|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 18:44
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 20:05 |
|
|
Andrast posted:Don't forget enterprise! I think it's best for all concerned if we forget Enterprise.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 19:24
|
|
|
How the gently caress is this guy even real. He's like a living caricature.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 19:24
|
|
|
Sunswipe posted:I think it's best for all concerned if we forget Enterprise. Enterprise gets a bad rap. It starts out unremarkable and ends up pretty good.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 19:55
|
|
|
I don't want to spoil what's behind this link, you have to see it for yourself. It's work safe. https://www.bigbadtoystore.com/Product/VariationDetails/126680
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 20:57
|
|
|
Cleretic posted:It sounds dumb when I type it out, but I feel like Trek exists in this weird space where it's a respected, classic Thing in nerd culture, but the original product is so of-its-time, slow-paced, and occasionally dense that it actually is kinda hard to watch the original shows that gave it that reputation. I'm sure it's not a large crowd, but I bet there are a few nerds that claim to be 'Trek fans' but just COMPLETELY bounce off of TOS and Next Gen. TOS is old enough and grounded enough in bygone cultural mores that it is embraced and respected by a good chunk of capital-c Conservative America, let alone conservative nerdkind. It provides a window into old Boomer dreams of the future, and by heck that means swaggering space captains providing the crew of mighty starships with Proper Leadership, who demand Respect and expect winsome female yeomans to bring them coffee while they lay down the law. Remember how many people decried Discovery for being "SJW" ? They weren't all under 30. Or even 40. It is entirely possible to be a conservative Trek fan, although they tend to stick their fingers in their ears and ignore TNG (or reject it as a relic of their teenage naivete). That type can get really into the final seasons of DS9 too.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 21:14
|
|
|
Loxbourne posted:TOS is old enough and grounded enough in bygone cultural mores that it is embraced and respected by a good chunk of capital-c Conservative America, let alone conservative nerdkind. okay see even this is a bizarre read on TOS and I am wondering if you've watched it recently
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 21:22
|
|
|
Knormal posted:I don't want to spoil what's behind this link, you have to see it for yourself. It's work safe. Oh my god. I mean the detail is impressive but, who will actually pay that for that? Oh wait we live in a world full of funkopops, there's no end of idiots who'll buy that.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 21:30
|
|
|
Knormal posted:I don't want to spoil what's behind this link, you have to see it for yourself. It's work safe. I can finally complete my Final Fantasy 15 cosplay now!! Hector Delgado has a new favorite as of 22:22 on Jun 6, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 21:42
|
|
|
Hector Delgado posted:I can finally complete my Final Fantasy 15 cosplay outfit now!! I don't get it. Are you cosplaying a cosplayer.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 21:45
|
|
|
Loxbourne posted:TOS is old enough and grounded enough in bygone cultural mores that it is embraced and respected by a good chunk of capital-c Conservative America, let alone conservative nerdkind. This part's absolutely true, my folks are on the religious/far right end of the spectrum and they still watch TOS religiously every weekend despite it being embedded in space communism and a sizable percentage of episodes are literally "we have moved beyond the need for a religion". It's very much grandfathered in as a show that's good because it's old.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:07
|
|
|
Pick posted:okay see even this is a bizarre read on TOS and I am wondering if you've watched it recently The idea of TOS as "swaggering space captain, etc" is probably how it gets reconciled with conservatives, though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:10
|
|
|
Kirk did have lots of swagger
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:20
|
|
|
Fruits of the sea posted:I don't get it. Are you cosplaying a cosplayer. Yeah I worded that poorly. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:21
|
|
|
It's particularly funny because a lot of the shows that olds liked in the day were too progressive for the networks of the time to touch, they didn't like it. So Lucille Ball, after her pilot was rejected because it starred her and her husband Ricky and they were an interracial couple, took her money and made her OWN studio, and self published her show. Then, she picked up Gene Roddenberry's show about space communism and why it's awesome. The kinds of people who misread Star Trek are precisely the people who almost prevented it existing. The shows they loved were taking down anti-miscegenation and anti-commie propaganda while they were completely missing the point of them.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:23
|
|
|
Dragonwagon posted:How the gently caress is this guy even real. He's like a living caricature. Is One Angry Gamer secretly Ken M?
