|
The bar for "under control" is definitely set at "are cases manageable without shooting into exponential growth?" and not complete eradication.
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 17:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 20:26 |
|
|
I like the people using military imagery in their rallying cries against masks and lock-downs. They're acting like they can actually wage a war of attrition against a virus.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 17:45
|
|
|
Threadkiller Dog posted:OTOH people are wildly overstating the differences in actual measures taken between the nordic countries. None used lockdowns. Border closures and schools in sweden are the main difference i can recall off the top of my head. Masks were never really used anywhere around here. For the same reason the economic impact shouldnt really differ much either. That’s completely false. Norway, Denmark, and Finland all had at least regional lockdowns lockdowns by any definition (and all closed their borders early. What people get wrong is that Sweden also implemented guidance against certain high-risk activities like out-of-work gatherings and symptomatic people, at least, did not work. And people by large followed the guidelines, which all the “herd immunity” shitheads in the US fail to mention. Heck, Sweden even had some school closures (when so many of the staff were sick that the school couldn’t remain open). Fallom posted:The bar for "under control" is definitely set at "are cases manageable without shooting into exponential growth?" and not complete eradication. It’s a pretty dumb bar, yes. Especially where relaxed measures mean that it could (or is likely to) shoot off again. And especially where those “manageable” cases are still causing preventable deaths and disability. Stickman fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Sep 8, 2020 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 17:47
|
|
|
FreelanceSocialist posted:I like the people using military imagery in their rallying cries against masks and lock-downs. They're acting like they can actually wage a war of attrition against a virus. It's not honoring the terms of its treaty and keeps leaving the blue states we gave it in tribute though
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 17:48
|
|
|
Eeyo posted:So yeah I think "something specific to Harley riders" is how I view it, it's just a subculture and that subculture had a predictable reaction to a pandemic requiring small actions from everyone for public safety. Just reinforcing it’s really hosed up that generally bikers organize fundraiser rides for things like little jimmy’s dialysis funds but willfully superspread a debilitating virus at their sleepover in sturgis. I’d expect the “All gave some” biker rhetoric to instill in them some notion of collective sacrifice but apparently it’s only meant for causes the conservative establishment deems worthy.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 17:50
|
|
|
Xakura posted:Here, let the tall canadian tell you about how harley painted itself into a cultural corner: Basically, a long serious of decisions made by Harley–Davidson has driven away everyone who’s not an aging chud. That’s why all Harley riders seem to be idiots.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 17:56
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1303374024500600833
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 18:15
|
|
|
I would say that most of the world has adopted the Swedish model at this point. Most of Europe it's fully into a second wave and there is not another round of lockdowns forthcoming. To quote Mette Fredericksen "it's simply too expensive for Denmark"
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 18:30
|
|
|
The impolite unspoken issue with everyone taking up the Swedish model is that some countries have combative, non-compliant and just outright dumb populations. I'm from the UK and everyone here is ridiculously obnoxious because our culture is just US lite. It's not going too work. The hospitals will end up filling up like last time and then either we lose our access to health care and anyone dying of things other than covid just get added to the pile and society begins to collapse or they'll have to lockdown again. Our government wanted a vindictive, reactionary and uncompassionate population, now it has to deal with everything that comes with that.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 18:48
|
|
|
The Swedish model is dog poo poo. There is no way to go “we’re willing to accept a hundred deaths per week for two percent GDP growth” and get that bargain with the devil. If Rt > 1, soon everybody will be infected. If Rt < 1, soon nobody will be infected. The reason Sweden didn’t full Italy is that people, out of their own fear, stayed home, and some public health policies were belatedly implemented. They never achieved herd immunity and they won’t without a vaccine.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:00
|
|
|
I had a brief "what am I doing with my life" bit about ~10 years ago and thought about buying a Harley. I walked into a dealership to find that a shiny new Harley was more than twice the cost of an average car. Then I looked at some slightly more reasonably costed Japanese bikes, but was told that I would be derided for riding a 'rice burner' if I bought one. gently caress that noise. I'm told it's worse nowadays. In order to feel the winds of freedom in your hair, you need to sell your soul to the bank.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:15
|
|
|
