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Hwurmp posted:On the other hand, if the Sun Station had worked as intended, shutting it down would have broken spacetime. If I had to make an educated guess, it's because time paradoxes happen when you consciously observe something having come out of a portal but prevent it from going in, but as you can see by the way you can get out of the body double causality, as long as you don't consciously observe the thing that's come out there's no paradox. And you don't consciously observe the radio waves or whatever coming out of that hole, as far as observable causality's concerned you're just going by memories already written to your brain and the probe log. Chev fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Jul 8, 2020 |
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Jul 8, 2020 21:28
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Chev posted:Eh, the game doesn't seem to regard information being sent back as the same level of breaking causality as concrete things being sent back do, for whatever reason likely linked to how their version of quantum mechanics works. This is verified by taking out the core and dying out of range of the supernova, which doesn't break reality but should as soon as the nova goes past the ash twin project like when you meet your other self. It's like Douglas Adams said: bad news follows its own rules 
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Jul 9, 2020 05:47
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To try BS'ing an explanation there, I think sending back information like the ATP does is fine because that only changes the state of matter that exists either way, while creating another scout of self adds to the amount of matter in the universe which shouldn't be possible
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Jul 9, 2020 07:39
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I think it doesn't need hardcore explanation and is more of a funny easter egg tbh
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Jul 9, 2020 13:36
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Sure, but like the probe one it's an easter egg built on the coherence of the clockwork cycle that drives the game world. It's natural that people are gonna think about it.
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Jul 9, 2020 13:41
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MikeJF posted:Looking though the patch notes, it's interesting to see what they've adjusted over time. what was the change to 9,000,000 launches supposed to insinuate? I beat this game a while ago so my memory might be a bit fuzzy but it was pretty clear to me at the time what was happening.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:06
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DarkAvenger211 posted:what was the change to 9,000,000 launches supposed to insinuate? I beat this game a while ago so my memory might be a bit fuzzy but it was pretty clear to me at the time what was happening. The loop has happened 9,000,000 times before it found the eye of the universe and you became aware you were trapped in the loop.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:11
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DarkAvenger211 posted:what was the change to 9,000,000 launches supposed to insinuate? I beat this game a while ago so my memory might be a bit fuzzy but it was pretty clear to me at the time what was happening. It's just that 9mil attempts at picking a random direction and actually finding something so far away is much more reasonable than 9k attempts.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:27
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Also, if it took on the order of 9000 to find it, then less dramatic measures could have been used.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:30
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Zack Ater posted:It's just that 9mil attempts at picking a random direction and actually finding something so far away is much more reasonable than 9k attempts. It’s still orders of magnitude of orders of magnitude too few, but I think we can give them a pass on it.
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Jul 9, 2020 20:46
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It also means that you and the other hearthians have been reliving the same 22 minutes for over 350 solar years or so before anyone else even had a chance of catching on. Once you get to a certain size of number, it kind of becomes meaningless to pile more digits on.
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Jul 9, 2020 22:52
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Kurr de la Cruz posted:It also means that you and the other hearthians have been reliving the same 22 minutes for over 350 solar years or so before anyone else even had a chance of catching on. None of the other Hearthians besides Gabbro experience any loops, because they haven't been picked up by the Nomai statues.
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Jul 9, 2020 23:01
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Hwurmp posted:None of the other Hearthians besides Gabbro experience any loops, because they haven't been picked up by the Nomai statues. They do, they just don't remember it.
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Jul 9, 2020 23:01
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Memories are literally all that gets looped
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Jul 9, 2020 23:02
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Hwurmp posted:Memories are literally all that gets looped It still happens.
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Jul 9, 2020 23:06
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ok
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Jul 9, 2020 23:08
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Oh god it's the teleporter argument all over again.
