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CainsDescendant posted:Peace Talks is really good, if a bit truncated. Coming here to read impressions before deciding to read it is probably a bad idea given the general atmosphere. It had its flaws. I would say that if I had it to do over again, I'd wait until both books were, but that's a complete loving lie. The prospect of a new Dresden novel has had me drooling for months. There was no way on God's Earth I'd have been able to wait an extra - what? Ten weeks to complete the "duology?" Peace Talks needed another pass or two from the editor, but it wasn't awful and it did a good job of touching base with the various characters while avoiding some of the cringier aspects of his earlier works: "No, seriously, my apprentice, who is the beloved daughter of my friend who is a literal D&D Paladin complete with badass magic sword, has some truly awesome rockin' titties."
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Jul 25, 2020 07:59
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Everyone posted:It had its flaws. I would say that if I had it to do over again, I'd wait until both books were, but that's a complete loving lie. The prospect of a new Dresden novel has had me drooling for months. There was no way on God's Earth I'd have been able to wait an extra - what? Ten weeks to complete the "duology?" I'd definitely agree with this. However as a caveat I'd say that it's not awful for the first half of a book. As a stand alone, it... doesn't. It's not like changes, ghost story and cold days where it's more satisfying to read all three together, it's literally half a book. It's all setup and no resolution. If the two had been released a week apart that would have been a nice tease and appetite wetter. A year apart would have definitely made it a "skip until you can read them together". Ten weeks is a weird middle ground. I don't regret reading it, but I do wish I'd waited a little longer.
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Jul 25, 2020 09:02
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Seems like most of what I have to say about Peace Talks has already been said:Everyone posted:As for Peace Talks, very much half a book - and not an especially interesting half. thumper57 posted:N'thing the editing complaints... aside from the "remake of The Blob" twice in four pages there was also Lara saying "we can always choose to use the Hunger, but can't always choose to not use it" two different times, and Harry reacting like this was a new insight both times, Harry saying about 4 times in one sequence that Lara made him want to beat his chest like Tarzan, and for one sentence Butters is sparring with Santa instead of Sanya. I enjoyed the book but it felt like a draft that got published by accident. I really don't understand how you end up with a book of this poor quality after, what, 6 years? Seems like it would have been better to just cut some of the filler and worst bits and combine it with Battle Grounds to release one presumably good book, although I really hope BG is going to be better edited. I was also disappointed that after all the build up and delays that we see "the parasite" for about one paragraph and it's not an interesting paragraph. Zore posted:Like, to be clear, the deal with Marcone was that he wouldn't go after them and they gave him weregild for the dead guy. And as far as we know Marcone has done literally nothing to Harry or Murphy since. Even if Marcone isn't involved and doesn't actually own Rudy as suspected, he does have a lot of the political power and other cops in his pocket, so you'd think he could put pressure on the investigation to go away now that they are all working together.
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Jul 25, 2020 11:54
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Darkrenown posted:Even if Marcone isn't involved and doesn't actually own Rudy as suspected, he does have a lot of the political power and other cops in his pocket, so you'd think he could put pressure on the investigation to go away now that they are all working together. Why would he give Dresden a freebie like that? If anything, I could see him manufacturing just enough of an investigation to get Dresden worried, then offer to make it go away in exchange for a favour. Marcone knows just how valuable favours are in the supernatural world. Remember, the two haven't had a chance to talk yet. When they do, I wouldn't be surprised to hear an offer to make this all go away.
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Jul 25, 2020 12:07
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I know I'm just echoing the crowd here but I was also annoyed by his refusal to have Dresden ever defuse a situation with a simple reasonable explanation. We've already covered the girlfriend thing or just talking to Ebenezer. but just as bad was on the boat to Demonreach not explaining the whole "We don't have time to fix this, but I can essentially put him into stasis until we can" plan.
