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Did Roger Zelazny do anything weird or bad beyond garden variety sexism?
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Jun 11, 2020 07:30
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Was it Isamov or Bradbury who recently got outed as a paedo? I remember there being a story about someone painting a crying nude mexican child. It resurfaced on twitter recently too, but it's one of those "too horrible to remember" deals. hyperhazard posted:Was it Terry Goodkind or Piers Anthony that had the book where the main character is tortured by the dominatrix with the magical pain fuckstick? I remember they turned the series into a show, but I'm not googling any of those combinations of words. that scene occupies less than a 100 pages out of an 800-900 page work, it takes place exclusively in the last third of the work, yet it is the only thing anyone remembers from The Wizard's First Rule. also 2nding Wizard People, Dear Readers. Relistening to it I had forgotten how fatphobic it is, and how often it calls cousin Roast Beefy-Weefs retarded.
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Jun 11, 2020 07:33
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Man, you write about the dominatrix with the magical pain fuckstick just once ...
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Jun 11, 2020 09:34
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You're not thinking of Clarke and his Srilankan houseboys?
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Jun 11, 2020 09:34
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The golden age of SF wasn't golden for everyonequote:As others have said, Forrest Ackerman is having his own #MeToo moment. However, Ackerman's sins went beyond harassing women to also being known for not paying and/or exploiting authors along with rumors of child porn and more. Turns out all the really dark creepy stuff that we hear about happening in insular circles has always been happening and power+prestige make people into monsters. Plus for "outsider" communities it becomes an supremely unhealthy extreme us vs. them mentality to the point of protecting the Big Names even when its things like pedophiles. We kind of saw that happen with the furry community from the 80s to now where nazis and extreme fetishists took over and dominated the conversation until they were forced out to the periphery.
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Jun 11, 2020 09:44
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Wouldn''t save a lot of time if we just made a (short) list of all the famous people who aren't pedos/racists/homophobes/etc?
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Jun 11, 2020 09:56
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Laterite posted:Man, you write about the dominatrix with the magical pain fuckstick just once ... Don't they make their dominatrix outfits out of their mom's skin and cap off their training by torturing their dads to death, or something like that? Those books were grody!
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Jun 11, 2020 10:44
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:that scene occupies less than a 100 pages out of an 800-900 page work, it takes place exclusively in the last third of the work, yet it is the only thing anyone remembers from The Wizard's First Rule. Sometimes they remember the protagonist literally kicking the teeth out of a child's face. Though admittedly that happens during the magic dominatrix plotline so maybe it doesn't count as another thing.
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Jun 11, 2020 11:11
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There is a long Let's Read of Goodkind's stuff that is worth a look if you want to see how bad it gets.
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Jun 11, 2020 11:13
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:
Were there any people in the movie who were fat and not an rear end in a top hat? Hagrid maybe, but he's more giant than fat.
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Jun 11, 2020 15:35
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I posted the line "clever turnips, these needle-teeth" on Tumblr one time and someone got mad thinking it was an actual slur
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Jun 11, 2020 15:39
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WaywardWoodwose posted:Were there any people in the movie who were fat and not an rear end in a top hat? Hagrid maybe, but he's more giant than fat. Did the movies retain that one chapter where Dudley apologizes for being such a piece of poo poo?
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Jun 11, 2020 15:46
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They filmed Dudley's apology but it didn't make the final cut.WaywardWoodwose posted:Were there any people in the movie who were fat and not an rear end in a top hat? Hagrid maybe, but he's more giant than fat. Jacob, who is one of the only redeeming elements of the prequels.
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Jun 11, 2020 15:51
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:
you god damned buffoon, you utter loving moron. How can you not see that was a deconstruction of Rowling's near inescapable ableism and body shaming. That poo poo is in all of her terrible books. Every page of Cormoran Strike is punching down on people for being dumb, ugly, fat, not wearing the right make up, not being feminine enough, being too feminine, etc. She's not good people Jokerpilled Drudge has a new favorite as of 16:35 on Jun 11, 2020 |
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Jun 11, 2020 16:12
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pentyne posted:The golden age of SF wasn't golden for everyone Noooo, not Clarke  Please tell me Vonnegut is still cool.
