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exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


It didn't bother me that GoT's combat eventually became super easy but the whiplash in the number of incremental upgrades and ghost tools turning you into an untouchable killing machine within like, the first few hours of the game was a bit extreme.

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JackSplater
Nov 20, 2014

Metal Coat? It's already active?!
Risk of Rain 2:

Finally released 1.0 this week. Still a good game, but the final boss is a giant pain. A good chunk of items that you'd normally want to use for every other level do practically nothing against him since they need more than one enemy to be useful. He's fast, which means if you don't get mobility items you're screwed. He hits hard, so if you don't have survivability and healing you're screwed. He has an attack that makes him untargetable for five to six seconds, so any items that need you to hit him regularly aren't nearly as useful. You basically only want movespeed, fire rate, and straight damage items.

The character you unlock for beating him is pretty great, though.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

JackSplater posted:

Risk of Rain 2:A good chunk of items that you'd normally want to use for every other level do practically nothing against him since they need more than one enemy to be useful.
why have roguelites still not figured this out

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


What are games that put an unnecessary plot in their campaigns?

The Crew is like Forza Horizon, only poo poo, and for some reason Ubisoft thought what this car-game really needed was a revenge story starring a Gordon Freeman lookalike voiced by Troy Baker. Never-mind the half-baked gameplay we've got to try our hands at writing a Fast and the Furious ripoff. If Ubisoft released a Bejeweled game they'd probably add a story about an angsty dude (with a dead girlfriend) who must collect gems for some reason.

Superhot still pisses me off. You can't replay any levels or try any extra game-modes until you beat the campaign. The plot has no real character or stakes so it relies entirely on meta-commentary, which is a bit like eating a dinner made entirely out of condiments. Sitting through those pretentious text logs again kills any incentive to replay.

Kennel
May 1, 2008

BAWWW-UNH!
It doesn't really drag the game down, because it doesn't really matter, but it amuses me, how irrelevant Hitman: Blood Money's "main" story is. The levels are pretty much completely independent from each other, but every now and then we watch a two-minute cutscene of two guys discussing how 47 went to country X and killed person Y. Then all actual plot happens between the final main level and the epilogue.

FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!

The original game is also like that. Unconnected missions with some vague mysterious cut scenes every now and then followed by the end mission where you find out it was all connected.

Hitman games at their best are basically puzzle games where the solution is always death and don't really need plot.

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


Which is why Hitman Absolution was such a stinker, and that is why people watch Columbo to see his work and not his personal-life.

LifeSunDeath
Jan 4, 2007

still gay rights and smoke weed every day
Agent 47 doesn't need a personal story, but there is a little story there which is ok. His targets are the stars, you learn all about them during the course of stalking/impersonating/killing them, and they're all wacky characters with weird extra details that make for some good comedy.

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020

In Yakuza 0 the cabaret club minigame sucks and feels creepy to play. Why can Kiryu make billions just checking in every once in a while but Majima has to babysit a bunch of sex workers for five minutes at a time for like a quarter as much money. What an unfair world really makes you think

Zanzibar Ham
Mar 17, 2009

You giving me the cold shoulder? How cruel.


Grimey Drawer

Manager Hoyden posted:

In Yakuza 0 the cabaret club minigame sucks and feels creepy to play. Why can Kiryu make billions just checking in every once in a while but Majima has to babysit a bunch of sex workers for five minutes at a time for like a quarter as much money. What an unfair world really makes you think

Dang, just a couple days ago I finally came back to 0 after a long hiatus exactly because I was going through the Cabaret stuff to unlock Majima's skill boards.

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters

Manager Hoyden posted:

In Yakuza 0 the cabaret club minigame sucks and feels creepy to play. Why can Kiryu make billions just checking in every once in a while but Majima has to babysit a bunch of sex workers for five minutes at a time for like a quarter as much money. What an unfair world really makes you think

Not sex workers though?

