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The very first clash between the X-Men and the Avengers was a very silly story in UXM #9 featuring the extremely forgettable villain Lucifer, a guy with a goatee who may or may not be an alien and was responsible for first paralyzing Xavier.  The most I can say about it is that it has a pretty cool Jack Kirby splash of everybody tussling: 
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Aug 4, 2020 05:45
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lmao at that fight
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Aug 4, 2020 05:50
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I loved when everyone had sort of the same power level. Thor vs. Angel? Sure that's believable.
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Aug 4, 2020 06:00
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Not only that, but Thor looks terrified.
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Aug 4, 2020 06:06
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Excuse me, his mortal blows are clearly but feather touches to Thor.
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Aug 4, 2020 06:07
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How Wonderful! posted:The very first clash between the X-Men and the Avengers was a very silly story in UXM #9 featuring the extremely forgettable villain Lucifer, a guy with a goatee who may or may not be an alien and was responsible for first paralyzing Xavier. With modern power levels that X team could probably chump that Avengers team. Or at least Jean Grey could.
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Aug 4, 2020 06:37
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Skwirl posted:With modern power levels that X team could probably chump that Avengers team. Or at least Jean Grey could. I dunno, Thor's only gotten stronger.
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Aug 4, 2020 07:29
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Dan Didio posted:Not only that, but Thor looks terrified. Wing envy. e: Has anyone in the funny papers ever used "Hey Asterix!" as an insult to the mighty Thor?
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Aug 4, 2020 07:33
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Lurdiak posted:I dunno, Thor's only gotten stronger. And all three of them have WAY stronger cultural cache now. Sorry Jean, the days where you could kill them off without it being a major event comic are long gone. Meanwhile... well, Angel and Iceman aren't so lucky.
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Aug 4, 2020 07:41
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Lurdiak posted:I dunno, Thor's only gotten stronger. So have Cap and Iron Man.
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Aug 4, 2020 07:42
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Dan Didio posted:So have Cap and Iron Man. Eh, Cap's about the same. He was already keeping up with The Hulk and Spider-man in the early days. In fact a fair amount of letters complained that a "glorified acrobat" shouldn't be able to do as well as he did in fights, let alone lead the Avengers.
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Aug 4, 2020 07:58
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Cleretic posted:And all three of them have WAY stronger cultural cache now. Sorry Jean, the days where you could kill them off without it being a major event comic are long gone. Depending on who's writing him, Iceman is a threat that could probably take on a whole Avengers team
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Aug 4, 2020 08:02
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Lurdiak posted:Eh, Cap's about the same. He was already keeping up with The Hulk and Spider-man in the early days. In fact a fair amount of letters complained that a "glorified acrobat" shouldn't be able to do as well as he did in fights, let alone lead the Avengers. I mean Spider-man's power had fluctuated more than probably any other hero I can think of. Even in his original run there's like a twelve issue period where he goes from being overpowered by Kraven (who's just a normal dude) to lifting a building. Or how he can beat up all the X-Men at once but a geriatric rear end in a top hat in a wingsuit gives him trouble Power levels are completely meaningless 
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Aug 4, 2020 08:06
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Lurdiak posted:Eh, Cap's about the same. He was already keeping up with The Hulk and Spider-man in the early days. In fact a fair amount of letters complained that a "glorified acrobat" shouldn't be able to do as well as he did in fights, let alone lead the Avengers. That's because Hulk and Spider-Man used to be a lot weaker too and a lack of consistency though, there used to be a lot of scenes of people like Quicksilver pointing out that Cap's just an ordinary dude at the end of the day, which isn't really how he's portrayed anymore. Now he's a bonafide superhuman. Scarlet Witch has got to be the most power-boosted character, though.
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Aug 4, 2020 08:27
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I think if anything Spidey used to be stronger. I can't imagine him taking on the entire X-men or FF anymore.
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Aug 4, 2020 10:02
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Nilbop posted:Oh! Do you have a link handy? A quick look turned up nothing. Sorry, I was dead wrong. I was remembering the end of "Emancipation," but that occurred way before Ivan got put into that coma. And here I was thinking he ended on a positive, if delusional, note.
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Aug 4, 2020 10:27
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TwoPair posted:Depending on who's writing him, Iceman is a threat that could probably take on a whole Avengers team As a threat? Yes. I believe Iceman's classified like, a hair below Omega-level mutant, but I might be wrong. But as a marketing tool to sell comics? Hell no. At best, he'd get to stunt during a lesser X-Men Vs. Avengers fight outside of a headline fight between Cap and Wolverine or something. But in actual lives-on-the-line major conflict between the two, Iceman is on the list of 'identifiable names they'd be willing to kill off outside of the climax' to me. Meanwhile Thor, Cap and Iron Man only die if a whole major issue gets devoted to it. Maybe two.
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Aug 4, 2020 10:44
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Lurdiak posted:I think if anything Spidey used to be stronger. I can't imagine him taking on the entire X-men or FF anymore. Maybe, yeah. They pay lip service to it sometimes when they need a big moment, but they don't really show how dangerous he is anymore. Cleretic posted:As a threat? Yes. I believe Iceman's classified like, a hair below Omega-level mutant, but I might be wrong. Unless something has changed since that issue where Emma Frost jumped around in his brain, he just straight up is, although the definition's different now that Hickman's in charge, so who knows.
