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That's what kinda ruined Emperor: Battle for Dune for me when I tried it again like two or three years ago, it looks modern enough but the pathfinding is obviously stuck in the late 90s. If you send out a blob of units, each one will determine if it can reach its destination separately, but if the path is "blocked" (by other units on the same path) half the squad will break off looking for an alternative route - or several. So you're constantly babysitting small enough groups so this doesn't happen in the first place, or you're babysitting the units taking the long way around "obstacles", it's maddening 
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Jun 30, 2020 11:41
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Discovered a good use for Nod stealth tanks - stealthed they work kinda the same way as sandbags (enemy units won't attack them but can't path through them) so on some campaign missions I'd send a bunch to trap an enemy harvester on an island because it only takes 3 to block a bridge.
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Jun 30, 2020 11:57
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EBD somehow might have worse pathfinding than early C&C. It and Dark Reign 2 are two RTS games that were absolutely ruined by pathfinding imo.
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Jun 30, 2020 13:12
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The Question IRL posted:I tried Soviet Mission 5, built a large pack of subs to take out the Allied ships. I still remember playing that mission in December 1996 because of how much babysitting I had to do to take care of the clumsy subs and make sure that they could effectively target the ships. It's tricky.
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Jun 30, 2020 15:57
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I wonder if it's possible if they have the TS source code to retrofit their pathfinding systems. Okay i'm clutching at straws but basically every game i'm always maddened by the pathfinding so a man can dream.
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Jun 30, 2020 16:01
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There's two inexplicable things about the AI to me: 1) Why do artillery move PAST their maximum firing distance before shooting at a stationary target? 2) Why do infantry do the same thing with moving targets? If you give them a target they'll get real close before shooting, but if you give them a move order along the way and then re-target the enemy they'll immediately fire at it. This is most noticeable when you order Tanya to shoot a dog that's a decent distance away - there's a good chance she'll get eaten. I would guess that the game does its "can I shoot at my target yet?" calculation very seldomly when the unit is moving, but immediately when the unit is given a new order. nexus6 posted:Discovered a good use for Nod stealth tanks - stealthed they work kinda the same way as sandbags (enemy units won't attack them but can't path through them) so on some campaign missions I'd send a bunch to trap an enemy harvester on an island because it only takes 3 to block a bridge. I tried this out recently and noticed a really interesting behavior that I don't remember from the original game. Blocking a harvester with units would actually trigger the AI to send an attacking force, though not to the same degree that attacking the harvester would. I repeated it a few times just to be sure that's what was happening, but I didn't check to see if the AI would keep doing it if you destroyed the responding units. Tiny Timbs fucked around with this message at 16:21 on Jun 30, 2020 |
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Jun 30, 2020 16:14
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Fishbus posted:I wonder if it's possible if they have the TS source code to retrofit their pathfinding systems. Okay i'm clutching at straws but basically every game i'm always maddened by the pathfinding so a man can dream. Well, the opposite is definitely true, since TS-based Dawn of the Tiberium Age has been able to lift features from TD/RA thanks to the open source code. I'm sure better pathfinding will eventually be possible even without backporting, but there will probably be inherent limits thanks to the map design and the way units take up space. Time will tell.
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Jun 30, 2020 16:48
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Mordja posted:EBD somehow might have worse pathfinding than early C&C. It and Dark Reign 2 are two RTS games that were absolutely ruined by pathfinding imo. What's EBD? e: oh the dune game. Mordja posted:Well, the opposite is definitely true, since TS-based Dawn of the Tiberium Age has been able to lift features from TD/RA thanks to the open source code. I'm sure better pathfinding will eventually be possible even without backporting, but there will probably be inherent limits thanks to the map design and the way units take up space. Time will tell. Sooner or later, time will tell Milo and POTUS fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Jun 30, 2020 |
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Jun 30, 2020 17:10
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To truly fix pathfinding you need to consider a selected group as a single swarm entity while they are following a move order.
