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And let's not even get into the dodgy as gently caress novelizations that were like grandma's 70's yaoi. Edit: https://www.theyboldlywent.com/trekbooks/2020/03/star-trek-the-prometheus-design-review/ lovely snipe so here's some reading on the whole issue Zurui fucked around with this message at 18:30 on May 16, 2020 |
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May 16, 2020 18:23
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Tighclops posted:Post the Spock helmet Hell, onto everyone's heads, complete with names like the Space:1999 spacesuits. On planets, on the bridge, in their quarters, everywhere.
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May 16, 2020 18:35
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One last thing about the whole warp speed thing.. in By Any Other Name, its mentioned that the Kelvins were able to modify the Enterprise warp engines so that it would reach the Andromeda Galaxy in only three hundred years. And it's currently 2.53 MILLION light years away! I hate how this got thrown away into the memory hole, because this implies that the Enterprise should have been able to do this for every episode after. The Kelvins literally made it the fastest ship in the galaxy! I mean did Scotty just go in and trash all their modifications without at least committing what they did to memory so he can build a Warp 50 shuttlecraft? I remember trying to do some napkin math based on pre-TNG warp calculations but gave up when I figured souped up Enterprise could get to the Delta Quadrant in less than 10 years.. At that speed they wouldn't need some dopey mushroom drive to get around and the Enterprise would win battles by being instantly 10 light years away from where the disruptors / torpedos were aimed. Also, Star Fleet plans its invasion of the Dominion, Magellanic Clouds and all the dwarf satellite galaxies just as a warm up.. Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 18:41 on May 16, 2020 |
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May 16, 2020 18:38
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F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:Uh...wow. I own the "Complete Comics Collection" DVD and I completely missed this one. My recollection is that the Gold Key comics were written by people who only had the promotional materials to go off of.
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May 16, 2020 18:39
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Zurui posted:And let's not even get into the dodgy as gently caress novelizations that were like grandma's 70's yaoi. I've had a long-running off-and-on spare time project I've been working on over the last few years: reading through the old Trek novels from the pre-TNG days and reviewing them / pointing out the really stupid, objectionable poo poo that didn't age well or that completely missed the mark of what Trek was going for (a couple of the prominent early Trek fan organizers / novelists were hardcore Randian Objectivists, for example). I've got about 12 of them done as of now, just haven't posted them anywhere yet really, besides the time I liveblogged reading Kathleen Sky's "Vulcan!" (the worst book I have ever read) in this very thread last year. So far I've seen:
And on, and on, and on. Edit: from my notes on one of the stories in one of the anthologies, "The New Voyages 1", that I totally forgot about. It's just so ridiculous: quote:“The Face on the Barroom Floor” by Eleanor Arnason and Ruth Berman Zurui posted:And let's not even get into the dodgy as gently caress novelizations that were like grandma's 70's yaoi. Aw man that guy stole my schtick and did it better. 
