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For a very short while I got one of those Ryzen 3700u 13" HP Envys and it was pretty much slick looking and otherwise a piece of poo poo. The best part was that it would never stop depleting the battery in sleep mode and googling about it revealed that it's endemic to a lot of HP laptops. Returned in a heartbeat.
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Jul 9, 2020 07:57
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Spacedad posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cBzq1muMVU Technically, it's still $50 for a letter. You're just paying for two letters. Jeff Fatwood posted:For a very short while I got one of those Ryzen 3700u 13" HP Envys and it was pretty much slick looking and otherwise a piece of poo poo. The best part was that it would never stop depleting the battery in sleep mode and googling about it revealed that it's endemic to a lot of HP laptops. Returned in a heartbeat. Not specifically aimed at OldFatMike, but lest you think that I have exhausted my list of complaints with the previous AMD 2-in-1, oh no, buddy, I just haven't been at a keyboard all day. There are so many problems with those laptops that I haven't even BEGUN to detail in length. SwissArmyDruid fucked around with this message at 08:32 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 08:29
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peepsalot posted:So I guess my main question is regarding the newer B550 variations (which could save me up to a whopping $20!) if there's any reason not to get one? As was noted earlier, pricing and inventory on everything is up in the air due to COVID. So keep that in mind, stuff goes out of stock moment to moment and some prices are jacked up ridiculously while others seem perfectly normal. poo poo's weird. VRM/power delivery/etc. is often NOT identical between B550 and X570 versions of boards, actually. Sometimes it's comparable, sometimes it's worse on paper, though on average they seem to be beefier and more "enthusiast focused" than the B450 equivalent. IIRC the B550 TUF is a downgrade (on paper, not necessarily real use) vs. the x570 version (8+2 power stages vs. 12+2). Yet another disclaimer: half this poo poo isn't even buy-able and there aren't a lot of hands-on comparisons of X570 vs B550 IRL performance. B550 has pcie4.0 for 1 video card x16 slot and 1 m.2 slot, everything else is 3.0, while x570 doesn't have that limitation. Of course right now it doesn't matter either way. e: I think if/when things settle down, the B550 boards will be just as good as the X570 boards for most users, unless you have a morbid fear that not being able to run two pcie 4.0 video cards and two pcie 4.0 SSDs at once will eventually be a big handicap. Which is theoretically possible but ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh sean10mm fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 15:01
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Technically, it's still $50 for a letter. You're just paying for two letters. "It's kind of like a buy one get one free except you pay the same price for the second one"
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Jul 9, 2020 15:39
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Statutory Ape posted:"It's kind of like a buy one get one free except you pay the same price for the second one" "First rule in [tech] spending: Why [have] one when you can have two at twice the price?"
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Jul 9, 2020 17:43
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Statutory Ape posted:i hope not i still havent received 2 bongs i ordered on ebay My earphones just showed up, 4 months after order. Hang in there!
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Jul 9, 2020 17:51
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Statutory Ape posted:"It's kind of like a buy one get one free except you pay the same price for the second one" For Sale: Baby shoes, priced each
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Jul 9, 2020 18:00
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I don't understand this '100 for a letter' bs, if they raised the prices sure, that is what Intel would have done. Instead they put the better silicon at the same price point and drop the price of original, still good, CPUs. If you done want to pay ( the same price) for better silicon quality then you saved a bunch of money? And people are upset? The gently caress? Its not like these were being marketed as a new generation.
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Jul 9, 2020 18:24
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Mr. Crow is correct. The youtube personas are putting out some ultra dumb hot takes to get your clicks. Just think for yourself.
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Jul 9, 2020 18:39
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at least you get what you pay for with Intel. It is undeniably top tier silicon and overclocks significantly better (or runs at much lower voltage at iso clocks). HWUB's 3900XT performs a grand total of 11 MHz better than their 3900X. Not missing a zero, eleven megahertz. Best you can say about the XTs is that the infinity fabric does a bit better.