LifeSunDeath
Jan 4, 2007

still gay rights and smoke weed every day

Manager Hoyden posted:

In Yakuza 0 the cabaret club minigame sucks and feels creepy to play. Why can Kiryu make billions just checking in every once in a while but Majima has to babysit a bunch of sex workers for five minutes at a time for like a quarter as much money. What an unfair world really makes you think

Not trying to defend mafia run prostitution and human trafficking, but Yakuza games accel at presenting the actual yakuza world as it is in japan. Hostess bars (snack bars), massage parlors, pachinko parlors, loan sharking and realestate scams....it's all run by the mafia in japan, still today. That is their world. It would be like playing GTA and getting upset about the glorification of auto theft.

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020

Morpheus posted:

Not sex workers though?

Man I spent half an hour leveling up my platinum hoe's love stat I don't know what to tell you man she is a sex worker

LifeSunDeath posted:

Not trying to defend mafia run prostitution and human trafficking, but Yakuza games accel at presenting the actual yakuza world as it is in japan. Hostess bars (snack bars), massage parlors, pachinko parlors, loan sharking and realestate scams....it's all run by the mafia in japan, still today. That is their world. It would be like playing GTA and getting upset about the glorification of auto theft.

I'm not morally outraged I just think it sucks to play gameplay-wise and also on top of that there is some creep going on like if someone looked over my shoulder I'm not sure how I would explain dressing up this young girl and going on a date with her to train her

Manager Hoyden has a new favorite as of 17:08 on Aug 13, 2020

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

You're being a supportive boss. Majima is pure.

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

You're being a supportive boss. Majima is pure.

That's what I told my wife but I'm still sleeping on the couch (which is good because that means I can date my sex workers in peace)

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


As someone who doesn't a poo poo about strategy can someone tell me how Total War is so prolific? Obviously there are multiple studios making the things, but how does the innovation and polish fare if they're able poop out Warhammer II a year after Warhammer I?

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Pillbug

Inspector Gesicht posted:

As someone who doesn't a poo poo about strategy can someone tell me how Total War is so prolific? Obviously there are multiple studios making the things, but how does the innovation and polish fare if they're able poop out Warhammer II a year after Warhammer I?

Warhammer II was more of a expandalone than a full game, wasn't it? Tons of the work was already done when they were making the first one.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Manager Hoyden posted:

In Yakuza 0 the cabaret club minigame sucks and feels creepy to play. Why can Kiryu make billions just checking in every once in a while but Majima has to babysit a bunch of sex workers for five minutes at a time for like a quarter as much money. What an unfair world really makes you think

Something pretty easy to miss in Yakuza 0, and honestly a bad move on their part: Majima makes less money, but also all his upgrades are cheaper. So it balances out, but it just feels bad, and I'm not sure exactly why they did it. Maybe because Kiryu's income as 'real estate mogul' just makes sense raking in less cash than Majima's 'skeezy cabaret club host', but... yeah, it still feels like Majima's a huge step down even fhough he's not.

SkeletonHero
Sep 7, 2010

:dehumanize:
:killing:
:dehumanize:
Yakuza 0 is good, but I feel like they missed the mark on Majima. He's fun to play and his story is better than Kiryu's but I think when fans said they wanted to play as Majima, they meant good-hearted wild card Majima and not mild-mannered yes man Majima.

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


SkeletonHero posted:

Yakuza 0 is good, but I feel like they missed the mark on Majima. He's fun to play and his story is better than Kiryu's but I think when fans said they wanted to play as Majima, they meant good-hearted wild card Majima and not mild-mannered yes man Majima.

Of course then the players who entered the series with 0 were confused as the Majima in the next two remakes is a completely different person. Somewhat criminally he's written out of 4,5, and 6. I do hope we get some closure to his character.

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



Casey Finnigan posted:

Man, after you upgrade your character in Ghost of Tsushima, the game is too drat easy no matter what you do (besides certain duels).

