Warhammer 40K 9th Edition: losing the force orgasm chart is going to hurt them

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40K 9th Edition: losing the force orgasm chart is going to hurt them

«‹›1117 »

akulanization: Dec 21, 2013

Kitchner posted:

Yeah, you'd have to touch it with something that can survive it's close combat, which isn't hard, and two heavy flamer shots.

I think mortal wounds via physic powers (probably from a Lord of Change) or a keeper of secrets in combat is the best bet. Ironically in 8th you could give it -2 to hit you with the KoS in combat (wit stealer sword and the psychic power) and -3 in shooting. Now with the -1 cap though you need to degrade it to neuter it, otherwise next turn its going to shoot whatever is tagging it with two flamers and a storm cannon array and probably kill it.

A Keeper of Secrets will do 4.38 damage from the wit stealer, and 1.94 with the snapping claws so that's about 6 wounds total. You can use the Slaanesh psychic power to fight twice, so about 12 wounds. That's enough to degrade it to BS 5, so when it fires back at you with its dual storm cannon arrays it's hitting on 6s. This does about 2.88 wounds back to you, and you can kill it in your combat.

You really need to roll at least average for that to work though, there's not really a lot of margin for bad rolls. If you fail to do more than 9 wounds it hits you on 5s which is nearly 6 wounds in return. You'd still win i think but your keeper would be crippled. Then again the leviathan Dread costs nearly 100 points more so maybe worth it.

Did you factor in duty eternal on the wounds? Because that�s 100% getting used if they have cp. Also I�m pretty sure that you cannot make it hit you on 6s since a leviathan is BS 2+, so even on bottom bracket it would be BS4+.

Also unless I�m missing something the only way to fight twice without facing a round of shooting in melee is if the opponent lets you heroically intervene.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 03:18

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 11, 2024 23:14

Red Herring: Apr 3, 2010

Charles Get-Out posted:

The Xenos drops would have to be massive to even match the amount of Primaris stuff considering there's practically 1-for-1 Primaris release to any given other faction release. I don't think "drat there's a lot of Primaris stuff and Xenos keep getting trickles" is an unfair complaint.

I'm not asking for massive Xenos drops though really as my main squeeze is Sisters and they just got a redo. More thinking about how Primaris constantly gets potential army soft spots filled by scads of new options every month. Hard to not look sideways at them when you can think of multiple useful tools you'd like in your faction and Primaris keeps getting fixes for problems they never had. (melta rifles hello)

I'm really hoping this is the edition of Xenos. It's been a little much imo, even marine players are getting new model fatigue.

Warp Spiders turned 26 this year, Falcons, Shining Spears, and Vypers are in their early 20s. All the aspects turn 14 in November. Shining Spears use the old bikes and are a half-finecast kit, if any unit is in desperate need of a new kit it's them.

Idk what is going on at GW but there are mainline troop models that are older than large chunks of their demographic. :smith:

# ? Sep 15, 2020 05:12

JIZZ DENOUEMENT: Oct 3, 2012; STRIKE!

New primaris storm speeder fits in perfectly with the other primaris vehicles; 80% near cool but then 20% hella goofy and dumb. The lil' head popping up in the back is a bold design choice.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 05:23

JBP: Feb 16, 2017; You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

Red Herring posted:

I'm really hoping this is the edition of Xenos. It's been a little much imo, even marine players are getting new model fatigue.

Warp Spiders turned 26 this year, Falcons, Shining Spears, and Vypers are in their early 20s. All the aspects turn 14 in November. Shining Spears use the old bikes and are a half-finecast kit, if any unit is in desperate need of a new kit it's them.

Idk what is going on at GW but there are mainline troop models that are older than large chunks of their demographic.

Yeah I don't know what the deal is with this. Maybe they have marketing data that no one likes or wants Eldar.