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Jul 9, 2020 18:46
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GRECOROMANGRABASS posted:Mr. Crow is correct. The youtube personas are putting out some ultra dumb hot takes to get your clicks. Just think for yourself. The XTs perform identically to the prior parts for significantly higher price. You shouldn't buy them, they are terrible values. Buy the original parts or wait from Zen3. Like the 10900K/10700K/2700 Anniversary Edition etc, being a terrible value does not mean they are objectively BAD CPUs. The XTs are very good CPUs. But that doesn't mean you should buy them with whatever wacky funbucks youve got in your wallet. Cygni fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 18:51
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Welp, here come the Intel Apologists
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Jul 9, 2020 19:31
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I mean yes, they're terrible value in the current market so just, you know don't buy them. Like the 3600/3700x/3900x still exist and are great value for their respective use cases.
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Jul 9, 2020 19:55
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SourKraut posted:Welp, here come the Intel Apologists sorry about your preorder i guess?
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Jul 9, 2020 21:29
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Cygni posted:sorry about your preorder i guess? Oh I didn't preorder it; I have a 3700X that's keeping me happy. Mostly just poking some fun at the fact that AMD releases a money-grabbing update and people poo poo on it, but nVidia and Intel do it, and we hear about how great it is that they keep wringing 0.5% performance gains*. Mostly that Intel can do no wrong in your and Paul's eyes.  *rhetorical comment/joke not based on research
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Jul 9, 2020 23:09
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I went like 17 straight years exclusively buying AMD CPUs, including for my college computer assembly side business, so I'm not sure if I really qualify as an Intel apologist. I absolutely was an AMD apologist for a long long time, though. I dunno, i dont think you should be loyal to any of these truly evil multi-billion dollar dipshit companies with incredible histories of consumer deception and legal dogshit. if that makes me anti AMD then i am definitely anti Intel and Nvidia, too. The fanboyism around AMD lately has been really fuckin annoying all over the internet, with people willing to breathlessly defend a lot of really lovely and stupid moves on their part just because they arent as bad as Intel in some ways. Being slightly better than the company that holds multiple anti-trust enforcement records. Like, that shouldnt be the bar here... I also don't think my opinions are Intel friendly, considering the only CPUs from them I think anyone should consider right now is the 10900K if all you care about is framez and you have an unlimited budget and maybe the 10400 on the low end? Maybe? Otherwise I think pretty much everyone should be getting a 3600 non X, which I've built 2 of recently for family members. If anything, im a Apple silicon on the Mac apologist now cause i think thats gonna whip rear end 
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Jul 10, 2020 00:04
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I haven't built an AMD system in roughly three Presidents worth of time, but I'm looking at slapping together a Ryzen build for development and video editing. While doing my initial research, I've come across a lot of posts bemoaning the fact you can't (easily/safely) use Ryzen Master with Hyper-V enabled. Hyper-V is mandatory for my needs. Am I likely care about Ryzen Master at all? Near as I can discern it primarily lets you tweak system settings without booting back into BIOS/EFI. I have no plans to overclock, so "mess with my timings and frequencies while booted into Windows" isn't much of a priority. I assume the sensor data Ryzen Master has access to is supported just as well by any other hardware monitor, yeah? The only thing I'd appear to give up is Eco Mode, but this is basically a single-purpose system. Intentionally slowing down compile times or video editing speed to get a lower TDP really isn't my goal.
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Jul 10, 2020 02:42
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Cygni posted:If anything, im a Apple silicon on the Mac apologist now cause i think thats gonna whip rear end Yeah, no joke, I might pick up an entry level MacBook when these hit to check out.
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Jul 10, 2020 02:49
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Molten Llama posted:I haven't built an AMD system in roughly three Presidents worth of time, but I'm looking at slapping together a Ryzen build for development and video editing. While doing my initial research, I've come across a lot of posts bemoaning the fact you can't (easily/safely) use Ryzen Master with Hyper-V enabled. Nah, you won't be missing anything.