The one next step in customizability that I'd like to see become the norm is to let you toggle more of the perks you buy, like you're pretty much forced into a lot of them because they're mostly arranged in trees even if they're not all sequential upgrades. This game has a pretty nice start in that the outfit upgrades are all treated as separate, so it's easy to take a step back if you don't want an upgrade. It'd just be nice to see that as universally as possible.

LifeSunDeath
Jan 4, 2007

still gay rights and smoke weed every day
I want to play Yakuza from the perspective of the average salary man just trying to get a beer and the bar has this overly complex scoring system and gangsters having full on warfare in the parking lot, and everything is so bizarre, and his wife doesn't believe him.

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


The last Devil May Cry lets you disable moves as well limit Dante's loadout. I didn't to hamper myself becuase I had no loving clue how half the poo poo works.

I think there's room for a Metroid or Zelda style game giving you the option to depower yourself: like selling all your heart-containers to a pawn-shop and choosing to wear the Level 1 Long-Johns you started with.

LifeSunDeath
Jan 4, 2007

still gay rights and smoke weed every day

Inspector Gesicht posted:

The last Devil May Cry lets you disable moves as well limit Dante's loadout. I didn't to hamper myself becuase I had no loving clue how half the poo poo works.

I think there's room for a Metroid or Zelda style game giving you the option to depower yourself: like selling all your heart-containers to a pawn-shop and choosing to wear the Level 1 Long-Johns you started with.

BoTW let you rush the end boss without any upgrades or equipment. To me that's the best when you gate endgame by difficulty not access, because I enjoy grinding and getting OP for boss battles, while some people love to speed run, everyone wins.

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Pillbug

LifeSunDeath posted:

BoTW let you rush the end boss without any upgrades or equipment. To me that's the best when you gate endgame by difficulty not access, because I enjoy grinding and getting OP for boss battles, while some people love to speed run, everyone wins.

Horizon Zero Dawn did difficulty and grind stuff pretty well, the upgraded versions of weapons aren't better in a numbers sense, they just have more options for you. I'm playing it again now that it's out on PC (jesus christ this port is a mess though) and it was crazy how much better I did starting from zero this time compared to when I first played it. Player skill and knowledge matters way, way more than weapons and levels.

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters

Inspector Gesicht posted:

The last Devil May Cry lets you disable moves as well limit Dante's loadout. I didn't to hamper myself becuase I had no loving clue how half the poo poo works.

I think there's room for a Metroid or Zelda style game giving you the option to depower yourself: like selling all your heart-containers to a pawn-shop and choosing to wear the Level 1 Long-Johns you started with.

This is one of the best things about The World Ends With You: reducing your level (which I guess just affects your maximum HP in this case) gives multipliers on enemy drops, meaning that while a drop of .50% might seem ridiculous, if you reduce your level by like 50, it's suddenly a 1/4 chance to get it with every battle.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Ugly In The Morning posted:

Horizon Zero Dawn did difficulty and grind stuff pretty well, the upgraded versions of weapons aren't better in a numbers sense, they just have more options for you. I'm playing it again now that it's out on PC (jesus christ this port is a mess though) and it was crazy how much better I did starting from zero this time compared to when I first played it. Player skill and knowledge matters way, way more than weapons and levels.

What do people mean when they say rush to Meridian and get a purple bow? Are all the purple bows just that much better, or are there specific ones that make a big difference?

AngryRobotsInc
Aug 2, 2011

Inspector Gesicht posted:

The last Devil May Cry lets you disable moves as well limit Dante's loadout. I didn't to hamper myself becuase I had no loving clue how half the poo poo works.

I think there's room for a Metroid or Zelda style game giving you the option to depower yourself: like selling all your heart-containers to a pawn-shop and choosing to wear the Level 1 Long-Johns you started with.

BotW is pretty much that. You can play the entire game in what you start in, wielding nothing but sticks and arms you got off Stalfos if you want. You can also just never turn in the orbs to upgrade your stats, or sell off your hearts or stamina upgrades to the shady statue in the one town.