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Jun 11, 2020 16:29
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Remember that time Gene Roddenberry directed a movie and made a pedophile/serial killer his self-insert character? https://trekmovie.com/2017/07/12/forgotten-roddenberry-pretty-maids-all-in-a-row/
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Jun 11, 2020 16:34
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Chubby Henparty posted:You're not thinking of Clarke and his Srilankan houseboys? owp, looks like I was, i forgot about that Vice article. Thanks! Spek posted:Sometimes they remember the protagonist literally kicking the teeth out of a child's face. Though admittedly that happens during the magic dominatrix plotline so maybe it doesn't count as another thing. i know you know this but for anyone following along at home: it was a princess and the kick not only broke her jaw and shattered her teeth, but severed her tongue. I think it's implied she bled to death after because that's the last time Margaret (??) is seen. purple death ray posted:I posted the line "clever turnips, these needle-teeth" on Tumblr one time and someone got mad thinking it was an actual slur brad neely has such a masterful grasp of language that he writes sentences like a ballerina dances. Jokerpilled Drudge posted:you god damned buffoon, you utter loving moron. wizard people dear readers predates the strike books by 11 years. you, uh, vile hamhock of a rectal-canker... guy... yeah. take that, you ol'... so and so...
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Jun 11, 2020 16:50
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:wizard people dear readers predates the strike books by 11 years. you, uh, vile hamhock of a rectal-canker... guy... yeah. take that, you ol'... so and so... Evil people being fat/ugly/dumb is a JK Rowling thing that Neely was calling her out for You saw the video, and decided to call out Neely for that. Nice thinking!
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Jun 11, 2020 16:58
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Also, this might be apocryphal, but I had heard Brad Neely hadn't read Harry Potter when he got the idea, and only watched the movie once before recording it. it's definitely got its issues as most 00s internet comedy does and I'm not trying to downplay emJokerpilled Drudge posted:Evil people being fat/ugly/dumb is a JK Rowling thing that Neely was calling her out for How come Hermione is a hideous Medusa child in wizard people tho
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Jun 11, 2020 16:59
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Jokerpilled Drudge posted:Evil people being fat/ugly/dumb is a JK Rowling thing that Neely was calling her out for shut the gently caress up you worthless sack of ex-jizz, i will fold you in half so many times you legally qualify as a katana. if i ever hear that you have even so much as considered posting again i will force feed you your own hands so hard you become a Fully Cucked & Loving It Ouroboros.
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Jun 11, 2020 17:08
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purple death ray posted:How come Hermione is a hideous Medusa child in wizard people tho early 00's was a confusing time for hair
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Jun 11, 2020 17:34
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drudge you're half a poo poo smeared over way too many biscuits.
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Jun 11, 2020 17:36
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DontMockMySmock posted:Noooo, not Clarke Vonnegut scholar chiming in! He was a good guy all told, he was just very grouchy and difficult a lot of the time. He could definitely be an arsehole, and he really wasn't the best husband and father, but his son (a trained psychiatrist) put a lot of that down to untreated PTSD. However, all the stories about him being encouraging and kind to people are all true, and he could be remarkably open and generous to pretty much everyone when he was well. There's certainly no evidence he was a creep or a paedo or a racist (more than your average person was at the time, anyway), unlike every other scifi author in existence. EDIT - sorry, for accuracy; his son was a paediatrician, not a psychiatrist, but he knew his poo poo when it came to psychological disorders, since he had to deal with severe mental illness throughout his life Barry Foster has a new favorite as of 17:47 on Jun 11, 2020 |
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Jun 11, 2020 17:37
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:i know you know this but for anyone following along at home: it was a princess and the kick not only broke her jaw and shattered her teeth, but severed her tongue. I think it's implied she bled to death after because that's the last time Margaret (??) is seen. The bratty princess shows up towards the end of the last few books in the first series. Pretty sure she then dies horribly when she gets eaten by a monster, but she absolutely doesn't die from the teeth kicking.
