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forkboy84 posted:I dunno, it was what it was. It relied far too heavily on the walk and brawl but even saying that I'd argue it is too strong to say they were 100% right. They had a point to some extent but god I'd sooner watch a random episode of Hardcore TV than about any other weekly TV show in the last 30 years of US wrestling. I'd say Sabu is a great case of Heyman being a competent booker, because he made the botchy, uncontrollable nature of his work part of the gimmick. As cringey as the whole 'homicidal, suicidal, GENOCIDAL' tagline is now, it does sell that Sabu's so wild he doesn't care what happens as long as someone gets hurt when he does a dive. It's also notable that for the most part the matches people remember in ECW are fairly tame by deathmatch/hardcore standards. The RVD/Lynn series, Tajiri/Super Crazy or Eddie vs Malenko are all pretty much straight wrestling matches.
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Aug 25, 2020 21:39
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The matches that jumped overboard into the land of being Really Gross usually involved New Jack
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Aug 25, 2020 21:47
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Gaz-L posted:I'd say Sabu is a great case of Heyman being a competent booker, because he made the botchy, uncontrollable nature of his work part of the gimmick. As cringey as the whole 'homicidal, suicidal, GENOCIDAL' tagline is now, it does sell that Sabu's so wild he doesn't care what happens as long as someone gets hurt when he does a dive. The trick with ECW wasn't to have gore and chaos all over the place, but to have just enough that you THINK gore and chaos are all over the place.
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Aug 25, 2020 21:51
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As has been pointed out by others, ECW stole a lot of the way they presented themselves from Memphis/Florida and FMW. The old school folks who bitched about how they did things either had short memories, never watched it and only heard about broad statements that painted it as blood n' guts, or suck at comprehension.
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Aug 25, 2020 22:04
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I watch a lot of UpUpDownDown, (especially the Uno stuff they are doing now), and I really love the dynamic of friends messing around having fun hanging out and playing with friends. What are your favourite pairs/groups of wrestlers from now or from long ago who were good friends in real life, and why?
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Aug 26, 2020 04:02
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BrigadierSensible posted:I watch a lot of UpUpDownDown, (especially the Uno stuff they are doing now), and I really love the dynamic of friends messing around having fun hanging out and playing with friends. There's this clip from a documentary about WM19 where Rock beats Austin in Austin's final match and they share some words after the pin. An interviewers asks Rock about it, but he just says, "None of your business." Cut to Austin, who's frank about it and says that Rock was thanking him for all he's done and the two shared an "I love you, man" moment. Considering how Hogan proceeded to alienate his colleagues and Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels were always at war with each other, I always liked that the two top guys from the Attitude Era had a genuine admiration and mutual respect for each other.
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Aug 26, 2020 04:39
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Did either of them have huge egos anyway? Austin refused to work with Jarrett since he had been an rear end in a top hat to Austin previously, and didn't want to lose to Lesnar on free tv instead of a PPV. Rock seemed willing to put most people over and off the top of my head I can't remember any drama. The time he beat Mick senseless with a chair was bad but I'm pretty sure that's both their fault.
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Aug 26, 2020 04:57
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Iirc the rock refused to put over Shawn michaels because he was rude to rock's grandma
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Aug 26, 2020 05:02
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There's the infamous Austin walking out due to his refusal to do a job for Lesnar who was (literally) The Next Big Thing. Steve apparently regrets all of this. Rock meanwhile put over Lesnar at SummerSlam and I've always wondered about why the crowd turned on Rock there since he wasn't heel Hollywood Rock yet.
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Aug 26, 2020 05:07
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Smoking Crow posted:Iirc the rock refused to put over Shawn michaels because he was rude to rock's grandma Even if this was true I don't think the timing ever worked out for them to have a real program anyway. Shawn was gone for Rock's entire run on top, and by the time he came back Rock already had one foot out of the company. NikkolasKing posted:There's the infamous Austin walking out due to his refusal to do a job for Lesnar who was (literally) The Next Big Thing. Austin's real issue was that Vince wanted to give away the match on free TV instead of drawing money with a PPV build, doing the job was never a problem. He was already getting frustrated with his creative by that point and it just happened to be the last straw.