Drone fucked around with this message at 18:50 on May 16, 2020 |
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May 16, 2020 18:43
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Tighclops posted:Post the Spock helmet https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etRJn6y48vg
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May 16, 2020 18:45
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:My recollection is that the Gold Key comics were written by people who only had the promotional materials to go off of. The Gold Key comics were literally made up from scratch, many were written by an unknown author, and illustrated by the great Alberto Giolitti, who before he did Star Trek did a lot of other Gold Key comics, and did it all from his studio in Rome, Italy. Whomever did most of the uncredited stories was most likely an in-house writer at Gold Key who didn't even bother to READ the press kit. A lot of these stories had no knowledge of the Prime Directive, the Federation, or even warp technology. Luckily, Len Wein, a comic book writer for Marvel and DC came on and gradually merged the retarded GK timeline into continuity with the actual TV show. Before Len, the Enterprise ran on rocket power, used a transporter that looked nothing like the actual set, and reported to a generic authority known as 'Space Central' and used 20th century radio for communications. The stories were written here in the US, then sent off to Alberto for him to illustrate; he drew the bulk of the series, #3-#37 using nothing but the first standard press kit that Desilu had sent off to most newspapers and media concerns. He had literally never seen any episodes of the actual show until well after he stopped drawing them! In a lot of the early stories, Klingons were drawn as bowl-cut or bald Asians, Klingons were not included in those early press kits! And neither was James Doohan, so Scotty was drawn as a young, thin blonde guy for about six issues. Nobody at Paramount gave a poo poo about the book, which is why the first dozen issues or so were purestrain batshit based on bad 50's sci-fi movie plotlines. Alberto drew a lot of his inspiration from Flash Gordon strips drawn by another great, Alex Raymond, hence the decidedly 40's feel to many of his backgrounds / locations / costumery. And, if nothing else, Gold Key Trek gave us Kirk with An Afro!  Gold Key lost the license to Marvel Comics in 1979, and evidently, not wishing to repeat the shitshow GK had with the first few issues of its Trek comic, Paramount actually started giving a poo poo, as they restricted the license, and each issue had to pass muster with some bored guy at Paramount. Marvel pinched out about 18 issues before losing the license in 1981. It had sucky sales in part because of a big restriction- Paramount had declared that Marvel could only write stories based on The Motion Sickness, any characters / concepts from TOS or other continuity were strictly forbidden. Can you imagine? A large number of their stories were either 'bottle' stories or involved alien races mentioned once then never again. In one issue, the alien race is never named, literally never even speaks to the Enterprise crew, and every one of their actions is only explained via exposition by Spock.. Also, it seems that Paramount decreed that the phaser sound in most situations is "BL-WHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEEOOOO" Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 19:38 on May 16, 2020 |
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May 16, 2020 19:15
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Tighclops posted:Post the Spock helmet Whatever you say, sir. Thy will be done. 
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May 16, 2020 19:30
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Drone posted:-HONOR though the typeface almost makes it look like Sulu is gonna learn the meaning of HONDA
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May 16, 2020 19:44
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Zurui posted:IIRC this was commonly accepted canon until TNG. Some fan sources had TOS in the 25th or 26th century. Dialogue in The Squire of Gothos implies that TOS is set 900 years after the 18th century!
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May 16, 2020 19:56
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https://twitter.com/AndorianSoup/status/1261648340246310913?s=19
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May 16, 2020 20:31
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Binary Badger posted:
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May 16, 2020 21:08
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The Leisure Suit Trek Movie? Its also interesting that the current comic book licensee, IDW, was respectful enough that they deliberately had a story set in the 'Gold Key Universe' in a recent Star Trek: Waypoint issue. They didn't quite land the awkward continuity-ignoring story elements but it could pass for a later Gold Key issue, where the writers actually tried to remain within canon. Star Trek: Waypoint appears to be purely a 'maintain the license while telling the continuing adventures of..' title, but it's nice to have a comic that tells stories from all the series viewpoints. They've had TNG, TOS, Deep Space Nine, and Voyager stories and have been very good at making sure that continuity is maintained. I believe we got that comic with Data, Spot, and Lore illustrated by the great Sonny Liew from a Waypoint issue. Also refreshing that Paramount has allowed IDW to step off a little bit, the result being the Mirror Universe TNG and Voyager series (the Voyager one being a one-shot where Mirror Janeway is just trying to exploit the Delta Quadrant every chance she gets and Neelix is a traveling frenemy of some kind.) Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 01:41 on May 17, 2020 |
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May 17, 2020 01:31
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Man, I've been doing some DS9 rewatching recently, and god drat but now that I'm a bit older (and not technically A Dad but I suppose closer to Dad Age, certainly closer to the age my dad, rest him, had me) I feel like I can appreciate The Emissary a lot more. I used to feel it was a little too whiplash-paced (the station's a wreck, then they largely fix it off-camera while finding the wormhole, the Cardies show up right after the E leaves, it's difficult to tell the full timeframe of the episode) but god drat the entire first Prophets-Sisko scene is dynamite in a way I hadn't quite appreciated and feels like a justification and explanation for what kind of show the whole thing is going to be. "It is not linear." "No. *slump* It's not linear." God. Chills. It really feels like the kind of tone that Kurztrek wants to take, but the writers are too cynical to actually understand what DS9 was saying. The baseball explanation is what holds it together, despite "It is not linear" being one of the genuinely best lines and moments in the history of television. There's still a few things I don't entirely like -- I do feel like the occasional bits of militarism come across differently in 2020 than they did in the 20th century -- but god, I just had to gush somewhere that I like Emissary even better than I did when I was younger. I guess if you find a place yourself where you feel like it isn't linear anymore, you get it more.
