|
can you make sticky-dynamite and stick it to EoW/The Destroyer?
|
#
?
Sep 7, 2020 19:39
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 30, 2024 23:10 |
|
|
no respect for anyone fighting monsters or bosses with dynamite. That poo poo is strictly for build hell-shafts to obsessively purge the map from every corrupted block.
|
|
#
?
Sep 7, 2020 19:50
|
|
|
Flimf posted:can you make sticky-dynamite and stick it to EoW/The Destroyer? Yep, just combine the dynamite with pink gel 
|
|
#
?
Sep 7, 2020 20:44
|
|
|
Psychedelicatessen posted:Yep, just combine the dynamite with pink gel gently caress yeah that is awesome
|
|
#
?
Sep 7, 2020 20:52
|
|
|
Oh god, he's actually going to try to do it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 02:10
|
|
|
Black August posted:This is a game for fun not for weird speed running purism so nah let explosives stay as they are because that’s fun for me, thanks
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 02:13
|
|
|
Baron von Eevl posted:Oh god, he's actually going to try to do it. hopefully without reading the description first also the fishing quest achievements going 1, 10, 25, 50, 200 is bullshit  Memento fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Sep 8, 2020 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 02:18
|
|
|
Happy Thread posted:At this point I only have one gripe in the game I'd really like them to fix. One remaining piece of low hanging fruit for rebalance: I don't mean to be rude here but I don't quite know what you're talking about. Could you break this down?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 02:35
|
|
|
NachtSieger posted:I don't mean to be rude here but I don't quite know what you're talking about. Could you break this down? Dynamite does 250 damage in a huge area. With a bit of know how you can use it to trivialize every boss up to plantera
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 03:32
|
|
|
And the reason that's worth complaining about is that a lot of modern gaming culture today is interested in optimal routes through games. You want the optimal route to itself be interesting. If it's trivially simple because one mechanic is a guaranteed shortcut to game completion, then the optimal route misses almost all of the game's cool and diverse content. That's bad and less fun, whether you"re attempting to use the route yourself or watching others do so. Or, encountering Terraria for the first time by seeing it live at a Games Done Quick event, as many people did last summer.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 06:11
|
|
|
Happy Thread posted:And the reason that's worth complaining about is that a lot of modern gaming culture today is interested in optimal routes through games. You want the optimal route to itself be interesting. If it's trivially simple because one mechanic is a guaranteed shortcut to game completion, then the optimal route misses almost all of the game's cool and diverse content. That's bad and less fun, whether you"re attempting to use the route yourself or watching others do so. Or, encountering Terraria for the first time by seeing it live at a Games Done Quick event, as many people did last summer. But the entire point of a speedrun is to skip as much content as possible. I've watched a ton of speedruns and if I see a game I don't know much about I watch a LP or read reviews or something to find out if I want to buy it. Speedruns are literally the worst possible way to see game content. Why should balance be changed for the less than 1% of players who are speedrunning when people can just look up one of the hundreds or thousands of Terraria gameplay videos that already exist?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 06:25
|
|
|
Gadzuko posted:... I've watched a ton of speedruns and if I see a game I don't know much about I watch a LP or read reviews or something to find out if I want to buy it. Speedruns are literally the worst possible way to see game content. ... That's you, the player's, perspective. That's distinct and separate from the game developer's perspective. For them, it's a win if their great content isn't skippable and boringly trivialized by some large popular games culture event. I'd think they would want to patch overpowered shortcuts out, since they're doing a big rebalance already. edit: Likewise If I'm designing a game and thinking ahead to it getting big attention boosts every GDQ event, I'd ideally want the speedrun to look as much as possible like the finished product. After all that's why I made all the content that way, and had everyone contribute all their labor on adding that content in. A ideally well-designed game without unintended exploits would look a lot like normal gameplay videos even when played optimally; just with much better skill showcased. Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 07:15 on Sep 8, 2020 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 07:00
|
|
|
As a game developer I would be far more concerned about the impact to the vast majority of my playerbase than making a change solely focused on speedruns. Would Breath of the Wild be a better game if it was patched to force the player to beat all the divine beasts before fighting Ganon? Would Metroid games be improved by removing sequence breaks? The answer is no, and in fact it would also destroy the speedrun community for those games, because the majority of people don't like long, slow, comprehensive speedruns. That's what a LP is for, or a 100% run. Any% speedruns are fast, glitchy, and skip content. Making them more like a LP is pointless because LPs already exist for anyone who wants to watch them.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 07:11
