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8one6
May 20, 2012

When in doubt, err on the side of Awesome!

This is responding to something from pages back and I apologize but...

... :negative:

Edit: and a lovely page snipe to boot.

I just don't understand how Crafty Games could be "just a few months away" from completing something they took preorders on almost a decade ago, or how someone would willingly give money to a company's kickstarter with that hanging over them.

2nd edit: loving poo poo, Crafty has run three kickstarters for Mistborn stuff.

8one6 fucked around with this message at 10:35 on May 17, 2020

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Tsilkani
Jul 28, 2013

8one6 posted:

This is responding to something from pages back and I apologize but...

... :negative:

Edit: and a lovely page snipe to boot.

I just don't understand how Crafty Games could be "just a few months away" from completing something they took preorders on almost a decade ago, or how someone would willingly give money to a company's kickstarter with that hanging over them.

2nd edit: loving poo poo, Crafty has run three kickstarters for Mistborn stuff.

Part of it is that they've backburnered Spellbound to focus on the Mistborn stuff, since it pays the bills for them. It's also been delayed since the d20 boom ended and they've pared down the company to just two or three guys, I think.

Still, I wants it.

Zurui
Apr 20, 2005
Even now...



I just wanted to interrupt this thread to say how sweet and wonderful it is that the Bakers troll the tags for their games on Twitter so they can like and comment (positively) on people's play experiences.

The Lore Bear
Jan 21, 2014

I don't know what to put here. Guys? GUYS?!

Tsilkani posted:

Part of it is that they've backburnered Spellbound to focus on the Mistborn stuff, since it pays the bills for them. It's also been delayed since the d20 boom ended and they've pared down the company to just two or three guys, I think.

Still, I wants it.

Yeah, the issue is that Mistborn pays the bills and it really is a small-time show. I talked to one of the guys from Crafty at a local con, and it's a combination of branching out and keeping the lights on. Also, I imagine a few months of work away is a lot if you count them as months worth of full time work rather than just a unit of time. Months of work can take years to do if you don't have the time.

Kestral
Nov 24, 2000

Forum Veteran

Zurui posted:

I just wanted to interrupt this thread to say how sweet and wonderful it is that the Bakers troll the tags for their games on Twitter so they can like and comment (positively) on people's play experiences.


Meguey Baker in particular is one of the nicest people on the planet, a whirlwind of positive energy. If you're ever at Big Bad Con and manage to get up on one of the balcony areas or have a room overlooking the lobby, you can tell where she is by the convection cell patterns of people swirling around her as she tries valiantly to cross a room in under 90 minutes while Vincent sort of smiles bemusedly.

DocBubonic
Mar 11, 2003

Tempora mutantur, et nos mutamur in illis

Bieeanshee posted:

I've always been amused by Illuminopoly. Pardon any frivolous fnords.

http://www.gamecabinet.com/rules/Illuminopoly.html

Wait, I didn't see any fnords! :tinfoil:

Absurd Alhazred
Mar 27, 2010

by Athanatos
e: nm

Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Jul 22, 2020

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Well now, that must make Crawford feel great, wasn't he the one that tweeted Mearls was no longer working on the TTRPG?

moths
Aug 25, 2004

I would also still appreciate some danger.



Did they, though? Wouldn't this have linked to the confirmation?

Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!

moths posted:

Did they, though? Wouldn't this have linked to the confirmation?

They didn't link it because they are basically livetweeting the D&D Twitch Stream from today that is till going on.

Mearls clip:
https://www.twitch.tv/dnd/clip/HardYawningBeefKippa?filter=clips&range=7d&sort=time

moths
Aug 25, 2004

I would also still appreciate some danger.



Well gently caress.

Thanks for the link though. I am beginning to suspect that they deliberately make lovely announcements in hard-to-quote media.

Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!
For 5e's audience, a Twitch stream is massively more visible than any written article/release. This is a product literally built on the back of livestreaming.

paradoxGentleman
Dec 10, 2013

wheres the jester, I could do with some pointless nonsense right about now

How disappointing.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

Silver lining is that this means they can kick him off again!

thetoughestbean
Apr 27, 2013

Keep On Shroomin
I don’t get why they keep Mearls around. At best, he’s incredibly mediocre. There isn’t any reason to not replace him with somebody competent

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

thetoughestbean posted:

I don’t get why they keep Mearls around. At best, he’s incredibly mediocre. There isn’t any reason to not replace him with somebody competent

Perhaps he shmoozes well?

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.
I mean he was on literally far and away the most successful version of D&D

How much of that is because of him, a minimal amount, but by god he was in charge and thus should reap the benefits of his comical good luck.

Desiden
Mar 13, 2016

Mindless self indulgence is SRS BIZNS

thetoughestbean posted:

I don’t get why they keep Mearls around. At best, he’s incredibly mediocre. There isn’t any reason to not replace him with somebody competent

Because the brand is doing well and is getting some positive press as being in a "revival", and Mearls' blunders haven't caused a backlash that's been picked up in the wider media beyond some specific online RPG discussion space. 5e is also selling very well, but the actual revenue probably matters little to Hasbro; so long as it's not losing money, they can keep making books.

Sure, that brand and revenue success has little to do with Mearls, but so long as doesn't personally irk his bosses or do something that starts harming the brand image beyond people yelling at his silent account on twitter, they don't give a poo poo. If articles on the nerdist or whatever go from "why is everyone in love with DnD again?" to "Why is Mike Mearls hiring abusive pants shitters to run DnD?", he'll be fired in a day. But until if/when Hasbro feels Mearls' presence is harming their ability to license the IP for games or movies or whatever, they're not going to really care about whether they could get 0.000000000...00001% more annual revenue out of 5e books by firing him.

StratGoatCom
Aug 6, 2019

Our security is guaranteed by being able to melt the eyeballs of any other forum's denizens at 15 minutes notice


Why, why can't we be shot of that stinkyhole for good?

Mystic Mongol
Jan 5, 2007

Your life's been thrown in disarray already--I wouldn't want you to feel pressured.


College Slice

thetoughestbean posted:

Has there been a single person in this thread that’s said that Monopoly is fun?

In real life, I've occasionally said Monopoly is fun when played competitively against people who have never played the game Rules as Written before. Fifteen minutes in you're looking at them hooded eyes over a fist full of high end property while they try to figure out why you have alllll the money.

Good game design is interesting choices, but there are no choices in Monopoly--there's an ideal strategy where you constantly buy properties, mortgage them, sell them to idiots, and repeat until half the board is foreclosed on and the other half has three houses on each. (Hotels? You credulous fool, why). Soon the entire board is full of slums you don't have any incentive to continue improving and abandoned storefronts that will never exit foreclosure.

Monopoly is a really good critique of capitalism. Fun is maybe a stretch.

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

thetoughestbean posted:

I don’t get why they keep Mearls around. At best, he’s incredibly mediocre. There isn’t any reason to not replace him with somebody competent

he's a legacy name that was present when D&D started to go from obscure basement fare to mainstream stuff. I think he's massively overblown for his own part in that, and near every product he works on without other more talented people shows what a mediocre talent he actually is, but he's wormed his way in secure enough to be a legacy and you can't just remove a legacy for supporting and covering for a rapist abuser, all the fans who TOTALLY know who he is would be outraged!

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth
I'm genuinely angry over this poo poo, 'removed from the project but still getting a heavy paycheck' was a weak punishment to begin with but the idea that they'd lie about even that is just insane. No one loving knows who he is aside from turbo nerds like us. This isn't a loving movie where you can't remove your big name star for being an abusive freak, he's Mike Who Gives A poo poo Mearls. It's just such a clear example of 'yea well he's our friend, so gently caress off'.