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Jul 25, 2020 12:15
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Masonity posted:Why would he give Dresden a freebie like that? If anything, I could see him manufacturing just enough of an investigation to get Dresden worried, then offer to make it go away in exchange for a favour. I meant more by the end of Peace talks, once everything kicks off and they know they're in trouble and on the same side it doesn't really make sense to let anything jog Harry's elbow. But yeah, might just be because they haven't talked yet. newershadow posted:Alternatively, we’ve seen the sword fail to cut someone. What happens if it does cut someone that it shouldn’t? And how do the Swords feel about Outsiders? I think the Swords might be very useful vs Outsiders, since Skin game establishes that major Christian relics are powerful weapons against them. Avalerion posted:That's another short story thing. Ramirez and Molly try to hook up, but since Molly is the Maiden in the Mother/Crone trio her mantle is hardwired to preserve that maidenhood - so as they are about to boink it makes her go berserk and beat Ramirez to a pulp. That sounds very strange. The winter lady can't gently caress? Maeve seemed to be all about sex any time she turned up, and in Cold days went on about how the Lady and Knight are traditionally meant to get it on. I know Nemesis let her lie, and Molly says she was a poo poo Lady who neglected her duties, but until the very end she had to keep her lying concealed so if her power is tied to virginity then you'd think she wouldn't constantly be publicly offering Harry and others sex. Also pretty surprised Molly is a virgin since she had at least one boyfriend in her late teens, got naked and offered Harry sex later, and is what, 25-30 now? Khizan posted:Yeah, that's what I think too. He didn't like Dresden hanging around with him, but Dresden's an adult and can make his own choices even if they're bad ones. It's when he saw that Maggie was around Thomas that his hatred got cranked up to 11. I mean, his daughter had been killed by Lord Raith. It's not surprising that seeing Raith's son hanging out around his granddaughter drove him over the edge. Does McCoy even know Lord Raith is a mere puppet of Lara these days? If not he still thinks the Whites are run by the magic-immune bastard who killed Maggie.
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Jul 25, 2020 13:38
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Deptfordx posted:I know I'm just echoing the crowd here but I was also annoyed by his refusal to have Dresden ever defuse a situation with a simple reasonable explanation. He knew she wouldn't go for it, I mean, as soon as he does it, her first assumption is that Harry tricked her and now he has Thomas as a hostage. Even when he does try to defuse the situation and explain things, she's convinced that he did it as a way to get leverage on her, because now if he dies, Thomas is lost to her, which means she has a vested interest in protecting him.
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Jul 25, 2020 13:44
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I forget, did we ever establish how Lord Raith is able to just shrug off magic?
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Jul 25, 2020 13:44
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Deptfordx posted:I forget, did we ever establish how Lord Raith is able to just shrug off magic? I thought he was established as just a capable wizard in his own right, and used his powers to deflect incoming attack
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Jul 25, 2020 13:49
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the_steve posted:He knew she wouldn't go for it, I mean, as soon as he does it, her first assumption is that Harry tricked her and now he has Thomas as a hostage. Even when he does try to defuse the situation and explain things, she's convinced that he did it as a way to get leverage on her, because now if he dies, Thomas is lost to her, which means she has a vested interest in protecting him. She reacts badly to the whole process because it looks like he's doing something horrible to Thomas, and he hasn't explained what he's doing and why. It looks like a way to get leverage, because they didn't discuss the need for it before he did it. Reasonable Dresden has a "He's dying, we don't have time to fix this, here's a stopgap till we do" discussion with her.
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Jul 25, 2020 13:56
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Darkrenown posted:Seems like most of what I have to say about Peace Talks has already been said: Marcone probably assumes they can handle their own poo poo. Also, these were two of his employees and not every cop in Chicago is on the take from him. If he started putting pressure on them to "make it go away" figure a good many of those cops would assume he had the murders done and look for ways to pin it on him. Deptfordx posted:I know I'm just echoing the crowd here but I was also annoyed by his refusal to have Dresden ever defuse a situation with a simple reasonable explanation. I was okay with that part. On a pretty deep level, Harry doesn't trust Lara Raith, so he doesn't trust her to not interfere with what needs to be done. So, from his perspective it's better to ask forgiveness than permission - and to make sure he's in a place where he holds all the advantages should forgiveness not be immediately forthcoming. Darkrenown posted:I meant more by the end of Peace talks, once everything kicks off and they know they're in trouble and on the same side it doesn't really make sense to let anything jog Harry's elbow. But yeah, might just be because they haven't talked yet. In Proven Guilty Michael and his Sword show up to kick the poo poo out of some Outsiders and save a bunch of Warden trainees, so, yeah, the Swords work pretty well against them. Figure it depends on your definition of "gently caress." My take on it is that the Winter Lady can't be vaginally/anally penetrate and must maintain her virginity that way. Figure outside of that, she's good to go. As for Molly still being a "virgin" by that time, she was raised in a pretty heavily Catholic family. Maybe she absorbed a bit more of that teaching than even she thought and never went "all the way" as a result of that. Ot maybe the Winter Lady mantle doesn't care what you did prior to that but once you get it, anal/vaginal penetration is off the table. I guess you could tweet Butcher about it. For my part, the whole thing is tied to some wrong-headed, archaic thinking about female sexuality/virginity, is kind of creepy and not something I really give a poo poo about knowing. As for Lord Raith, I should assume that Harry told him about the whole thing some time after Blood Rites. On the other hand, Harry is the same person who never bothered to sit McCoy and Thomas down in a calm, controlled environment (like on Demonreach where they would both be guests in his home and he was basically God) and shared the truth of Thomas with McCoy, so who the gently caress knows? Everyone fucked around with this message at 14:16 on Jul 25, 2020 |
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Jul 25, 2020 13:59
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I'd assume the whole "Has to stay a Virgin" shtick is more Butcher retconning along the lines of what exactly the Knight mantle power-up is. It might even be as simple as he thought it'd be a cool end to that short story and not even have considered something contradictory he wrote years ago.