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Jul 10, 2020 02:51
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Anything you can do with Ryzen Master, you should be able to do with the BIOS/UEFI There is someone that managed to hack Ryzen Master into being compatible with Hyper-V, but you still don't want to do it anyway, because if you tinker with memory timings on Ryzen Master and get to a config that doesn't work, you can get stuck in a boot loop that can only be broken with a CMOS reset, so you still shouldn't be doing it gradenko_2000 fucked around with this message at 03:25 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 03:00
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Cygni posted:The XTs perform identically to the prior parts for significantly higher price. You shouldn't buy them, they are terrible values. Buy the original parts or wait from Zen3. The comparison is apples to oranges and performance is factually false. While I wouldn't recommend it to most consumers, if your an overclocker (who are always paying premiums for marginal gains) it could be a good choice if you're concerned about silicon quality. For everyone else you get a drop in price. There is literally no reason to be up in arms over this surprise announcement.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:24
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No one is up in arms. They're saying the XT products are poo poo value and people shouldn't buy them, which is objectively true.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:33
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Mr. Crow posted:For everyone else you get a drop in price. Sorry, I haven't looked at / watched the XT reviews (was pretty easy to guess they wouldn't be very exciting ahead of time). But has AMD actually dropped the wholesale price of the 3600, 3700X, & 3800X as well? Before launch I was under the impression the prices for old CPUs were unchanged, and the XTs were just slotting into the gaps.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:35
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Klyith posted:Sorry, I haven't looked at / watched the XT reviews (was pretty easy to guess they wouldn't be very exciting ahead of time). But has AMD actually dropped the wholesale price of the 3600, 3700X, & 3800X as well? Before launch I was under the impression the prices for old CPUs were unchanged, and the XTs were just slotting into the gaps. It's my understanding that the XT models are priced at what the non-XT models were originally set to on their release, and the non-XT models have been dropped in price.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:37
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Mr. Crow posted:if your an overclocker (who are always paying premiums for marginal gains) Their freedom with their wallets doesn't mean what they do isn't completely dumb from a value perspective.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:38
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Palladium posted:Their freedom with their wallets doesn't mean what they do isn't completely dumb from a value perspective. No argument, does not change the silicon quality of which they have websites dedicated to buying and testing superior binned CPUs https://siliconlottery.com/
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Jul 10, 2020 03:42
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Palladium posted:Their freedom with their wallets doesn't mean what they do isn't completely dumb from a value perspective. What’s the standard of value, then?
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Jul 10, 2020 03:50
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Subjunctive posted:What’s the standard of value, then? "Intel" (Honestly, I mostly just always find it ridiculous that the hardware discussions can be so reasonable the majority of the time, but at times, Intel and nVidia are allowed to be minimally denounced for things that are even worse than this.) Canned Sunshine fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 03:53
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gradenko_2000 posted:It's my understanding that the XT models are priced at what the non-XT models were originally set to on their release, and the non-XT models have been dropped in price. Like, further than they were a month ago? The official SEP price hasn't changed since Zen 2's launch, but that doesn't say anything about the wholesale price. Basically, is the 3700X going to stay at $275-280 or see further discounts? SourKraut posted:"Intel" this is a pretty dumb line, you are boxing at shadows here. nobody has said intel is good value ITT for the past 3 years.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:57
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Klyith posted:this is a pretty dumb line, you are boxing at shadows here. nobody has said intel is good value ITT for the past 3 years. Paul MaudDib posted:at least you get what you pay for with Intel. You were saying?
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Jul 10, 2020 04:02
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SourKraut posted:You were saying? oh, right, except him. he's the Stux of SHHC.
