying that it can damage the finish. I assume that means it can gently caress up clearcoat? If you have a penchant for danger, use petrol! Shelvocke fucked around with this message at 21:42 on May 15, 2020 |
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May 15, 2020 21:39
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Bernie Panders posted:What do I need to change sprockets on my Honda CTX700ND? I bought a new front, a new rear, and a new chain, but I don't have a center stand or spools/track stand. I've got my socket set + basic tools + PB Blaster, but worried that I'll need an impact wrench. how are you going to change the sprocket if you can't lift the rear wheel off the ground
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May 15, 2020 22:20
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With bicycles you can flip the whole bike upside down and rest it on the saddle and handlebars. So I recommend trying that. EDIT: If you are in Denver you can borrow my Pitbulls 
Ulf fucked around with this message at 22:34 on May 15, 2020 |
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May 15, 2020 22:30
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There is no way two dogs can lift a motorcycle
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May 15, 2020 23:11
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:There is no way two dogs can lift a motorcycle You’d think, but... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=M2w3NZzPwOM
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May 15, 2020 23:40
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MomJeans420 posted:Isn't simple green bad for aluminum if you let it sit on it for too long? I always heard it was fine if you washed it off right away, but I always avoided it for that reason in case I missed some
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May 16, 2020 02:14
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Just add more grease.
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May 16, 2020 02:44
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Ulf posted:With bicycles you can flip the whole bike upside down and rest it on the saddle and handlebars. So I recommend trying that. Just hold the rear brake, grab the handlebars and walk backward. Or, well, hop.
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May 16, 2020 03:50
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