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Who will you vote for in 2020? This poll is closed. |
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|---|---|---|---|
| Biden |
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425 | 18.06% |
| Trump |
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105 | 4.46% |
| whoever the Green Party runs |
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307 | 13.05% |
| GOOGLE RON PAUL |
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151 | 6.42% |
| Bernie Sanders |
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346 | 14.70% |
| Stalin |
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246 | 10.45% |
| Satan |
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300 | 12.75% |
| Nobody |
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202 | 8.58% |
| Jess Scarane |
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110 | 4.67% |
| mystery man Brian Carroll of the American Solidarity Party |
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61 | 2.59% |
| Dick Nixon |
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100 | 4.25% |
| Total: | 2089 votes | ||
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Glumwheels posted:Why can’t either of you answer the question? Why just deflect and go bbbut Obama and Iraq! If a core pillar of your argument is immigration, and it turns out the prior reaganite deported more people and started the act of treating children as targets, then that is worth pointing out. The reaganite before Trump was loving awful when it came to treating immigrants with dignity. The reaganite that is running against Trump now is even more conservative and has already acknowledged that the wall is staying, and that hes not dismantling ICE.
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Aug 21, 2020 21:55
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F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:Even if Biden wins - and I've said this before - I worry the lesson learned from the smug lanyard types will be that the left is "irrelevant" and "unneeded". They will utterly fail to understand the NoJoe position and its nuances, and will take as the lesson that Biden's campaigning to temporarily embarrassed suburban Panera moms is more successful than "catering" to "whiny" leftists who actually expect things to be done. I don't necessarily agree with anything you are saying in the first paragraph, or the conclusion you reach in the second. I also don't think we need the DNC or traditional establishment to get "it" or even like us for the "party-within-a-party" approach to work. What they think is irrelevant.They can (and will) fight, kick, and scream the entire way. But if you build up a significant enough coalition within a party, you can hijack it against "the establishments" will. Trump did. And not only is he a moron, the GOP establishment was way more coordinated and powerful than the feckless clusterfuck by committee that is the post-New Deal DNC. Its just hard work, years of effort, and not guaranteed to work. People like immediate results. Bernie would have provided that. It didn't happen.
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Aug 21, 2020 21:56
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Glumwheels posted:Why can’t either of you answer the question? Why just deflect and go bbbut Obama and Iraq! Would Biden be an improvement? Honest question. He seems like the kind of politician who will continue many of the same policies, except not out loud and with more decorum. To be fair to Biden, I don't think he'd ever have someone like Miller in his administration. Whatever Biden is guilty of, I don't think he's that much of a hateful racist. But he was part of the administration that began the camps, and I have serious doubts he's going to do much to change that. He already backed off of defunding the wall. e: Grayly Squirrel posted:I don't necessarily agree with anything you are saying in the first paragraph, or the conclusion you reach in the second. I understand where you're coming from for sure. It has occurred to me that part of my frustration (probably other NoJoes too) is not getting the more immediate satisfaction of a Sanders candidacy pushing for M4A and the Green New Deal. Real change takes time. It took several decades of civil rights protests and sacrifice for the Voting Rights Act to be enacted into law. Where I part company with you is that I have serious doubts whether the Democratic party can be coopted to the left, or even that a sizeable leftist Squad will do the job. If past is prologue, an expanded Squad will be ignored, defanged, and forced to play ball in the name of "unity". F_Shit_Fitzgerald fucked around with this message at 22:04 on Aug 21, 2020 |
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Aug 21, 2020 21:57
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is Biden even to Obama's left on immigration? I'm skeptical.
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Aug 21, 2020 21:59
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Grayly Squirrel posted:I don't necessarily agree with anything you are saying in the first paragraph, or the conclusion you reach in the second. Name a single time the party has ever attributed electoral success to moving left, or a time where they attributed an electoral defeat to moving right. This isn't up for debate. If the most conservative democrat alive today wins, the party will attribute the success to running to the right. You can argue that Biden is better than Trump in spite of this cold fact, but let's not deny facts.