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Jun 11, 2020 18:18
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Barry Foster posted:Vonnegut scholar chiming in! Phew! I do know that, at least at some points in his life, he had socialist tendencies. And I obviously know from his books that he was anti-war, anti-fascist, etc. I'm just worried that someone is gonna post a quote of him saying like "but also, i hate the gays" or whatever. Also, Slaughterhouse-Five is a strong contender for my favorite book of all time, and IMO no one who reads that can possibly think that Vonnegut didn't have PTSD or at least have intimate knowledge of it. So whether he's pediatrician or psychiatrist, I believe the son's diagnosis.
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Jun 11, 2020 18:31
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Ghost Leviathan posted:They filmed this in a nuclear test site and everyone got cancer iirc not "in" one, just immediately downwind of one, which the government swore up and down was completely safe and not at all dangerous, swear to God, y'all, pay no attention to how it snowed around here every time we set one of those suckers off. But here's the kicker! On-site filming in Utah wound up being a total shitshow, and they ended up needing to do extensive reshoots back in LA. So Howard Hughes- the (in)famously brainworms-riddled billionaire/airplane guy who was producing the movie- forked out to have SEVERAL DOZEN TONS of (fallout-riddled, radioactive) soil excavated from the original filming site in Utah, trucked out to Hollywood, and dumped into the studio lots to make sure the reshoots matched up with the original footage. Argus Zant has a new favorite as of 18:54 on Jun 11, 2020 |
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Jun 11, 2020 18:50
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in the "authors that aren't poo poo" category I nominate Tamora Pierce, who has basically always been an ally and super pro LGBTQ, she's made some mistakes but not any worse than the usual "of the times" phrasing problems and recently posted a huge twitter dunk on JKR The Alanna books owned when I was a kid and probably still do
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Jun 11, 2020 19:06
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No surprise with Clarke. I adored his writing as a kid, but even then i could sense the skeezy "white expatriate in asia" vibes before i fully understood the stereotype.
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Jun 11, 2020 19:06
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Harry Enfield says blacking up as Mandela was 'so wrong it was right' On Radio 4’s Today programme, the comedian justified decision to portray former South African president in blackface
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Jun 11, 2020 19:11
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TheKennedys posted:in the "authors that aren't poo poo" category I nominate Tamora Pierce, who has basically always been an ally and super pro LGBTQ, she's made some mistakes but not any worse than the usual "of the times" phrasing problems and recently posted a huge twitter dunk on JKR Applegate and her husband (K. A. Applegate, collectively) also support trans rights and have a trans daughter. Animorphs was also real good for the most part (a 50+ book YA series is bound to have weaker parts) and dealt with legit character traumatizing events over the course of the series. Also it had a black girl main character right from the start. gently caress off with trying to score diversity points years after the fact, Rowling.
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Jun 11, 2020 19:56
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Ok so what about the James Clavell books, did those age well? I feel like they could be accused of orientalism edit: can we just change the thread title to something like "Aged like milk: media that hasn't aged well" Jokerpilled Drudge has a new favorite as of 20:18 on Jun 11, 2020 |
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Jun 11, 2020 20:03
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Jokerpilled Drudge posted:Ok so what about the James Clavell books, did those age well? definitely orientalist, but they do tell a story about white people in asia, instead of trying to tell a story for asian people, so it's a bit more nuanced than saying it's straight out appropriation
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Jun 11, 2020 20:11
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Shogun does have those embarrassing scenes revolving around Japanese women being impressed by the white lead's enormous dick. But it does feel like Clavell at least attempted to get the cultures right and does try to treat them with some respect. With mixed results but there was an attempt to avoid caricatures. It's romanticized but that's often a staple of historical fiction. Mokinokaro has a new favorite as of 20:19 on Jun 11, 2020 |
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Jun 11, 2020 20:16