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Jul 9, 2020 23:09
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g o o n s
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Jul 9, 2020 23:12
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Something I keep forgetting to post is there are more than a few tracks in this game that remind me a shitload of the Donnie Darko soundtrack.........coincidence???????????  🐰✈⌚
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Jul 9, 2020 23:24
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Arrhythmia posted:It still happens. There's a Nomai debate about that in-game with no conclusive answer. The ash twin project faction build the sun station because they believe it doesn't. The quantum moon suggests it both happens and doesn't happen depending on the observer, but because you are not the same individual for which the previous loop occurred, it didn't happen unless the previous loop's player character jumped into the ash twin project and was then observed. As soon as you enact a loop where the previous character is not observed, the previous loop hasn't happened. Chev fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 00:22
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On my replay, one of the things I've been trying to pay attention to is the scale of time we're talking about here. I'm pretty sure we're talking about a toybox scale here too. (lol, the recent spoiler'd chat deals with this directly) I am overthinking this, but are there any other messages/indicators I've missed? So for the Nomai, we have relatively fresh but still stripped-bare skeletons, which puts it probably somewhere between 5 and 50 (earth) years from the Nomai's demise to your Hearthian's adventures. The state of ruins in the Hanging City and the Sunless City kind of seem to support this--some potted plants are still verdant, others are dessicated but not completely gone. The Vessel escape pods are also very well-maintained, and we have a consistent set of Nomai talking to each other throughout the solar system, although we witness Solanum growing from a child in Hanging City to an adolescent making her pilgrimage to the Quantum Moon. Nomai life expentancy, then, would seem to be relatively close to our own. However, that suggests that the Hearthians evolved at a pretty surprising rate. From water-based amphibians to space-faring race in 100 years, tops. This might be more-or-less in line with their five minute day cycle? Either way, I'd have liked to hear more about just how long ago they started their Outer Wild Ventures. Seems like it'd be on the order of days or weeks, but it's hard to imagine building spacefaring vessels so quickly. This is also ignoring the nonsensical nature of Brittle Hollow. Aside from gameplay convenience, why is the planet intact at the start of the 22-minute cycle despite Nomai warnings that they needed to relocate because they sensed fragility in the crust? As for the orbital probe cannon, 9.4 million 22-minute cycles parses out to about 400 years. The earlier estimate of 9500 cycles parses out to just over half a year, which feels more "right" with the rest of the solar system. I get why they changed it, but meh, I prefered the older way. f#a# fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 02:10
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the Sun station states it's been ~2800 years since the Nomai. Of course, who knows what year they use - are there any other indicators for the use of year?
MikeJF fucked around with this message at 02:59 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 02:57
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You're both wrong. The sun station states it has been offline for 281,042 years.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:06
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drat, yeah, I knew I remembered a 28. Thanks.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:08
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Well drat it, now I need to either figure out how long a Nomai year is or figure out the orbital period of the sun station.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:09
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I would assume the Nomai would use their own years rather than a different one on every body. Re: the skeletons, don't forget many are in weird environments and also the local bacteria may not be adapted to eat Nomai bone very well.
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Jul 10, 2020 03:11
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Nomai and have genders btw (Hearthians don't) and Solanum is a lady 
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Jul 10, 2020 04:53
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beep by grandpa posted:Nomai and have genders btw (Hearthians don't) And it seems like by and large names that sound masculine in English are feminine to Nomai, and vice versa.
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Jul 10, 2020 05:32
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLqTnJ5fEqU
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Jul 10, 2020 05:33
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I'm sure I'm the billionth person to say this, but having an endgame based around being suuuuuper slow and patient and creeping pace in a game centered around a ticking clock time limit is an... interesting choice
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Jul 10, 2020 09:59
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MikeJF posted:I'm sure I'm the billionth person to say this, but having an endgame based around being suuuuuper slow and patient and creeping pace in a game centered around a ticking clock time limit is an... interesting choice the clock is a round-the-day cock, not a speedrunner's timer. It's about being in the right place at the right time. Sometimes that means you have to be fast, sometimes that means you have to wait for the right moment. This is true long before the endgame.