Cabbages and Kings posted:as a non-Harley riding motorcycle user, anyone who voluntarily gets on a 2-wheeled vehicle at 40+ MPH has a couple screws loose, but Harleys are emblematic or at least iconic of some of the stupidest parts of a stupid culture, in the same way that all gun culture is stupid and terrible but the AR-15 has become the icon of the most stupid and terrible parts of it. all said if i were rich, i'd still buy a livewire. it's a great bike if you're not going far. Regarde Aduck posted:The impolite unspoken issue with everyone taking up the Swedish model is that some countries have combative, non-compliant and just outright dumb populations. I'm from the UK and everyone here is ridiculously obnoxious because our culture is just US lite. It's not going too work. The hospitals will end up filling up like last time and then either we lose our access to health care and anyone dying of things other than covid just get added to the pile and society begins to collapse or they'll have to lockdown again. Our government wanted a vindictive, reactionary and uncompassionate population, now it has to deal with everything that comes with that. please do not take this as support for this sort of tactic, but several articles over the summer have mentioned how fewer people are dying in part because we know better, at all levels, how to manage and treat covid (which, again, i'm not mentioning out of any attempt to downplay severity or risk - obviously, people are still dying daily as a result of this). i expect that many, from the general public to government, will cite these sorts of "achievements" as reasons why they don't need to react as severely as they did earlier this year.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:17
|
|
|
While it's true that we're better at treating it, that treatment still requires a stay in hospital. Once they fill up with second wave covid patients and seasonal flu patients those mortality statistics are going to start looking a hell of a lot worse.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:22
|
|
|
Unless healthy previously forty year olds start dropping from heart attacks in two years, and then we’ll regret everything. It’s so frustrating for people to be this blasé when there is so much we don’t yet know
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:25
|
|
|
PIZZA.BAT posted:[Interviewer:] So what was done with the children of the affected school? This is some meme or Monty Python or some poo poo, right? I tried looking it up but couldn't find it.* Also, why does Boris Johnson always look like he literally just rolled out of bed after passing out in his suit the night before? That hairstyle is very post-post modern. Edit: *Knew I heard it somewhere. -Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Sep 8, 2020 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:36
|
|
|
Edgar Allen Ho posted:Unless healthy previously forty year olds start dropping from heart attacks in two years, and then we’ll regret everything. yeah, man, this is the part that frightens me the most, to be honest. oh, and the clotting. can't forget that. and in kids they're showing that a multisystem inflammatory syndrome can strike a full month after a completely asymptomatic infection https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(20)30271-6/fulltext -Blackadder- posted:This is some meme or Monty Python or some poo poo, right? I tried looking it up but couldn't find it. it's an affectation to appear as a humble man of the people. it is 100% on purpose.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:37
|
|
|
Why, do Brits not own a comb as well as a toothbrush?????
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 19:56
|
|
|
Simplex posted:I would say that most of the world has adopted the Swedish model at this point. Most of Europe it's fully into a second wave and there is not another round of lockdowns forthcoming. To quote Mette Fredericksen "it's simply too expensive for Denmark" Well, part of the problem with the Swedish model was timing. My primary reason for opposing a mitigation strategy back in spring was that we knew too little about this virus. I still think that's a problem, but a lot of the Swedes who died back then would be saved today. It was silly to just treat this like the flu. Buying time to establish best practices, even in the absence of vaccine and truly effective antivirals, had a significant effect on survival rates. The establishment of various social protocols seems to have reduced the severity of infection as well. I think this aspect of buying time is often completely overlooked when evaluating the early choice of strategy. Even now, we have a limited knowledge if allowing this to become endemic will have unforeseen and severe effects on public health in the long term. I'm glad there is still a focus on containment - even if it is a limited containment. It's quite possible that accepting a constant level of infection is not sustainable and/or rational. As for the "it's too expensive" argument - that is only true until a certain point. The negative impact on the economy caused by the epidemic itself does have the potential to surpass that of containment interventions. There are numerous ways this can happen if the second wave spirals out of control. But I guess politicians don't want to admit this could happen because they never want to admit the existence of factors outside of their control, until those factors force their hand. We're at a crossroad right now - this end up as a tolerable new normal for whatever time is needed, or we could end up in a more serious crisis than we had during spring. This time (in Europe) it will be much more difficult to act decisively due to the mountain resistance to containment and the polarization of the discourse regarding the pandemic.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 20:00
|
|
|
Gynovore posted:I had a brief "what am I doing with my life" bit about ~10 years ago and thought about buying a Harley. I walked into a dealership to find that a shiny new Harley was more than twice the cost of an average car. Then I looked at some slightly more reasonably costed Japanese bikes, but was told that I would be derided for riding a 'rice burner' if I bought one. gently caress that noise. Honestly, if it was going to be your first bike, you're almost guaranteed to wreck it, so it's good to go used. I'd say it's good to go used regardless, however.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 20:19