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:26
|
|
|
cakesmith handyman posted:Oh my god. There's these model kits too http://schizophonic9.com/re6/bandai_playstation.html http://schizophonic9.com/re6/bandai_segasaturn.html
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:46
|
|
|
He's so close, that One Angry Gamer. 'Everyone I love and admire is taking this political stance! clearly they're all bad after all!' So close.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 22:54
|
|
|
I bet he thinks he’s getting back at those “ess jay dubbyas” for pointing out every tiny instance of inclusivity because he pretends to believe with every fiber of his being that tiny LGBTQ+ flags in a game background is equal to pointing out a small but significant instance of bigotry, like when a transphobic poem provided by a crowdfunding backer was removed in Pillars of Eternity.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 23:42
|
|
|
Captain Hygiene posted:This part's absolutely true, my folks are on the religious/far right end of the spectrum and they still watch TOS religiously every weekend despite it being embedded in space communism and a sizable percentage of episodes are literally "we have moved beyond the need for a religion". It's very much grandfathered in as a show that's good because it's old. There's an episode ("Let That Be Your Last Battlefield") that does everything but have the entire cast turn to camera and say "Racism is stupid and bad." It has been criticised for being too heavy-handed, but it seems they weren't heavy-handed enough. I normally hate fan gate-keeping poo poo, but anyone who decries modern Star Trek for engaging in "SJW stuff" is no fan, and also a loving moron.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 23:44
|
|
|
Inspector Gesicht posted:This racist is hilarious. The metal gear series is well known for loving America and all it does right?
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 23:49
|
|
|
Having an interracial kiss back then was loving shocking, I would think
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 23:50
|
|
|
Randaconda posted:Having an interracial kiss back then was loving shocking, I would think If I'm remembering correctly, they were supposed to film two versions of the Kirk/Uhura kiss scene, one where they kiss and one where they don't, so the latter version could be broadcast in the south. Apparently, Shatner kept deliberately flubbing the filming of that version until they ran out of time to film and had to use the kiss in all versions of the episode. e: Yes, trap sprung, I like Star Trek. It's just a shame there hasn't been any since Deep Space Nine finished.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 23:52
|
|
|
Sunswipe posted:There's an episode ("Let That Be Your Last Battlefield") that does everything but have the entire cast turn to camera and say "Racism is stupid and bad." It has been criticised for being too heavy-handed, but it seems they weren't heavy-handed enough. I normally hate fan gate-keeping poo poo, but anyone who decries modern Star Trek for engaging in "SJW stuff" is no fan, and also a loving moron. The funny (well, not haha funny) thing is, that particular episode goes down well enough because it's so large scale of a statement. It's easy to watch that and go "yes, racism is bad, I am a good person for not being racist  " but then turn around and complain on facebook that those darn protesters are causing trouble again or whatever.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 00:00
|
|
|
Sunswipe posted:If I'm remembering correctly, they were supposed to film two versions of the Kirk/Uhura kiss scene, one where they kiss and one where they don't, so the latter version could be broadcast in the south. Apparently, Shatner kept deliberately flubbing the filming of that version until they ran out of time to film and had to use the kiss in all versions of the episode. There's actually a pretty good interview with Nichelle Nichols about it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 00:05
|
|
|
Sunswipe posted:If I'm remembering correctly, they were supposed to film two versions of the Kirk/Uhura kiss scene, one where they kiss and one where they don't, so the latter version could be broadcast in the south. Apparently, Shatner kept deliberately flubbing the filming of that version until they ran out of time to film and had to use the kiss in all versions of the episode. I grew up watching og Star Trek since it was still rerun all the time in the 80s and 90s, along with TNG, so I feel you
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 00:10
|
|
|
Sunswipe posted:If I'm remembering correctly, they were supposed to film two versions of the Kirk/Uhura kiss scene, one where they kiss and one where they don't, so the latter version could be broadcast in the south. Apparently, Shatner kept deliberately flubbing the filming of that version until they ran out of time to film and had to use the kiss in all versions of the episode. And then subtle stuff with Uhura. Kirk takes a few of the bridge crew and then gives Uhura the conn. Of one of the 12 most powerful units in Starfleet. She's a qualified watchstander, sits at the helm station, by being head of communications she's a sub-department head under Scotty, and is probably the ship's expert on encryption and communications security - if she isn't, she's that person's boss. They never say any of that, but just her moving down to the helm station speaks volumes about her qualifications.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 02:05
|
|
|
I'm not a star trek fan, so forgive me if this is a stupid/naive question. Was there as big a kerfuffle about Worf marrying a white woman in, I think DS9? Or was that OK, because Worf is Kilingon, and if I remember right, the woman wasn't actually a woman but a 1,000 year old parasitic worm who could inhabit bodies of any gender.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 04:20
|
|
|