|
|
|
How many people watched the speedrun at GDQ, the most popular speedrunning event in the world? ...As it turns out, I have no idea how to find that information. How many people own Terraria? About fifteen million, lowballing it. People interested in speedruns are less than 0.01% of the game's audience, and I'd guess that it's less than 0.001%, one in a thousand. Your idea that speedruns should, or even do, show off a majority of the game's content in a manner similar to that intended by the devs, is just not supported by actual speedruns, of any game. The whole reason different categories exist is that any video game at all (with MAYBE a couple exceptions) is able to be bypassed, cheesed, glitched, etc. As was pointed out above, the entire point of a speedrun is to engage with content as little as possible, and your idea that a truly well-designed one forces the speedrunner to engage with the game almost entirely places the dev and runner at odds with each other explicitly and directly instead of implicitly.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 07:33
|
|
|
Memento posted:hopefully without reading the description first At least now you can use journey mode to easily terraform lakes in every biome, speed up time (12 sec/day with a bed) and dupe master bait. Doing it in 1.3 by juggling 4 characters on three worlds was maddening.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 07:40
|
|
|
Happy Thread posted:That's you, the player's, perspective. That's distinct and separate from the game developer's perspective. For them, it's a win if their great content isn't skippable and boringly trivialized by some large popular games culture event. I'd think they would want to patch overpowered shortcuts out, since they're doing a big rebalance already. Okay so you just don't like non 100% speed runs or emergent gameplay.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 07:56
|
|
|
Whilst speedrunning is a fun category in itself, changes catering to non-speedrunning are more important for the game. The problem with ”rebalancing” dynamite against bosses just to make it less viable to speedrunning is that the attempt would hurt the core gameplay. The easiest three options are; -make dynamite less accessible by price hike. This would be more of an ordeal to casual players than speedrunners that know optimal gold grind methods. -make dynamite in general do less damage. Would reduce its utility for core gameplay, and lessen the “whoa” impact for new players. -give bosses immunity or resistance to dynamite. Whilst maybe the easiest conceptually it really sounds like a hack solution that reminds me of starbound forcing you to play bosses with predetermined arenas and conditions. -increase the throwing time between bombs. This might actually be doable, but it might end up feeling clunky.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 10:37
|
|
|
Valtonen posted:Whilst speedrunning is a fun category in itself, changes catering to non-speedrunning are more important for the game. Being able to cheese 3/4 of the bosses with dynamite still feels weird after they gutted so many ways to skip most of prehardmode in 1.4. I don't really care about speedruns or whatever but if they're gonna do all that they might as well go all the way with it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 10:59
|
|
|
Valtonen posted:-give bosses immunity or resistance to dynamite. Whilst maybe the easiest conceptually it really sounds like a hack solution that reminds me of starbound forcing you to play bosses with predetermined arenas and conditions. It's funny you say that, because in my last few times playing I had: -Plantera despawn on us twice because one of us had the bulb offsceen during one frame while the other player stood on an exactly 1 block wide area that counted as corruption rather than jungle -Brain of Cthulu despawn on four of us, because we evidently all forgot to stand inside the crimson instead of right below the crimson while we bombed up to the final heart from beneath -Wall of Flesh spawn moving right, attacking 3 of us but leaving the fourth completely out of the battle, who was off to the left in a helltower completely oblivious that anything was happening. Instead of hearing her surprise at learning what WoF is, we were hearing her surprise at having disappeared when we told her to take her buffs which must have included invisiblity. She still doesn't know that we're in hardmode. Anyway yes your proposed fix there sounds more elegant than mine. I like that it addresses the cheese directly without affecting anything else.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 11:16
|
|
|
Hard-coding more ways to force players to do or not do things a very specific way in an open sandboxy game like Terraria is stupid, more options are always better even if some are "easier".
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 13:58
|
|
|
My thought is, using dynamite on any boss requires more skill than fighting them normally, WoF being something of an exception because you can basically dribble dynamite along your hellbridge with appropriate timing. I think anyone that got into Terraria through seeing a dynamite speedrun would quickly realize "Oh, this is way harder than it looked," with a majority then concluding "maybe I should do something else first, find other weapons."