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Aug 21, 2020 21:59
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Glumwheels posted:Why can’t either of you answer the question? Why just deflect and go bbbut Obama and Iraq! Those are pretty big buts! At any rate, for the third time, I, Pentecoastal Elites, would find it funny, as I have said three times now including the original post where I said it would be bad but funny.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:02
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Neurolimal posted:Name a single time the party has ever attributed electoral success to moving left, or a time where they attributed an electoral defeat to moving right. I am not debating you. I'm saying what the party attributes success to is irrelevant, as the "party-within-a-party" insurrectionist approach does not require their consent. It does work better if the party you are trying to hijack is in a position of power, however. Hijacking the corpse of a defeated minority party gets you an obstructionist Tea Party, at best. Hijacking the legislative branch of a party that controls the White House gets you a lot more.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:02
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The Tea Party led to the complete takeover of government by the Republicans and transformed conservatism. E: it was also sponsored by the incredibly well-funded radical wing of the GOP and essentially just a big exercise in astroturfing but it still worked and it still ended with the complete destruction of the party’s “moderate” wing.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:06
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Glumwheels posted:Why can’t either of you answer the question? Why just deflect and go bbbut Obama and Iraq! Uhh if we're going by victims Biden arguably has a higher body count. He's actively courting the support of legitimate war criminals, the same people who destroyed the countries the refugees came from. Biden has been a supporter of coups in South America and the middle East his entire life, hes never really met a war he hasn't liked. He knew WMDs were a sham and still lied to get hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people killed. Do those victims not get to laugh when Biden loses? Or are you the only person allowed to use victims to win an argument.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:09
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rko posted:The Tea Party led to the complete takeover of government by the Republicans and transformed conservatism. Trump did that. At most the tea party broke the GOP power structure, and that process allowed Trump to step into the vacuum. It could have been anyone, though. Thats not the outcome I'd like to replicate. edit - what I'm saying is, the Tea Party would have probably been even more "effective" in actually getting what it wanted (like say, the ACA repealed) if Romney was President instead of Obama. It wasn't a good thing for them that Romney lost. All they managed to do was break poo poo and oppose things. Trump took advantage of the damage they did to the party, and is now looting the store for himself, not them or their goals. Grayly Squirrel fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Aug 21, 2020 |
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Aug 21, 2020 22:10
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Pentecoastal Elites posted:Those are pretty big buts! Well I don’t find it funny especially since I’m living through the bullshit Trump and Miller have inflicted on USCIS. So maybe don’t say people’s suffering is funny to you?
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Aug 21, 2020 22:10
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Grayly Squirrel posted:Trump did that. At most the tea party broke the GOP power structure, and that process allowed Trump to step into the vacuum. It could have been anyone, though. Thats not the outcome I'd like to replicate. In terms of senior politicians, there's not a democrat worse than Biden, so the floor on a party-collapse-free-for-all has already been reached. Anyways, talk of taking over the party is futile so long as Obama is alive and has good favorables & extreme clout within the party. He killed off Keith Ellison's attempt, he killed off Bernie Sanders' attempt, if the house ever reached a point where more than 50% of the democrat officials approach being leftist you can be sure that he'll start fisting state-level elections as well. Direct Action. Participate in a protest, join a strike, throw a sandwich at a scab, slash a cops' tires, burn down a precinct, all of the above will enact more change than voting ever will.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:16
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Grayly Squirrel posted:Trump did that. At most the tea party broke the GOP power structure, and that process allowed Trump to step into the vacuum. It could have been anyone, though. Thats not the outcome I'd like to replicate. Breaking poo poo and opposing things is exactly how Republicans accomplish their goals with respect to government, but given that you’ve apparently internalized this Trump-centric narrative that’s going to allow the rest of the GOP to continue completely unhindered and helps normalize their bloodthirsty political mission, I’m not holding my breath that you’ll change your mind. If you think the left is going to have an easier time under Biden, then you’ve spent the entire year being willfully blind to the enormous amount of money and effort the party poured into their opposition to leftist candidates. Given the last several hundred pages of this thread, I somehow doubt anything I say will open your eyes, either, so whatever.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:16