Falcons are still baller but the rest needs help.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 05:57

Der Waffle Mous: Nov 27, 2009; In the grim future, there is only commerce.

the falcon chassis seems evergreen.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 06:04

akulanization: Dec 21, 2013

JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:

New primaris storm speeder fits in perfectly with the other primaris vehicles; 80% near cool but then 20% hella goofy and dumb. The lil' head popping up in the back is a bold design choice.

It�s great they are so stupid. Like the military dream of a twelve year old.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 06:05

tangy yet delightful: Sep 13, 2005

JBP posted:

Yeah I don't know what the deal is with this. Maybe they have marketing data that no one likes or wants Eldar.

Falcons are still baller but the rest needs help.

I'll try and spend more money on Eldar to juice the stats. Need some Dire Avengers and a Guardian squad once I finish with this box then I'll be kitbashing Shining Spears which means the new kits will start rolling in right after I make purchases :v:

# ? Sep 15, 2020 06:10

JBP: Feb 16, 2017; You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

tangy yet delightful posted:

I'll try and spend more money on Eldar to juice the stats. Need some Dire Avengers and a Guardian squad once I finish with this box then I'll be kitbashing Shining Spears which means the new kits will start rolling in right after I make purchases

Thank you for your service, cashsinger.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 06:38

Squibsy: Dec 3, 2005; Not suited, just booted.; College Slice

JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:

New primaris storm speeder fits in perfectly with the other primaris vehicles; 80% near cool but then 20% hella goofy and dumb. The lil' head popping up in the back is a bold design choice.

If anything I feel the front gunner who is operating a fixed forward weapon is the superfluous crewmember. The pilot can probably fire that gun more effectively! Although he looks like he fits more reasonably into the vehicle, so if the rear turret wasn�t manned he could be operating that as well as using scanners or whatever.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 08:24

Eej: Jun 17, 2007; HEAVYARMS

It's obviously a make-work position for Primaris who are smart enough to not just die but don't do much aside from that

# ? Sep 15, 2020 09:01

Fingat: May 17, 2004; Shhh. My Common Sense is Tingling

Finished 2 more Marines this week.

I realized I mixed up one of the Reaver's backpacks with the Sgt's, I'm painting them next so he will get the right one.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 09:50

Kitchner: Nov 9, 2012; IT CAN'T BE BARGAINED WITH.
IT CAN'T BE REASONED WITH.
IT DOESN'T FEEL PITY, OR REMORSE, OR FEAR.
AND IT ABSOLUTELY WILL NOT STOP, EVER, UNTIL YOU ADMIT YOU'RE WRONG ABOUT WARHAMMER; Clapping Larry

akulanization posted:

Did you factor in duty eternal on the wounds? Because that’s 100% getting used if they have cp. Also I’m pretty sure that you cannot make it hit you on 6s since a leviathan is BS 2+, so even on bottom bracket it would be BS4+.

Also unless I’m missing something the only way to fight twice without facing a round of shooting in melee is if the opponent lets you heroically intervene.

Didn't factor in any strats to be fair on either side, and you're right about the profile and fighting twice. The psychic power is fight twice immediately so not useful when you're the one charging.

In which case I guess the best thing is a combination of mortal wounds from psychic plus hitting it in combat? Like I said originally though leviathan dreads are super tough and hard to deal with, so I don't think there's an easy answer.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 12:08

bird food bathtub: Aug 9, 2003; College Slice

Red Herring posted:

I'm really hoping this is the edition of Xenos. It's been a little much imo, even marine players are getting new model fatigue.

Warp Spiders turned 26 this year, Falcons, Shining Spears, and Vypers are in their early 20s. All the aspects turn 14 in November. Shining Spears use the old bikes and are a half-finecast kit, if any unit is in desperate need of a new kit it's them.

Idk what is going on at GW but there are mainline troop models that are older than large chunks of their demographic.