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DontMockMySmock posted:Phew! I do know that, at least at some points in his life, he had socialist tendencies. And I obviously know from his books that he was anti-war, anti-fascist, etc. I'm just worried that someone is gonna post a quote of him saying like "but also, i hate the gays" or whatever. He was avowedly socialist throughout his life, although he was so in the American sense (i.e. relatively milquetoast, New Deal-y sympathies, rather than anything more revolutionary). He was socially pretty conservative, a bit baffled by hippies but supportive of their cause, always sympathetic regarding the plight of minorities in America. Had a particular attachment to Biafra, and was devastated by what happened there. Hated Nixon and especially Reagan, and when W. came along he openly and quite seriously wished he was dead (and soon was). He was a fuddy-duddy and not what anyone would call 'woke' nowadays, but he was - despite of and because of his own personal pain - genuinely committed to compassion, equality and common decency
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Jun 11, 2020 20:34
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Mokinokaro posted:Japanese women being impressed by the white lead's enormous dick. Even at the age of 11, reading this part was super loving cringey
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Jun 11, 2020 20:36
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Schubalts posted:Applegate and her husband (K. A. Applegate, collectively) also support trans rights and have a trans daughter. Animorphs was also real good for the most part (a 50+ book YA series is bound to have weaker parts) and dealt with legit character traumatizing events over the course of the series. Most of the weaker parts came about after the switch to ghostwriters. Most of my friends and I dropped the series at around 30-31 after a string of bad books, and lo and behold, the switch was at book 26. Applegate came back to write the finale and it was back to “oh man that’s good but also legitimately horrifying and hosed up”. I think that series was the first real “war is hell” media a lot of people my age read. I was in like 3rd or 4th grade when I read the sixth one, where one of the main characters is getting his mind hosed with by an alien that they’re also in the middle of starving to death. poo poo was crazy.
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Jun 11, 2020 20:41
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Mokinokaro posted:scenes revolving around Japanese women being impressed by the white lead's enormous dick. Ah I see they made this into a porno
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Jun 11, 2020 22:54
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Ugly In The Morning posted:Most of the weaker parts came about after the switch to ghostwriters. Most of my friends and I dropped the series at around 30-31 after a string of bad books, and lo and behold, the switch was at book 26. Applegate came back to write the finale and it was back to “oh man that’s good but also legitimately horrifying and hosed up”. I think that series was the first real “war is hell” media a lot of people my age read. I was in like 3rd or 4th grade when I read the sixth one, where one of the main characters is getting his mind hosed with by an alien that they’re also in the middle of starving to death. poo poo was crazy. I dropped it around the same time, and then tuned back in for the last book. I remember thinking it was super dark and didn't match the tone of the earlier series. Years and years later I went back and read the books leading up to the last one. Holy loving poo poo. Those of you who have never read the series, buckle up. Leading up to the finale -- and again, I want to point out that this series is made for middle schoolers -- the main characters realize they'll need more firepower to win the intergalactic war. So they recruit a bunch of other kids, specifically targeting ones with physical disabilities, theorizing that these will be the ones the parasitic aliens bad guys will be the least likely to use a hosts. The morality of asking other kids to sacrifice themselves is discussed at length, as is the idea that people with disabilities are somehow "less valuable". Deep stuff for a 12 year old reader. Then the time comes for the new kids to go into battle. Many of them don't want to, since their new animal-morphing power allows them to enjoy things in life they couldn't before. The Animorphs tell them tough poo poo, they're child soldiers now even if they don't like it. The new kids are ordered to act as a diversion on the battlefield, and they get loving slaughtered. The main bad guy explodes them one by one with his ship's ray gun, having so much fun (and describing their deaths in detail) that he's distracted enough to get captured. Then the last book deals with the aftermath of the war. Exactly one character makes it out of the series alive; the rest are so racked with PTSD that they sacrifice themselves in a suicide mission.
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Jun 11, 2020 22:58
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:shut the gently caress up you worthless sack of ex-jizz, i will fold you in half so many times you legally qualify as a katana. if i ever hear that you have even so much as considered posting again i will force feed you your own hands so hard you become a Fully Cucked & Loving It Ouroboros. Hi, katana expert here. I know we’re having fun but I just want to clarify that this is a lot of times.
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Jun 11, 2020 23:31
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christmas boots posted:Hi, katana expert here. I know we’re having fun but I just want to clarify that this is a lot of times. thank you, katana expert christmas boots, i am unwavering in my commitment.
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Jun 11, 2020 23:40
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