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Glumwheels posted:Well I don’t find it funny especially since I’m living through the bullshit Trump and Miller have inflicted on USCIS. So maybe don’t say people’s suffering is funny to you? I would find it funny if Biden lost after courting the support of war criminals and spurning the left, yes. We're in a real Kang/Kodos situation here in my opinion.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:18
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Glumwheels posted:Well I don’t find it funny especially since I’m living through the bullshit Trump and Miller have inflicted on USCIS. So maybe don’t say people’s suffering is funny to you? I'm also going through ROC with USCIS right now - before the Pandemic is was taking (at best) a year for that process to finish, now with USCIS about to lay off most of their staff it will probably be 2 years. There's a ton of people in this thread who really don't get how seriously hosed up Immigration has gotten since Trump took over it with Miller handling it. Even if Biden doesn't go open borders, it will make tens of thousands of peoples lives better and get them out of unending wait times.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:18
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Glumwheels posted:Well I don’t find it funny especially since I’m living through the bullshit Trump and Miller have inflicted on USCIS. So maybe don’t say people’s suffering is funny to you? If you think I've ever said "I find people's suffering funny" you gotta actually read the posts you're replying to.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:19
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Mellow Seas posted:My point isn’t that it wasn’t illegal. My point is that there’s no evidence that Joe Biden took any action to get him on the board, and no evidence that Joe Biden took any action because his son was on the board. The unethical behavior here is on the part of Burisma for hiring an unqualified person in an attempt to curry favor and (arguably) Hunter Biden for taking a million dollars a year for a fake job. idgaf, an appearance of conflict is unethical by itself, because it can be exploited to cover up for unethical behavior with precisely this "ok but where's the cartoon bag of money and the dollar sign eyes and the signed contract spelling out the specifics of who bribed who for what" Justice John Roberts bullshit. That is why ethical people avoid conflicts of interest that have even the appearance or potential of wrongdoing. Because even if you aren't doing anything wrong yourself, you're normalizing behavior that other people can use to cover up their own wrongdoing. And the benefit of the doubt is doubly absurd for Biden who has nepotismed Hunter into jobs before, like getting him on the Amtrack board because he uhhh has ridden trains before. Really. That was his only qualification. If Don Jr got a job with Gazprom paying him $60k/month to do nothing, would you be doing this "hay guys we don't have any evidence that President Trump got him the job or took any action specifically because Putin gave Trump's failson a spot on the board and for no other reason" song and dance? No, you wouldn't. You would call it corrupt. So this is really just about teamsports. VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Aug 21, 2020 |
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Aug 21, 2020 22:19
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rko posted:Breaking poo poo and opposing things is exactly how Republicans accomplish their goals with respect to government, but given that you’ve apparently internalized this Trump-centric narrative that’s going to allow the rest of the GOP to continue completely unhindered and helps normalize their bloodthirsty political mission, I’m not holding my breath that you’ll change your mind. You are arguing past me and projecting. Its not even that I think the left is going to have an easier time under Biden specifically. I think the Left will get better results from the "Party-within-a-Party" approach if the Party we are attempting to hi-jack has control of the White House. Bernie, and plenty of other Leftists, agree with me. You don't, and thats ok. But lets debate the actual merits instead of condescension about how I'm blind but you somehow see the light. edit- the "breaking poo poo" I was referring to was the power structure of the GOP, not government, but you are clearly reading what you want to read.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:19
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Heliotrope posted:I worry that if Biden wins, liberals will go "Problems solved! Back to brunch!" and a lot of the outrage about the injustices in the United States will fade. Look at what happened to #MeToo when it was revealed Biden is a rapist. Trump is obvious about what's hosed up with the United States, you can't ignore it even if you would prefer to. But Biden will do a better job of not saying the quiet part out loud and letting people tune it out. I don't support the outcome of Trump winning, it's just that Biden doesn't plan on doing anything to address someone like Trump becoming President in the first place and is going to try to stomp out any leftist progress. Yeah this is my concern. I’m worried that the left will be completely purged from the democratic party because they are the masters of using institutions, laws and media to make you look illegitimate and crazy. Their gaslighting skills are next level and appeal to the middle class/intellectuals in that occupy the college educated strata. So those people can feel smart and pat themselves on the back when they land a “gotcha” on AOC while reminding you that everyone wants “free stuff” but it’s not the governments problem and shouldn’t come out of Hedge Fund Steve’s taxes because he struggles enough paying for his kids private school fees. (Not).