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009
It was never a punishment because he was very clearly never removed from anything, despite a misleading tweet that could have been construed that way.

WotC is not some poor victim being tricked by Mearls the Great Deceiver, they're been complicit in keeping him on from the start and do not give a poo poo that he solicited and aided known harassers because it doesn't impact their bottom line one iota.

gtrmp
Sep 29, 2008

Oba-Ma... Oba-Ma! Oba-Ma, aasha deh!

Dexo posted:

I mean he was on literally far and away the most successful version of D&D

As far as I know, 5e has yet to meet the sales figures that were set by 1e, let alone the multiple million-selling iterations of the Basic Set

Filboid Studge
Oct 1, 2010
And while they debated the matter among themselves, Conradin made himself another piece of toast.

gtrmp posted:

As far as I know, 5e has yet to meet the sales figures that were set by 1e, let alone the multiple million-selling iterations of the Basic Set

Yeah, I don’t think anything will overtake the red box, it shifted like five and a half million units.

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

Didn't WotC hire DungeonCommandr semi-recently?

Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!

Dawgstar posted:

Didn't WotC hire DungeonCommandr semi-recently?

Yes, and they are not taking the news well.

gourdcaptain
Nov 16, 2012

Dawgstar posted:

Didn't WotC hire DungeonCommandr semi-recently?

Who's DungeonCommandr, and do they have a history involving this that would make them annoyed/disgusted to be working under Mearls especially? I mean beyond it just being Mearls.

That Old Tree
Jun 24, 2012

nah


gourdcaptain posted:

Who's DungeonCommandr, and do they have a history involving this that would make them annoyed/disgusted to be working under Mearls especially? I mean beyond it just being Mearls.

They were very outspoken about diversity and safety before being brought onboard for D&D. But this all happened well before everyone was misled into thinking Mearls was gonepromoted away. Humans and life are endless in their complexity etc, so I don't want to roundly condemn them, but as an outside observer it sure looked like someone said all the right words about inclusivity and then packed up to go work for Superficial Wokeness Inc when they got noticed. And hey, sometimes you can effect real change by slowly replacing the existing shitlords. Sure doesn't look like that's happening this time, though!

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

That Old Tree posted:

They were very outspoken about diversity and safety before being brought onboard for D&D. But this all happened well before everyone was misled into thinking Mearls was gonepromoted away. Humans and life are endless in their complexity etc, so I don't want to roundly condemn them, but as an outside observer it sure looked like someone said all the right words about inclusivity and then packed up to go work for Superficial Wokeness Inc when they got noticed. And hey, sometimes you can effect real change by slowly replacing the existing shitlords. Sure doesn't look like that happening this time, though!

Huh?

They were contracted and worked on Mythic Odyssey's of Theros, and their contract ended when the book was finished before this news was revealed.


Like a ton of people in the D&D and tabletop community they just hate the poo poo out of Mearls, and think it's trash that he's back.

Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!

Dexo posted:

Huh?

They were contracted and worked on Mythic Odyssey's of Theros, and their contract ended when the book was finished before this news was revealed.

They list themselves as #WotCStaff on Twitter and say they have a bunch more WotC writing credits forthcoming, so I don't know why you think it was a 1-off.

That Old Tree
Jun 24, 2012

nah


^^^^ hm, anyway the main takeaway is WotC is poo poo and if you touch it you got the poop on your hands even if your intentions were very pure.

Dexo posted:

Huh?

They were contracted and worked on Mythic Odyssey's of Theros, and their contract ended when the book was finished before this news was revealed.


Like a ton of people in the D&D and tabletop community they just hate the poo poo out of Mearls, and think it's trash that he's back.

Oh I thought they were working with WotC in a more extensive manner. That kind of makes things worse to me, because even working for WotC a freelance job is poo poo money to lose credibility over.

That Old Tree fucked around with this message at 15:54 on May 22, 2020

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

Toshimo posted:

They list themselves as #WotCStaff on Twitter and say they have a bunch more WotC writing credits forthcoming, so I don't know why you think it was a 1-off.