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Aug 26, 2020 05:09
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Benne posted:Austin's real issue was that Vince wanted to give away the match on free TV instead of drawing money with a PPV build, doing the job was never a problem. He was already getting frustrated with his creative by that point and it just happened to be the last straw. not just on free TV, free TV with no build. it was like a king of the ring first round match or something
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Aug 26, 2020 05:11
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NikkolasKing posted:Rock meanwhile put over Lesnar at SummerSlam and I've always wondered about why the crowd turned on Rock there since he wasn't heel Hollywood Rock yet. Was Rock already doing some movies at that point or no? Even if he wasn't doing the gimmick, maybe there was some resentment there. I remember watching the PPV and we were all rooting for Brock, probably largely due to the fact that he was a new guy who loving ruled. It was time for something new and the fans wanted it.
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Aug 26, 2020 05:45
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Ganso Bomb posted:Was Rock already doing some movies at that point or no? Even if he wasn't doing the gimmick, maybe there was some resentment there. Yeah, it was a combination of The Rock clearly being on his way out to act full-time, and everybody being ready for Brock to just murder everybody. He came off 100% legit like a guy who was too good to ever lose. Man, that match was so much loving fun. You can see in the first 10 seconds why people were so excited for Brock as champ. Rock runs in, starts throwing punches, and Brock just grabs him and throws him into space.
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Aug 26, 2020 06:12
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Just watched that match. Still owns.
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Aug 26, 2020 06:27
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Smoking Crow posted:Iirc the rock refused to put over Shawn michaels because he was rude to rock's grandma Rock was a Bret Hart guy and Bret just talked about it recently, but Shawn and HHH were apparently really lovely to Rock when he first started and tried to get him to quit, which pissed off Owen and Bret, who talked him through it.
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Aug 26, 2020 12:33
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It's so funny how Brock had that unbelievable summer, climaxing with a dominant win over The Rock. A lot of people had tuned out after WCW died and the Invasion happened, but it wasn't completely unsalvageable like it's been for a decade plus. WWF was dead and WWE had its first new star! Who was then immediately shuttled off to the B Show so HHH could run Raw and scare off more viewers and prevent any new stars from being born. And now we're here. Oops!
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Aug 26, 2020 21:09
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So just so I'm clear, Jim Johnston was dumped by the WWE a while ago, because they had CFO$. Now CFO$ is in some sort of dispute, and can't currently do music for WWE. So is WWE using stock music, or what? I can't imagine Johnston would want to return. Can anyone summarize the Johnston to CFO$ to 'what the gently caress', and where WWE stands now in regards to theme music?
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Aug 26, 2020 21:20
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Nut Bunnies posted:It's so funny how Brock had that unbelievable summer, climaxing with a dominant win over The Rock. A lot of people had tuned out after WCW died and the Invasion happened, but it wasn't completely unsalvageable like it's been for a decade plus. WWF was dead and WWE had its first new star!
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Aug 26, 2020 21:26
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El Gallinero Gros posted:As has been pointed out by others, ECW stole a lot of the way they presented themselves from Memphis/Florida and FMW. Mid South, too. Specifically, Raven stole a lot of Mid South's TV pacing and sold it to Heyman when he showed up in ECW.
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Aug 26, 2020 21:33
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Red posted:So just so I'm clear, Jim Johnston was dumped by the WWE a while ago, because they had CFO$. They are using an artist by the name of def rebel now. He's a 46 year old record executive.
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Aug 26, 2020 21:46
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WWE should get that CEO from Goldman Sachs who is a trance DJ on the weekends.