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 16:59
|
|
|
And here I am still a complete newbie at the game. Had a friend of mine somewhat help me out in journey mode to get me bee armor and a decent summon weapon to get started. But I have zero clue on what to do or where to go. I checked the wiki and it basically just says go to biomes and look for things. So right now I am in the ice biome hunting for those items.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:40
|
|
|
Katamari Democracy posted:And here I am still a complete newbie at the game. Had a friend of mine somewhat help me out in journey mode to get me bee armor and a decent summon weapon to get started. But I have zero clue on what to do or where to go. I checked the wiki and it basically just says go to biomes and look for things. So right now I am in the ice biome hunting for those items. It's a lot, but the wiki has a tutorial/walkthrough
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:45
|
|
|
Yeah, thats the website I am checking out. Thanks for the help.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:49
|
|
|
Katamari Democracy posted:Yeah, thats the website I am checking out. Thanks for the help. Ah, okay well then to simplify even further: 1. Dig/explore, find ores to craft stuff. 2. Craft things (include new crafting stations for crafting things!) 3. Once you've found enough hearts to be 200HP you're about ready to fight bosses (see the wiki for each) 4. Keep finding hearts to get to 400HP and beat all the bosses. Also keep upgrading gear as you go. 5. Dig a hellavator (straight shot shaft down all the way to the bottom of the world) 6. Prepare to fight the Wall of Flesh in hell (see wiki) Basically, always be farming stuff. Eventually you'll likely want to pick what kind of a build you want to play (melee, ranged, magic, summons) and then start prioritizing equipment (armor/accessories/weapons) for those, but frankly you can swap between those sets as well if you want since your character itself doesn't have any inherent stats other than HP/MP. and step 0 is "just look stuff up in the wiki, there's a billion things and the game isn't super great about spoon-feeding info"
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 22:56
|
|
|
No Safe Word posted:and step 0 is "just look stuff up in the wiki, there's a billion things and the game isn't super great about spoon-feeding info" There's the guide who drop hints, but they're vague and often kinda useless.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2020 23:26
|
|
|
They updated the Guide for 1.4 with hints about all main bosses/npc/progression type events. A few of the npc requirements and invasion event hints are too vague, but the rest will point players to the next big thing they should do.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2020 08:06
|
|
|
Has modding been updated for 1.4 yet? I got the itch again, but after having had Journey mode I refuse to never not have Journey mode again.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 14:29
|
|
|
No
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 14:32
|
|
|
Well that is dumb and I hate it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 14:36
|
|
|
Dareon posted:My thought is, using dynamite on any boss requires more skill than fighting them normally, WoF being something of an exception because you can basically dribble dynamite along your hellbridge with appropriate timing. I think anyone that got into Terraria through seeing a dynamite speedrun would quickly realize "Oh, this is way harder than it looked," with a majority then concluding "maybe I should do something else first, find other weapons."
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 14:52
|
|
|
The change wouldn't be for them, it would be for you who later gets to watch a really cool video or several where you see every mechanic and weapon of Terraria potentially put to use by an extremely skilled person or more who still manages to beat the game in under two hours, featuring even far more impressive feats than memorizing the "buy dynamite, lay it in this pattern" algorithm every single time. For all of us to get to see something so cool involving all the game's other content, you don't even have to give up anything, because the change could be extremely minimal such as adding a new boss damage type for explosives and nerfing it some. No reason to oppose an interesting future creative development with virtually no downsides.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:04
|
|
|
I don't watch speedruns because I don't find them interesting, but if it wouldn't change anything except for the damage that explosions do to bosses, then I suppose it wouldn't affect me either way and they might as well.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:06
|
|
|
Happy Thread posted:The change wouldn't be for them, it would be for you who later gets to watch a really cool video or several where you see every mechanic and weapon of Terraria potentially put to use by an extremely skilled person or more who still manages to beat the game in under two hours, featuring even far more impressive feats than memorizing the "buy dynamite, lay it in this pattern" algorithm every single time. For all of us to get to see something so cool involving all the game's other content, you don't even have to give up anything, because the change could be extremely minimal such as adding a new boss damage type for explosives and nerfing it some. No reason to oppose an interesting future creative development with virtually no downsides. There's nothing stopping anyone from doing a no explosives challenge run. Balance changes to a 10 year old game solely for speedruns are still a dumb idea, sorry.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:15
|
|
|
At the same time, part of the GDQ appeal is that the game gets done quick. If you plug all the skips and force speedrunner to play "legit", a speedrun for a game like Terraria is going to take what, ten hours? Twenty? Who's gonna watch it?
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:19
|
|
|
I wouldn't particularly appreciate them patching out my ability to blow through early-game progression with explosives and skip right to Demonite gear by skipping right to the (incredibly easy at any stage) Eater of Worlds fight instead of grinding crappy beginner ores, so that's one way in which the wrong kind of explosives change would actually affect my own enjoyment of the game negatively.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:26
|
|
|
lol nobody is going to patch the game to do any of that idiot poo poo because Redigit is one of the smartest game developers of the decade, and one trait of that is that he doesn't listen to fans, because their opinions are WORTHLESS
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:35
|
|
|
Black August posted:lol nobody is going to patch the game to do any of that idiot poo poo because Redigit is one of the smartest game developers of the decade, and one trait of that is that he doesn't listen to fans, because their opinions are WORTHLESS This but unironically
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:36
|
|
|
He sure listened quickly enough when everyone was giving him poo poo for the torch luck change, soooo...
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 17:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 30, 2024 23:10 |
|
|
Cardiovorax posted:He sure listened quickly enough when everyone was giving him poo poo for the torch luck change, soooo... Considering how everyone was gathering outside his house with real torches...
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2020 18:02
|
|