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Jul 25, 2020 14:36
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I think it's much more simple than all of that: Maeve preferred to play the sexpot and shirk her duties. Mab openly said (to Molly) that Maeve had been ignoring her duties for years, which is why Molly's been busy as hell. And we were never privy to Maeve's private life, either, so who knows how many people she's murdered by luring them in and then letting the mantle do its thing—it's even possible that she would have enjoyed that.
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Jul 25, 2020 15:08
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It's not that she has to remain a virgin explicitly, but that the lady can't become a mother (or even risk it) because then she'd have to depose Mab. Which does put Maeve offering Harry to carry his child into an interesting new light.
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Jul 25, 2020 15:51
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jivjov posted:I thought he was established as just a capable wizard in his own right, and used his powers to deflect incoming attack I believe it was part of his deal with the Outsiders.
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Jul 25, 2020 19:26
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jivjov posted:I thought he was established as just a capable wizard in his own right, and used his powers to deflect incoming attack I think his magic immunity was down to his pact with the Outsiders (specifically He Who Walks Behind).
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Jul 25, 2020 20:23
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I disliked this book. In fact, I liked book one and two more than this book. It just didn't feel fun. It didn't really tug on any of the really interesting threads I was hoping it would. I especially did not like him eyeballing Ivy, and felt actively skeeved out when he eyeballed a girl he knew since she was a toddler ( The Hobbit ), the later in particular bugging me for the rest of the book. It was gross. GROSS. And it's just so juvenile in its sexuality that it got really annoying, and annoyed me for making me feel like a prude. I don't like that the Fomor didn't get much of a build up, and now they've got a God. I don't like that a lot of the conflict was caused by not communicating. It feels like that was supposed to be due to Harry's status as a Fae-thing influencing him, and others views of him. But it wasn't sufficiently established on the page. It just immediately ramped up to ten. We needed more of that, more reaction to him being the knight, coming back from the dead, etc, to ground that paranoia in. I didn't like that the end was another 'heist' like Skingame but worse. The idea that Thomas was guarded by a guy is hella dumb and doesn't seem like something Marcone would do. It doesn't seem like something Odin's brood would do. It doesn't seem realistic. The magic sneezing thing I don't care to spell was dumb and came out of nowhere and I didn't like it. Butcher's good at setting things up, this wasn't. Can we be introduced to more women who don't want to ride the D-train I really didn't enjoy waiting this long for a book that ended without a satisfying conclusion or many of the fun set-pieces Jim does. I really didn't enjoy the book ending on the verge of what felt like what was supposed to be its climax. The book just went all over the place and nowhere. It felt like it was written, cut apart, and then put back together again to serve as a spring-board for all the stuff that's going to happen in the next. It's my least favorite in the series, hands down, and I'm seriously considering returning it. There were things that I liked, but the things that I didn't were too numerous and too often.
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Jul 25, 2020 21:50
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Deptfordx posted:I forget, did we ever establish how Lord Raith is able to just shrug off magic? People are skipping The Porn Star Book, I see. Harry's Mom's death curse stopped him from being able to feed, slowly starving him, while simultaneously protecting him from magic. Faraday cage type situation. This of course leads to Lara successfully dominating him with her own brand of sexy magic because  Butcher.