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Jul 10, 2020 10:04
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MikeJF posted:I'm sure I'm the billionth person to say this, but having an endgame based around being suuuuuper slow and patient and creeping pace in a game centered around a ticking clock time limit is an... interesting choice It's by far the weakest part of the game. Which is a shame because the rest is so good. Instead just cheesing the anglers by barreling into the final room at max speed to glide past them is a more reasonable use of time and completely avoids the arbitrary thrust limits
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Jul 10, 2020 10:15
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I used the ejector seat in dark bramble in the last loop just to ratchet up the tension and say goodbye to the ship.
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Jul 10, 2020 10:19
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Is it possible to get yourself killed by asphyxiation or blunt-force trauma after crossing the point of no return? On the surface of the Eye.
Inspector Gesicht fucked around with this message at 10:25 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 10:23
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If you mean after taking the warp core then yes
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Jul 10, 2020 10:23
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Is it possible to get yourself killed by asphyxiation or blunt-force trauma after crossing the point of no return? On the surface of the Eye. If you die on the Eye, but before actually going into the vortex, the game will put you back at the vessel right after warping, and if you had done something that would've softlocked you into a 'loop' of game overing then those flags are removed. Once you are inside the vortex fall damage is disabled and trees are everywhere in the Eye so you can't asphyxiate.
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Jul 10, 2020 10:59
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That’s literally like $5000 worth of gear, just the 4 things listed in the title- Elektron Digitakt and Digitone are about 700 each, Moog Sub 37 is $1600, the OP-1 is $1300. But he’s also got a Moogerfooger pedal, which is another ~$500, I think a Novation Circuit which is like $300+ and at least 3 other pedals that I can’t identify. So it *should* sound nice (and it does, I love Elektron gear, and I want to make a cover using my Elektron Model Samples and my iPhone) imhotep fucked around with this message at 11:28 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 11:25
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Hey, what is the gold dish at the back of your ship meant to be. I always bugs me - it's like there was some pickup mechanic that never got used? EDIT: Oh derp, it's the hatch cover! MikeJF fucked around with this message at 11:43 on Jul 10, 2020 |
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Jul 10, 2020 11:35
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Re: loops and probes Is the implication actually that everyone's been caught in this loop for 9 million cycles before the first one you play? That seems kind of strange because it would imply that, what, the previous 9,000,000 times you just didn't happen to get to the statue in time for you to start remembering, and that the loop the Eye was discovered happened to be the exact one before your expedition? Both seem like odd contrivances, why do things differently on that particular loop? I'd assumed that after the failure of the Sun Station and the need to research life lengthening technologies, the Nomai left the cannon running effectively on autopilot until eventually it finds the Eye on the nine millionth-and-change attempt, long after the Nomai are gone. The cannon then goes dormant for however many millions of years, and then when the ATP fires off for the first time, it sends back an new "fire probe" instruction to the dormant cannon, triggering the cannon to fire for the first time in eons, causing it to explode and wake you up with its flash at the beginning of the first loop.
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Jul 10, 2020 12:11
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Nah, nah. The project works like this: The probe cannon requires a ton of energy to fire-- in fact, it can only fire if the sun goes nova. The Nomai set up the whole system, and it sits dormant for 280 000 years. Eventually, the sun goes nova, the cannon fires a probe, it finds nothing, and sends a message to the ATP computer telling it that the coordinates it tried are no good. The ATP sends this info back in time. Next loop, the cannon tries a different random coordinate; same result. Eventually, the cannon chooses the correct ccoordinate (after generating a random coord, and removing 9 million confirmed negatives from the pool); the cannon fires to this coordinate, finds the eye, and records this info in the probe tracking module. This turns on all the statues, and causes the player and Gabbro to become aware of the time loop. Prior to this, both of you had been experiencing the time loops, but were dying and being reset every time (along with every other sentient being in the universe, I guess). Presumably, the player was exploring the same way every time up until that point. There's a Nomai dialogue where they mention how the statues will only activate once the probe has found the right data, and what a horrifying experience it would be to be conscious for millions and millions of loops; I think it's in the statue workshop. Anyway, the player encountered the statue nine million times, but it didn't do anything until the probe found the eye.
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Jul 10, 2020 12:28
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