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Jun 30, 2020 18:15
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An interesting newly introduced bug is that harvesters don't quite harvest up all the gems and will leave a weird pattern of them. They will ignore them forever and won't register them unless you force harvest each and every individual tile. How? What do you have to do for that to arise as a bug? I'd like to know, it's probably interesting enough. (Much like the ore growth from a mine is offset y -1 tile )
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Jul 1, 2020 12:43
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The whole “unit tries to wait until they are on top of an enemy to shoot at it rather than shooting from max range” makes naval units in RA super frustrating—it doesn’t matter which side you play as, because the AI will handle its navy units like ninja-snipers that will unload on your ships or subs the second they get into range while you furiously click on them and pray that your destroyers will actually shoot at the subs rather than try to move on top of them first
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Jul 1, 2020 15:20
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The best part has always been AI rocket soldier micro, who basically can shoot mid-run
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Jul 1, 2020 16:38
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Fishbus posted:An interesting newly introduced bug is that harvesters don't quite harvest up all the gems and will leave a weird pattern of them. They will ignore them forever and won't register them unless you force harvest each and every individual tile. They had an update where harvesters would leave some tiberium in a field so that you don't need to babysit them to let it regrow. That's probably tied in to all sorts of stuff in arcane ways.
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Jul 1, 2020 17:45
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Sheen Sheen posted:The whole “unit tries to wait until they are on top of an enemy to shoot at it rather than shooting from max range” makes naval units in RA super frustrating—it doesn’t matter which side you play as, because the AI will handle its navy units like ninja-snipers that will unload on your ships or subs the second they get into range while you furiously click on them and pray that your destroyers will actually shoot at the subs rather than try to move on top of them first Thankfully this isn't a huge issue as the best way to fight subs is stutter-step since torpedoes do far less damage if it's not a direct hit. Move until the torpedo detonates, immediately fire, immediately resume moving, repeat. Try to avoid driving straight at them. And if you're the sub-haver, subs wildly outrange destroyers and gunboats so you can just fire a salvo and run because the AI doesn't know to chase you, at least beyond the point you fired from. Naval combat still sucks in general though. I would love to know why sometimes destroyers do like 30% of a sub's health in one salvo and sometimes they basically one-shot the thing. Is there a second weapon that it only fires sometimes or does it depend on if the depth charges "miss"?
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Jul 1, 2020 18:11
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Its splash damage on the depth charges being miniscule coupled with ballistic inaccuracy iirc
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Jul 1, 2020 19:32
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nimby posted:They had an update where harvesters would leave some tiberium in a field so that you don't need to babysit them to let it regrow. That's probably tied in to all sorts of stuff in arcane ways. Odd, since they don't do it for ore. It would be better for them to just change the growth rate though! I've mad a map in RA where i just slapped in a custom ini rule inside the map that just increases the ore regrowth rate.
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Jul 1, 2020 20:18
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nexus6 posted:Discovered a good use for Nod stealth tanks - stealthed they work kinda the same way as sandbags (enemy units won't attack them but can't path through them) so on some campaign missions I'd send a bunch to trap an enemy harvester on an island because it only takes 3 to block a bridge. I bet it works fine for blocking harvesters, but didn't work for blocking GDI tanks in Nod 11b, even when they were only blocking one of two exits from their base. They would come close enough to my stealth tanks to see them and shoot. side note; that one was kinda a bitch even with sandbagging, as reaching the eastern GDI base exit requires getting rid of some tiberium first. edit: afaict there's no intended order for covert ops/console missions. But reddit poster recommended leaving Twist of Fate, Blindsided, Eviction Notice, Bad Neighborhood and Deceit for last as they're hardest. Personally think I'll go approximately by the mission numbers. Eregos fucked around with this message at 04:29 on Jul 2, 2020 |
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Jul 2, 2020 00:00
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Man, RA is better than I remember and somehow worse. Friendly AI pathing is really, really bad but the enemy AI is prone to going full gently caress you mode early and often in a way I really missed in tiberium sun/ra2 and on. Like you can accidentally trigger the enemy to rush you causing a desperate scramble to survive just by putting you base in a different area where in later games you have more flexibility in that. That said, I'm really hoping TS/RA2 are next. 
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Jul 2, 2020 08:15
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This is pretty cool. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ww1WfyVRehU
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Jul 2, 2020 13:11
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RA2 is where I get interested, that was much fun with great unit selection and differing factions, also I played a lot of it stoned in my shared house LAN.
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Jul 2, 2020 13:27
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This seems like it could do interesting things for modding:quote:This mod provides an extensive 📃 RULES.INI file 📃 for Tiberian Dawn & ⚙ Lua event scripting ⚙. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2147631402
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Jul 4, 2020 01:54
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Is it just me or is the Chronosphere useless?
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Jul 4, 2020 15:28
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nexus6 posted:Is it just me or is the Chronosphere useless? The one time I used it it spawned a vortex right outside my base that ate up half my harvesters 
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Jul 4, 2020 16:43
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The standard Soviet tank is so good.