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Jul 25, 2020 23:00
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I don't remember that being established. The death curse preventing him from feeding, yes, but not the magic immunity.
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Jul 25, 2020 23:15
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The curse doesn't give him immunity to magic. The curse was used because it could bypass his immunity to magic. The immunity to magic is due to a pact with the Outsiders. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Jul 25, 2020 |
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Jul 25, 2020 23:18
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Deptfordx posted:I know I'm just echoing the crowd here but I was also annoyed by his refusal to have Dresden ever defuse a situation with a simple reasonable explanation. This is incredibly frustrating and the reason I stopped reading DF a few books in, and it seems to be more common in urban fantasy in general than in other genres. I don't know why, but it drives me right up the loving wall.
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Jul 26, 2020 01:01
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ToxicFrog posted:This is incredibly frustrating and the reason I stopped reading DF a few books in, and it seems to be more common in urban fantasy in general than in other genres. I don't know why, but it drives me right up the loving wall. It's a theme in Wheel of Time (not urban i know), but much more competently done. Nobody talks and huge problems come out of nobody talking, for the good AND bad guys.
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Jul 26, 2020 01:28
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DarkHorse posted:It's a theme in Wheel of Time (not urban i know), but much more competently done. Pretty sure drat near every series is reliant on the "nobody talks" trope.
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Jul 26, 2020 01:29
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the_steve posted:Pretty sure drat near every series is reliant on the "nobody talks" trope. True, but it's constant in that series instead of just plot points. Everything from the three main male characters all thinking the other two are way better with women, and a character having marriage problems because his wife is from another culture and their mixed signals ticking each other off. To say nothing of things like a character trying to take down a rival with a misdirection, only for it to be proven true and unearthing a huge conspiracy in the process.
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Jul 26, 2020 06:59
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It's because real life works that way too
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Jul 26, 2020 07:14
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lol i hope butcher keeps puttin girls in for dresden to oogle because the meltdowns in this thread are so good over them (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 26, 2020 09:02
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DarkHorse posted:To say nothing of things like a character trying to take down a rival with a misdirection, only for it to be proven true and unearthing a huge conspiracy in the process. It's been a while since I read WoT, which book is this?
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Jul 26, 2020 11:55
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the_steve posted:Pretty sure drat near every series is reliant on the "nobody talks" trope. There are lots that aren't, as it happens And I know this because "this entire conflict could have been averted or resolved with five minutes of conversation that no-one involved had a good reason to avoid" is, these days, a reason for me to drop a book without finishing it, and somehow I'm still finding lots of stuff to read
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Jul 26, 2020 12:16
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Illuyankas posted:It's been a while since I read WoT, which book is this? It's Elaida trying to take down Alviarin, but Pevara misinterprets her hints and starts hunting (and finding!) black ajah in the white tower instead
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Jul 26, 2020 14:53
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Ramadu posted:lol i hope butcher keeps puttin girls in for dresden to oogle because the meltdowns in this thread are so good over them Eh, at this point I'm just annoyed that it comes up with girls he used to see as children. There are ways to mention someone is not the toddler they used to be without going "jesus they come with boobs and hips now!!!!!!!!" To me it's not meltdown worthy, just obnoxious. Go ham on white court vamps, it's kinda their whole shtick, but stop being weird about every single girl you've ever seen. Edit: boobs and hips, not boots and hips. Thanks, phone.