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Aug 4, 2020 10:56
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"Iceman is able to form a rising column of ice beneath his feet, capable of lifting him off the ground. The tensile strength of the column is determined by its thickness, and its steadiness by how well it has been braced. A well-braced and regular column, 6 feet in diameter at its base, is able to support his weight without toppling for about 85 feet in a 40-mile per hour wind. ... Iceman, although, has shown that he is not limited to creating constructs and can fly on his own with his control over moisture." i know that this means there are definitely issues where Iceman did both of those things precisely to those specifications but lol
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Aug 4, 2020 11:22
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cowboy
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I think you'll find that Bobby Drake is actually an Omegle level mutant.
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Aug 4, 2020 11:23
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if Magneto can fly by pushing against the metal in the ground? i guess? it's totally fine for Iceman to be capable of flying by subtracting energy from the water molecules in the air? i guess? "Iceman's powers are so vast that it extends down to the molecular level, to the point he can freeze all of the molecules of an object/being with a thought, he can with a thought freeze the flow of blood to the brain and reverse the process with no side effects, and even evaporate someone into nothingness and reverse the process." okay yes superpowers are magic but this is too much
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Aug 4, 2020 11:26
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FFT posted:if Magneto can fly by pushing against the metal in the ground? i guess? it's totally fine for Iceman to be capable of flying by subtracting energy from the water molecules in the air? i guess? I thought Magneto flew because he had metal in his costume, and he moved that metal. Has he flown nekkid?
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Aug 4, 2020 11:46
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I never understood how his force field works either.
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Aug 4, 2020 12:00
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prefect posted:I thought Magneto flew because he had metal in his costume, and he moved that metal. Has he flown nekkid? He used to use all kinds of wacky explanations for it.
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Aug 4, 2020 12:43
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Aug 4, 2020 12:45
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This is almost as bad as the time he mindcontrolled people with his magnetic personality
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Aug 4, 2020 13:59
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McCloud posted:This is almost as bad as the time he mindcontrolled people with his magnetic personality Brains are based on electricity. That is physically the same as magnetism.
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Aug 4, 2020 14:04
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He once performed brain surgery by destroying the iron in someone's brain blood.
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Aug 4, 2020 14:25
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Lurdiak posted:I never understood how his force field works either.
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Aug 4, 2020 14:27
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Rhyno posted:He once performed brain surgery by destroying the iron in someone's brain blood. Magneto also performed surgery with Professor X on a person in Genosha. He used his powers to basically make a large MRI, so Charles knew where to operate. I thought that was a pretty clever use of his powers.
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Aug 4, 2020 14:47
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Rhyno posted:He once performed brain surgery by destroying the iron in someone's brain blood. Also i think he shut down someones powers temporarily in the 90s in the same way. Maybe in X-Force? There was a neat subversion of that in Exiles, where an evil Hyperion runs into an alternate universe Magneto, who tries that trick, to which Hyperion just says "my blood doesn't have any iron in it" and blows up magnetos head with eye beams.
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Aug 4, 2020 15:10
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 Plastic Man #23 (1950)  House of Mystery #17 (1953)  The Fantastic Four #9 (1962)  What If? #26 (1981)  The Sensational She-Hulk #12 (1990)  Spider-Man Unlimited #4 (1994)
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Aug 4, 2020 15:40
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Darthemed posted:
The beret on the fishbowl helmet is 
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Aug 4, 2020 19:19
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Lurdiak posted:I think if anything Spidey used to be stronger. I can't imagine him taking on the entire X-men or FF anymore. He chumped Mr Fantastic pretty hard in Civil War and took on two phoenix powered X-Men and lived in AvX. Sue Storm could probably him out, but thats true of most anyone who isn't psychic. She didn't even have force fields the first time the FF and Spider-Man fought.
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Aug 4, 2020 19:27
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Cleretic posted:As a threat? Yes. I believe Iceman's classified like, a hair below Omega-level mutant, but I might be wrong. At the moment every single X character is on the list of who they're willing to kill outside of a climax.
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Aug 4, 2020 19:29
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Back in the day you'd have stuff like Daredevil fighting Dr. Doom and be all "yeah that seems right". But Spider-Man has an absolutely terrifying power set for anyone who can't just instantly shut him down with a thought.
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Aug 4, 2020 20:41
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Remember that time he broke into a prison and beat up the Kingpin.
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Aug 4, 2020 20:53
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McCloud posted:This is almost as bad as the time he mindcontrolled people with his magnetic personality 
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Aug 4, 2020 22:25
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Magnato?
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Aug 4, 2020 22:37
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Ghostlight posted:what about the time he became a shipping magnate? I know that's using the literal definition of awesome but I can't help laughing at at the narration in the second panel. Like the narrator suddenly goes "poo poo, this dude looks cool"
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Aug 4, 2020 22:51
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