Not that it's much of an issue with Nurgle's blessing running rampant over the globe currently, but it has been kinda sad to see how the game has transitioned in to "Which color marine army are you?" over the years. It wasn't unusual to show up for game night and be *the* xeno guy in a sea of tables that are marines slugging it out against marines.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 12:37

Kitchner: Nov 9, 2012; IT CAN'T BE BARGAINED WITH.
IT CAN'T BE REASONED WITH.
IT DOESN'T FEEL PITY, OR REMORSE, OR FEAR.
AND IT ABSOLUTELY WILL NOT STOP, EVER, UNTIL YOU ADMIT YOU'RE WRONG ABOUT WARHAMMER; Clapping Larry

I was kind of annoyed because when I signed up to that 40K league I think I was grey Knights and the rest of my pod was blood angels, daemons, and something else non-soace mariney. I doubt I'd be that lucky again if I were to sign up. I did feel sorry for the daemons guy getting put into a pod with grey Knights though.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 12:45

SteelMentor: Oct 15, 2012; TOXIC

Posted this guy in the last thread, but now I have half decent lighting!

https://twitter.com/Neon_Goblin/status/1305839074247409665?s=20

And a video trying to show off the colourshift's iridescence.

https://twitter.com/Neon_Goblin/status/1305839696375885824?s=20

# ? Sep 15, 2020 13:28

alexmac: Jun 4, 2008

Looking for C+C for these smelly bois. These are my first models for probably a couple of decades and took me AGES to paint. This is also the first attempt I've made ever at basing that was more than just a coat of paint. Also only realised when trying to take a picture that the left dude had a slightly different green as a base coat, not sure which I prefer.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 15:08

Snail Information: May 29, 2010; Snailmancy

Any of you know of a decent homebrew ruleset for playing 8th/9th with alternating activations? I'm doing a big homebrew crusade-ish, planetary empires-ish campaign for some friends, and since I'm already doing a load of custom rules, I figured it might be time to try alternating activations.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 15:21

Kitchner: Nov 9, 2012; IT CAN'T BE BARGAINED WITH.
IT CAN'T BE REASONED WITH.
IT DOESN'T FEEL PITY, OR REMORSE, OR FEAR.
AND IT ABSOLUTELY WILL NOT STOP, EVER, UNTIL YOU ADMIT YOU'RE WRONG ABOUT WARHAMMER; Clapping Larry

Snail Information posted:

Any of you know of a decent homebrew ruleset for playing 8th/9th with alternating activations? I'm doing a big homebrew crusade-ish, planetary empires-ish campaign for some friends, and since I'm already doing a load of custom rules, I figured it might be time to try alternating activations.

I'd just use the kill team rules and apply it to 40K. Then again I'm really not into homebrew stuff for anything and I try to keep everything simple so maybe I'm not the best person to ask.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 15:32

I said come in!: Jun 22, 2004

Snail Information posted:

Any of you know of a decent homebrew ruleset for playing 8th/9th with alternating activations? I'm doing a big homebrew crusade-ish, planetary empires-ish campaign for some friends, and since I'm already doing a load of custom rules, I figured it might be time to try alternating activations.

Two rulesets you might like:
https://onepagerules.com/portfolio/grimdark-future-firefight/
https://www.genesysgames.com/the-genesys-project

# ? Sep 15, 2020 15:55

Ashcans: Jan 2, 2006; Let's do the space-time warp again!

Red Herring posted:

I'm really hoping this is the edition of Xenos. It's been a little much imo, even marine players are getting new model fatigue.

Warp Spiders turned 26 this year, Falcons, Shining Spears, and Vypers are in their early 20s. All the aspects turn 14 in November. Shining Spears use the old bikes and are a half-finecast kit, if any unit is in desperate need of a new kit it's them.

Idk what is going on at GW but there are mainline troop models that are older than large chunks of their demographic.