|
|
|
mediaphage posted:all said if i were rich, i'd still buy a livewire. it's a great bike if you're not going far. I have an allergy to keeping up on Harley things but I believe these are more than twice as expensive as the highest end Zero model (at least, as of what Zero was making in 2018). If we're talking about short hops what does a $30k hog do for me that a $7k entry level Zero won't? I assume there might be some reason other than the logo medallion that Livewires cost more than a Forester. edit: I see they are 100hp but so is the ~$18K Zero model.... that's 110, actually. 30% harley tax? Abner Assington posted:Honestly, if it was going to be your first bike, you're almost guaranteed to wreck it, so it's good to go used. I'd say it's good to go used regardless, however. I got a real POS Enfield as my first bike and now I'm stockholmed to riding Enfields, so, be a little careful with that. to bring this back on topic, at this time last year I think I'd ridden close to 1000 miles despite bike being in shop until late spring. This year I've ridden 500; a small dump on some nasty gravel S's in April really made me think twice about riding in COVIDWORLD, I even named a thread about it in the bike forum. Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Sep 8, 2020 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 20:36
|
|
|
Sarcastro posted:So is it bikers just inherently being stupid, or something about the biker life making people stupid, or something specific to Harley riders, or what? Stereotypes and all, but "Harley Rider" is a symptom, not a cause. It's largely a subset of the boomer generation latching onto a particular lifestyle/worldview that involves a commercial motorcycle brand as a cultural statement. They're dumb as gently caress and would have found another way to infect themselves even if Harleys never existed. Whatever they believed was cool in 1973 in lieu of riding a Harley across the country while the wind blows through their unkempt beards, like, it's freedom man, would be the replacement commercialized culture piece. They are trying to embody a cultural lie/mythos, told through the purchase of an overpriced motorcycle and refusal to acknowledge that the world doesn't work the way they want it to.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 20:46
|
|
|
thanks for the tips on going in to buy a car, guys. i feel more safe now.Threadkiller Dog posted:OTOH people are wildly overstating the differences in actual measures taken between the nordic countries. None used lockdowns. Border closures and schools in sweden are the main difference i can recall off the top of my head. Masks were never really used anywhere around here. For the same reason the economic impact shouldnt really differ much either. this isn't true is it? i mean, the entire point of singling out sweden was that they were doing things the other nordic countries weren't doing and were much more lax about it. still, i find the chuds bragging about sweden to be pretty dumb regardless considering that even they did infinitely more than any MAGAt is willing to tolerate here
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 21:46
|
|
|
Trump is King Midas, but of turning everything to poo poo that he touts/touches
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 21:52
|
|
|
-Blackadder- posted:This is some meme or Monty Python or some poo poo, right? I tried looking it up but couldn't find it.* To me boris looks exactly like how I would imagine a real life ralph wiggum who grew up would look like
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:19
|
|
|
Booourns posted:To me boris looks exactly like how I would imagine a real life ralph wiggum who grew up would look like According to people who know him he deliberately cultivates his buffoonish image
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:35
|
|
|
AstraZeneca trial put on pause due to adverse reactions from at least one person https://twitter.com/BChappatta/status/1303445301756387329 the tl;dr of the writeup is there's basically no info here on exactly what happened and whether it's actually bad, because everyone in AZ is keeping their mouth shut -- they've already lost 5+% in after-hour trading lol my understanding is that the operative question at this point is "was this just random chance that something bad happened to someone or did their vaccine candidate actually cause it?" and no one has any info yet
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:57
|
|
|
Me, opening this thread: hmm wonder when I'll hear back about the AstraZeneca study I volunteered foreke out posted:AstraZeneca trial put on pause due to adverse reactions from at least one person Ah, well, hmm
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 23:17
|
|
|
To also be clear, this is one of the legit trial sets; the stuff being run out of Oxford was scheduled to end in about two years.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 23:23
|
|
|
quote:An individual familiar with the development said researchers had been told the hold was placed on the trial out of “an abundance of caution.” A second individual familiar with the matter, who also spoke on condition of anonymity, said the finding is having an impact on other AstraZeneca vaccine trials underway — as well as on the clinical trials being conducted by other vaccine manufacturers. Sounds like antibody-dependent enhancement to me, which means there will likely be no vaccines at all.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:01
|
|
|
St. Dogbert posted:Sounds like antibody-dependent enhancement to me, which means there will likely be no vaccines at all. How did you get from point A to point B on that?
