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"wtf why does she feel hurt"
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Jul 23, 2020 17:25
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https://twitter.com/WOTonPrime/status/1285994561588703232
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Jul 23, 2020 18:14
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Their story is so bleak.
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Jul 23, 2020 18:38
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Please tell me that the top guy is Raen. That is the most perfect casting ever.
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Jul 23, 2020 18:59
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silvergoose posted:"wtf why does she feel hurt" I love it because generally it's due to Perrin acting super loving guilty Like she senses that somehow, in some way, Perrin's being more emotionally honest with Berelain than with her VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Jul 23, 2020 |
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Jul 23, 2020 19:09
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Gnoman posted:Please tell me that the top guy is Raen. That is the most perfect casting ever. Yep, and the younger guy is Aram. Bet they have Illa do some casual singing at the very least - that actress is a pretty well known Irish folk singer. Looking forward to Perrin awkwardly sitting through the tiganza 
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Jul 23, 2020 19:14
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aparmenideanmonad posted:Yep, and the younger guy is Aram. Bet they have Illa do some casual singing at the very least - that actress is a pretty well known Irish folk singer. Aram has a very good intensity around him Was always annoyed at Perrin for how he treated Aram
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Jul 23, 2020 19:36
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I always felt it was at least implied, but Masema was definitely being influenced by one of the Forsaken, right?
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Jul 23, 2020 20:37
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aparmenideanmonad posted:Yep, and the younger guy is Aram. Bet they have Illa do some casual singing at the very least - that actress is a pretty well known Irish folk singer. Personally, I'll hold out for the sasara.
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Jul 23, 2020 20:39
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:I always felt it was at least implied, but Masema was definitely being influenced by one of the Forsaken, right? It's hard to tell because of how bugfuck crazy he was anyway. Spreading chaos through the westernmost nations of Randland seemed to be Graendal's thing so if there's any one of them it was probably her.
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Jul 23, 2020 20:45
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:I always felt it was at least implied, but Masema was definitely being influenced by one of the Forsaken, right? The spoilers podcast dudes have a theory that one of them is loving with his dreams. Something about a bright light claiming to be the Dragon telling him what to do, I forget the details
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Jul 23, 2020 20:46
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:I always felt it was at least implied, but Masema was definitely being influenced by one of the Forsaken, right? Yeah, at the end. Just double checked, his perspective in TGS Prologue (I think) he talks about how the Dragon Reborn came to him glowing and floating, telling him to kill Perrin. Maybe it’s madness but it’s around when the push to kill the two of them started.
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Jul 23, 2020 20:49
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silvergoose posted:Their story is so bleak. aparmenideanmonad posted:Yep, and the younger guy is Aram. He has the right look in his eyes to play Aram, I think.  "Can I use this one?" 
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Jul 23, 2020 20:58
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Prairie Bus posted:Yeah, at the end. Just double checked, his perspective in TGS Prologue (I think) he talks about how the Dragon Reborn came to him glowing and floating, telling him to kill Perrin. Maybe it’s madness but it’s around when the push to kill the two of them started. VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:It's hard to tell because of how bugfuck crazy he was anyway. Spreading chaos through the westernmost nations of Randland seemed to be Graendal's thing so if there's any one of them it was probably her. I'd say that's a case closed. Graendal should have been Nae'blis, she was the most competent of them next to Ishamael himself.
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Jul 23, 2020 21:37
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Vavrek posted:He has the right look in his eyes to play Aram, I think. The parallels between that and the aiel memories are so depressing.
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Jul 23, 2020 22:00
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certain things definitely kind of take on a bit of further meaning when you remember that he was a vietnam war vet
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Jul 23, 2020 22:02
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:I'd say that's a case closed. Demandred, Semirhage, and Mesaana all individually and collectively were pretty drat effective. Demandred has Taim and Shara, Semirhage had Seanchan, and Mesaana has the White tower.
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Jul 23, 2020 22:09
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As the song goes, five out of thirteen ain't bad.
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Jul 23, 2020 22:16
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Those are the ones that made it to the Last Battle, but there were others who were pretty useful before that. Rahvin effectively destroyed Andor. Sammael not only threw Illian into chaos, but created the entire Shaido sub-plot that tied up all three Ta'veren for a good chunk of time.
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Jul 23, 2020 22:39
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Lanfear's biggest contribution to the effort was indirectly removing Moiraine from play by getting tackled through a doorway.