Almost all the Phoenix Lords are their original sculpts (lucky Jain Zar) and some (all?) of the warlocks are the same versions I bought in 1993 or something. It's amusing to see the guy that still has the old version of the shuriken pistol, I have to imagine he's like some officer showing up to war with his grandad's Peacemaker.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 16:16

Snail Information: May 29, 2010; Snailmancy

Those are both great looking generic rules, that I didn't know existed. However, I'm just looking for a hack of 8th/9th edition to add in alternating activations. The problem is that if you just do alternating actions instead of you go I go, the close combat rules kinda break, because you get one less fight phase per turn. That's just the only glaring and obvious issue I can think of. I looked around to see if I could find a workable hack somewhere on the first page of google, but either they are all abandoned half ideas, or dead links to downloads for someone's homebrew rules.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 16:16

TURGID TOMFOOLERY: Nov 1, 2019

There are some depressing posts on reddit where they inventory Tyranid releases against marine releases. It�s been something like 80+ new model kits for power armor loyalists since the last bug release.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 17:22

JackMann: Aug 11, 2010; Secure. Contain. Protect.; Fallen Rib

Red Herring posted:

I'm really hoping this is the edition of Xenos. It's been a little much imo, even marine players are getting new model fatigue.

Warp Spiders turned 26 this year, Falcons, Shining Spears, and Vypers are in their early 20s. All the aspects turn 14 in November. Shining Spears use the old bikes and are a half-finecast kit, if any unit is in desperate need of a new kit it's them.

Idk what is going on at GW but there are mainline troop models that are older than large chunks of their demographic.

It starts to make more sense when you think of Primaris as a separate army, and what they're trying to do with them.

Eventually, Primaris are going to replace firstborn. It might not happen anytime soon, I'm guessing it won't even start until we hit 10th edition, but it's going to happen eventually. Smolmarine units are going to start to get phased out into legends. Before GW can do that, they want to have all of the main roles that smolmarines have filled by Primaris. So GW is rushing out to try and get as many Primaris models out while still trying to keep it at a pace that players can at least kind of keep up with. The limit is what they think demand will be, and so far it seems to have been working.

This is exacerbated by the fact that marines are already the largest, most diverse model line in the game. So that's a lot of roles to fill. The good news is that Primaris are getting a lot closer at this point. Hopefully that means they'll slow it down for a while again (though I wouldn't be surprised if they tossed a couple more in, like a Primaris flyer).

This doesn't mean that you need to think what they're doing is good and necessary. As an ork player, I definitely want to see some more xenos releases. Hell, I want to see more chaos releases so there are more cool models to play against. But I think there's at least some logic to what they're doing.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 17:26

Crab Dad: Dec 28, 2002; behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB

Orktober is just a few weeks away.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 17:36

Cessna: Feb 20, 2013; KHABAHBLOOOM

JackMann posted:

Before GW can do that, they want to have all of the main roles that smolmarines have filled by Primaris.

Too bad about 30K.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 17:43

MRLOLAST: May 9, 2013

Man I laugh every time I see Karandas. Same model , still ugly and going on 20 years. Never seen him in a game lol

# ? Sep 15, 2020 17:45

Gravitas Shortfall: Jul 17, 2007; Utility is seven-eighths Proximity.

LingcodKilla posted:

Orktober is just a few weeks away.

Sweet, time for a new buggy

# ? Sep 15, 2020 18:15

Hihohe: Oct 4, 2008; Fuck you and the sun you live under

LingcodKilla posted:

Orktober is just a few weeks away.

The months may change but Its always Orktober in your head.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 18:28

ro5s: Dec 27, 2012; A happy little mouse!

You dare talk about other factions in T�au Sept�ember?

# ? Sep 15, 2020 18:34

Cessna: Feb 20, 2013; KHABAHBLOOOM

# ? Sep 15, 2020 19:14

Yvonmukluk: Oct 10, 2012; Everything is Sinister

Cessna posted:

Too bad about 30K.

I guess they can keep making the Horus Heresy squads in production for that purpose and leave the vestigal Tactical/Terminator Squad choices in the codex.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 19:27

TTerrible: Jul 15, 2005

Cessna posted:

Too bad about 30K.

We're fine, we just got Men of Iron.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 20:13

inscrutable horse: May 20, 2010; Parsing sage, rotating time

I think you mean Loyal Imperial Robots!