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:10
|
|
|
Regarde Aduck posted:The impolite unspoken issue with everyone taking up the Swedish model is that some countries have combative, non-compliant and just outright dumb populations. I'm from the UK and everyone here is ridiculously obnoxious because our culture is just US lite. It's not going too work. The hospitals will end up filling up like last time and then either we lose our access to health care and anyone dying of things other than covid just get added to the pile and society begins to collapse or they'll have to lockdown again. Our government wanted a vindictive, reactionary and uncompassionate population, now it has to deal with everything that comes with that. It's actually that the wealthy have this planet so loving wired that they've convinced themselves they face no health risk and no economic risk from letting the virus burn through the plebs. Our "dumb" populations are filled with people demanding better working conditions for essential workers and safe conditions for their children's education but those people never make it on news stations owned by rich men or social media feeds ad boosts. It's not the people, it's the leadership (collectively) in the west which has failed.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:14
|
|
|
St. Dogbert posted:Sounds like antibody-dependent enhancement to me, which means there will likely be no vaccines at all. The Statnews article mentions that the other vaccine trials were double checking their databases to confirm they haven't missed similar reactions. I assume that's the impact on other trials.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:18
|
|
|
E: misread on mobile
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:18
|
|
|
Mr. BT posted:How did you get from point A to point B on that? I certainly don't. However, if that becomes a factor, more dark irony: antibody-dependent enhancement was the mechanism by which the Illuminati flu vaccine would kill you in the brilliant BBC4 conspiracy Utopia, a show that Amazon is needlessly remaking and completely recklessly releasing in Fall 2020 TYooL. It was not called such by name, IIRC, but something along the lines of "if you've been exposed to the vaccine, then your immune reaction to the virus kills you" was said.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:27
|
|
|
My mom invited two of her (republican fox news) friends from Florida over for 2 weeks. They flew in to NJ, stayed with her and I'm sure went to dinners and whatnot. No way they wore masks at home. They flew back last night. How long should I wait before allowing my mom to come over and see a 4 month old?
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:43
|
|
|
FateFree posted:My mom invited two of her (republican fox news) friends from Florida over for 2 weeks. They flew in to NJ, stayed with her and I'm sure went to dinners and whatnot. No way they wore masks at home. They flew back last night. How long should I wait before allowing my mom to come over and see a 4 month old? 17 years and 8 months
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:50
|
|
|
FateFree posted:My mom invited two of her (republican fox news) friends from Florida over for 2 weeks. They flew in to NJ, stayed with her and I'm sure went to dinners and whatnot. No way they wore masks at home. They flew back last night. How long should I wait before allowing my mom to come over and see a 4 month old? Cabbages and Kings posted:17 years and 8 months ^^ This, but probably more realistically 3 weeks. 2 is the normal quarantine, but you should add a week to be sure/punish your mom/make a point of her unsafe behavior.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:54
|
|
|
Cabbages and Kings posted:17 years and 8 months So true In more realistic terms, assuming your mom doesn’t do dumb and bad things after this (which her even doing this shows that she does dumb bad things), then probably a month after her last dumb thing should suffice, two months to be safer.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:56
|
|
|
RZA Encryption posted:^^ This, but probably more realistically 3 weeks. 2 is the normal quarantine, but you should add a week to be sure/punish your mom/make a point of her unsafe behavior. agree but this only works if she does a good job actually quarantining for three weeks, which i am suspicious about in terms of vaccine enhanced effects, this was a problem with one of the prototype SARSI vaccines. but just because it happens with one set doesn't mean it's a guarantee for others. the tendency, however, does make caution worthwhile.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 00:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 20:26 |
|
|
St. Dogbert posted:Sounds like antibody-dependent enhancement to me, which means there will likely be no vaccines at all. Sounds like you're full of poo poo. There's no way you got anything like that from the quote or even the full article.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 01:04
|
|