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May 17, 2020 01:53
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Combs looks way better than the other guy did But I am always up for more Jeffrey Combs in ST
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May 17, 2020 05:41
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Zurui posted:And let's not even get into the dodgy as gently caress novelizations that were like grandma's 70's yaoi. star trek is great
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May 17, 2020 07:02
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thotsky posted:Having a separate thread for nu-trek is not a terrible idea tho. If you like them you might even prefer having that focus to go along with a show as it is being aired. honestly a big part of it is I wanted a scifi subforum and we got one so I want people to post in it so it sticks around
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May 17, 2020 07:08
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The City Builders feels like a teenagers idea of a good TOS story: "We...we built robots to build us cities, and by god, they never stopped! They never stopped!"
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May 17, 2020 07:21
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https://twitter.com/retroscifiart/status/1261919134662590467?s=19 That first one is an interesting take on the design.
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May 17, 2020 08:28
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Just finished ds9 again, I remember the bit with dukat and winn and the whole war and the conclusion of that whole deal, but I totally forgot that Sisko just fucks off to become a god kind of leaves a bad taste in my mouth, I know he's all like "I'll be back baby someday, maybe tomorrow, maybe yesterday" but gently caress, then he doesn't even say goodbye to his own son.
runaway dog fucked around with this message at 09:36 on May 17, 2020 |
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May 17, 2020 08:47
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Tighclops posted:Post the Spock helmet 
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May 17, 2020 09:05
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Kelvan ultra-warp drive is probably kept in the same Raiders-style warehouse as the tech that creates perfect android duplicates of people or swaps minds between bodies, and plant spores that cure illnesses, repair damaged organs and protect against radiation.
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May 17, 2020 09:41
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Payndz posted:Kelvan ultra-warp drive is probably kept in the same Raiders-style warehouse as the tech that creates perfect android duplicates of people or swaps minds between bodies, and plant spores that cure illnesses, repair damaged organs and protect against radiation. People joke about this a lot but I actually would like to think that the Federation is smart enough to keep technologies that would radically alter/destabilize society under wraps and revisit them in the future, or at least gradually introduce them instead of just being like "yeah we can cross the galaxy in ten years now, shuttles can fly through stars, android immortality is possible and there are multiple time travel methods of varying reliability and accuracy, go nuts". Fake edit: did some math for funsies, under the TOS "warp factor = cube of the velocity in c" system the Kelvan upgrades equaled approximately warp 20.6.
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May 17, 2020 13:07
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4000 Dollar Suit posted:Just finished ds9 again, I remember the bit with dukat and winn and the whole war and the conclusion of that whole deal, but I totally forgot that Sisko just fucks off to become a god kind of leaves a bad taste in my mouth, I know he's all like "I'll be back baby someday, maybe tomorrow, maybe yesterday" but gently caress, then he doesn't even say goodbye to his own son. Avery Brooks wasn't a fan of it either - that's why he's got the line about coming back someday, he insisted on it to try and soften it.
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May 17, 2020 13:35
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This O'Brien undercover in the Orion syndicate episode was weird. Who the fucks idea was it to give him that assignment.
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May 17, 2020 14:13
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John Wick of Dogs posted:This O'Brien undercover in the Orion syndicate episode was weird. The O'Brien Must Suffer division of Starfleet Intelligence was ridiculed at first, but dammit, they got results
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May 17, 2020 15:07
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"We need a tech guy for this mission to earn their trust" "How about the guy who keeps the most strategically important station in the federation operational?" "Great let's check his personnel file to see if he ever gets too sympathetic with people, jeopardizing missions" "I read through most of it last night, from Aalbie to Tosj, didn't see anything out of the ordinary"
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May 17, 2020 15:32
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I assume it’s like jury duty. Sometimes your number just comes up, but everyone in starfleet is too upstanding to try to get out of it. I also assume that’s what actually happened with Chain of Command.