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Jul 4, 2020 17:13
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RA is definitely the pinnacle of the tank rush. TD's economy is slow enough and the AI is passive enough that it's sometimes simpler to let infantry and vehicles meatshield while engineers dismantle an enemy base. Meanwhile, later games have specialized artillery that are actually good at their job, as well as gimmick units that can sow chaos if you micro them well enough. And of course some mods rebalance things so that tanks are just inefficient against structures.
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Jul 4, 2020 17:27
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nexus6 posted:Is it just me or is the Chronosphere useless? It's almost useless. About the only thing that keeps it from being completely useless is using it to teleport a cruiser into a small, enclosed body of water close to your enemies base. Considering that the Chronosphere can only teleport one unit at a time and that it will not allow you to teleport an APC with infantry in it means that you can only really use it to try and creatively troll your opponents with it. So yeah, it's basically useless outside of the one idea I mentioned earlier. Also as Mordja mentioned, the fact that it has a chance to spawn a negative effect that has a high chance to destroy your base/army makes it not really worth it. Edit: So I got curious and looked up the Chronosphere on a wiki and I just learned that in Aftermath they added a second negative Chronosphere effect called Time Quake. Both the Chrono Vortex and Time Quake have a 20% chance of happening when you used the Chronosphere. https://cnc.gamepedia.com/Time_Quake A Nice Big Dinner fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Jul 4, 2020 |
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Jul 4, 2020 17:31
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obese retard posted:It's almost useless. About the only thing that keeps it from being completely useless is using it to teleport a cruiser into a small, enclosed body of water close to your enemies base. Considering that the Chronosphere can only teleport one unit at a time and that it will not allow you to teleport an APC with infantry in it means that you can only really use it to try and creatively troll your opponents with it. So yeah, it's basically useless outside of the one idea I mentioned earlier. Also as Mordja mentioned, the fact that it has a chance to spawn a negative effect that has a high chance to destroy your base/army makes it not really worth it. Don't tell me you never used the Chronosphere to teleport an enemy harvester into your own base? Do it twice and it's paid for itself.
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Jul 4, 2020 20:07
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The Question IRL posted:Don't tell me you never used the Chronosphere to teleport an enemy harvester into your own base? The RA1 Chronosphere only lets you use it on your own units, not enemy units. RA2 and RA3 allowed the Chronosphere to be a little bit more on the offense and allowed it to be used on enemy units.
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Jul 4, 2020 21:43
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Oh god another thing that's dumb about RTS AI is ranged units bunching up, the first units to get in range stop moving to shoot and all the the units behind them are stuck out of range.
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Jul 5, 2020 17:00
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I love how that allows a single submarine to take out your entire fleet
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Jul 5, 2020 17:08
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I think I found a bug that crops up in Soviet 10: When I take over the Allied Service Depot with an engineer it will allow me to repair planes but not tanks. I just replicated it to make sure. Is there formal channel to report these?
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Jul 5, 2020 18:28
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I don't think you're meant to be able to repair those tanks with it.
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Jul 5, 2020 18:38
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IIRC that service depot had the same weird behaviour in the original game as well. What is new is that using Alt+# to jump to a control group no longer works, and there doesn't even seem to be a setting for it in the options.
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Jul 5, 2020 19:46
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Nostalgamus posted:IIRC that service depot had the same weird behaviour in the original game as well. You can just double tap the number of your control group to jump to it.
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Jul 5, 2020 20:52
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I noticed that pressing T to select all of a type doesn't work, but I can't remember if that was introduced later with TS or not.
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Jul 5, 2020 21:54
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Nostalgamus posted:What is new is that using Alt+# to jump to a control group no longer works, and there doesn't even seem to be a setting for it in the options. Double tap the control group number.
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Jul 5, 2020 23:23
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Plek posted:I noticed that pressing T to select all of a type doesn't work, but I can't remember if that was introduced later with TS or not.
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Jul 6, 2020 00:58
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Plek posted:I noticed that pressing T to select all of a type doesn't work, but I can't remember if that was introduced later with TS or not. Double-clicking one unit will give you all of that type, which I usually use. There's no equivalent for hitting F for Formation orders in Remastered is there? I get bored trying to manage mixed units with different speeds.
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Jul 6, 2020 07:40
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gary oldmans diary posted:I don't remember doing that until RA2. Also, RA2 had a function for selecting by health that by default wasn't assigned a key. Very handy for pulling tanks to the back for repairs. Whaaaaat
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Jul 6, 2020 08:21
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I replayed TD before RA and man I never fully appreciated the improved economy of RA at the time. TD has a ton of personality but its economy feels so much more awkward by comparison.
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Jul 6, 2020 14:41
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