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Jul 10, 2020 04:11
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Mr. Crow posted:The comparison is apples to oranges and performance is factually false. While I wouldn't recommend it to most consumers, if your an overclocker (who are always paying premiums for marginal gains) it could be a good choice if you're concerned about silicon quality. For everyone else you get a drop in price. How much performance did GN get from those overclocks? How much extra money does that performance cost? GN's best sample of the three was their 3600XT which showed marginal OC gains for $100 over the non 3600. Thats a bad value, you should not buy that unless you are one of the 20 weirdos on earth trying to set OC records with LN2. (or you just really really like fiddling with BIOS settings and already own a 10600K) And the prices for non XTs have not changed as far as I am aware, at least in the US. GN, again, was explicit about that. Letter Free 3600 at Microcenter is still $159, 3600XT is $249, 3700X is still $259. Do not but the XT. Cygni fucked around with this message at 04:19 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 04:11
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SourKraut posted:You were saying? I think you're being a bit sensitive in interpreting that as "value"; value usually means best bang for a reasonable buck. Intel is still the highest clockspeeds if you don't care about price.
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Jul 10, 2020 04:11
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SourKraut posted:You were saying? I didn't say the 9900KS was good value. It obviously wasn't the peak of the value curve. What I said was you got what you paid for: the 9900KS is undeniably significantly better silicon than the average chip. From SiliconLottery, a good 9900KS (top 28%) will do 5.1 GHz at 1.287V, the equivalent 9900K (top 30%) is only 5.0 GHz at 1.30V. So you are getting an extra bin frequency bump at a bin lower voltage, essentially gaining two bins over a normal 9900K. It's obviously not for everyone (nor is the 9900K in general), but you are undeniably getting something for your money there. The problem with the XT line is that you literally don't get anything for the money. HWUB's 3900XT is 11 MHz faster than their 3900X. That's literally less than the sample to sample variation. The only real improvement of any note is that 1900 MHz infinity fabric is no longer a silicon lottery thing, it's pretty much guaranteed and some samples will do 2000 MHz, but that's like a second order effect there. HWUB scored it as a total of 0.5% faster overall in Cinebench. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 04:19
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I didn't make the connection until the Gamers Nexus review, but it does make sense that since Ryzen doesn't really hit its boost clocks as reliably as we think it might, then getting a higher advertised boost clock might not be as much of A Thing as, say, Intel doing the same.
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Jul 10, 2020 04:31
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Out of curiosity I disabled CPB (but left SMT enabled) on my 3600 just to see how that would affect the load temps and the load temps were almost 20C cooler while running Cinebench (66C VS 85C). That's crazy how much hotter the chip runs at around 4GHz on all 6 cores VS 3.6GHz on all six cores with CPB disabled with my Cinebench score only going down ~250 points.
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Jul 10, 2020 06:11
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I haven't followed all the coverage, but has anyone done any undervolting/tdp limiting benchmarks? From the GN 3600XT video, it looks like you do get really good silicon, but Zen2 hits a wall around 4.7ghz anyways. If the downward power limit scalling is much better, these chips could be well worth the extra 100 bucks for use in a sff case.
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Jul 10, 2020 08:33
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I don't think AMD actually expects to sell any XTs, at least not to anyone except a tiny minority of overclockers or people obsessed with having the latest. I think the XT release is really about raising prices back to zen 2 launch levels in order to temper expectations before zen 3 releases. At the moment AMD's main competitor is themselves, especially since zen 2 is so solidly good. They might run into a value problem where Zen 3 is better, but when lined up against discounted Zen 2 it looks much less attractive. Hence the last-minute release of XT in order to bump the appearance of prices up again, so Zen 3 looks better in comparison.
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Jul 10, 2020 19:02
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Didn't see it talked about, but the much rumored 8 channel memory Threadrippers (aka Epycs that like frequency and don't care who knows) are imminent, with new TRX80 motherboards that were leaked like a year ago but vanished. https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-ryzen-threadripper-pro-3000-final-specifications-leaked Prolly aint gonna be cheap and you will really need specific workloads to flex them, but 64c/2TB DDR4-3200 with an eight channel memory in ATX form factor is p dang cool. Seems like a part that is worth every ounce of cooling you can throw at it.
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Jul 11, 2020 04:03
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Thank god, AMD is finally realizing that the people that buy these kinds of chips need more than half a SwissArmyDruid fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Jul 11, 2020 |
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Jul 11, 2020 04:27
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