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Aug 21, 2020 22:22
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Terror Sweat posted:I would find it funny if Biden lost after courting the support of war criminals and spurning the left, yes. We're in a real Kang/Kodos situation here in my opinion. As someone Biden wants locked up for my political beliefs, if he loses I'm going to laugh so hard I pee.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:23
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Grayly Squirrel posted:You are arguing past me and projecting. I literally see no reason to believe we’ll have an easier time getting power with the Dem establishment in control of government. Why would them having more power make it easier to wrest control from them, exactly? quote:edit- the "breaking poo poo" I was referring to was the power structure of the GOP, not government, but you are clearly reading what you want to read. Breaking the power structure of the Dems is exactly what you’re arguing we have to do!
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Aug 21, 2020 22:23
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Speaking of, if anyone is holding out hope for a 2024 AOC run under the current Dem regime, please consider how quickly the libs turned on her for the high crime of the meaningless but procedurally necessary endorsement of Bernie Sanders.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:24
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Thom12255 posted:I'm also going through ROC with USCIS right now - before the Pandemic is was taking (at best) a year for that process to finish, now with USCIS about to lay off most of their staff it will probably be 2 years. There's a ton of people in this thread who really don't get how seriously hosed up Immigration has gotten since Trump took over it with Miller handling it. Even if Biden doesn't go open borders, it will make tens of thousands of peoples lives better and get them out of unending wait times. 1 year in and best estimates for my wife’s GC is now 2-3 years. Her work visa expires next year, her job wants to find her a new role outside our state, and her temp EAD expires next year. We can renew but will Trump/Miller allow it? We got lucky in that she got hers fast but everyone else who’s applied since us was hosed and have no clue when they’ll get their cards. USCIS is going to furlough 70% of its workforce this month with no funding in site. Pentecoastal Elites posted:If you think I've ever said "I find people's suffering funny" you gotta actually read the posts you're replying to. Well it appears you’re ready to laugh at Biden as if losing is a big joke to you when it will directly hurt a lot of people in this country. I don’t find it funny!
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Aug 21, 2020 22:24
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https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1296901665514299392?s=20 Glancing through the replies liberals seem... surprised by this? I guess they thought after the convention that all former elected Republicans were Democrats now, and I suppose I can understand how they might have gotten that message.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:25
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Ok, now we are getting somewhere. rko posted:Breaking the power structure of the Dems is exactly what you’re arguing we have to do! It is! But to what end? If we smash the DNC establishment and take power, what is our plan? And how do we intend to implement it. The Tea Party hi-jacked a shambling corpse with control of just the House. They haven't achieved much of anything-- even via obstruction. ACA is still here, deficits are even higher, LGBTQ protections are now guaranteed under Title VII, etc. They could have gotten a lot more if Romney won in 2012. If Leftists took control of enough congressional seats (House is easier, but also Senate) while the Dems also control White House, now we can actually influence getting things done. rko posted:I literally see no reason to believe we’ll have an easier time getting power with the Dem establishment in control of government. Why would them having more power make it easier to wrest control from them, exactly? I don't see how its any harder, either. Local politics are just that. Having the White House doesn't do much to affect individual primary races that are local in nature. Obama and Biden already got their clocks cleaned once at the local level in 2010. Its not about it being harder or easier-- its about what we can actually do if we succeed.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:31
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Pentecoastal Elites posted:Speaking of, if anyone is holding out hope for a 2024 AOC run under the current Dem regime, please consider how quickly the libs turned on her for the high crime of the meaningless but procedurally necessary endorsement of Bernie Sanders. Further evidence that the Democratic Party and many of its voters are a top down organization rather than a bottom-up. Which means that instead of obeying the will of their base and voters, the voters vote and denounce who the leadership tells them to. It’s about the team you’re on and the identity it gives you, not the policy. Hence the discomfort so many elder boomers had with Bernie that they shanked him the moment Biden felt viable again.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:33