They have credits forthcoming sure. I'm sure not everything they worked on for the year or so they were there is out yet.


I can't find the specific tweet where they said it but. Here they are mentioning their contract about to be up in back in March.


https://twitter.com/DungeonCommandr/status/1237878309343485953


That Old Tree posted:

^^^^ hm, anyway the main takeaway is WotC is poo poo and if you touch it you got the poop on your hands even if your intentions were very pure.


Oh I thought they were working with WotC in a more extensive manner. That kind of makes things worse to me, because even working for WotC a freelance job is poo poo money to lose credibility over.

Yeah nah man speak for yourself. DC has lost absolutely loving no credibility with me. Not everyone has the ability to turn down a solid contract and consistent pay. A job is a job. Gotta pay rent and bills. They are some bottom run contractor working on some stories. No where near any type of decision making process.

Surviving under Capitalism etc etc.

DressCodeBlue
Jun 15, 2006

Professional zombie impersonator.
In the same line, they also list themselves as a contractor, which encompasses a poo poo ton of people who wouldn't be considered staff. I wonder which is accurate?

Back when they announced it, it sounded like they were a full employee.

Edit: I type slow. :(

Second edit: Found the original tweet and they've always represented themselves as a contract writer. Not sure why my brain thought otherwise.

DressCodeBlue fucked around with this message at 17:00 on May 22, 2020

That Old Tree
Jun 24, 2012

nah


Dexo posted:


Surviving under Capitalism etc etc.

Yeah I'm probably being overly judgy.

Kestral
Nov 24, 2000

Forum Veteran
Contract writing for roleplaying games has got to be in the top 10 worst ways to "survive under capitalism."

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Kestral posted:

Contract writing for roleplaying games has got to be in the top 10 worst ways to "survive under capitalism."

Which is what makes this so sad for DC. Writing for D&D contract, even if it pays okay, is really about resume padding for future writing. And while I hope it matters, like if they try to get onboard with MCG or whatever, for me it never will. Having written for 5e to me isn't an endorsement, it's just... nothing.

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

Kestral posted:

Contract writing for roleplaying games has got to be in the top 10 worst ways to "survive under capitalism."


Huh?

Please correct me if I'm parsing your statement wrong, but the being a Game Designer/Narrative designer is silly, and you should do something else to make a living is certainly some argument. Considering there are tons of people doing it now.

Anyway, my philosophy.

https://twitter.com/bombsfall/status/569072652096286720

theironjef posted:

Which is what makes this so sad for DC. Writing for D&D contract, even if it pays okay, is really about resume padding for future writing. And while I hope it matters, like if they try to get onboard with MCG or whatever, for me it never will. Having written for 5e to me isn't an endorsement, it's just... nothing.

It's a Job, that pays rent for a year or however long the contract is. And frees one from the stresses of the freelance hustle, for if only little while. They don't particularly need some forum posters endorsement. Being published and credited does help get other writing jobs.

Dexo fucked around with this message at 18:12 on May 22, 2020

DressCodeBlue
Jun 15, 2006

Professional zombie impersonator.
I think their meaning is the pay is usually absolute garbage.

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homullus
Mar 27, 2009

Dexo posted:

Huh?

Please correct me if I'm parsing your statement wrong, but the being a Game Designer/Narrative designer is silly, and you should do something else to make a living is certainly some argument. Considering there are tons of people doing it now.

Anyway, my philosophy.

https://twitter.com/bombsfall/status/569072652096286720


It's a Job, that pays rent for a year or however long the contract is. And frees one from the stresses of the freelance hustle, for if only little while. They don't particularly need some forum posters endorsement. Being published and credited does help get other writing jobs.

I think the point was that the way they treat you and pay you with that job sucks, and should be much better, which is why it's a bad way to survive under capitalism. It's not that DC made a bad choice in taking the job.

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