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Aug 26, 2020 22:15
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Nut Bunnies posted:It's so funny how Brock had that unbelievable summer, climaxing with a dominant win over The Rock. A lot of people had tuned out after WCW died and the Invasion happened, but it wasn't completely unsalvageable like it's been for a decade plus. WWF was dead and WWE had its first new star! I'm pretty sure Smackdown was the A show while Heyman was running it, so it makes sense that Brock was on the show where he'd be best booked
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Aug 26, 2020 22:18
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Yeah smackdown ruled in that era
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Aug 26, 2020 22:20
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ShallNoiseUpon posted:They are using an artist by the name of def rebel now. Also WWE are mad because they have to actually pay royalties on the CFO$ stuff.
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Aug 26, 2020 22:24
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If AEW were smart they'd make a deal with CFO$ immediately, just so they can give a wrestler the best entrance theme they ever made: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=av1usw_GzmY
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Aug 26, 2020 22:29
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CFO$ are apparently out of the music business completely; both of them are doing regular jobs now. Based on how lovely music industry contracts can be: they might not legally be able to actually do anything in the industry without going through their old management team without a protracted, expensive, risky legal battle.
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Aug 26, 2020 23:35
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are we seriously at the point where people miss CFO$ now
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Aug 27, 2020 06:19
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Paper Lion posted:are we seriously at the point where people miss CFO$ now I like that one theme that was "dun dun dun dun, dun dun dun dun, dun, dun" and then it looped.
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Aug 27, 2020 08:39
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Samoa Joe's theme was good but I legitimately can't think of another great one that didn't involve another talent. Nakamura's was fine, I GUESS.
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Aug 27, 2020 09:49
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Paper Lion posted:are we seriously at the point where people miss CFO$ now I dunno. Do people still type out seth rollins SETH ROLLINS
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Aug 27, 2020 14:44
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CFO put out some great themes.
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Aug 27, 2020 16:00
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you are lying if you don't give credit for sasha banks theme. i don't know if she still uses it but the good one
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Aug 27, 2020 16:06
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My favorite CFO$ theme was the one that sounded a lot like some other band or artist’s songVenomous posted:I'm pretty sure Smackdown was the A show while Heyman was running it, so it makes sense that Brock was on the show where he'd be best booked Smackdown was a better show to watch but Raw was, is, and always will be #1 in the company and viewing public’s eyes
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Aug 27, 2020 16:09
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scoundrels
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Aug 27, 2020 16:12
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Nut Bunnies posted:My favorite CFO$ theme was the one that sounded a lot like some other band or artist’s song Ripping off real songs because you can't just use them due to copyright is an honourable tradition in wrestling.
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Aug 27, 2020 20:51
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Nakamura and Balor’s themes were good.
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Aug 27, 2020 20:55
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in mexico they have decided that copyright simply doesn't count south of the border
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Aug 27, 2020 21:17
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i always tended to enjoy feds that just used real music from the start like roh and pwg. roh would just include it on their dvds and hope nobody noticed until the hdnet deal came in and raised their exposure. i always wondered how ecw got away with it on tv and ppv. people claim that heyman had music industry contacts but because its heyman i somehow do not believe that
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Aug 27, 2020 21:25
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JOHN CENA posted:i always tended to enjoy feds that just used real music from the start like roh and pwg. roh would just include it on their dvds and hope nobody noticed until the hdnet deal came in and raised their exposure. i always wondered how ecw got away with it on tv and ppv. people claim that heyman had music industry contacts but because its heyman i somehow do not believe that ECW probably got away with it by being small and nobody really noticed mixed in with the fact that the 90's really was the tail end of music companies not being quite so vigilant on cracking down on copywrite.
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Aug 27, 2020 21:47
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JOHN CENA posted:i always tended to enjoy feds that just used real music from the start like roh and pwg. roh would just include it on their dvds and hope nobody noticed until the hdnet deal came in and raised their exposure. i always wondered how ecw got away with it on tv and ppv. people claim that heyman had music industry contacts but because its heyman i somehow do not believe that He had a contract with Tommy Boy records, he'd promote their poo poo, they'd let him use music, which is why he was able to use Whoomp There it Is and Here Comes the Hotstepper
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Aug 27, 2020 22:17
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