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Jul 23, 2020 23:00
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DarkHorse posted:Demandred, Semirhage, and Mesaana all individually and collectively were pretty drat effective. Semirhage was in good with the Seanchan, but she didn't really end up accomplishing all that much in the scheme of things- Yeah, Suroth was a darkfriend under her thumb, but on the whole, the seanchan invasion and rule of the western nations was an upgrade for the populace in that area. Her failed attempt to kill Rand did end up almost breaking him though, so, on the one hand, good for her, but on the other hand, Rand learning to tap the True Power through his link to Moridin was also probably the key to him figuring out how to fully fix the dark one's prison sooooo that's kinda a large negative. The other two were definitely hugely effective in Forsaken terms, Mesaana's instigation of the white tower split was a stunning shitshow, and Demandred basically pulled an entire channeling army out of his rear end. Graendal's actual actions around the last battle in terms of both directly dunking the people around Shayol Ghul and loving with the minds of the great captains to lose over half the armies of the light was a big play.
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Jul 24, 2020 01:54
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Gnoman posted:Those are the ones that made it to the Last Battle, but there were others who were pretty useful before that. Rahvin effectively destroyed Andor. Sammael not only threw Illian into chaos, but created the entire Shaido sub-plot that tied up all three Ta'veren for a good chunk of time. And yet they couldn't actually win. loving idiots.
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Jul 24, 2020 01:59
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Khizan posted:Lanfear's biggest contribution to the effort was indirectly removing Moiraine from play by getting tackled through a doorway. Lanfear's entire schtick is thinking she's way more important to stuff going on than she actually is.
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Jul 24, 2020 02:00
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She just wanted to get laid so bad. I must say though, damning humanity for all time is some ultra-crazy-ex poo poo. I feel I need to refer to my earlier point of 'just how loving crazy do you have to be to not get laid when you're the most beautiful woman alive?' Comrade Blyatlov fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Jul 24, 2020 |
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Jul 24, 2020 02:01
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Khizan posted:Lanfear's biggest contribution to the effort was indirectly removing Moiraine from play by getting tackled through a doorway. Drilling the bore, but ya know. What have you done lately?
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Jul 24, 2020 02:07
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I really liked Lanfear till she got tackled. She had a different motive than just whining about being Nae’blis. It is pretty funny that a resurrected Ishamael is given the title for no reason. I can’t remember which one of the chosen realized it and kinda thought it was hosed up.
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Jul 24, 2020 03:16
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He got the job because had the most fitting goal to the Dark One's own, stop the Wheel and destroy Creation so he wouldn't keep getting rezzed every time the DO and the Dragon needed to have their regular discussion.
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Jul 24, 2020 03:56
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He's also less fussed about personal grudges with the other Muppets. I guarantee anyone else would have immediately wiped out half the others.
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Jul 24, 2020 04:06
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Also he did most of the work setting the stage for the Tar'mon Gaidon showdown anyway. His efforts led to the destruction of the Ten Nations, humanity's first major attempt at crawling back towards civilization from the post-apocalyptic wasteland. He drove the political divide between the White Tower and the rest of the world. He created the Black Ajah. He splintered Artur Hawkwing's legacy, sending Hawkwing's children to Seanchan instead of allowing them time for consolidation--ending Hawkwing's dynasty in Randland and driving the world towards an immediate World War right after Hawkwing's war of conquest.
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Jul 24, 2020 04:14
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:The Ishamael Power Hour Did they ever explain how he managed all that while sealed with the other Forsaken? I don't think it was a "trapped near the surface" deal like Aginor & Balthamel, but I can't remember how it worked. And related, was a rough timeframe ever given for when the seals weakened enough to let the Forsaken walk out and start messing with things in the flesh?
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Jul 24, 2020 04:46
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It is pretty blatant that Ishamael was not wholly sealed, given that he was able to walk around in the prologue while Lews Therin is still alive. The implication is that he's free sometimes but not always.
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Jul 24, 2020 04:48
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Every thousand years or so.
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Jul 24, 2020 04:51
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I didn't even think about that part of the prologue, how embarrassing. Whatever deal he had certainly seems better than Aginor and Balthamel's, if he's walking around on and off for millennia but not a withered and or tongueless husk.