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May 17, 2020 15:42
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Some people still put care and attention into Enterprise: From Mike Okuda: quote:Faith of the Heart: The bridge of the Enterprise NX-01 was designed to be more cluttered and more contemporary than the original series bridge. For this prequel series, production designer Herman Zimmerman wanted to evoke the tight, stark functionality of a nuclear submarine or the space shuttle, rather than the spacious elegance of later ships. I filled the panels with physical buttons (in contrast to the software-defined flatscreen panels of 24th century ships), and I put columns of rectangular icons on the computer screens (animated by Jim Van Over, Sr.) I wanted to imply a precursor to Matt Jefferies’ blinkie screens in the original series. With each succeeding season of ST:Enterprise, I added a more columns of icons to the screens, suggesting (I hoped) that technology was progressing toward the sophisticated simplicity of the panels in Kirk’s ship.
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May 17, 2020 18:10
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ENT had fine set design, and I thought the uniforms made sense at least.
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May 17, 2020 18:13
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Most things in ENT were quite good except the characters and writing.
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May 17, 2020 18:17
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Yeah, I don't really have any complaints about the visual design of Enterprise, they did a good job making it in universe retro while having modern set design. That's why anything since then has been a cop-out.
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May 17, 2020 18:21
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Drone posted:Most things in ENT were quite good except the characters and writing. I like the episode where Trip accidentally gets pregnant from an alien and everyone decides to make fun of him instead of showing concern.
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May 17, 2020 18:43
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I genuinely really enjoy Enterprise and I really like the episode where they clone an injured Trip and harvest the clone’s organs to keep him alive. Also the episode where Trip teaches the species with three genders about equality, and the alien ends up killing herself over it lmao
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May 17, 2020 19:25
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Payndz posted:Kelvan ultra-warp drive is probably kept in the same Raiders-style warehouse as the tech that creates perfect android duplicates of people or swaps minds between bodies, and plant spores that cure illnesses, repair damaged organs and protect against radiation. My favourite theory is that Starfleet gets Kirk’s logs and just say ‘uh-huh, today you met Abraham Lincoln floating in space and you and Spock joined him and Vulcan Jesus in a battle against the Evils of the Universe’. There’s also the idea that they can easily travel in time by flying round a sun (to the extent they do it for shits and giggles under the guise of historical research), however post TOS this was completely forgotten as a reliable way of time travel. Would’ve let Voyager get home in Future’s End, for one...
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May 17, 2020 19:27
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The_Doctor posted:Some people still put care and attention into Enterprise: Not enough lens flare, lights pointed directly in the face, and transparent plastic. We’re supposed to believe this is the future???
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May 17, 2020 19:33
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floodlights pointing out of the bulkheads at eye level is so stupid who thinks that's cool looking
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May 17, 2020 19:36
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Drone posted:Most things in ENT were quite good
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May 17, 2020 19:39
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Yep. Rewatching it directly after Voyager, the writing and characters have way more substance than general fan opinions would lead anyone to believe. Still not as consistent as TNG or DS9, but as a show about a bunch of idiot humans bumbling their way through cosmic diplomacy in a space submarine, it’s very enjoyable. Enterprise Good.
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May 17, 2020 20:06
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My favorite thing about the aesthetic design of the various Treks is that you can pinpoint the decade they were made in, yet (for the most part) they don't feel dated. TNG has these pastel hallways and tan, blocky tech, and a big wooden arch on the bridge. That, coupled with the hair and makeup (especially Troi's) of the crew makes it really obvious that it's late 80s. And then we get to ENT and you get those repurposed early-flatscreen Dell monitors, the silvery, exposed metal, kind of "unfinished" future tech look for a lot of the gadgets, and whatever the hell is happening with these women's hair and makeup. The very dark, very thin, sort of pointed arch on the eyebrows especially.  On the "immediately dates the show" side of things, Trip's sunglasses. 
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