BrigadierSensible posted:I'm not a star trek fan, so forgive me if this is a stupid/naive question. The much bigger issue involved with DS9 was when Dax, the aforementioned 1,000 year old worm inhabiting a woman at the time, got in a relationship with another worm woman. I think it was the first same-sex kiss in syndicated television or some minor milestone like that. The problem was the head of Star Trek at Paramount at the time was homophobic and wouldn't let any gay characters appear, so they were very clear in the episode that the only reason they were in a relationship was because they were in a previous relationship as a man and a woman. It was a very half-assed and phoned-in attempt at pushing boundaries. The Star Trek Wiki has a lot more info about its reception: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Rejoined_(episode). It wasn't until Star Trek Beyond in 2016 when they retconned Sulu as gay that Star Trek had an official gay character, and if I remember right even then they just showed him holding hands with another man. Star Trek has a pretty disgraceful track record with homosexuality for as progressive as people credit it as being.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 04:45
|
|
|
Knormal posted:It wasn't until Star Trek Beyond in 2016 when they retconned Sulu as gay that Star Trek had an official gay character, and if I remember right even then they just showed him holding hands with another man. Star Trek has a pretty disgraceful track record with homosexuality for as progressive as people credit it as being. In Beyond, you saw both Sulu’s partner and daughter. I don’t recall if there was any more PDA, but they were pretty clearly a family, which I’m sure had some idiots clutching their pearls.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 05:06
|
|
|
Takei was actually pissed at that change because he played and viewed Sulu as a straight man. I don't know if there was any controversy with Worf getting married to a white woman, but there was a controversy with Dax's actress and Spermin' Rick Berman, which FINAL SEASON DS9 SPOILERS led to her leaving the show, so her character got killed off. So the symbiotic worm inside her went into another host body, who had no romantic feelings towards Worf. It's awful that she left the show,. It from a story standpoint, if they were gonna kill one character off, one that can go into a new body and have a new personality and access the memories of past lives is the perfect one to kill.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 05:43
|
|
|
The Sulu thing is mostly just weird because he was straight in the original timeline and he was already born when the Narada arrived. Time-travelling spaceships make you gay.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 05:49
|
|
|
Detective No. 27 posted:Takei was actually pissed at that change because he played and viewed Sulu as a straight man. They actually do a few interesting things with that; Worf is pretty distraught about Jadzia and then has a lot of trouble dealing with someone with all of her memories showing up, and they actually end up sleeping together, making things even more awkward. Ezri eventually just says they made a mistake, and that's okay because they're people with flaws and traumas, and they can admit it and move on with their lives.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 05:59
|
|
|
I forgot to address the actual controversy, which was Rick Berman's treatment of Terry Farrell, which extends to most of the other female actors on the various Trek shows he worked on.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 06:09
|
|
|
mandatory lesbian posted:The metal gear series is well known for loving America and all it does right? Metal Gear repeatedly calls out America's actions within the series as lovely. A major point of MGS3 was America basically forcing someone to be a sacrificial lamb, which eventually rippled outward and caused every villain later in the timeline, directly or indirectly. The military-industrial complex and war economy are also decried as a horrific waste of human life and resources. Ground Zeroes even takes place entirely on Guantanamo Bay, with graphic torture and prisoner executions.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 06:41
|
|
|
I believe he hated Gates McFadden to the point he made an ultimatum to Roddenberry that either she leaves or he leaves. That's why she got fired for season 2. Patrick Stewart actually threatened to leave the show if they didn't bring her back for s3.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 06:41
|
|
|
grittyreboot posted:I believe he hated Gates McFadden to the point he made an ultimatum to Roddenberry that either she leaves or he leaves. That's why she got fired for season 2. Patrick Stewart actually threatened to leave the show if they didn't bring her back for s3. That was Maurice Hurley.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 07:12
|
|
|
Schubalts posted:Metal Gear repeatedly calls out America's actions within the series as lovely. A major point of MGS3 was America basically forcing someone to be a sacrificial lamb, which eventually rippled outward and caused every villain later in the timeline, directly or indirectly. The military-industrial complex and war economy are also decried as a horrific waste of human life and resources. Yeah but then Phantom Pain has you running around Africa enslaving people while saving the world, so it's kind of not going the whole way.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 08:06
|
|
|
Hel posted:Yeah but then Phantom Pain has you running around Africa enslaving people while saving the world, so it's kind of not going the whole way. Kind of a theme in that game is that by then you're well past the point where you were the good guy.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 08:19
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 20:05 |
|
|
Knormal posted:That was in 1995, so while modern times have proven I'm sure there were many people against interracial relationships at the time, the internet was too young for them to have a place to say it publicly. I don't remember hearing any chatter about it on Star Trek boards and the like at the time, other than by people upset it had wrecked the Worf/Troi stuff they'd started to set up at the end of TNG. David Gerrold pitched an AIDS allegory script to TNG. It included a gay couple on the Enterprise-D. The producers quashed it. He turned it into a novel in his Star Wolf setting, and it's a hell of a story. The fan production New Voyages would go on to produce the script. Unfortunately they let Gerrold direct it, and... he's a great writer, but so much a director - and it shows. It's still a good episode of Star Trek and should have been produced as a TNG episode in the first place. Here it is with Kirk et al, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWWR9z71CFI
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 08:41
|
|