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Jul 26, 2020 16:08
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NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:I disliked this book. In fact, I liked book one and two more than this book. I didn't really see it as sexual, just as Harry noticing that these people he knew (and thought of) as little girls are now young women. Compared to the Molly stuff in previous books, that was positively demure. NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:I don't like that the Fomor didn't get much of a build up, and now they've got a God. I don't think they were supposed to get much of a build-up. They're the "out of nowhere" threat. But yeah, the execution could've been a lot better. NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:I don't like that a lot of the conflict was caused by not communicating. It feels like that was supposed to be due to Harry's status as a Fae-thing influencing him, and others views of him. But it wasn't sufficiently established on the page. It just immediately ramped up to ten. We needed more of that, more reaction to him being the knight, coming back from the dead, etc, to ground that paranoia in. Agreed. I mean, sure, Harry isn't really the most contemplative or self-aware protagonist, but this verged into bad soap opera levels of poor communication. NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:I didn't like that the end was another 'heist' like Skingame but worse. The idea that Thomas was guarded by a guy is hella dumb and doesn't seem like something Marcone would do. It doesn't seem like something Odin's brood would do. It doesn't seem realistic. Actually, I think it was very realistic on the part of Marcone. Marcone's "superpower" is grand strategy. He pretty well knew that Lara Raith was going to try to spring her brother. He likely expected her to involve Harry Dresden in that. So, he set up security that he expected them to penetrate in a non-lethal manner. That way, he doesn't end up in a war with the White Court and he can potentially leverage that tough-looking but faulty security as something he did deliberately as an unasked favor for Lara. NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:The magic sneezing thing I don't care to spell was dumb and came out of nowhere and I didn't like it. Butcher's good at setting things up, this wasn't. That could also have been set up a lot better, [spoiler]perhaps with Maggie stifling a sneeze or two. NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:Can we be introduced to more women who don't want to ride the D-train Well, Lara's Valkyrie clearly wants to spend some time on the M train... NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:I really didn't enjoy waiting this long for a book that ended without a satisfying conclusion or many of the fun set-pieces Jim does. I really didn't enjoy the book ending on the verge of what felt like what was supposed to be its climax. It was basically Harry Dresden and the Deathly Hallows: Part I There was a bunch of set-up, a couple of set pieces and it ends on what was supposed to be a "gently caress yeah! poo poo just got real!" note. NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:The book just went all over the place and nowhere. It felt like it was written, cut apart, and then put back together again to serve as a spring-board for all the stuff that's going to happen in the next. It's my least favorite in the series, hands down, and I'm seriously considering returning it. There were things that I liked, but the things that I didn't were too numerous and too often. The cutting apart thing is probably what happened. Meanwhile, I'll feel a little stupid when it happens, but it would not surprise me in the least if we get a "special omnibus" edition that puts the two works together in the same volume. Probably timed for whenever Book 18 is released. Everyone fucked around with this message at 18:07 on Jul 26, 2020 |
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Jul 26, 2020 18:00
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DarkHorse posted:It's Elaida trying to take down Alviarin, but Pevara misinterprets her hints and starts hunting (and finding!) black ajah in the white tower instead Thanks, I should have guessed It involved Aes Sedai
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Jul 26, 2020 23:09
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Everyone posted:It was basically Harry Dresden and the Deathly Hallows: Part I There was a bunch of set-up, a couple of set pieces and it ends on what was supposed to be a "gently caress yeah! poo poo just got real!" note. The best part about this comparison is that Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows was one book.
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Jul 27, 2020 00:15
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OptimusWang posted:The best part about this comparison is that Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows was one book. There was a book?
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Jul 27, 2020 00:25
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OptimusWang posted:The best part about this comparison is that Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows was one book. Sure, but it was two movies. And, honestly, it's easier to think of the Dresden Files books as prose comics or movies than as books in some ways.
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Jul 27, 2020 04:00
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OptimusWang posted:The best part about this comparison is that Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows was one book. No, the best part is that the author of Harry Potter and the author of the Dresden files are both terrible people and we should be talking about better books.
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Jul 27, 2020 13:46
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biracial bear for uncut posted:No, the best part is that the author of Harry Potter and the author of the Dresden files are both terrible people and we should be talking about better books. I know Rowling is a TERF, what's wrong with Butcher?
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Jul 27, 2020 14:05
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Rygar201 posted:I know Rowling is a TERF, what's wrong with Butcher? Casual yellow peril racism and a covid conspiracy theorist.
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Jul 27, 2020 15:18
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biracial bear for uncut posted:Casual yellow peril racism and a covid conspiracy theorist. Then I guess I'm one, too. I don't think China deliberately released COVID. However, I have no trouble believing that they covered up the extent of the threat and that they published misleading data to keep themselves from blame and to exploit the crisis for their benefit.
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Jul 27, 2020 15:44
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Everyone posted:Then I guess I'm one, too. I don't think China deliberately released COVID. However, I have no trouble believing that they covered up the extent of the threat and that they published misleading data to keep themselves from blame and to exploit the crisis for their benefit. Yeah, but you're also the one rushing to defend every creepy and terrible thing Jim Butcher puts into his books so I'm not surprised there. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 27, 2020 15:48
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