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Grayly Squirrel posted:If Leftists took control of enough congressional seats (House is easier, but also Senate) while the Dems also control White House, now we can actually influence getting things done. Actually stop and think about this for a second. You would literally need to somehow get a majority of the House and Senate to consist of left candidates, at a time when you could literally count the number of members of Congress who can be trusted to support something like MfA on two hands. Controlling just "a large portion of Democrats" doesn't cut it, because Republicans will all vote against such legislation and so will the remaining Democrats. Grayly Squirrel posted:It would be funny in isolation, which is the most charitable thing I can say. This doesn't make sense. There are two separate things here, and your argument doesn't really make sense for either of them: - If the idea is to do a "party within a party" approach it implies you're talking about Congress, but there is 0% chance of the left gaining control over Congress during a Biden presidency. If you think otherwise I would be very curious about how you think this is going to happen. - If you're talking about state/local elections, it doesn't directly matter who is president. Trump being in power does not stop the left from winning in state elections. - In both these cases, historically the party with the presidency does poorly in the midterms, so empirically speaking you should actually want Trump to win if your goal is to win in down-ballot elections. edit: Basically your argument isn't really any different than someone talking about leftists taking over Alabama or something. It's technically possible in the "if a very large number of people suddenly changed their behavior in an unprecedented way it could happen" sense, but realistically it isn't remotely possible within such a short time-frame. Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Aug 21, 2020 |
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Aug 21, 2020 22:38
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Pentecoastal Elites posted:Speaking of, if anyone is holding out hope for a 2024 AOC run under the current Dem regime, please consider how quickly the libs turned on her for the high crime of the meaningless but procedurally necessary endorsement of Bernie Sanders. People being mad on twitter are not necessarily Representative of people as a whole. Most of them probably already forgot about that stupid mess as much as those who hate her wanted it to be a bigger deal.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:42
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Rockit posted:People being mad on twitter are not necessarily Representative of people as a whole. they may have forgotten about that specific incident but they absolutely will grow to resent her as the media and democratic establishments constantly reminds them to
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Aug 21, 2020 22:43
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Ytlaya posted:This doesn't make sense. There are two separate things here, and your argument doesn't really make sense for either of them: Let me be clear then. I'm talking about primarily House races, which are inherently local in nature. An insurgency primary challenge in a House district can be done in a local way, while a Senate race cannot. State and local races also factor in. Yes, they do not rely on who is in power in the White House. But they are a part of process of changing the national conversation by changing state policies and shifting the overton window. While parties tend to do poorly in the midterms, I'm not talking about general elections, I'm talking about primaries. The best seats for the "Party-within-a-Party" approach to take are safe Dem seats-- not the target seats that are open to flipping to a conservative. We don't need to win a majority, just a sufficiently large voting bloc that the Dems need to deal to pass anything without openly inviting GOP support and killing the party on their own. We don't need an outright majority, just the willingness to play hardball and a large enough voter-bloc to cause a crisis in Dem party leadership. Call it the AOC approach. AOC won her primary in a safe Dem district by going local, and she alone already has an outsized influence despite what the DNC establishment tries to do or thinks about her. Grayly Squirrel fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Aug 21, 2020 |
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Aug 21, 2020 22:47
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Rockit posted:People being mad on twitter are not necessarily Representative of people as a whole. are polls representative of people as a whole? because if so there was a relatively recent one that put AOC well behind Cuomo and Harris (and this isn't recent enough to have been conducted after Harris was announced as VP)
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Aug 21, 2020 22:47
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Rockit posted:People being mad on twitter are not necessarily Representative of people as a whole. This has nothing to do with how people reacted on Twitter and everything to do with how quickly and enthusiastically the media played their part in boosting the idiotic, baseless, false attack.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:48
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Eminai posted:As someone Biden wants locked up for my political beliefs,
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Aug 21, 2020 22:50