# ? Sep 15, 2020 20:25

Improbable Lobster: Jan 6, 2012; "From each according to his ability" said Ares. It sounded like a quotation.; Buglord

JackMann posted:

It starts to make more sense when you think of Primaris as a separate army, and what they're trying to do with them.

Eventually, Primaris are going to replace firstborn. It might not happen anytime soon, I'm guessing it won't even start until we hit 10th edition, but it's going to happen eventually. Smolmarine units are going to start to get phased out into legends. Before GW can do that, they want to have all of the main roles that smolmarines have filled by Primaris. So GW is rushing out to try and get as many Primaris models out while still trying to keep it at a pace that players can at least kind of keep up with. The limit is what they think demand will be, and so far it seems to have been working.

This is exacerbated by the fact that marines are already the largest, most diverse model line in the game. So that's a lot of roles to fill. The good news is that Primaris are getting a lot closer at this point. Hopefully that means they'll slow it down for a while again (though I wouldn't be surprised if they tossed a couple more in, like a Primaris flyer).

This doesn't mean that you need to think what they're doing is good and necessary. As an ork player, I definitely want to see some more xenos releases. Hell, I want to see more chaos releases so there are more cool models to play against. But I think there's at least some logic to what they're doing.

GW is happy to sell 20+ year old scuplts, I don't think regular marines are going to be relegated to legends when they can instead just not making new sculpts

Improbable Lobster fucked around with this message at 21:08 on Sep 15, 2020

# ? Sep 15, 2020 21:05

Lord_Hambrose: Nov 21, 2008; *a foul hooting fills the air*

inscrutable horse posted:

I think you mean Loyal Imperial Robots!

# ? Sep 15, 2020 21:14

Kitchner: Nov 9, 2012; IT CAN'T BE BARGAINED WITH.
IT CAN'T BE REASONED WITH.
IT DOESN'T FEEL PITY, OR REMORSE, OR FEAR.
AND IT ABSOLUTELY WILL NOT STOP, EVER, UNTIL YOU ADMIT YOU'RE WRONG ABOUT WARHAMMER; Clapping Larry

Improbable Lobster posted:

GW is happy to sell 20+ year old scuplts, I don't think regular marines are going to be relegated to legends when they can instead just not making new sculpts

There's big business benefits to simplifying your product offering. I really think in like 3/4 years time small marines will be no more, and they will all just be "counts as" primaris marines in the same way my metal cadians can be modern day cadians with the right bases.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 21:22

The Demilich: Apr 9, 2020; The First Rites of Men Were Mortuary, the First Altars Tombs.

TTerrible posted:

We're fine, we just got Men of Iron.

Hold up what?

# ? Sep 15, 2020 22:38

EdsTeioh: Oct 23, 2004; PRAY FOR DEATH

Man, I think I'm about to rebase 2000+ points of White Scars...

# ? Sep 15, 2020 22:40

neaden: Nov 4, 2012; A changer of ways

The Demilich posted:

Hold up what?

A character in black stone fortress, UR-025 who walks around pretending to be a loyal robot. They also brought back a zoat and some chaos guard so I love it for keeping out of production stuff alive.

# ? Sep 15, 2020 22:46

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 11, 2024 23:14

TTerrible: Jul 15, 2005

The Demilich posted:

Hold up what?

The Dark Angels just got expanded upon in Book 9. One of the fluff things that has been heavy in 30k is that as the first legion the Dark Angels have lots of insane poo poo from the conquest of terra and the dark age of technology. One of the things they have access to now is essentially a tormented Man of Iron strapped into a penitent engine covered in weapons. It has a kill switch so a DA tech marine can blow it up if it starts rampaging through friendly forces. It's very expensive points wise and absolutely absurdly dangerous. It will kill almost anything.

EDIT:

The fluff in the book also mentions that it is similar in behaviour to units from the "Ordos Katastrophica" so we wait to see what nonsense that involves :allears:

# ? Sep 15, 2020 22:46

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40K 9th Edition: losing the force orgasm chart is going to hurt them

«‹›1117 »