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Jul 24, 2020 04:56
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Johnny Joestar posted:certain things definitely kind of take on a bit of further meaning when you remember that he was a vietnam war vet There's a passage in book 2 that really stood out to me. quote:“I was told by the Lord Captain Commander himself to avoid all eyes.” The village has been pacified.
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Jul 24, 2020 05:07
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Lord Awkward posted:I didn't even think about that part of the prologue, how embarrassing. Whatever deal he had certainly seems better than Aginor and Balthamel's, if he's walking around on and off for millennia but not a withered and or tongueless husk. Well, it did lead to his brain being broken and him begging for annihilation
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Jul 24, 2020 05:10
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Lord Awkward posted:Did they ever explain how he managed all that while sealed with the other Forsaken? I don't think it was a "trapped near the surface" deal like Aginor & Balthamel, but I can't remember how it worked. IIRC he's free for ~40 years every millennia or so and while out he has varying levels of ability to draw on the true power but ranges between being basically intangible and having a mostly physical form. As far as the seals, it seems like by the start of book 2 basically all of the Forsaken are free and starting to meddle in mortal affairs. Mat Cauthon fucked around with this message at 05:27 on Jul 24, 2020 |
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Jul 24, 2020 05:22
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Lord Awkward posted:I didn't even think about that part of the prologue, how embarrassing. Whatever deal he had certainly seems better than Aginor and Balthamel's, if he's walking around on and off for millennia but not a withered and or tongueless husk. Yeah, he does a lot but the characters in story don't really realize it for a long time. You basically have to piece it together from stuff he says in the dreams, specific bits of info that get dropped etc. Like, for instance, Ba'alzamon was the Trolloc and Myddraal name for him, not the Dark One. Almost everyone in modern day Randland has no idea that's the case but if you read some of the Trolloc black writing with that in mind you learn a lot about how he engineered the Trolloc Wars and corrupted Artur Hawkwing etc.
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Jul 24, 2020 06:28
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I'd argue that Mesaana was actually a pretty worthless forsaken. What was her accomplishment anyway? Ordering Siuan to be brought down? The Black Ajah might have done that by themselves anyway, they did it often enough in the past when Mesaana was still bound in the Bore. And notice how Alviarin orchestrated the whole thing, Elaida approached her when she learned what Siuan was messing with. Alviarin always did the whole work of the Shadow in the White Tower. Mesaana did nothing more than impersonate a brown sister. What else did she do? Order Rand's capture? Elaida would have done that herself anyway. Drive a wedge between the White Tower and Rand by letting Elaida write that letter? It certainly didn't help, but I doubt Rand would have trusted Elaida anyway, especially after the kidnapping. Then Mesaana had the brilliant idea to send the head of the Black Ajah, and Keeper of the Stole, to check whether the female Choedan Kal really melted. Which resulted in Alviarin losing her position as Keeper, to accomplish a task any darkfriend Aes Sedai could have done just as well. And she does nothing to help her regain her position. She does nothing to eliminate Egwene. Then she leads the attack against the reunited White Tower, and fails spectacularly at that as well. She also didn't show up at Shadar Logoth. So really, did she do anything that Alviarin with a few general orders from Moridin couldn't have done just as well, if not better? And notice how she boasted in that meeting with Moridin and Demandred (and Graendal) that her agents basically controlled the White Tower, that it was broken, and that she would deliver a brood of channelers to the Shadow. Notice how Graendal, whose PoV it is, doesn't rate her very highly, compared to Demandred. And again, she failed to break the Tower, and the channelers that went to join the Shadow at the Last Battle were Black Ajah, so it's not Mesaana's work. She's overrated imho. And it's certainly a big failure of the story that the only new Forsake is Taim, when Alviarin deserved that title just as well, and it would have been a nice gender balance to boot.
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Jul 24, 2020 06:52
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Torrannor posted:And it's certainly a big failure of the story that the only new Forsake is Taim, when Alviarin deserved that title just as well, and it would have been a nice gender balance to boot. It would seriously own if Alviarin also got that promotion in the show.
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Jul 24, 2020 07:26
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Torrannor posted:I'd argue that Mesaana was actually a pretty worthless forsaken. What's funny is that they figured the same in the Age of Legends. She was rejected for a research position at the Collam Daan. Lanfear got in and she didn't. In terms of how they figured worthiness, 8 of the 13 Forsaken had 3rd names in the Age of Legends. Mesaana is among the ones that don't. (Though, interestingly, Lanfear also did not)
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Jul 24, 2020 07:48
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