Zoig
Oct 31, 2010

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

why have roguelites still not figured this out

Risk of rain 2 actually did nearly figure it out, because theres a item that triggers enemy death effects multiple times where its thrown. That being said whats hosed up is the boss would be easier if it constantly spawned enemies like a normal area instead of the final zone only, incredibly durable enemies that rarely spawn there.

When going for special skins its easier and more fun to go for the secret ending instead of fighting the final boss and that seems like a design failure to me.

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


sebmojo posted:

What do people mean when they say rush to Meridian and get a purple bow? Are all the purple bows just that much better, or are there specific ones that make a big difference?

Higher weapon tiers give you more ammo options, which becomes important when you need to have a full complement of elemental attacks and tear. But Horizon's loot curve is actually quite flat, by the time you are wrapping up the Sacred Lands you already have access to everything you need to take down the biggest machines in the game. I've played through the entire game on Ultra Hard several times now, and I still have blue tier weapons by the time I'm killing Thunderjaws and Stormbirds.

Memento
Aug 25, 2009


Bleak Gremlin
New neat little roguelite Undermine: the main thing dragging it down is that it doesn't retain your save data between sessions. Avoid.

LifeSunDeath
Jan 4, 2007

still gay rights and smoke weed every day

Memento posted:

New neat little roguelite Undermine: the main thing dragging it down is that it doesn't retain your save data between sessions. Avoid.

how so? haven't heard anyone streaming it say anything about saving issues.

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


exquisite tea posted:

I've played through the entire game on Ultra Hard several times now, and I still have blue tier weapons by the time I'm killing Thunderjaws and Stormbirds.

Now if only we could defeat the hardest foe in the PC port: the onscreen text which is more memory-intensive than any robot dinosaur.

Memento
Aug 25, 2009


Bleak Gremlin

LifeSunDeath posted:

how so? haven't heard anyone streaming it say anything about saving issues.

I played ~3 hours last night, fired it up today and there was no save data. Looking around there's plenty of people having the same problem, on Xbox game pass and steam. Some people were able to get their save files back by closing and restarting but they seemed to be in the minority.

LifeSunDeath
Jan 4, 2007

still gay rights and smoke weed every day

Memento posted:

saves lost

that's not a little thing, that's an assault on gamers to gently caress with save files.

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



I'm struggling to understand a reason for putting running stamina in Ghost of Tsushima. It doesn't affect climbing or anything else, and a ways into my second playthrough I don't think I've ever been in a combat situation where I'm running for long enough that it would matter. As far as I can tell, literally the only thing it does is pointlessly slow you down when you're on foot between missions or following a fox to its shrine. It's like it's just there because games have stamina meters now.

Lobok
Jul 13, 2006

Say Watt?

Captain Hygiene posted:

I'm struggling to understand a reason for putting running stamina in Ghost of Tsushima. It doesn't affect climbing or anything else, and a ways into my second playthrough I don't think I've ever been in a combat situation where I'm running for long enough that it would matter. As far as I can tell, literally the only thing it does is pointlessly slow you down when you're on foot between missions or following a fox to its shrine. It's like it's just there because games have stamina meters now.

To make using the horse more attractive?

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005


Memento posted:

New neat little roguelite Undermine: the main thing dragging it down is that it doesn't retain your save data between sessions. Avoid.

Gamepass sometimes just has broken games on it. There was one (Dungeon of the Endless) that was out for weeks and it was literally impossible to actually play the game because clicking on it would bring up a loading screen and then it would just crash to desktop.

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



Lobok posted:

To make using the horse more attractive?

I mean, the horse is the best vidyagame horse implementation I've seen, but there's plenty of times where I just want to run on foot for shorter distances, or do stuff in game (tracking, fox following) that just works better on your own.

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Lobok
Jul 13, 2006

Say Watt?

The only time stamina seems like it would be a factor (if you don't know how to reset it) is the mountain climbing mission. Other than that, yeah, I can't think of anytime you would need to run that is long enough it would be a thing. Like if you needed to save a hostage you would be pretty close to that.

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