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e: Mellow, you might notice that in a year where it’s become common for activists to be snatched off the street by plainclothes cops and shoved into unmarked vans, the Democratic Party has a ticket comprised of someone who’s been a law-and-order Dem longer than most of us have been alive and someone who bragged about being the top cop of California. I realize it doesn’t say otherwise on Joe Biden dot com, but I think people are right to be afraid that the police state will stay just as bad under his administration at the same time most libs feel free to check out when it comes to politics. Grayly Squirrel posted:It is! But to what end? If we smash the DNC establishment and take power, what is our plan? And how do we intend to implement it. The Tea Party hi-jacked a shambling corpse with control of just the House. They haven't achieved much of anything-- even via obstruction. ACA is still here, deficits are even higher, LGBTQ protections are now guaranteed under Title VII, etc. They could have gotten a lot more if Romney won in 2012. Again, the GOP isn’t trying to achieve things. They don’t have to pass bills to accomplish the dismantling of the government. Making government not work is the whole point, and they’re being wildly successful at that! It doesn’t matter if we have the ACA if they’ve gutted all of the regulations that made it even semi-useful, for example, and while I’m glad that not all of my human rights as a gay person have been demolished under Trump, I doubt very much that a President Romney would’ve destroyed more of them. The entire point of what I’m saying is that leftists taking control of congressional seats is contingent on being able to win races, and the Democrats have shown that they’re willing to do everything in their power to prevent that from happening. The idea that they’re going to be less successful at that with a Dem in the White House is baffling to me. And without any kind of critical mass of representatives on the left, their voices will continue to be ignored at best, if the Dems don’t actively abet the Republicans in trying to paint a target on them like they did with Ilhan Omar. quote:I don't see how its any harder, either. Local politics are just that. Having the White House doesn't do much to affect individual primary races that are local in nature. Obama and Biden already got their clocks cleaned once at the local level in 2010. In 2016, Bernie Sanders had just come out of a campaign season where he captured nearly half the delegates and his opponent ate world historical levels of poo poo against the most evil man to run for the office in our lifetime. In 2018, the Squad and the wild success of the DSA in growing its membership made change look promising. In 2020, the party brutally crushed the entire wing of the party, and while there were a couple of good progressives elected to office, it was far more common for the establishment-backed candidates to win handily thanks to far bigger war chests. I see no reason whatsoever to believe that they’ll have more trouble with greater control of government and a presidential victory to point to while they shake their head at the idealistic leftist and gut social security in exchange for being told they’re very responsible on TV. As for 2010, you might also remember that it was Rahm Emmanuel’s big centrist surge that got the clock cleaning. I have no great expectations for 2022, and nor should you. rko fucked around with this message at 22:54 on Aug 21, 2020 |
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Aug 21, 2020 22:50
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Mellow Seas posted:This somehow passed without notice but could you elaborate on this? I assume they're referring to this https://twitter.com/BoKnowsNews/status/1288212348780544002 Marianne Williamson, who would have beat Trump, explains https://twitter.com/marwilliamson/status/1289048283965521920
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Aug 21, 2020 22:51
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Mellow Seas posted:This somehow passed without notice but could you elaborate on this? Most likely an anarchist. Biden said he wanted them locked up. One of the few ways Biden is similar to Stalin. https://twitter.com/chrislhayes/status/1288248800482660352?s=19
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Aug 21, 2020 22:51
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F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:To be fair to Biden, I don't think he'd ever have someone like Miller in his administration. Biden’s position on disallowing Vietnamese into the US during the war (to say nothing of his deportation policies during the Obama era) is a good indicator he wouldn’t really need to have a Miller around to navigate that kind of “gently caress off we’re full” territory like Trump has.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:52
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Glumwheels posted:
Biden winning is also going to directly hurt a lot of people in this country. Sometimes you just gotta laugh.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:54
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gallows humor is CANCELLED
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Aug 21, 2020 22:54
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rko posted:Again, the GOP isn’t trying to achieve things. They don’t have to pass bills to accomplish the dismantling of the government. Making government not work is the whole point, and they’re being wildly successful at that! It doesn’t matter if we have the ACA if they’ve gutted all of the regulations that made it even semi-useful, for example, and while I’m glad that not all of my human rights as a gay person have been demolished under Trump, I doubt very much that a President Romney would’ve destroyed more of them. I don't think we actually disagree on much. While the GOP isn't trying to achieve things, we are. So their approach does not really work for us. The DNC will continue to fight tooth and nail until we get a critical mass of representatives, and they will do anything they can to prevent that. This is what losing looks like. We lost the primary. 2022 will be tough, so we have a lot of work to do. But, its all we can do. So lets try. Maybe I'm just inherently optimistic. Hoping that 2022 and 2024 will be better for us if Biden loses- and a bunch of things go our way- and people blame the right people is just wishful thinking that makes the hard work and uphill struggle ahead of us go away. Its not going away.
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Aug 21, 2020 22:55
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